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Why Can't Sam Complete his Marks?


Kent
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Tried to watch as much of Sam replays over the last 5 years as I could.

I still cant work out what his problem is>

It appears that in a pack he doesn't compete strongly enough or his body position is quite right

Also he is very close to marking more but continues to drop them

Any body have a thought?

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A good comparison would be when he has been a marking machine - Geelong 2018, the early games in 2020. What the difference is I have no idea - keen for anyone's thoughts

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My thought is that he's great against lower opposition in the VFL.  Great against people that are undersized or not as strong as him.   But in the big dance he's up against the best of the best every step of the way.   And he can't out-body people most of the time and can't lead with clear space.    He's an inbetweener.   Not AFL standard for the most part, but way too good for VFL level.

It's just a reality he's not going to be as good as what some people will lead you to believe 

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He held plenty last year. 

I'd say it's mostly confidence. He's still rarely had a consistent run of AFL footy.

Otherwise it's a bit of athleticism - he can't jump up over the pack to get clear air, he doesn't have that quick second reaction to take it on the second bite like Jackson does, and he hasn't been strong enough to hold his position until the last couple of seasons.

There's not many key forwards who rely on contested marking these days. You got to get your easy kicks on the lead. The pack situations are more about not being out marked. If you can get 1-2 a week that's doing well.

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Posted (edited)

I think it's a perception thing based on the fact that the majority of his marking 'opportunities' are contested marks or pack situations. He could definitely improve, but I believe he gets marked very harshly in this area due to that.

This year so far he's ranked 4th for us for average contested marks per game. Only Gawn, Lever and TMac are ahead of him.

Would be difficult being a young key forward, trying to build your confidence, in and out of the team, bad luck with poorly timed injuries, who then comes up against pack mark situations most of the time at AFL level.

Weid can definitely improve, but I'm pretty staggered by the amount of criticism of him so far this year.

Edited by Lord Nev
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As frustrating as it is, I look at it like this... he is getting to the contest and making a good fist of it.  That is half the battle.  The hands will come with more consistent game time and some confidence.  

He could have kicked 5-6 goals the other night with the contests and positions he was putting himself in, but unfortunately he is just not holding them. 5-6 goals is a solid day out against a solid opponent.  It will come eventually.

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Not sure, confidence maybe?  Hopefully?  But I hope he starts clunking them.  If he had have marked every ball he got his hands to on Friday we'd be talking about what a great game he had.  I'm still holding out hope he has a huge game soon which gets his confidence up to start consistently impacting games.

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  • Demonland changed the title to Why Can't Sam Complete his Marks?

I never want to question any AFL footballers courage -   but I think he gets too far under ball as he fears contact of the pack behind him -  needs to stay in best position to mark no matter what's around him -  and sometimes that's not about courage but just comes when you're full of confidence and playing on instict. 

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Last year when he was the number one forward, and Jackson was two, his marking was border-line elite. As soon as Jackson was injured and Tmac came back in his marking fell away. I genuinely feel like he defers to the senior player and doesn't attack marking contests with as much authority when he doesn't feel like he's the main target.
 

So in short my theory is it is all confidence/self belief, combined with a bit of structural tinkering to separate our key forwards in marking contests. 

 

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just listened to the podcast and the criticism of weid is so disproportionate. he has a presence and crashes packs which allows crumbing goals like the harmes and jordan goals that i don’t think brown can bring. a week ago brown had 4 touches in the vfl without a goal. give him a chance and let him get some continuity and we’ll be rewarded for it

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It would be more concerning if he was getting outmarked by his opponent. I’m sure it’s confidence.

Tmac, Weid, Fritta, Dogga and Max need to spend more games together. Besides Max who only spends short stints in the forward line. There doesn’t seem to be a clear leader, unlike the backline, May and Lever. I just think they’ll need an extended run at it altogether. Hopefully we don’t get any injuries!

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18 minutes ago, mfcrox said:

As frustrating as it is, I look at it like this... he is getting to the contest and making a good fist of it.  That is half the battle.  The hands will come with more consistent game time and some confidence.  

He could have kicked 5-6 goals the other night with the contests and positions he was putting himself in, but unfortunately he is just not holding them. 5-6 goals is a solid day out against a solid opponent.  It will come eventually.

Yes that was my impression mfcrox. He is definitely getting to enough contests. Why does he try to mark in the pack? T Mac and Max are already doing that. Maybe he needs to rethink and give alternative options by leading as he did in 2018

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Posted (edited)

He gets his hands on a lot of balls but does not complete the marks because he is too straight he should mark the ball at eye level with his arms outstretched and [censored] in a v shape stopping the defender from getting is arms near his arms or the ball.

He need to practice this at training so it become second nature when he gets near the ball along with timing his leads so that players make his job easier, on Friday in the 3rd quarter he was timing his leads and positioning himself much better and 2 goals resulted.

Also on Friday the talls were either competing against each other or not flying at all.

Edited by durango
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Posted (edited)

I can't remember tomohawk or Jack rewoilt being incapable of holding a mark. They have come from and built premiership winning sides.

Petty can mark it and kick straight.

I'm sick of the idea Weid is still developing or lacks confidence. 

Nathan Jones is still developing but it gets to a point in your career when you need to bring something. Not fluke a few marks in a final when everyone else fell over like Bradbury won gold

 

Edited by Wrecker46
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Weed was a reliable mark early in his Career both at AFL and VFL level .In the last 3 years his marking above his head has been generally poor at both levels .He gets away with it in the VFl  bccause of greater opportunityand the number of soft goals.If you watch him at training it is clear that he is a strong one grab mark and there is nothing wrong with his technique.So it probably just comes down to confidence in a similar way that Tmac needs a basket when his confidence is down but clunks them when it is up.

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He has a few issues when going for marks. 

Sometimes, he has his hands too far above the head and the ball is not in his line of view. Other times, his wrists and elbows seem to stiff and they don't act like shock absorbers. He has difficulty finding separation, when he can create a mismatch, he does well, as he doesn't have to elevate too high. Leaping is not his preferred method.

Needs to be more aggressive against his opponents, body them away instead of leading with them on his tail. Frequently finds himself with two opponents or in a pack. Loved that he can bring the ball down though.

I want to see him come a bit more laterally at the contest and have his arms infront of his eyes, or a bit to the side, then have softer hands and some give in his elbows. 

Really needs to get his hands in the right position as he snaps the ball. High focus on the ball, don't take your of it, be relaxed and get in the zone.

A bit about technique but also, alot about confidence. A little anxiety exacerbates his, not quite right technique.

C'mon Weids, I still believe he can get there.

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50 minutes ago, Knuckles said:

Last year when he was the number one forward, and Jackson was two, his marking was border-line elite. As soon as Jackson was injured and Tmac came back in his marking fell away. I genuinely feel like he defers to the senior player and doesn't attack marking contests with as much authority when he doesn't feel like he's the main target.
 

So in short my theory is it is all confidence/self belief, combined with a bit of structural tinkering to separate our key forwards in marking contests. 

 

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but his two marks and goals on the weekend came when McDonald was off the ground after a marking contest collision.

 

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Sam has great judgement and gets his hands to the ball first regularly in packs. It's just that they don't stick.

Maybe better resin (sticky stuff on the hands), maybe squeezing a squash ball in each hand to develop strength in the hands, maybe screaming "it's mine" to switch on his brain and body; maybe short, sharp kicks into his hands at training to build muscle memory; maybe he should stick to leading rather than pack marks.

He has the ability it's just that it is stuck somewhere.  Find the release and he will be good.

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TMac said it can take a while to get in to a groove with marking, especially if you're returning from being out of the side. I figure as someone who has had two seasons where he marks everything and two in between where he really struggled to mark anything, he's qualified to talk on the topic. 

And it makes sense to me - the ball moves so fast that your timing, either of arriving at the ball, or getting your hands to it, only needs to be out by a fraction and you've blown it. 

I remember when Gawn, pre-elite era, where things just started coming together for him, but it seemed he couldn't catch a cold. Obviously he's still not perfect, but you'd back him most of the time now.

Weid's shown he can mark before. I'm backing this part of his game to come good with patience and time in the side.

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31 minutes ago, Wrecker46 said:

Petty can mark it and kick straight.

Not sure if you mean kicking for goal here, but his kicking is very poor. I'd put in the same 'confidence' category as Weid's marking. Catch his first two kicks on Friday? One out of bounds on the full, one straight to the opposition.

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