Jump to content

Time for a Change….Don’t wait another 2 years…



Recommended Posts

4 hours ago, Engorged Onion said:

It's midway though the season and we are sitting 10th by % out of the 8. We haven't bottomed out, we're still in a window... but with all factors considered - it'll be tough to perform in finals if they are indeed even made.

Going by Footywire and arbitrarily choosing the last 5 years...

                          2019       2020       2021       2022       2023

Geelong =       1st            4th          3rd         1st           12th

Hawthorn =    9th           15th        14th       13th         16th

Collingwood = 4th         8th          17th       4th          1st

Sydney =         15th        16th        6th       3rd           8th

Melbourne  =   17th       9th          1st          2nd       4th

 

We have a collective memory lapse at at times of how teams other than our own have progressed, and as such, things are never linear.

I was contemplating a longer time frame than since 2019, where those teams have been fairly consistently “thereabouts” over substantial periods.

Edited by Tim
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

34 minutes ago, Tim said:

I was contemplating a longer time frame than since 2019, where those teams have been fairly consistently “thereabouts” over substantial periods.

Fair enough. 😀 Here's the last 10 years (from last year).

All clubs, including Geelong and Hawthorn have had periods of being flaccid.

Here's a little thing I put together via Reddit. (hope it's not too small).

Whilst Longmire and Scott are verry good coaches, Sydney and Geelong have clear (and now often spoken about) niche, boutique and geographical advantages that attract certain players at a 'discount' compared to other clubs. A fair, or unfair competitive advantage on the rest of the competition.

 

Screenshot 2024-06-13 at 19.57.57.png

Edited by Engorged Onion
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Engorged Onion said:

Fair enough. 😀 Here's the last 10 years (from last year).

All clubs, including Geelong and Hawthorn have had periods of being flaccid.

Here's a little thing I put together via Reddit. (hope it's not too small).

Whilst Longmire and Scott are verry good coaches, Sydney and Geelong have clear (and now often spoken about) niche, boutique and geographical advantages that attract certain players at a 'discount' compared to other clubs. A fair, or unfair competitive advantage on the rest of the competition.

 

Screenshot 2024-06-13 at 19.57.57.png

Nicely done, but can't ignore the impact of Academy players (Sydney) and father-sons (Collingwood) amongst that list. Also, can't underestimate the arrival of even a single key player, e.g. Dangerfield at Geelong as a way of avoiding the dreaded rebuild and keeping clubs competitive.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 11/06/2024 at 14:22, Jaded No More said:

Is our forwardline great? No.

Is it the reason we are losing? No.

Who the hell was playing in Collingwood's forwardline yesterday? Absolute nobodies, that's who. Still managed to pile on 14 goals.

 

We hit the post 4 times

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, jnrmac said:

We hit the post 4 times

As well as two on the fulls.

Absolutely butchered our scoring shots.

And I don't buy it was because Collingwood had all their shots from 30m directly in front. It's factually not correct. Both their rucks kicked ridiculously acute angled goals.

  • Like 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 10/06/2024 at 21:11, Sir Why You Little said:

It would have been a brave move. Sadly that ship has sailed 

3 years with the same Forward problems. Today was exactly the same, when is enough…?

Agreed. To let a homegrown asset like Yze disappear was a travesty.

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Deemania since 56 said:

Agreed. To let a homegrown asset like Yze disappear was a travesty.

Holding a homegrown legend and hero of our club back from a senior coaching position would have been worse!

Only way I could have seen Yze staying would have been the club disclosing a succession plan which would have named up Goodwin's exit. That wasn't going to happen so close to the premiership.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The psychology is being underestimated I feel. 

Off the back of 2020 and through to mid 2022 Goodwin & Gawn (and others) managed to galvanise the group. To play for the jumper, give it everything, back eachother, respect the game and appreciate the fans. 

It stuck fat for ~18 months, then took some body blows but hung in for 12 more months. I feel now it's been irreparably damaged. 

Goody looks & sounds exhausted to me. He's taken body blow after body blow for 2 straight years and tried manfully to hold his head high but the bludgeoning has been immense. On top of that club has kicked a number of own goals that just heaped on more pressure.

A tired leader is not a good motivator

Edited by Dee*ceiving
Link to comment
Share on other sites


I dreamt last night that the Crows coach was sacked and the job offered to Goodwin as they recognised the Partnership With Burgess worked Burgess was the main reason we won the Flag he  gelled and understood our Players he got the best out of them.

We  then offer Scott  Pendelbury (his Family were supporters of Melbourne) from Collingwood not as senior coach but as assistant to Mc Qualter also change most of the other Assistants with fresh  new ideas as anything would be better than what we have now.

 

 

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

This time reminds me of 65 or so 

really brilliant and the dominant team for years. Win the flag.  Unbeaten for what 10 games in 65. Win nothing almost for rest of the year,

Flag in 21.  Best time to follow the Dee’s I can remember,   First few games on 22 unbeaten.    Stuff all since. Seriously bad decline.

i think we have lost it in the centre. Decline of Viney, Gus gone, Tracca forward, Oliver off his food. And the opposition rucks to Max.   He never really hits to our blokes.

so we lose it in the guts every time,

pity about the quarters we do not score goals.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, 640MD said:

This time reminds me of 65 or so 

really brilliant and the dominant team for years. Win the flag.  Unbeaten for what 10 games in 65. Win nothing almost for rest of the year,

Flag in 21.  Best time to follow the Dee’s I can remember,   First few games on 22 unbeaten.    Stuff all since. Seriously bad decline.

i think we have lost it in the centre. Decline of Viney, Gus gone, Tracca forward, Oliver off his food. And the opposition rucks to Max.   He never really hits to our blokes.

so we lose it in the guts every time,

pity about the quarters we do not score goals.

Jackson gone as well. It all adds up

Schache and Fullarton have contributed almost zilch, massive decline in a short period of time

  • Like 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Back the OP’s question about change:

I can see some parallels between Joe Maddon and Simon Goodwin.

Joe Maddon was the manager (head coach) of the famous Chicago Cubs in the MLB from 2015-2019. Although the Cubs were one of the most popular sporting clubs in the world, they hadn’t won a World Series since 1908. Our drought was nothing on Chicago’s, but you get the point.

Anyway, in 2016 the Cubs finally won the World Series beating the Cleveland Indians and Maddon was the king of Chicago, make no mistake. He was the man responsible for the Cubs finally tasting success and they were no longer the butt of all jokes from non Cubs fans. Sound familiar about our coach in 2021?

In 2017 and 2018 the Cubs had very good regular seasons but bowed out in the second round and first round of the playoffs respectively in very disappointing fashion.

In 2019 the Cubs had a good start to the season, but progressively got worse as the season unfolded. Despite their recent World Series win and subsequent strong regular seasons, the Cubs shockingly missed the playoffs in 2019. The club and Maddon mutually (although Maddon later claimed he was sacked) parted ways as it was understood that Maddon had lost the players and couldn’t take the group any further.

Not agitating for change, but just an interesting parallel between the 3 years following the Chicago Cubs drought breaking World Series win and the 3 years following Melbourne’s flag.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 hours ago, Ferghus31 said:

I dreamt last night that the Crows coach was sacked and the job offered to Goodwin as they recognised the Partnership With Burgess worked Burgess was the main reason we won the Flag he  gelled and understood our Players he got the best out of them.

We  then offer Scott  Pendelbury (his Family were supporters of Melbourne) from Collingwood not as senior coach but as assistant to Mc Qualter also change most of the other Assistants with fresh  new ideas as anything would be better than what we have now.

 

 

 

Oh great, when does it come to fruition.?

The year 2025 has to see changes in assistants at least.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 12/06/2024 at 18:30, bing181 said:

Viney struggling (age?), Oliver with no pre-season, Petracca having to play forward/now injured, Brayshaw out ... that's pretty well our entire mid-field.

Just what were people expecting?

Smith out.

Bbb cooked.

Spargo out all year .

Tmac no longer admits he can play fwd.

Schache not sure why's he's on our list 

Fullerton ditto.

McAdam rightly dropped.

Petty not a forward.

Milkshake still recovering.

Three years to fix a forward line with no success.

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

One thing I’m noticing at the moment is the emergence of young and fast midfielders. Sydney has Gulden and Warner. Port has Butters, Rozee and JHF. Carlton have Walsh. Hawks have a couple coming though too.

We don’t have anyone emerging. Maybe that can be Tholstrup for us. The golden age of the midfield bull is over and we’ve been late to the party to notice.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

22 minutes ago, At the break of Gawn said:

One thing I’m noticing at the moment is the emergence of young and fast midfielders. Sydney has Gulden and Warner. Port has Butters, Rozee and JHF. Carlton have Walsh. Hawks have a couple coming though too.

We don’t have anyone emerging. Maybe that can be Tholstrup for us. The golden age of the midfield bull is over and we’ve been late to the party to notice.

100%

game has gone from 'contest and defence' to 'speed and skill'

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, whatwhat say what said:

100%

game has gone from 'contest and defence' to 'speed and skill'

Which is why we drafted Windsor, and traded up to get him.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites


2 minutes ago, whatwhat say what said:

agreed

i'm really curious to see if he can add that inside / outside game to his arsenal, as it is one of the things that sets the likes of dawson and warner apart

Windsor will be good inside and outside.  He maybe still young but he  isn’t the best field kick - too many clangers so far this season. 
 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Gawndy the Great said:

Windsor will be good inside and outside.  He maybe still young but he  isn’t the best field kick - too many clangers so far this season. 
 

going okay at 67% disposal efficiency; his clangers and turnovers hurt him - 2.4 and 3.1 a game from only 14.2 possessions per game

you can't teach speed and skill

what i like is that he is capable of punching the kick when moving at top speed - some of his field kicking this year has been elite

Edited by whatwhat say what
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, At the break of Gawn said:

One thing I’m noticing at the moment is the emergence of young and fast midfielders. Sydney has Gulden and Warner. Port has Butters, Rozee and JHF. Carlton have Walsh. Hawks have a couple coming though too.

We don’t have anyone emerging. Maybe that can be Tholstrup for us. The golden age of the midfield bull is over and we’ve been late to the party to notice.

There's still a case for at least one mid field bull.

Cripps - No Cripps no Blues success imho.  Walsh is good on the outside but he feeds & relies off Cripps hard work in and under quite a bit.

Viney - before being injured this year).  With his decline (and or tagged out of influencing matches) goes our season.

Clarry - before his fall from grace... as per Vines

Danger - Cat's decline since his injury no coincidence

Libba - not so much a bull but he does the same thing, first use extraction and he is the best in the comp at that this season.  The best clearance average in the AFL, daylight the rest.  No coincidence they are rising again post his return.

Rowell

Green

Miller

I get what you're saying and yes we are devoid of the more outside bias types you are referring to.

Especially now that Tracc is done for the year, we simply have to get Rivers into the middle to play some serious minutes and see how he goes.

If we don't i fear we are in for more horror in the back half.

Also important we start blooding the likes of Kolt & Sestan in place of Billings & Laurie.

Will they have some shockers as well?  Absolutely.

But their upside potential is a mile ahead of the former two if we persist with them and don't [censored] the bed and send them straight back to Casey after their first few weeks as we tend to do far too often with our rookies.  Talk about a confidence killer.

Edited by Demon Dynasty
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

You need a mix of inside bull and speed in the middle or you need to get speed on the ball with your movement. 
 

Windsor, Rivers, Kozzie have it and we have shown interest in Cody Angove so no doubt the list is moving towards having more leg speed 

  • Like 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Pennant St Dee said:

You need a mix of inside bull and speed in the middle or you need to get speed on the ball with your movement. 
 

Windsor, Rivers, Kozzie have it and we have shown interest in Cody Angove so no doubt the list is moving towards having more leg speed 

They need skilled guidance and mentoring

We have none...  just what is.

  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Unfortunately, your content contains terms that we do not allow. Please edit your content to remove the highlighted words below.
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Demonland Forums  

  • Match Previews, Reports & Articles  

    LIVE AND LET DIE by Meggs

    The Demons’ impressive late season charge to finals will most likely come unstuck this Saturday evening when the Bombers blow up the also-ran Blues in the Ikon Park double-header.   To mangle McCartney, what does it matter to ya? To have any chance to play next week Narrm has got a job to do and needs to do it well.  We’ve got to give the Pie sheilas hell, say live and let die! It’s Indigenous Round for this game and the chance to celebrate and engage with Aboriginal and Torres

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    AFLW Melbourne Demons

    2024 Player Reviews: #32 Tom Sparrow

    Had to shoulder more responsibility as the club’s injury concerns deepened but needs to step up more as he closes in on 100 games. Date of Birth: 31 May 2000 Height: 186cm Games MFC 2024: 21 Career Total: 95 Goals MFC 2024: 6 Career Total: 34 Games CDFC: 1 Goals CDFL: 0

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 17

    2024 Player Reviews: #35 Harry Petty

    Failed to fulfill the promise of his breakout six goal effort against the Tigers in 2023 and was generally disappointing as a key forward. It remains to be seen whether Simon Goodwin will persevere with him in attack or return him to the backline where he was an important cog in the club’s 2021 premiership success. Date of Birth: 12 November 1999 Height: 197cm Games MFC 2024: 20 Career Total: 82 Goals MFC 2024: 9 Career Total: 28 Brownlow Medal Votes 3

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 14

    2024 Player Reviews: #22 Blake Howes

    After a bright start to the season, playing mostly in defence, Howes seemed to lose his way in midseason but fought back with some good performances at Casey and finished the year back at AFL level. One to watch in 2024. Date of Birth: 7 March 2003 Height: 191cm Games MFC 2024: 15 Career Total:  15 Goals MFC 2024: 0 Career Total:  0 Games CDFC 2024: 6 Goals CDFC 2024: 0

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 5

    2024 Player Reviews: #33 Tom Fullarton

    Originally an NBL basketballer with the Brisbane Bullets, he moved across town in 2019 to the AFL Lions where he played 19 games before crossing to Melbourne where he was expected to fill a role as a back up ruckman/key forward. Unfortunately, didn’t quite get there although he did finish equal sixth in Casey’s best and fairest award. Date of Birth: 23 February 1999 Height: 198cm Games CDFC: 14 Goals CDFL: 13

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 5

    2024 Player Reviews: #10 Angus Brayshaw

    Sadly, had to wrap up a great career in midstream on the back of multiple concussions which culminated in the Maynard hit in the 2023 Qualifying Final. His loss to the club was inestimable over and above his on field talent given his character and leadership qualities, all of which have been sorely missed. Date of Birth: 9 January 1996 Height: 188cm Games MFC 2024: 0 Career Total: 167 Goals MFC 2024: 0 Career Total: 49

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 8

    2024 Player Reviews: #40 Taj Woewodin

    The son of former Demon Brownlow Medalist Shane, Taj added a further 16 games to his overall tally of games but a number were as substitute. He is slowly fitting into the team structure but without doing anything spectacular and needs to take further steps forward in 2025 for his career to progress. Date of Birth: 26 March 2003 Height: 182cm Games MFC 2024: 16 Career Total: 20 Goals MFC 2024: 1 Career Total: 3 Games CDFC 2024: 6 Goals CDFC 2024: 1

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 5

    2024 Player Reviews: #16 Bailey Laurie

    The clever small was unable to cement a place in the Melbourne midfield and spent most of his time this year with the Casey Demons where he finished equal fourth in its best & fairest. Date of Birth: 24 March 2002 Height: 179cm Games MFC 2024: 6 Career Total: 11 Goals MFC 2024: 2 Career Total: 2 Games CDFC 2024: 12 Goals CDFC 2024: 7

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 23

    2024 Player Reviews: #17 Jake Bowey

    Bowey’s season was curtailed early when he sustained a shoulder injury that required surgery in the opening game against Sydney. As a consequence, he was never able to perform consistently or at anywhere near his previous levels.  Date of Birth: 12 September 2002 Height: 175cm Games MFC 2024: 14 Career Total: 61 Goals MFC 2024: 0 Career Total: 6

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 7
  • Tell a friend

    Love Demonland? Tell a friend!

×
×
  • Create New...