Ferghus31

Melbourne are asking for a player and picks and have offered Sydney Pick 14 plus a future pick plus Grundy for Hadyn Mclean a Forward would do that deal now

After Saturdays win I would throw the kitchen sink at Leppitch he was responsible for the set ups Saturday as stated by McRae and add the promise he would become our next Senior coach it seems the Richmond style is successful look at GWS and Collingwood also lure Neville Jetta back

Melbourne are now breathing rarefied air, or eating mouthfuls of dirt to put it more accurately, by becoming the first club to suffer back-to-back straight sets exits out of finals this century. The Demons won 16 home and away games in each of 2022 and 2023, giving them a total of 32 that only Collingwood has bettered across that time. They finished second on the ladder last year and fourth this season. They earned two double chances and have a grand total of zero finals wins to show for it. After Melbourne won the flag in 2021, playing their finals in Adelaide and Perth, there was all the talk of being hungry to do it in front of their loyal Victorian fans, a packed MCG, etc… Of course, such things are always easy to say and this has proven empty talk. It’s doubtful whether it was ever truly believed in the first place, and certainly not from a playing group that has proven to be so smug yet so delicate at the same. Jack Viney and Brayden Maynard fight. Jack Viney and Brayden Maynard fight. (Photo by Quinn Rooney/Getty Images) Some will say the burden of trying to replicate their 2021 feats in front of a home ground has become a noose around their neck, but that is nonsense. In finals, weaknesses get shown up, and for the Demons it is their dysfunctional forward line and inability to kick goals. In their qualifying final loss to Collingwood, Melbourne conspired to kick a losing score despite amassing 69 inside 50s to 37, generating roughly one score per four entries. However, this isn’t a new problem under Simon Goodwin. Rewind back to Round 14, 2018, a Friday night against Port in Adelaide. The Demons won the inside 50 count 69 to 39 yet still lost. Five years later and it looked exactly the same as the final against the Pies two weeks ago – bombs away from all corners into the forward line with no care, responsibility or skill in the delivery. Dees fans have been bemoaning the lack of system in the forward line for most of Goodwin’s tenure, apart from parts of 2018 when they were kicking monster scores for fun. But with all the focus on Melbourne’s tight defence, they simply haven’t got the balance right when it comes to attacking off that base. And in those last four finals losses, all at the MCG, they have kicked of 37 goals. 37. They kicked 40 goals just in the prelim and grand final of 2021. How the mighty have fallen. Tom McDonald must have almost played his last game of competitive football. In his last five matches as a key forward in a top four team, he has averaged six touches, two marks and less than a goal a game. He couldn’t have looked older and slower, to the point they might as well have brought David Schwarz or Allen Jakovich out of retirement instead. Max Gawn Max Gawn withj he 2021 AFL premiership trophy. (Photo by Paul Kane/Getty Images) Joel Smith looked like Wayne Carey at stages in the first half against Carlton, but is a 27yo that has 42 games to his credit, averaging seven matches a year since his debut. He ain’t the answer, and also only had six touches in the end despite his three goals. Jacob van Rooyen has the talent, and the fire in the belly to be a key forward of substance, but is going to be erratic for a while yet. Ben Brown’s papers appear to be stamped. The best Melbourne’s forward line looked all finals series was a 20-25 minute patch either side of three-quarter-time. The forward line was open, Kossie Pickett was playing out of the square, Bayley Fritsch had space to lead into, and the two of them put their team into a winning position. Most importantly, the ball carriers were hitting them on the lead. More AFL AFL News: ‘Blatant manipulation’ – Coaches angry as Roos get draft boost, Lions star pushes through Payne barrier COMMENT: Lachie Neale’s baffling win proves it’s time to take Brownlow voting off the umps AFL Trade Period state of play: Why this gun Crow is almost out the door – and destined for a grand finalist Suns gun’s night to remember as Neale takes Charlie, Bont bridesmaid again: 2023 Brownlow winners and losers Neale’s real deal: Lions star claims shock second Brownlow in thrilling count What can’t be denied is that the Melbourne midfield continues to be less than the sum of its parts. Max Gawn, the ruckman of his generation, Christian Petracca and Clayton Oliver, who both have claims as the number one midfielder in the competition, and Jack Viney coming off a career best year and on the cusp of All Australian selection. The problem is none of them can kick. Between the four of them, they had 32 inside 50s in that first final against Collingwood. Gawn was dominant on the night, but how did that help the team? Do Demon supporters want Gawn having 27 disposals and kicking it inside 50 ten times? What sort of system is that? And let’s not get started on the Brodie Grundy trade. Does it even happen if Gawn didn’t kick five goals against Geelong in the 2021 preliminary final? The idea was supposed to be that Gawn would play more forward, both giving Melbourne a focal point and prolonging his career, while Grundy could come in and take more ruck duties. What they ended up with instead was a downgrade in the ruck spot and a poor key forward, that can take the occasional mark near goal but be a less than 50/50 prospect of converting it anyway. Brodie Grundy. (Photo by Chris Hyde/Getty Images) And then the question has to be asked, what sort of lunatics would bring Josh Schache into their football club, thinking he was anything other than simply not up to the cut and thrust of AFL football? Not only that, but to then make Schache the starting sub in a final after only one full game for the season? And to know your judgement was so appalling in making him the sub, that you couldn’t even bring yourself to inject him into the game with tired bodies everywhere and the season on the line? It’s just infuriating to think about. We can only imagine how Demons fans must feel about it. And all the way through, Simon Goodwin talking the same old nonsense about taking learnings, whatever that means, without ever acknowledging the midfield ball movement and forward line disarray that keeps bringing them unstuck at the big moments. But he brought a premiership to the club after an almost 60 year drought, and the way of these things is that you get an eternal sort of credit. We see it with Luke Beveridge at the Bulldogs to this day. Perhaps Melbourne are destined to be like Sydney of a decade ago. The Swans won the 2012 flag, and have chipped around the edges ever since, making some grand finals without ever winning another. The Demons may well be one and done, and are already on the downslope. It has to leave them unfulfilled. The Crowd Says: 4 days ago Wikipetia Roar Rookie The hardness we are talking about is different I think. I’m talking about the self-abnegation of selfless team first footy. That’s hard to maintain under pressure I don’t doubt at all their commitment to the contest 4 days ago Steele Roar Rookie Yup it’s been a media pile on all week. Doesn’t make it true though. They play hard, but sometimes stupid footy. Key injuries and game plan for mine. 5 days ago Wikipetia Roar Rookie have you seen the horror critique of all of the individual acts that were non-teamy in the last quarter? of an elimination semi? i don't have belief. just belief in inquiry 5 days ago Mr Right Roar Rookie PD, glad you agree. But in these times of political correctness, you are not supposed to categorise the Swans, Lions etc are playing in a "non-football state". 5 days ago Pumping Dougie Roar Guru Yeah, I think the 2007-2011 is one of the greatest teams on paper that I have ever seen, up there with Brisbane in the early 2000s and Hawthorn in the mid to late 1980s, and definitely better on paper than the Hawthorn or Richmond recent triumphant eras. So I'd say they delivered, but didn't over-achieve, given their list. The 2008 loss to Hawthorn was one that got away and hurts their legacy. 5 days ago Arges Tuft Roar Rookie umm 2007 2009 2011 2022 5 days ago Steele Roar Rookie I thought they did actually. You have a different belief in why they lost to me. 5 days ago Wikipetia Roar Rookie did they show elite intent and commitment to each other, when it really mattered. it appears not. now 17 teams won't win the comp this year but Melbourne (and prob Brisbane) would be the two teams that people are gonna legitimately ask - how come? 5 days ago Steele Roar Rookie Agree 5 days ago Steele Roar Rookie Well sure, Melbourne’s best years may still be ahead. But I don’t think this year was a hangover, injuries and game plan had a bigger impact than want and desire. They play a tough brand, suggesting it’s not a lack of intent. Forward entries and forward cattle weren’t good. 5 days ago Pumping Dougie Roar Guru I think Melbourne have the best list on paper and from that point of view they have under-achieved (so far). But if they snag a flag next year or the year after then they have delivered on their window. I rate the lists of Brisbane, Bulldogs, Carlton and Port highly too, and on that front I think the Bulldogs under-achieved this year and the other three teams are where they should be. Collingwood’s list is very good, but I think their performance exceeds expectations. GWS list is good, but they only just snuck into the finals … a finish anywhere between 7th and 10th would be on par I reckon, so they have definitely over-achieved. Then again, last year I would have said Geelong’s list was about the 10th best. 5 days ago Pumping Dougie Roar Guru Well not Geelong ... 5 days ago Pumping Dougie Roar Guru Cheers Mr Right. I admit I was very critical of the 9 year Buddy deal when it was signed, due to it's length. I know that his contract value meant a number of other players left seeking more money, but that happens at other clubs too and it's futile to speculate whether the Swans would have won a flag if those players stayed and Buddy never came. But now with the benefit of hindsight, I think Buddy's tenure and value for the Swans was exceptional. He was a rockstar on the field and delivered fans to the sport in a non-football state. He performed exceptionally well in the 2022 season, the last year of his 9 year contract. The Swans went very close to winning the flag with him in 2016. 5 days ago Naughty's Headband Roar Rookie Fair enough. I think we are arguing the same thing just from different perspectives. 5 days ago Wikipetia Roar Rookie Petracca is fabulous. but the defining image for me of his season will be his extended arms out burn of Pickett for not dishing off. seems like plenty more connection needed. maybe the flag came too easily for the key players? they were a slightly young team (under 25 average) with Oliver only 24 and Petracca 25, Brayshaw 25 etc the 2022 internal events were a terrible look but winning papers over a lot -- in comparison, for the core star/leadership/values setters: Cotchin was 27, Martin 26, Edwards almost 29, Jack almost 29, Rance almost 28. Grigg was the real glue and was 29. they'd had more bad years, more hopes dashed, and I just feel like it meant more to them to win as individuals, and that they also knew that they had to keep working hard because the moment is short and the window always struggling to defy gravity. it was a first premiership based more in team and system and structure, albeit with some brilliance. only Melbourne will really know if the team is giving its all, individually and collectively, especially when it matters. but it's possible they are still in a hangover, it's just that this what a hangover with elite talent looks like? 5 days ago Wikipetia Roar Rookie there are pies in the sky. they taste better at high altitude it's win-win-win for all of Dees, Tiges and Coasters 5 days ago Charlie Keegan Roar Guru That’s part of the reason why I am glowing in my assessment of Kevin Sheedy he won four flags across a span of twenty years and three of which had close to a decade between them. Like you said the hardest thing is to win one flag but to do it multiple times with largely different teams is impressive. Of course the mark against sheeds is that 2000 side really should’ve won in 99 and 2001 5 days ago Charlie Keegan Roar Guru That and the Cats had a magnificent slate of father son recruits, the abletts, Matthew scarlet, tom Hawkins, mark Blake and Jed Bews are all father son recruits for the cats 5 days ago Charlie Keegan Roar Guru Yeah I reckon they would’ve won another flag if they got one or the other not both. I remember the Tippet deal not being good business from the Swans like he kicked five on debut against the Pies but he struggled in Sydney 5 days ago Scyphus Roar Rookie Demon, I mostly agree with your assertion that line (and other assistant) coaches are really important to a team, much more than most people realize. But it *is* entirely on the head coach to assemble his team of assistants. I am not a Goodwin fan, and though I have no idea whether he drives the high quality of the defensive scheme more than his assistants, it is very damning for me that he clearly either: (1) hasn't gotten the right mid/forward assistants to develop a scheme for creating quality shots; or (2) hasn't gotten the he!! out of the way of a good assistant who would do something differently. Melbourne clearly has personnel weapons in abundance to be able to score goals by the basketful, and the fact that they usually don't, or at least don't when it counts, is either on the coach, or else on the list management team who bring players in who do what they're gonna do regardless of any coaching they might get. From what I can see, I'd bet it's the former. More Comments on The Roar Read more at The Roar

Josh Carr Andrew Mc Qualter both capable of Senior Coaching and with points to Prove also Daisy Pearce hate it that she is at Geelong and Ben Brown Forward Coach

Yes it needs to be fully examined thoroughly my concerns are that the assistant coaches need to be refreshed replaced with more recent retired players like Cotchin Selwood Davis that can convince Goodwin his style method and Game plans just dont work and he be more flexible also no Favourites

Just Heard on Perth Radio Bulldogs and West Coast Desperate for our early picks if we could lure Aaron Naughton and Liam Ryan imagine them with Pickett and Mc Adam boy some powerful forward line

Would love to see the Yank give away a free kick with 30secs to go and either Jesse or Toby kick the winning goal that would be a payback for his knees jumping into Max

The Problem is Goodwin he wont listen to others is pig headed makes huge errors during games he Needs to go

If Adam gets the Tigers gig i would replace him with Trent Cotchin and Daisy Pearce make them responsible for Midfield and onballers get Stewart Dew as Forward Coach make Mark Stinnear our Assistant coach i am very impressed with him he has an amazing ability to read the game unlike Goodwin he listens to others . Finally lure Phil Davis for backline all of these replace all other Coaches except Williams

Make Smith the Sub and add JJ

Totally Agree but Goodwin does not look at history and doesnt take risks all season our forwards were the problem except when Petty and Melk applied defensive Pressure he is the problem for not fixing this also our assistant coaches incl Choco should demand fixing before its too LATE

Goodwin will have to be forced into playing Grundy he doesnt like change and will resist it he should have realized earlier Max cannot do it on his own and played Grundy against Collingwood just like his idea of a Forward Line he wont admit that he was wrong i blame him entirely

Fully agree a very decent person and Fair Footballer HE HAS A GREAT FUTURE outside of football also laughs at himself and of course Max Get better hopefully all up and about for the G Final hope its against Collingwood would, be great if he does make it and he kicks the winning Goal