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Demon Forever

Farewell Sam Frost

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I loved watching Frosty run and carry and in some ways wish he was staying but it wasn't just his disposal/decision making which was an issue.  His marking was very inconsistent, could drop some absolute sitters at times and just makes too many blunders to be a reliable key back.  He'll do some great things from time to time (last couple of mins v Hawthorn and the Petrucelle tackle v West Coast are examples) but he's also likely to cost 2-3 goals a game.

 

 

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Watch the 2018 final series closely. Frost did a lot right, but the amount of times he ran under a high ball, got turned inside out by his opponent (especially in the West Coast game), or he let the ball get out the back when he needed to stop it doing so were very costly. Can you imagine Frost with the ball in his hands under the high pressure of playing Richmond in a Grand Final??? Yikes.

If we're claiming that Frost is going to be a crucial loss for our hopes of rising up the ladder then we are a million miles off the pace.

 

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1 hour ago, Kent said:

Another in a long line of mistakes I think but we will all see next year. Frost is missing good coaching and development. He will get it at the Hawks. Melbourne is the worst team at developing players in my opinion and our footy department is a basket case. Shifting assitants wont help. Nothing has concvinced me Melbourne will be any better in 2020 Just read Goodwin interview in the Sun  "We got it all wrong in 2019"

And he reckons it gave him a pain in the guts. Geesus this guy is not up to the job. Hope he goes soon. Low IQ and stubbornness is not a great combination.

 

I have high lighted the above, these comments frustrate me because the players should be driving this, it is not entirely up to the MFC to develop players.  It has to be on the players themselves,  MFC should review a players strengths and weaknesses and the end of the year, and its up to the player in the off season to put the work in and improve their skills/craft etc before their official preseason starts.

NBA players organise their own camps with players from all other teams, to scrimmage and improve, they employ shooting coaches (should be kicking coaches for our players) and seek advise from past greats like Kobe Bryant (Dunstall's, Brown's, Carey's, Black's etc).

Players have to want to get better on their own, once the players embrace getting better and not heading to Europe for 4 weeks, then we'll have a serious team, until then we'll continue to play like boys in a mans competition. 

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Lets all be totally honest with ourselves here. Sam Frost is an at best Average Footballer, which in itself is ok, but he is not the messiah. He is a great athlete with great endeavor, but May and Lever and Hore are better footballers.

Sam benefited from a year where we were a mess down back, but his pace and willingness to try was thrust into our awareness because such was the lack of class and chemistry down back.

Its a shame you cant take Sam great qualities (pace, and endeavor) and combine them with Oscars good qualities (ball use and decision making) we would have a really good footballer.

If we can get a pick in the 30s for Frost, take it, turn it into something and move on. Sam Frost is not our future.

 

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1 hour ago, Kent said:

Another in a long line of mistakes I think but we will all see next year. Frost is missing good coaching and development. He will get it at the Hawks. Melbourne is the worst team at developing players in my opinion and our footy department is a basket case. Shifting assitants wont help. Nothing has concvinced me Melbourne will be any better in 2020 Just read Goodwin interview in the Sun  "We got it all wrong in 2019"

And he reckons it gave him a pain in the guts. Geesus this guy is not up to the job. Hope he goes soon. Low IQ and stubbornness is not a great combination.

 

Name the long list of mistakes and your development comment is complete and utter rubbish but let’s just throw out comments for the hell of it. 

We had a poor season but the following players have improved since joining the club and there development has been exceptional in some cases. 

Oliver

Brayshaw

Harmes

Trac

Fritsch

Salem

even the older bunch has improved

T Mac

Jetta 

Melksham

Shall I continue?

Frost himself has also improved under Goodwin but is still very limited and wanted to to much Money for a player of his calibre.

 

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Thanks for your service Frosty......A great move & what a great club you are going too. More importantly, going to a club with a great coach.

Sure Frosty isn't our best backman, (maybe he was this season) but his run & carry we need in spades especially with the new 6 6 6 rules......& to show total disrespect to Sam & what the Dees desperately need is just so typical of Melbourne.

Sam frost may not be our future but if 2019 wasn't an indication that he is an important part of our make up, then I give up....maybe Goodwin is going to pull a rabbit out of the hat?

Tomlinson & Langdon not our future either.

 

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3 hours ago, praha said:

Frost played in a team with a fit May, Lever, Jetta, Salem and Hibberd. Albeit not many but he still played.

When Hore was injured?

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One of our biggest issues in 2019 was scores from turnovers. One of our biggest culprits was Frost.

It's not rocket science to say " see ya later" if he's asking for more than we're willing to pay.

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14 minutes ago, Laughing Goat said:

Thanks for your service Frosty......A great move & what a great club you are going too. More importantly, going to a club with a great coach.

Sure Frosty isn't our best backman, (maybe he was this season) but his run & carry we need in spades especially with the new 6 6 6 rules......& to show total disrespect to Sam & what the Dees desperately need is just so typical of Melbourne.

Sam frost may not be our future but if 2019 wasn't an indication that he is an important part of our make up, then I give up....maybe Goodwin is going to pull a rabbit out of the hat?

Tomlinson & Langdon not our future either.

 

Is it that disrespectful? At the end of the day a lot of our cap has gone to May and Lever. Need to sacrifice somewhere to make changes. If he wants/can get more money elsewhere then good on him

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2 hours ago, Redleg said:

I was looking at deals, not comparing players. I thought that was pretty obvious, as Howe and Frost are clearly different types of players. 

Anyway, since we are looking like losing Frost to the Hawks, why not go for one of their key forwards, to solve a major problem area of ours. 

They are bringing in Patton, which makes 5 tall forwards in Lewis, O'Brien, Gunston, Nash and Patton. They can't all get a game so why not see if we can entice one, say Nash, to want to come to us. I would rather get a tall forward than a late 2nd rounder pick. They also have their ruckman go forward quite often, making it more crowded.

With one reserve in Smith T gone and Keilty not coming on as hoped, we need another key forward even with Tom, Weid and maybe Petty, who could still end up in the backline.

Nash hasn't shown anything yet, I wouldn't have any interest. O'Brien maybe, but he just started to look like a regular in the Hawks side so they probably aren't keen to give him up.

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8 minutes ago, Vineytime said:

So what’s he worth on the trade table early pick in the 30’s ??

Under normal circumstances that seems about right but we will be lucky to get a packet of crisps from the Hawks and probably a half eaten stale packet at that

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2 hours ago, Engorged Onion said:

My take is this  - as soon as Goodwin labelled it "Frost ball" he was done at the club.

On the surface it looks like an endearing term, dig a bit deeper and it speaks of inconsistency, uncertainty in what will be delivered and in effect, each possession is a roll of a dice.

What Goodwin, and actually what we all know is, that players up the field like the certainty of how a player will in effect deliver a ball and adhere to structures. These are the anthesis to "Frost Ball" - he called have easily called it "Frost Roulette".

It’s so easy to bag out on a player who is looking at leaving as it’s all his fault. 

Whilst I agree ‘Frost ball’ was correctly explained by Goodwin at the time, the Coach could have also easily said “but hey, it means stuff all anyway because his teammates upfield are never in position anyway.”

It could be argued that Frost’s composure levels in game are relevant to the entire teams. 

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2 hours ago, Engorged Onion said:

On a side note, anyone know how many players at their 3rd club have won premierships?

 

2 hours ago, Redleg said:

Caddy for a start.

Martin Pike .... was that 3rd and 4th?

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2 hours ago, Redleg said:

I was looking at deals, not comparing players. I thought that was pretty obvious, as Howe and Frost are clearly different types of players. 

Anyway, since we are looking like losing Frost to the Hawks, why not go for one of their key forwards, to solve a major problem area of ours. 

They are bringing in Patton, which makes 5 tall forwards in Lewis, O'Brien, Gunston, Nash and Patton. They can't all get a game so why not see if we can entice one, say Nash, to want to come to us. I would rather get a tall forward than a late 2nd rounder pick. They also have their ruckman go forward quite often, making it more crowded.

With one reserve in Smith T gone and Keilty not coming on as hoped, we need another key forward even with Tom, Weid and maybe Petty, who could still end up in the backline.

I'd like Lewis but they won't let him go, Gunston would be another but can't see him being moved on

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56 minutes ago, Demons11 said:

Name the long list of mistakes and your development comment is complete and utter rubbish but let’s just throw out comments for the hell of it. 

We had a poor season but the following players have improved since joining the club and there development has been exceptional in some cases. 

Oliver

Brayshaw

Harmes

Trac

Fritsch

Salem

even the older bunch has improved

T Mac

Jetta 

Melksham

Shall I continue?

Frost himself has also improved under Goodwin but is still very limited and wanted to to much Money for a player of his calibre.

 

There has been serious lack of improvement in all those listed players

I say it again This club in my opinion cannot develop players. Fritch has not improved he started to play in his right position. 

Your opinion is different to mine so be it.

 

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2 minutes ago, Kent said:

There has been serious lack of improvement in all those listed players

 

No there hasn't.  

All of those listed have shown vast amounts of improvement over the years.  One down year doesn't wipe that away.

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9 minutes ago, Pennant St Dee said:

I'd like Lewis but they won't let him go, Gunston would be another but can't see him being moved on

I would look at Nash, could be gettable. Not as good as the others but is improving.

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1 hour ago, Tough Kent said:

Watch the 2018 final series closely. Frost did a lot right, but the amount of times he ran under a high ball, got turned inside out by his opponent (especially in the West Coast game), or he let the ball get out the back when he needed to stop it doing so were very costly. 

 

 

This is exactly right. A huge weakness in his game.

The issue i think is that he doesn't read the ball well in flight so whist he is strong and one on one really good, a forward who reads the flight of the a ball well will hurt him and often can, wit a slight nudge, get him under the ball.

A good example of that was gunston out marking him the semi last year. Frosty is heavier and stronger than gunston but did not have his ability to read the flight of the ball and ended up way out of position. 

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26 minutes ago, monoccular said:

 

Martin Pike .... was that 3rd and 4th?

Hardwick & L Mathews player/coach's 

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31 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

No there hasn't.  

All of those listed have shown vast amounts of improvement over the years.  One down year doesn't wipe that away.

Your opinion is just an opinion like mine  Im talking about real improvement ! But its ok if you disagree 

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Get it right 

Had his best year and continues to improve 

run and carry

played all 22 games

fit and firing

9th in B&F 

Fastest player on our list (2nd fastest in AFL...😀)

Destroys key forwards in match ups (completely shut down Ben Brown in round 23)

26 year old

Sure had some clangers but not alone there 

 

but we don’t even offer a contract !!! Ridiculous 

No wonder he is talking and walking to elsewhere 

 

 

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Give me Frost any day over the rest of our defence.

Height, pace, chase, tackle, never give up, durable, wants to play. Chases the pill and his opponents like no others. 

The rest of our defenders have dodgy bodies, slow, and prone to drop their heads. 

Who seriously thinks that May, Lever and Nev, will get through the season without injury and without missing games. And don't even mention Oscar.

Sure Frostys disposal is iffy but hey join the club. His attack on the ball and dash make him stand out so his clangers look bad. 

Best and most improved defender in the second half of season.

As the Tigers show you need players with dash and a bit of x factor that take risks. 

Always sorry to see someone go that wants to play with the Demons. 

 

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3 hours ago, Redleg said:

Caddy for a start.

Good one!

 I wasn't coming from a dismissive perspective - I was generally interested. I like random facts

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Reckon Dal Santo sums up my feelings on Frosty:

Nick Dal Santo: Sam Frost is fantastic defender but questionable with ball in hand. In the modern game you have to be able to make split-second decisions off the half back line. I think that might be the reason that the Demons haven't re-signed him.

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