Farewell Jack Watts

[jackaub 1,402]

10 minutes ago, Older demon said:

Putting aside personalities and that it is Jack, it was always going to be interesting to ship out someone at the end of the first year of a 3 year contract. It is usually the player, eg Gibbs, who wants out with lots of time on their contract.

Personally I think Goodwin has handled this poorly and McCartney talking openly and honestly at lunches about his desire to move Jack on hasn't helped in this day of social media where evrything you say can be broadcast.

Did they think that this form of rejection would make Jack leave? They cleraly don't know him and his personality. He has copped more flack and criticism than anyone I know and through it all has kept his head high and maintained his composure and not complained. He is very relient. It is no surprise that he has responded saying he doesn't want to leave despite his disappointment.

Why did the club give Jack a 3 year deal if they were so concerned with his shortcomings? What has changed in the space of 12 months? Does this mean any player on contract can expect to be shipped out if they have a bad season?

I liked it that the club came out and Mahoney made a statement about Hogan being a required player. The comments from the coach and captain critisizing Jack and Goodwin having to explain himself has been amateurish and out of character for how the club has been run. This will be difficult to manage if Jack digs in his heels and says "I have a contract you must honour it" as it is very clear Goodt wants him to leave.

Roos covered for Watts IMO  as soon as he wasnt there Goodwin made his move

He doesnt rate Watts and wants him out

[rpfc 27,451]

Just now, jackaub said:

Roos covered for Watts IMO  as soon as he wasnt there Goodwin made his move

He doesnt rate Watts and wants him out

And Watts responded.

 

 

FMD, if I was a Dee I wouldn't want to leave either...

Is that not something to laud? We bemoan contracts meaning nothing and here is, allegedly, Jack trying to hold us to it...

IF this is the case, Goodwin should bring him back into the fold and pay him out at the end of 2018 if it goes belly up...

[jackaub 1,402]

1 minute ago, rpfc said:

And Watts responded.

 

 

FMD, if I was a Dee I wouldn't want to leave either...

Is that not something to laud? We bemoan contracts meaning nothing and here is, allegedly, Jack trying to hold us to it...

IF this is the case, Goodwin should bring him back into the fold and pay him out at the end of 2018 if it goes belly up...

RPFC I for one  would be happy with that outcome

But as many on here have alluded Jack has to change his ways and convince the footy department the changs are real and permanent

[Leoncelli_36 2,264]

1 hour ago, Ron Burgundy said:

What's the issue with him having his own business?

All professional clubs encourage their players to study or focus on building a business, rather than playing X Box and gambling their lives away in their spare time.

 

Nothing, but when you take a mid injury holiday to Byron Bay to shoot a clip for your company, then return and the 2 week estimate layoff turns into a 4 to 6 week break, I'd suggest to you that he isn't a full time footballer. This is what irks the coaches 

[spalding 1,118]

If what GNF said is true, then the key to this whole debate, imo, is who was behind that fluff piece with channel 7 re queens birthday a week or so ago.

if not club sanctioned, or if Goodwin wasn't aware or advised of the content, it would seem like an effort by jack/manager to gain support from some inside the club and those outside (like us) for him to stay after getting some home truths at his 2017 exit interview. Perhaps he was spooked by this and what has happened with stringer.

if he is playing politics we have no choice but to seperate him from this playing group.

having said all that, I would love him to be contrite in the background begging for one last chance from the coaches/leadership group, putting in place a mentor etc to push him to where he needs to get to. I know that I am probably in fantasyland, and that if he could change he would have by now, but I'd love him to have the ultimate success with us - but perhaps those outcomes are mutually exclusive.

 

 

 

 

[binman 38,019]

8 minutes ago, Demons1858 said:

More like when you cut a girlfriend loose and she keeps coming back wanting to rekindle the romance but you've already got your eye on the next girl ... 

You have a contract with your girlfriends? I think that is something else...... 

[Demon Dynasty 15,413]

39 minutes ago, Socrates said:

The Coach and Skipper have thrown Jack Watts under a bus with their public comments about him. It's culture destroying.

The great Jim Stynes would be turning in his grave.

As to whether the comments were valid / warranted?   I see this as our potential Cats leadership group end of season 2006 talk (i hope) where more was asked of Ablett Jnr as the leadership group felt he wasn't prepping / giving it his all.  I don't have an issue with that part.  The way it's been handled and brought into the public spotlight however, is in my view very poor form.  I'm certainly not saying Watts is the equivalent to Ablett either.  Far from it, and who the hell is up at that level anyway.  So rare.  But the principles seem the same.  And Ablett was obviously good enough to not be shown the door.

I know this would have been discussed / posted before but Jones does have valid points... just wish he would keep them within the four walls.  The old saying, never air your dirty laundry in public still holds true, especially in this matter IMO!

...."Jones says that he demands Watts and the rest of the Demons’ playing group to take more of a responsibility for their game day preparation away from the club, believing it had a factor in their disappointing ninth-place finish in 2017.

“That’s the discussion we have had with him. That’s the discussion that went through the entire group post-season… You need to take control of (preparation),” the Dees on-baller said.

“I can hold you accountable from 8 ‘til 4, but I’m not sure what you do on the weekend, I’m not sure what you do after the game, I don’t know when you go to bed, what you eat and what decisions you make that then may impact your performance on the weekend.

“That’s something we addressed clearly particularly with our younger players. There’s inconsistencies with our performance and from my perspective, you see their weeks and how their weeks unfold and it’s hard to see it when you’re in the moment.

“We train pretty well, we prepare well when we’re at the club, but it’s those decisions that may impact your performance at the weekend is what I’m talking about: how well you recover and how much time and effort you put into extra work.”

Loose lips sink ships Jonesy!!  Who the hec is advising him and giving him the ok for this to be aired!??  Lead by Goody and Macca!!??  If so, horrible work guys & PR dept also!  What goes around comes around fellas

Extract courtesy of SEN

[Adzman 2,085]

This thread takes me back to the woewodin trade. Never since then have I seen a supporter base so divided. Clearly when it comes to Watts it stirs up something positive or negative in all of us.

On the plus side, we have something to talk about until trade week starts.....

[Demon Dynasty 15,413]

2 hours ago, Grand New Flag said:

There is a little more going on that has almost forced Goodwill to make public comments so to off load Watts.

As a contracted player Watts cant be traded without his approval. 

Watts has made an unprecedented pitch to the club to stay.  It started with a PR news story when he was first told to find a new club. His campaign to stay has now involved his manager, all senior coaches, he has looked for support form the administration, the Board and now the media and general public.  This has not gone down well with Goodwin and created a  problem for him, these tactics are unprecedented. Usually when players are told they are not wanted they cant find a new home fast enough. 

I don't like Watts chances of staying but he is going all out.  He is going down fighting.

This may be the wake up he requires.

Its going to be an interesting few weeks. 

If Goody was true working class as you say GNF then he could and should be capable of sorting it over a Pot & Parma eyeball and heart to heart down at the local surely!!

[Deecisive 1,651]

i would love to know if we can get to the point where we can get stats on players conversion rate of opportunities. for instance how often the ball was kicked to jack or his area and how often he got it/lost out. It would be a better stat than just kicks etc, it also comes down to realization of opportunities into worthwhile stats. 

[At the break of Gawn 3,488]

21 minutes ago, Rusty Nails said:

That's a solid summary that i can't argue with BOG.  My worry here is that Goody (and friends / assistants) are possibly playing favourites here but then there's the pre-season issue that Watts allegedly brought upon himself.  We can only speculate as to how others in the playing group are viewing all this.   The downside, if unfavourable, would be yet another potential ugly period ahead for this club if the culture turns sour.....again!!

Thanks. I get that there are no certainties in life, but when you sign a contract, you should at least have a sense of comfort that the club wants you around and your future is secure at the club. These contacts aren't designed for a club to break when a player has a drop in form, and Watts hasn't got arrested here. List management have made a three year decision, and it seems the FD are trying to wriggle out of a contract when there's a few clouds. 

How does something like this communicate faith in a players ability to get through a rough patch? This fosters a culture of mistrust and will have players anxious about being traded when they have a drop in form. 

[bing181 8,165]

3 hours ago, McQueen said:

Listening to Watts today, as stunned as he sounded, there was no real connection to why the status quo exists.

 

Agree with this. The fact that Jack doesn't see what the problem is, IS the problem. Yet to hear him acknowledge that this is all down to him - though perhaps that's a conversation that's been had in private.

Also fairly obvious from some of what Jack said today that this isn't just coming from Goodwin, it's club-wide. Hard to argue with "you give 100% on and off the field or you're out".

Edited October 3, 2017 by bing181

[SFebes 4,692]

20 minutes ago, Rusty Nails said:

If Goody was true working class as you say GNF then he could and should be capable of sorting it over a Pot & Parma eyeball and heart to heart down at the local surely!!

I would say that was done before last pre season...and the one before that....and....

[Demons1858 1,658]

38 minutes ago, binman said:

You have a contract with your girlfriends? I think that is something else...... 

Yes, it's called a marriage and a divorce

[Pates 9,536]

My thoughts on this have been that if he were happy with the idea of having an opportunity at another club then let’s make it happen. But hearing him come out and say he wants to be a Demon it makes it simple for me. Don’t trade him. 

I know this may be letting emotions get in the way but sport is an emotional caper. He has been through some of the worst times the club has ever faced and he has born the brunt of a lot of criticism directed at the club, very unfairly. Of course he would feel upset about the idea of us moving him on just as we start to push up the ladder. 

Putting all that aside though, one of our biggest deficiencies, which got worse during his injury run and failure to recapture his form, is disposal into the forward 50. He is the best at the club for that. He has also proved to be a cool head at clutch moments. 

We trade him for a 2nd rounder then I feel we’re losing at the trade table and it wouldn’t be for the first time with an established player. I mean have a look at our history of trading out players, Gysberts for Pederson is the only one I can think of that has worked for us and even that was pretty iffy for a while.

I say Watts and Goodwin sit down, Watts says “I’m committed, I want to be here next year”. Goodwin tells him exactly what is expected of him over pre-season and next year and we move on. 

I think this has been a poor move by the club, even more poorly executed. 

[Hellaintabadplacetobe 4,089]

3 hours ago, Cards13 said:

Can you say which interstate team?

Port

[beelzebub 22,225]

What does this tell me ?

Someone(s) haven't done a

bangup job thinking this through.

Amateur hour stuff

[Pates 9,536]

Just now, beelzebub said:

What does this tell me ?

Someone(s) haven't done a

bangup job thinking this through.

Amateur hour stuff

Agreed, after all the great work we’ve done to build a club that doesn’t have controversy and stays off the front page for the wrong reasons we’ve gone and done this. 

Clubs can’t whine about “a player being contracted” when we’re trying to push someone with 2 years on a contract out the door that clearly wants to be here. 

[Bitter but optimistic 21,246]

Quite a poignant interview just now on 7 news - Jack wants to stay.

However, the closing comment from the 7 reporter was "Look like Jack Watts has played his last game for Melbourne"

Interesting. Could be a bit to play out yet. 

[What 18,810]

Lever coming, Watts likely going....  Gaff on the horizon too? And who knows what other players we are into.

Going to be a fun trade period for Demon fans,  bring it on.

[Guest]

Something was missing in this statement, and it makes me wonder if Jack understands the severity of the situation.

The being surprised about the coaches not thinking he was cutting it didn't make me skeptical. For a lot of people, when the hammer comes down part of the reason it has come down is because they are oblivious to their own behavior (I know that this has happened to me before when I have been behaving like a prat and people have confronted me).

What does concern me is that some of the feedback hasn't been taken on board. It seemed Jack wasn't willing to hear what the coaching staff were saying and was too willing to say that everything was hunky dory until his hamstring injury. 

It had an effect sure, but did his hamstring have anything to do with him coming to preseason underdone? No one forced him to do that. 

If you are a person of principle, you can disagree with certain assessments put to you about your own character and performance (Matt Scarlett did so once when told by Bomber Thompson that Hamish Simpson was going to play in his spot). The difference was that he told Bomber he was wrong and then busted a gut to prove him wrong.

Jack would have been within his rights to rebut certain things but what I wanted to hear was 'I have my own opinions concerning what led to my decreased output at the end of the year. However, the perceptions are out there and I will do my best to change those perceptions'.  Instead, we heard about how he didn't want to 'leave his mates with finals so close'. 

Sorry, there are two things wrong with that. Finals ARE NOT a given next year. The team learnt this year (and Nev Jetta said it best) that they don't just 'hand out' finals spots. You have to go out and earn it. If you think that it's is par for the course we will get in, then you will be back at the pub on the first week of finals again.

Secondly, this is a professional sports club. It's not a social club for you to hang with your buddies.. You can be mates with your teammates but as I heard Tony Shaw say once on an Open Mike, it's better to be respected than liked. He was a bloke who got everything out of himself. In that, there is a lesson for Jack

Edited October 3, 2017 by Colin B. Flaubert

[Dee Zephyr 17,455]

Regardless of opinion on Watts, he does look good in a suit.

[McQueen 17,863]

3 hours ago, sue said:

Seems surprising that there are several other clubs who think he does.  Obviously they don't read Demonland and are happy to have a player with all of Watt's defects in their team.

"Above the shoulders"?

Knew I should've included that.

[whatwhat say what 18,918]

To a greater or lesser degree it seems like he’s not prepared to move interstate due to his comfort of home surrounds and no one in Victoria wants him including MFC

[SFebes 4,692]