Farewell Jack Watts

[Bitter but optimistic 22,241]

25 minutes ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

I think Jack Watts is a mixture of Nick Riewoldt and Lucas Cook. 

You've nailed it perfectly Ethan.

 

[Moonshadow 17,676]

6 hours ago, GCDemon said:

I have just signed up to share with you all some information I have learned this morning

As a Dees supporter on the Gold Coast with links to the Suns, found out that the Suns and the Power are doing a deal to help Power get a pick to us for Jack Watts. All centres around the Suns Pick 21 being up for grabs if the Suns can get more draft points to help with an academy selection when they get to their Pick 24. And Power with Pick 31 and 34 help them get an extra 260 points.

As it stands, this deal is on the table and will be close to signed off tomorrow or Tuesday:

Melbourne
GAIN - Pick 21
LOSE - Watts and Pick 66

Port Adelaide
GAIN - Watts and Pick 66
LOSE - Pick 31 and 34

Gold Coast Suns
GAIN - Pick 31 and 34
LOSE - Pick 21

This deal is extremely fair i think and very shrewd as everyone wins here based on these principles

- GCS want draft points, and 31 and 34 is more valuable than 21
- Dees get a very high 2nd round pick (21) for Watts. Send pick 66 to Power which they wont use anyway as they have just 3 list spots left and will take 21, 29 and 36 to the draft after trading 47 to Freo for Balic
- After giving up 31 and 34, Port want a later pick back so they can have enough decent picks to make their 3 compulsory draft selections. These will be Pick 49, 62 and our 66. With Watts, Rockliff and Motlop and still these 3 picks, a great trade period for the Power.

I know people may or may not believe me, but I have got this info via the Suns and sharing it on this forum wont affect the deal going through in the next 24 - 48 hours as no other clubs are in the discussion for Watts anymore..

Only sticking point will be if Suns want to keep 21 and put 24 into this deal instead and hope their academy player can get done with their Pick 26 that they have as well. It is the final piece of the puzzle in discussion apparently but it will be 21 or 24 for Watts.

What do we think Dees supporters??

*** Personally, pick 21 or 24 is fair for Jack. We paid 23 for Vince, 31 for Hibberd and 30 for Melksham who are all the equal or better players than Watts and were similar ages when traded. 
 

 

 

I like that a lot. However, I thought the AFL put a stop to clubs stockpiling late selection points for academy draftees by trading higher picks. Didn't we do something like that while roos was in charge with GWS? And other clubs did too iirc. Not sure though.

[Sargent Shultz 267]

For some reason, the anti-Watts crew remind me of Elmer Fudd

[Dr. Gonzo 24,219]

1 hour ago, rpfc said:

Really, you think this? And the 5 posters so far that liked the above?

You think he was 'application' away from being Nick Riewoldt?

You think he was 'giving a [censored]' away from being a great of the game?

 

I thought this thinking died years ago, and we all came to the conclusion that he was never able to reach those heights because he is not that type of player.

Would you say that Ben Kennedy is 'application' and 'commitment' away from being Jack Viney?

The very fact that some fans think this - floors me. He was never going to be the reincarnation of Nick Riewoldt, and to judge him on not getting there and blaming a lack of application and commitment is delusional and one of the many reasons we this is so personal to so many.

You were promised Nick Riewoldt and no-one ever explained to you it was never going to happen, and no-one took the blame but Jack.

I'm not saying you're wrong and this is on a bit of a tangent not strictly related to Watts but using the example raised

What IS the difference between Riewoldt & Watts? Kennedy & Viney? It makes for an interesting discussion on what makes a great player a great player.

52 minutes ago, jumbo returns said:

Not so fast, keyboard boy....

NR was playing for a Saints' team that was quite successful in his early tenure there, so his development would have been going along nicely

Compare that to the basket case that JW found himself in

You don't remember what the Saints were like in 2000? Don't remember Hudghton crying as he came off the ground because they sbatched victory from the jaws of defeat after something like 20 straight losses. Don't remember the disasters of Blight and Watson? That club was in disarray.

[Bobby McKenzie 2,385]

2 hours ago, Dr.D said:

what are you smoking. if you ask any other teamsupporters who are they more scared of when they play us do you think its jack watts. for me, i wouldnt even have him in my top 25 because i think his physical work is just so bad that it trumps anything positive that be brings to the table.

pedo who has probably had about 5% of the opportunity of watts has outperformed him already. i agree that hogan has a lot of weaknesses that he needs to work on but he can kick bags of goals which watts never can.

So you HONESTLY think Watts 2016 season and this season until injured was not up to scratch? Last season he showed everyone except you and a few others what he was really capable of. I suggest you take a panamax and sit down and look at just some of the replays over the past two seasons.( Until the time he was injured and beyond.) Gee Doc you and the other doc refuse to give him the slightest credit. But be unbiased in your appraisal.  On the subject of Hogan, he has  huge potential but he hasn't kicked bags of goals. Only twice in his career so far he has kicked 5 or more. You make it sound as if its a regular occurrence. We don't need a team of gorillas, just some CLASS would be great. I know, as well as another 297 supporters on this forum, that Jack has this attribute.

[Skuit 10,031]

12 minutes ago, Sargent Shultz said:

For some reason, the anti-Watts crew remind me of Elmer Fudd

Spot on SS.

Especially when one considers this a perfect representation of Jack:

300 × 400 - terapeak.com

[spirit of norm smith 16,460]

1 hour ago, fr_ap said:

You must be some negotiator mate - anyone who disagrees with you is told to sit down and shut up. Nice.

You're clearly running with your own narrative on this, aligning it with previous failures of the club, and I doubt I could convince you of anything otherwise, so good luck finding peace with the decision. I know I have very quickly.

We have put Jack on the table and to those who have asked why, been upfront that for a senior player of his experience, his inconsistency is unacceptable. How this equates to dragging him through the mud or 'dismissing' him, I have no idea. 

And yes, in the recent past we have kept inconsistent senior players, and have not used their inconsistency as a catalyst or excuse to trade. That recent past has also been extremely unsuccessful. I don't think that's a coincidence so I for one am pleased the club is taking a harsher stance. 

But hey, my opinion isnt as valid as yours is it? 

It’s not what is happening, it’s the how and this is my opinion, as valid as yours. Still you attacked my opinion and yet get offended when I reply.  QED

[Ron Burgundy 8,584]

7 hours ago, GCDemon said:

I have just signed up to share with you all some information I have learned this morning

As a Dees supporter on the Gold Coast with links to the Suns, found out that the Suns and the Power are doing a deal to help Power get a pick to us for Jack Watts. All centres around the Suns Pick 21 being up for grabs if the Suns can get more draft points to help with an academy selection when they get to their Pick 24. And Power with Pick 31 and 34 help them get an extra 260 points.

As it stands, this deal is on the table and will be close to signed off tomorrow or Tuesday:

Melbourne
GAIN - Pick 21
LOSE - Watts and Pick 66

Port Adelaide
GAIN - Watts and Pick 66
LOSE - Pick 31 and 34

Gold Coast Suns
GAIN - Pick 31 and 34
LOSE - Pick 21

This deal is extremely fair i think and very shrewd as everyone wins here based on these principles

- GCS want draft points, and 31 and 34 is more valuable than 21
- Dees get a very high 2nd round pick (21) for Watts. Send pick 66 to Power which they wont use anyway as they have just 3 list spots left and will take 21, 29 and 36 to the draft after trading 47 to Freo for Balic
- After giving up 31 and 34, Port want a later pick back so they can have enough decent picks to make their 3 compulsory draft selections. These will be Pick 49, 62 and our 66. With Watts, Rockliff and Motlop and still these 3 picks, a great trade period for the Power.

I know people may or may not believe me, but I have got this info via the Suns and sharing it on this forum wont affect the deal going through in the next 24 - 48 hours as no other clubs are in the discussion for Watts anymore..

Only sticking point will be if Suns want to keep 21 and put 24 into this deal instead and hope their academy player can get done with their Pick 26 that they have as well. It is the final piece of the puzzle in discussion apparently but it will be 21 or 24 for Watts.

What do we think Dees supporters??

*** Personally, pick 21 or 24 is fair for Jack. We paid 23 for Vince, 31 for Hibberd and 30 for Melksham who are all the equal or better players than Watts and were similar ages when traded. 
 

 

 

You have just won the Rising Star.

This is the best first post I have ever read.

But for paying any of Watts' salary going forward, this seems to be a very good deal.

 

 

[jnrmac 20,081]

6 hours ago, pinkshark said:

Stupid post the above.  I couldn't care if he was no 1 or number 100.  He is amongst our best 10 players.  Bottom line.  And we are giving him away.  None of this is complicated.

So why has he only finished in the top 10 of the b&of twice? 5th and 9th. In 9 yrs of football?

[jnrmac 20,081]

7 hours ago, Sir Why You Little said:

That is absolute drivel. 

THE CLUB treated JW as the Messiah for years and now wonder why he cruises in 3rd gear  the CLUB did that  

READ THIS CAREFULLY

Jack has never had the Rocket up his Backside before  So YOU and all the other “experts on his psyche”have no idea how he will react....yet  

this is the ONE and ONLY reason i would give him this summer preseason  

because now he is not the chosen boy  he has to fight for his dignity and pay check  

He has never had to do that before  

if he goes to Port it will be under the same conditions  sink or swim  

Nobody can predict the outcome of this summer until it happens

not even you BB...not even you mate

 

Really ? Getting dropped in the final round of 2015 wasn't a rocket? Getting dropped late this year wasn't a rocket? Getting dropped for the pre season games wasn't a rocket? FFS Watts even dropped himself a few years ago.

selective memory...

Edited October 15, 2017 by jnrmac

[Wells 11 5,406]

8 hours ago, spalding said:

I vote for this as the best post of the 200 pages.

I think GCDemon may have just taken over on that front. 

[Ron Burgundy 8,584]

2 hours ago, Redleg said:

I am actually getting sick of this.

I happen to really like Jack and hoped he would stay.

I would still be happy if he did.

I along with Whispering Jack was at Southport Footy ground some 8 or so years ago, where Jack was playing in a practice match.

The crowd was giving it to Jack as a high draft pick and I was screaming out encouragement to Jack from my position at the interchange area on the fence and was baiting the crowd all game. Every kick or handball that Jack had I turned around to the crowd and baited them about how good he was.

 Jack couldn't help but notice, as I screamed at him every time he came off, that he was killing them and they didn't like it and he was thrilled with the support and came over to us as soon as the game ended and chatted. That was the first of many chats I have had with Jack over the years. He became one of my favourite Demons. On a fan day like Luna Park, I always made a beeline for Jack with my grand daughter to spend a few minutes with him. He has always remembered me and been happy to chat.

I have supported him when other Dees fans have attacked him and wanted him gone over the years.

I still support him.

However I support the MFC more than Jack.

As a result of a decision made by the FD, not me, I have reluctantly accepted that Jack is probably leaving.

I acknowledge there is probably not much I can do about that decision.

I am trying to support the FD of my club and the club.

I think I have been reasonable in my comments towards Jack.

I put up a list of players that the FD would probably value more than Jack, obviously correct since they are not being offered elsewhere and didn't include future players like Weid and made no other comment.

You can disagree with that list if you wish to.

However, I have never shown dislike of Jack.

I will not boo him at his next club and in fact wish him well, unlike number 9 of GWS.

I think you owe me an apology.

PS. I note you are knocking other MFC players on that list. Interesting.

Terrific post.

[Bobby McKenzie 2,385]

2 hours ago, Redleg said:

I am actually getting sick of this.

I happen to really like Jack and hoped he would stay.

I would still be happy if he did.

I along with Whispering Jack was at Southport Footy ground some 8 or so years ago, where Jack was playing in a practice match.

The crowd was giving it to Jack as a high draft pick and I was screaming out encouragement to Jack from my position at the interchange area on the fence and was baiting the crowd all game. Every kick or handball that Jack had I turned around to the crowd and baited them about how good he was.

 Jack couldn't help but notice, as I screamed at him every time he came off, that he was killing them and they didn't like it and he was thrilled with the support and came over to us as soon as the game ended and chatted. That was the first of many chats I have had with Jack over the years. He became one of my favourite Demons. On a fan day like Luna Park, I always made a beeline for Jack with my grand daughter to spend a few minutes with him. He has always remembered me and been happy to chat.

I have supported him when other Dees fans have attacked him and wanted him gone over the years.

I still support him.

However I support the MFC more than Jack.

As a result of a decision made by the FD, not me, I have reluctantly accepted that Jack is probably leaving.

I acknowledge there is probably not much I can do about that decision.

I am trying to support the FD of my club and the club.

I think I have been reasonable in my comments towards Jack.

I put up a list of players that the FD would probably value more than Jack, obviously correct since they are not being offered elsewhere and didn't include future players like Weid and made no other comment.

You can disagree with that list if you wish to.

However, I have never shown dislike of Jack.

I will not boo him at his next club and in fact wish him well, unlike number 9 of GWS.

I think you owe me an apology.

PS. I note you are knocking other MFC players on that list. Interesting.

 Well presented and very interesting. I do sincerely apologise Redleg for my comment about your apparent dislike for Jack. It seems i was very wrong on this one.I guess the thought of losing such a class player and not really understanding why has led to my low opinion of Goodwin and the FD. I am really disappointed in their actions on this one. I too love the Demons ( have for over 60 years) and can't work out the logic of their call. Time will tell I guess. As for knocking other MFC players though I really can't see where I did this but no matter. Cheers.

[Hunt29 275]

Watts is a very talented athlete and footballer. That talent will get you so far. You can as Jack did, win the Lark Medal. However once you get to an AFL club you need to work extremely hard. I'm not sure he's had the work ethic, drive or commitment. However I also feel the club has some responsibility as well. For example he should have been playing some school footy in year one. I remember hearing Robert Shaw who I think may have coached him. He said Watts played one game and on strict instructions had limited minutes etc. apparently almost won them the game to. The clubs development of young players was very poor at the time and the fitness regime was apparently lacking. So unless you had the drive and work ethic of Nathan Jones you might struggle. 

When Roos came on board he had to repair and build relationships. He needed to build confidence in guys like Watts. He needed to take a soft approach with the some of the players. 

Goody has taken a tougher approach and brought a hard edge to the place. We saw earlier this year that clearly Watts wasn't meeting standards. And it appears he possibly didn't commit himself to rehabbing his hammy. 

Personally I'll be happier if he stays but if we get a decent pick then I can live with it. I'll be disappointed if the club flips him for pick 31.

[rpfc 28,433]

1 hour ago, Roost It said:

We disagree 

So Riewoldt and Watts are as talented as each other with the same predispositions in physicality and courage? With the same god given endurance and marking ability?

@Dr. Gonzo - the difference between a Watts and Riewoldt or a Kennedy and a Viney are intangible and tangible. 

The tangible differences between Watts and Riewoldt are so marked and numerous that the difference in intangibles don’t even register. Don’t matter. 

The intangibles that Watts didn’t live up to - commitment, application, ‘giving a [censored]’ - only meant he didn’t become a better version of Jack Watts.

Not some delusional fever dream that he shat away the chance for us to have a great of the game play for us.

[daisycutter 29,616]

58 minutes ago, Sargent Shultz said:

For some reason, the anti-Watts crew remind me of Elmer Fudd

and the pro-watts crew reminds me of don quixote 

[Biffen 12,943]

1 hour ago, Return to Glory said:

That's very true JR. And the club put him front and centre as our Messiah when he clearly wasn't ready for it. The disaster that was that first Collingwood match still sticks with me.

People recall that time on the wing with some distortion.

3 Collingwood players were intent on roughing him up ,which is true, it's a game for bullies if we are honest.

What happened was that he drew a free kick through their stupidity.

He was not hurt and indeed had a slight smile as he took the kick

It's funny how people repeat things they think to be something when they are only partially so.

It was a time when the club was a revolving [censored] house of mercenaries drifting through without aim or purpose.

What I like about Jack is that he became an extremely loyal man-and I am a very loyal person myself.

Goodwin is just a foreigner to me at this stage and I think presentation night was somewhat of a shock to him at how much our Jesus ,I mean Jack ,is loved after his 9 year input, no matter how inconsistent.

[Gator 17,361]

9 minutes ago, rpfc said:

So Riewoldt and Watts are as talented as each other with the same predispositions in physicality and courage? With the same god given endurance and marking ability?

@Dr. Gonzo - the difference between a Watts and Riewoldt or a Kennedy and a Viney are intangible and tangible. 

The tangible differences between Watts and Riewoldt are so marked and numerous that the difference in intangibles don’t even register. Don’t matter. 

The intangibles that Watts didn’t live up to - commitment, application, ‘giving a [censored]’ - only meant he didn’t become a better version of Jack Watts.

Not some delusional fever dream that he shat away the chance for us to have a great of the game play for us.

Excellent post.

It just goes to show that there's more to AFL footy than raw talent and the best recruiters have an innate sense of what to look for and even then will get them wrong.

[Return to Glory 8,441]

5 minutes ago, Hunt29 said:

Sorry about the font size in my last post. Types it in notes on my phone and trying to edit the font size on my phone just isn't working. 

It's fine. These things happen.

[dees189227 12,394]

So now herald sun journos are tweeting that Jack didn't have a dig at the club about getting rid of a good kick, he was replying to a little kids video.

Well journos maybe before u type a headline actually check the footage first so then Jack doesn't cop unnecessary bashing online. 

[GCDee 3,199]

8 hours ago, GCDemon said:

I have just signed up to share with you all some information I have learned this morning

As a Dees supporter on the Gold Coast with links to the Suns, found out that the Suns and the Power are doing a deal to help Power get a pick to us for Jack Watts. All centres around the Suns Pick 21 being up for grabs if the Suns can get more draft points to help with an academy selection when they get to their Pick 24. And Power with Pick 31 and 34 help them get an extra 260 points.

As it stands, this deal is on the table and will be close to signed off tomorrow or Tuesday:

Melbourne
GAIN - Pick 21
LOSE - Watts and Pick 66

Port Adelaide
GAIN - Watts and Pick 66
LOSE - Pick 31 and 34

Gold Coast Suns
GAIN - Pick 31 and 34
LOSE - Pick 21

This deal is extremely fair i think and very shrewd as everyone wins here based on these principles

- GCS want draft points, and 31 and 34 is more valuable than 21
- Dees get a very high 2nd round pick (21) for Watts. Send pick 66 to Power which they wont use anyway as they have just 3 list spots left and will take 21, 29 and 36 to the draft after trading 47 to Freo for Balic
- After giving up 31 and 34, Port want a later pick back so they can have enough decent picks to make their 3 compulsory draft selections. These will be Pick 49, 62 and our 66. With Watts, Rockliff and Motlop and still these 3 picks, a great trade period for the Power.

I know people may or may not believe me, but I have got this info via the Suns and sharing it on this forum wont affect the deal going through in the next 24 - 48 hours as no other clubs are in the discussion for Watts anymore..

Only sticking point will be if Suns want to keep 21 and put 24 into this deal instead and hope their academy player can get done with their Pick 26 that they have as well. It is the final piece of the puzzle in discussion apparently but it will be 21 or 24 for Watts.

What do we think Dees supporters??

*** Personally, pick 21 or 24 is fair for Jack. We paid 23 for Vince, 31 for Hibberd and 30 for Melksham who are all the equal or better players than Watts and were similar ages when traded. 
 

 

 

Great first post

Cool name too. 

Ps thanks for the info amid all the craziness which is this thread! 

[Redleg 40,926]

30 minutes ago, Bobby McKenzie said:

 Well presented and very interesting. I do sincerely apologise Redleg for my comment about your apparent dislike for Jack. It seems i was very wrong on this one.I guess the thought of losing such a class player and not really understanding why has led to my low opinion of Goodwin and the FD. I am really disappointed in their actions on this one. I too love the Demons ( have for over 60 years) and can't work out the logic of their call. Time will tell I guess. As for knocking other MFC players though I really can't see where I did this but no matter. Cheers.

Thanks.

Yes the Jack Watts departure is certainly a divisive one for the fans.

Hopefully we end up ok at the end of this week.

[jumbo returns 6,741]

Just now, Redleg said:

Thanks.

Yes the Jack Watts departure is certainly a divisive one for the fans.

Hopefully we end up ok at the end of this week.

Is it conceivable, Mr Red, that the club could be w....w.....w....wrong! in all of this?

Go Jack!

[Biffen 12,943]

Interestingly ,Demonland currently has a poll regarding supporting the club or the player.

For my Father, RDB and Melbourne were synonymous .

According to my father ,when Barassi went to Carlton

"That was it for me-money had ruined the game"

In hindsight -it was our lack of using money that ruined our club for decades i suppose.

 

[jumbo returns 6,741]

7 minutes ago, dees189227 said:

So now herald sun journos are tweeting that Jack didn't have a dig at the club about getting rid of a good kick, he was replying to a little kids video.

Well journos maybe before u type a headline actually check the footage first so then Jack doesn't cop unnecessary bashing online. 

Jack is copping an online bashing???

By who? Give me their hashtags now!!