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Surprised the media didn’t say our culture is terrible because our vice captain didn’t turn up early to pre season either 🙄 We all know Viney is an unfit slacker 😂

I don't discount the possibility that the club arranged for Oliver not to be present at the first day of training so as to avoid a media circus.

Clarry has always been a hard trainer, that's the least his problems. Agree with 'pilgrim' here. Would rather see a happy, healthy player with a clear mind. The only statement he needs to make is when he hits season 2024. With his teammates, enjoying the game and back at his peak. All the rest is BS. You don't make statements in November...

You can’t win, those calling for Oliver to be there to make a statement are the same who say words and statements in pre season means little, it’s all about peering on game day and in particular at the pointy end of the season

And achieve what exactly? Harmes - McAdam. I'm more than happy with that. We've had nothing for Harmes to do for 2 years and have been crying out for a guy like McAdam to provide a mix of what Fritsch and Kossie do. JJ - Billings. JJ might go on to be a player for the Swans but he was a free agent, we replaced him with a player who could be an immediate upgrade in a needs position. Grundy - Fullarton. Personally I'd have liked to get in on the Brandon Ryan deal but Fullarton has a fair bit of upside and I'd rather have him than an unhappy and expensive Grundy. 33 was worthless in this draft. Would've ended up pick 40 on the night of the draft. We ended up with a spare pick 42 (44 come draft night) which we dealt for a future 3rd. 25 became 34 on draft night. Ended up at Carlton for Billy Wilson. 18, 34 and a pick we'd never use for 13 to get Tholstrup. Doesn't look so bad when Essendon and GWS gave up 2nd rounders to move 1 spot on draft night. We've replenished our depth with better fits and drafted 2 talented kids. It's not flashy but the flashy moves often don't work out. Plus surely we're reloading with list spots and salary cap to be more aggressive next year.

Indeed. And on Clarry, sure the club has said he has some off field issues to sort out, and there might have been some issues in terms of how he rehabbed his hammy, but on field and on the track he has never been accused of being anything less than 100% committed and full throttle (his numbers were nuts after missing nearly 4 months of footy). So why does he need to come back a week early? To prove what to whom? Ooh Clarry has been a bad boy, he should send a message he is a good boy by coming back a week early. There's every chance he has been advised by people providing support that to get his head in a good place and get on top of his demons (metaphorically speaking - literally, he could just go to training) he is better away from the club as long a possible in terms of maximizing his break.

I think we might see young Woey jnr force his way into the side more this year. Looks fit and now has the body to match. Very coachable kid too, from all accounts. Good on him

More rubbish reporting from the Herald Sun. Headline: DEES’ OLDIES RIPE FOR FIRST SESSION, OLLY MISSES MEMO Josh Barnes - Track watch Opening Two Paragraphs: “A bunch of senior Melbourne leaders joined their younger teammates for day one of pre-season on Monday but Clayton Oliver was not one of them. “As an experienced player, Oliver is not required back until next week, with the first week of training officially only for first to four year Demons.” If Clarrie is not required back until next week and is still on leave, exactly what “memo” has he missed?

Great interview Andrew. JT never gives too much away. But I think there are things you can deduce if you listen carefully. He somewhat gave away Windsor was at least a little needs related, and watching how slow we’ve been between the arcs the last 2 years it’s not a surprise. Why do I get the feeling they wanted Windsor at 11 but he kept rising? When JT does he due diligence on a player the word probably gets around and other sides start circling. I get the sense he’s excited by Tholstrup’s potential in a range of roles but also they really like the character and early indications are so do I! He was probably a little more excited for Kynan Brown than I expected. Aside from the 2 early picks I get the sense Jed Adams might be a favourite of JTs. Hope he gets through preseason healthy.

His statement will be made and made boldly, come R1.

I'll be going on Friday so everyone can look forward to a detailed report.

Slightly off the topic but every single supporter could do worse than watching a compilation of Clayton Oliver's highlights. It has been forgotten the calibre of footballer Clarry is. There's no way we miss the 8. The coach is brilliant and he's hired a strong strategist in McQualter.

And no one was predicting that Brown or T-Mac would be incapacitated rendered ineffective for nearly all the season On top of that Fritsch was nowhere near match fit when he returned. As previously mentioned, Melk & Petty were out Brayshaw being taken out in an act of thuggery meant that we couldn't use Petracca forward as we would have liked So if the majority of those aforementioned players were fit and raring to go, I'm not sure JVR gets a game ... instead of that he was a virtual linchpin I never make excuses but sound reasoning has to be acknowledged ... we did exceeedingly well to get so close in both finals All this misery talk of a straight sets exit seems to be bypassing that our stocks were bare (in the forward line) As for 2022, I reckon we mucked up fitness wise and if our top players were exhausted, take the chance and rest them ... we won our first 10 games so we had that luxury

Stop talking logic, the naysayers want to feel important. These things are so hard to win, we’ve given ourselves good chances the last two seasons. Overload and wear and tear injuries hit us in 2022 and we learned from that with our player/load management in 2023 to give ourselves a good shot at it. What happened to Petty and Melksham really hurt us heading into finals and there was nothing we could do about that. The significance of those two missing out to our forward structure can not be understated especially against Collingwood and tying up Moore but such is life. Fagan and Hinkley would love 1 so posters are comparing Apples and oranges as usual

He also clearly stated that we were only ever going to take 2 players in the draft.

I think I might find out when Josh Barnes takes his annual leave then check in to see if he gets back to the office a week early.

It's kind of depressing watching some people here who have so much of their identity wrapped up in Melbourne being terrible that they desperately want to pretend we're not good. It's really sad.

Let's leave Clarry alone. If there are still some issues, let him and the club sort them out without any pressure from us, who should be his strongest supporters. GO CLARRY GO GOODY GO DEES

True. And regardless of which government is in power, there is no funding unless you have a proposal which will justify the injection of funds. Our Boards have been asleep at the wheel for the past 40 years, and the current crop have done nothing to further that position. Other clubs have gone to the government with all sorts of slim community benefits which justify the government putting in as well. If we want something to happen we have to do it ourselves, then go with a proposition to the powers that be. Jim Stynes was able to muster supporter enthusiasm to clear debts. What has been asked of supporters in that past 40 years toward getting a home base? Nothing. Imagine what we would have available if we had been asked to make just a small contribution each year over that period of time. All that has been sought has been handouts. All we have heard in the past 4 years has been " we can't say anything because negotiations with government are in confidence" . I wonder what sort of hollow promises will be sprouted at this years AGM?

The three that caught my eye today: 1. Woey. On a similar path to Sparrow as someone who for a couple of years (not so much now for Tom) has just come back noticeably thicker. We might have our answer for who can go on ball if we're shorter on depth after losing Harmes and JJ. 2. Rivers. He just looks cherry ripe. Leaner than before without losing strength. No idea how much they'll try him in the midfielder but if nothing else he'll be covering more ground. 3. The 2nd year talls. Jefferson is the obvious one because he was skinny to begin with and isn't now. But KFW is a unit. Jed Adams looks good. And Verrall for a 199cm ruck is looking strong without losing mobility.

If we miss the 8, I will bite the bullet and teach everyone on here how to correctly use an ellipsis… 7 dots?! That ain’t it.

I don't think that is correct, the final ladder is after the finals and the draft order and the next year's fixture (groups of six) are based on this. The Premiers finished first no matter where they were placed at the end of the home and away. Brisbane finished second, Carlton third, GWS fourth and we finished sixth.

So who's starting the Marley Davey thread?

They have for the last three years. ☺️

Top job, Andy, as ever. Perhaps my biggest take out was that Kalani White, Noah Yze and Marley Davey are all being closely monitored for upcoming F/S. Hard not to get excited!

Yikes, it doesn't take much for the Chicken Little Melbourne supporters to come out from under their doonas, does it???

He's a witch!!

Agreed, Disco def ahead of MH 💯 but Marty offers depth, kicking, decision making & helps sure up stocks well. We’re extremely thin down back esp in that mid-range size so he fits A need & we don’t give away list spots for fun so again, I defer to JT & his team above ANY of you fine specimens, which is why — for me — I’m wrapped cus if we’ve added him it means he’s up to it & for a guy that hasn’t had a lot of luck, I rkn that’s a great thing! So no, not my brother — but he’s a demon I like due to his assets, they offer something different we don’t have a surplus of! So relax a little & lighten the hell up, such a group of grumpy sods on here. Bloody hell it’s exhausting

Fantastic to see Tmac up and and about. It's worth remembering that this time last year Tmac was still rehabbing his foot injury. In hindsight they made an error, albeit a very understandable one given a premiership was on the table, trying to rush him back at the end of the 2022 home and away season. But that decision stuffed Tmac's 2023 preseason as he struggled with complications for months. It's accepted fact that players who have interrupted preseasons struggle to get back to their best that season. I suspect that was particularly true for Tmac, one because he had a foot injury which would have negatively impacted his aerobic conditioning. And two Tmac has said he needs to a mountain of work to get into peak shape. Tmac ended up having surgery last season (2023). I cant recall the specifics, but given it was foot surgery i assume it was likely related to his 2022 injury. He never got back his full mobility and speed over the ground when he came back in but at least it appears his foot was ok. A full preseason and no further injuries and Tmac still has a big role to play. Similarly, great to see Salo on deck. From memory he had a great pre xmas period last year (and maybe Jan too?) training wise but it all went pear shaped in Feb with his thyroid issue. Another season impacted by an interrupted preseason. A full preseason and no further injuries and salo will be a critical piece of the puzzle next season. We desperately need him to get back to his 2021 form in terms of his ability to make high risk kicks. If he can get back to that level it will massively help our transition game, but perhaps more importantly our ability to retain the ball in our back half and on transition. Turnovers in our opponent's half of the ground back cost us dearly in our home and away and finals losses to the blues and our QF loss to the Pies. An in form Salo also takes some pressure of McVee and Bowey. Ideally both can be get more offensive and take on some high risks kicks too but that's harder if Salo is not at his best.

Photo gallery is up. https://www.melbournefc.com.au/albums/1470139/afl-training-gallery-pre-season-begins?modal=true&type=gallery&playlistId=1470139&playlistSize=10 Jefferson certainly looks like he's added a little bit of weight on. Sparrow is a pure ball of muscle. Blake Howes looks like he's put on a bit of weight as well. Woey looking very fit.

I'd say the opposite. Ladder position is irrelevant. Finals is the real stuff and when the proper season starts. We have a finals system to determine the winners and placers. Minor premiers are meaningless. We have failed to finish top four two seasons running. We've [censored] the bed and are wasting our premiership window. If we fail again next year, I expect significant changes to senior coaches and onfield personnel and leaders. Otherwise we become Port Adelaide who keep resigning Hinkley as coach and never achieve any success.

HS=TRASH

I think that's one area I'm comfortable with going into 2024. May, Tomlinson and Lever as our three taller defenders, with T Mac (some may disagree), Turner and Hore as back ups.

Spot on. we have finished 6th the last two Seasons Get your ship together Goodwin….

Outstanding, insightful interview Andy. My hopes for 2024 and beyond are becoming rejuvenated after listening. JT always seems so open with his responses. Thanks to you and all Demonlanders who posed questions. ⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️

A Collingwood supporters honest (not trash talk or trolling) assessment of Melbourne that I came across on another forum. 5th to 8th with a chance of dropping out. Also sees parallels between Collingwood's fall from grace after 2010 and a potentially Melbourne's from 2021. That’s the nature of a very even league. As a Collingwood fan who depressingly watched the 2010 team unravel over the following years, I can’t help but draw several comparisons to the Melbourne premiership team of 2021. Both teams were absolutely red hot on route to winning a flag and near unbeatable for a long time - the Pies won 32/35 games at one stage and Melbourne won 17 on the trot over two seasons including their premiership win. Pies 2011 and Melbourne 2022 started on fire but at some stage, the invincibility aura wore off, and culminated in unsuccessful finals runs. Pies 2012 and Melbourne 23 were similar too - still carrying much of the core and class of their premiership sides, the depth had dropped off, and the teams were just not at the level of the competing grand final teams anymore. In 2013, the Magpies went 13-9 to secure sixth but bombed out in the first week of finals. My realistic expectation of Melbourne for 2024 is probably a 5th-8th finish but my bullish feeling is that due to an unbalanced 23 and skinny depth, Melbourne could drop out. The forward line is still a serious concern and intercept defenders will likely continue to hurt the Dees. Is there too much expectation placed on Petty to glue the forward line together based on his 6 goal game against Richmond? I think so. A pass mark for he and JVR would be 65 goals between them. Realistically both are in their infancy as forwards at this level and it’s not going to be easy. I really like the Billings acquisition and if Windsor kicks on immediately, the Demons will have elite outside run and better connection with their forwards. McAdam at best breaks even with Melksham’s output I think. Trading Grundy was obviously the right move, but a back up as unreliable as Fullarton is not good. You can’t afford to have Gawn miss games IMO. Then there’s the behind the scenes factor. I don’t have a read on Melbourne’s plying chemistry, but history suggests when you’ve got a number of loose units at one club, it eventually catches up and hurts on field results. Smith looks suspended, Oliver very close to blowing football and (I edited player out per DL rules) by way of rumour has some real issues. There’s likely some other culprits too that are better at covering their tracks (as would be at any club). Melbourne undoubtedly still have a really good playing group but I think their days of seriously contending are gone unless there is change

Well i look at it this way i dont shed Crocodile tears over our losses, I look at what happened, firstly BBB is out JVR is out (and no action from club) Melks out, Pets out and not to mention the around 23 touches we missed from the the legal it seems, head high shirt front on Brays and still only miss out by a kick.

Instant man (boy) crush, that's weird from a 53 y.o. bloke isn't it.... Anyway mad props to the young fella name checking Jetta, be cheering hard at your debut.

Absolutely, well deserved. Meanwhile, Garner is left wondering once again. Hopefully she'll get the team success on Sunday.

Why the hell is Zanker on the bench when she was the leading goalkicker?

I’ll be in a parallel universe cos it just won’t happen

… the meltdown on Demonland will truly be epic.

Wow Andy you and JT covered a lot of territory and every player that we asked about. JT goes at 100 mph he has great recall and you can tell how closely he follows each of his recruits and watches them closely for the right signs. I love his word Intent, something that he seeks in the draftee’s. Top interview thanks again.!!

Rounded up, Australia's government debt to GDP ratio is 38 percent. Remarkable low by both peak historical standards and compared to our major trading partners and other developed countries. https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/economy/government/government-finance-statistics-annual/2021-22 Despite the rantings and ravings of those in public life, Australia is in remarkably good shape financially. And anti-intuitively maybe, the debt to GPD ratio is dropping quickly due to inflation being higher compared to its average of the last 20 years. So, in short, there's more than enough liquidity to build a home stadium in Melbourne, and Alice Springs.

Continue living my life because I don't have an unhealthy emotional dependence to a football team

I’m of the opinion that the real season begins in September. They don’t award the premiership cup to the team that finishes the H&A ladder in first

We have strengthened our forward half not including organic growth in existing kids, we have added run and carry and retained and strengthened our backline. Only bad luck and severe injuries will stop us, 2024 is a Premiership year for the Dees.!!!

Fixed

Agree, but let's spin it the other way. He's taking the time he needs (and has been granted) to enjoy his off season, get away from the city and reset. I'd rather him be happy, healthy and start on time instead of rushing back just to please people.