Leaderboard

Disagree with your first sentence DD. In fact I’ll take it one step further & suggest it’s very old school yesterday thinking. Sure if a young player is attempting to break into the AFL starting 23 then it’s relevant but BBB ‘s circumstance was completely different. The dynamics & personal in the 2 competition’s are completely different. BBB was there to maintain match fitness only. He has plenty of credit’s & runs on the board to return ASAP. The bloke was a critical piece in delivering our Premiership & you want him running around at Casey, getting targeted off the ball by VFL thugs? Extraordinary thinking really.

90% of that distance covered is in his runups when kicking for goal.

One thing I think we can all agree on is that if it wasn't for ... Rail replacement buses. Public transport in general. Uber prices. Parking. Too long a walk after we've parked. Traffic. $10 beers. Mid strength beer. Food outlets closed. Loud music. Weather too nice to go. Weather too bad to go. Games on public holidays. Games at night. Games at 3.20pm on a Sunday. Games at 1.10pm on a Saturday. Games on a Wednesday. Games on a Thursday. Games on a Friday. Games at Easter. Games on Mother's Day. Bringing the family to a night game. Leaving the family to go to a night game. Games against interstate teams. Games against teams with no rivalry. Games at Marvel. School holidays. Going away for the weekend. Can't sit exactly where we want. Sitting on level 4. Can't stand at the game. Spending all our money on the Grand Prix the week before. Can't pay in cash at the gate. Not being able to access our digital ticket until 72 hours before a game. Stupid ticketing system. Ticketek Ticketmaster Free to air on TV Kayo Club not promoting games enough. 2 years of lockdown. Covid. ...we would all crawl over broken glass to watch this Melbourne team right now.

Bask in the gloriousness of this article published today in Stats Insider: https://www.statsinsider.com.au/blog/afl/deemonic-presence-why-melbourne-are-set-for-years-of-contention

Sitting on the fence on the wing, couldn't help but be amazed at how much Jack Viney has improved. Always thought he was limited with his skills and decision making. Now he just looks a different player and I am so pleased to have been wrong. He will catch a lot of teams off guard with the attention on the 2 bulls.

Players need to keep their mouths shut when it comes to the umpires. I will 100% support a zero-tolerance policy in this regard Trying to police reactions is futile and counter productive. Frustration, disappointment etc will always be apparent in a players demeanour. You can’t fake or curtail it. It will be written all over their face. Rugby Union is as an example where referees are respected no matter what. And it’s a sport full of interpretations. Players will shake their head and show obvious disappointment when decisions go against them. But they never back chat. I think this is the standard we should aim for

Here you go:

Here is a report on the reasons for lack of umpires commissioned by the AFL in 2021. https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-03-12/afl-umpire-shortage-in-community-australian-rules/100903628 Looks like abuse is the 8th (yes, eighth) biggest reason at 6% Work and study commitments (18 per cent) Health/injury/age related (14 per cent) Inadequate support/pay (13 per cent) Lack of enjoyment (10 per cent) Abuse, at 6 per cent, was eighth on the list and half of inadequate support and pay (which is the one thing the AFL could actually fix). Even if you argue the lack of enjoyment is entirely due to abuse (which is a dubious assumption) and should be added to the 6%, it is still not dominant. Read that article and you will see all sorts of reasons for the lack of umpires, including a big drop off due to Covid possiby causing the AFL to hit the panic button. So what is the point of all this over-reaction about abuse? The AFL finds it easier to fiddle with the rules than do anything that requires some hard work.

Posters trying to argue that keeping out a 60 goal a year fwd is good for the team:

Its not Cultural change, its Social engineering at its most dangerous. Taking the emotion out of the game hurts the fabric of the game. If thats what the AFL want I dont agree with the way the rule is now being interpreted. Punish umpire verbal abuse but never ever hands out.

Very ironic that this is coming from Brad Scott who, when in the coaches box, was notorious for waving his arms and dropping his jaw when decisions didn’t go his way.

We haven’t seen enough of the Brown Weideman combo. Personally I want us to give it a go for the next few weeks. I know what we get out of the Brown Tmac combo. It’s effective, but can it be better?

I live a 5 min walk to the G, and was considering not going (I went) because the crew of 3-5 i'd normally go with, were Out with covid Away for Easter (now lives past Torque) Deceased Away for Easter (family holiday) MFC has an affluent supporter base, many people have moved permanently to coast or hills to work virtually and commute to town, many are just starting to re-establish family holidays for the first time in 2 years, some have covid, some just don't want to get it. I ended up going alone, and loving it, but having had covid (and long Covid) just after Christmas, I am not as enthusiastic about big crowds as some on here would like me to be. I try and keep space, and would find the prospect of 100k jammed into the G a little anxiety producing at this stage. I'll get over it I'm sure (fourth booster and finals will help), but we all have our reasons and they don't necessarily reflect any lack of love for our club or the fantastic team we have at the moment. Just being human stuff..

In my opinion tbere is zero doubt Brown will get selected. I'm also of the opinion tmac should and will will keep his spot, but harder to argue there is zero doubt he will. Apart from the fact tmac is the incumbent, plays his role and, in my opinion, is the better option the likely continued selection of Bedford as the menu sub is a factor in his favour. In the event of Toby being activated he is likely to play as a forward - meaning a forward has to be moved to another position. If we lose a defender, big or small tmac can go back as occurred when Salem was injured against the doggies. If a ruck goes out tmac can take that role. Hell, if a winger goes out tmac can even play that role. That flexibility is important and I don't think weed offers it, or at least nor to tbe same degree.

I'm not going to sit here and pretend I have no idea why this has been made a point of focus. We all know that there needs to be a level of respect for umpires, with a shortage of qualified umpires at all levels of the game we need to stamp out the disrespectful behaviour towards these men and women and make this an attractive option for kids choosing a sport to pursue. However, and this is a big however because it is driving me absolutely nuts at the moment. Is it necessary to teach professional footballers to suck eggs? I get that we're trying to condition new behaviour but do we really have to turn the football field into a classroom from the early 20th century where you get the strap if you look sideways at the teacher? In my opinion players are well within their rights to ask the question behind a decision made, yes the umpire's decision is final but there needs to continue to be dialogue between official and player. I don't know who came up with the theory that raising the arms in surprise is bad and punishable by 50 but it's ridiculous. Players are not robots. They train themselves into the ground then come game time they go into battle and I feel like we're asking them to be perfect in the heat of the moment, get off the grass! If they want to persist with this attitude, then go for it. But that means penalising everything. I've seen A LOT of players with 'arms out' appealing for a deliberate out of bounds and honestly going pretty over the top but nothing happening, ping them for that. I've seen players wait 2 seconds before not throwing the ball perfectly to the recipient of the free kick, ping that. I've seen Jack Reiwoldt joke with the umpire last week that he was going to go the Torp right before he did, ping that (ok bit over the top). It's just becoming a hard game to watch when substantial penalties are given for what the eyeballs are seeing is very little to nothing at all. 50s for dissent, 50s for breaching the stand rule and taking 1 step backwards on the mark. Our game is supposed to be about execution, athleticism and toughness. Right now it feels like mime or charades or whatever.

My favourite Umpire abuse?

It's a farce. A 50-metre penalty should only be given if a player mouths off or is aggressive in their demeanour towards an umpire. Raising one's arms or shaking one's head is not worthy of a 50 metre penalty. It is a poor reflection on Brad Scott and the umpires department that this has been so inconsistently applied and poorly interpreted.

Let’s call a spade a spade. The crowd of 20,000 was quite frankly pathetic from our supporter base. We can’t blame GWS because they don’t have any supporters. 1) It was on one of the best April Melbourne nights you will ever get from a weather perspective - 24 degrees at 7:25pm. 2) We’ve started the season magnificently to the extent that the media have us so far ahead of the second seed. 3) We’ve finally won a flag so I would’ve thought Melbourne people would be desperate to attend every single game imaginable after being denied a once in a life time opportunity to see a flag live, as well as two other finals. 4) I can’t accept or believe that 35,000 odd Melbourne members were out of town. So I’m not using the Easter holidays as an alibi for our supporter base. Pert and Co would be disappointed by such a small crowd on a marquee time slot that is Saturday night. Still a long way to go if we want to be consider a Melbourne based power house club.

Enjoying watching all the goals, but noticed: Weid kicks one, solid assist in another, dropped three marks he should take. TMac kicks one, directly assists two. Generally TMac does more heavy lifting than Weid! Leaning towards TMac re structure and impact, but wouldn’t might seeing Weid have a crack at CHF! Both are well behind BBB!

Bit of discussion on the impact of abuse on umpires. I umpired around 150 junior and senior games. I used to do it on Sundays after playing on Saturdays. Yes, you tended to be a bit sore afterwards but it was a good freshen up and great pocket money! Getting abuse is par for the course as an umpire. It mainly came from the drunken bogans in the crowd rather than the players. With the players, they always knew you were the one in control. So, ridiculous threatening or abusive language was always met by a 50-metre penalty. Players are quick learners and if you had a reputation for not putting up with crap, the players quickly adjusted. Also the fact that you played the game to a decent standard is a big factor in how umpires are treated. I found the umps that struggled most were those who never really had an affinity for the game. Believe me there were a few who took it up just for the money! We were always available after the game to have a a beer and a chat and i think that helped as well. I found after a while that the players became very supportive of your efforts on field and actually helped keep everyone in line. A two way respect, if you like. The one thing I will say now is how difficult it is to umpire with all the grey area interpretations. This dissent rule is going the same way. We were always taught to pay the first free kick you saw. That way you set the standard for the whole game and you kept it relatively simple.

Drink two and a half litres of water !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! FMD, I don't use that much for a shower!

Yeah, I did it for about 5 years eons ago. I loved it, the crowd getting into me, got called some really funny names, but always tried to be impartial and fair. You gotta remember I played 10 years of Amo footy and thought I had a good feel for the game. One funny incident stands out. This big lumbering center half forward who thought he was Wayne Carey keep infringing in marking contests time and again. He would mouth of , shake his fist and threaten me with all sorts of inhumane tortures at the end of the game. Anyway at three quarter time he wanders over and asked what he had to do to get a free. I said play in front son. Anyway he said I'll tell you what If you start giving me some frees I could set you up with a beaut sort after the game........... I proceeded to pay the next 5 free kicks against him but mercifully gave him a couple late coz he played in front and slotted a couple. He was my Best mate after the game and I still see him around and he tells his mates this ame story over and over again. My Umpiring career ended when this bloke decided it was a wise move to verbally abuse me and chest me coming of the ground at half time..I gave him more than he bargained for and then reported him. Not surprisingly he never fronted the Tribunal to get his 10 weeks. The league although supportive suggested that I take a break. I never went back after that!

And we wonder why we have "grey areas" We question why Andrews gets pinged for raising his arms yet Holman & Hewett don't Again, this is not on the umpires. They are trying to make the best of a steaming pile that's been dropped on them. It's entirely on the AFL administration

"As to what that level (of Dissent) looks like, that's up to the umpire to decide, but we've been really clear on this. We have unanimous support from all the clubs, all the leaders of clubs, and in fact, they want us to pay these free kicks. That is seriously a dumb comment from Scott...and a total cop out. For the players and clubs to be totally clear then how about the AFL be totally clear and transparent. Spell it out Brad...that's not clear, it's a clear cop out.

Was always going to be a hard task to follow up on the 2021 indigenous jumper,

i'm really hating the umpiring standards this year, the contentious and technical, non-consequential 50m penalties and now the new baffling umpire dissent adjudications it is all so frustrating and ruining my enjoyment of the game and i don't think i'm alone

Hibberd is well behind the pecking order now. Having a calf complaint (old man injury in footy terms) at 32 years of age doesn't bode well for him this season. Even Joel Smith who is fighting for the same spot at VFL level is ahead of him which shows how far he is behind.

Hunts weapon is his explosive pace off HB. Given our current game plan focuses heavily on defensive transition and scores from D50 he gives us an alternate scoring pathway to Bowey/ Salem who use kicking. not saying he is best 22 but food for thought.

BBB smashed it in Round 1 & 2. Clunked everything in the air & kicked straight. You cant judge VFL form. Harrison Petty was awful 2 weeks ago in his return game & was sensational back in AFL team on Saturday. BBB return is a No Brainer.

Robbo gave the solution, do away with all the players and use robots.

I’m not sure if this is tongue in cheek or not. You can’t punish someone for being emotional, Scott’s not being abusive here. It’s quite scary to me that people are calling for instinctive emotions (not abuse) to be punished. You can’t bottle up the frustration/emotions in such a high-intensity environment.

It’s a poor turnout. No getting away from it. Easter a factor so I don’t think this game is the best indicator Covid has impacted attendances across the board and is the main reason for lower attendances. There are those who are afraid of catching covid but there are also iso rules still in place meaning isolating fans can’t get to the games and isolating workers can’t man the food and alcohol stalls and all the other supporting services. Once rules and restrictions are finally lifted (and its well past time they were imo), I hope the 10%-20% covid holdouts will return Watching on TV will never replace attending the game live. It’s a social occasion centred around the game for me. Catching up with mates, enjoying the banter and beers and getting the chance to belt out Grand old flag with the rest of the faithful. You can’t replicate that watching on the TV There are 2 types of Melbourne based Dees supporters (I’ll leave out country and inter-state given the logistics involved). Those who find reasons to attend and those who find reasons not to attend. Which are you?

50 for abuse is fine 50 for questioning a decision or expressing frustration is embarrassing The AFL trying to equate a professional sport with umpiring at grass roots is laughable. The AFL usurped governance of the sport from the ANFC and has allowed grass roots footy including umpiring to fester and rot for 3 decades. Now they think some lip service in treating professional sportsmen like preschoolers is going to fix the problem? It's a band-aid solution and they are a farce of an organisation.

After 2 games I didn't see any threads about how we had the best supporters because we were 2nd in the comp for home attendance but after the third, against an interstate team on Easter weekend, we are crying foul. I really think that sums it up.

Lay off the drugs kids they make you paranoid.

We're only playing Richmond, so it doesn't really matter.

most (real) abuse umpires cop (at all levels) is from the spectators this over-reaction is only going to get the umpires more abuse from the spectators and a reduction in respect hard to see much will be gained, especially as they continue to make inconsistent and bad decisions in general a lot of it is the afl's fault for meddling with the rules and weekly changing interpretations

The reality is we were super healthy last year and Salem is a while off being back, it's very unlikely there won't be shuffling by the time that occurs. And whilst we've built some backline depth through this period we haven't got any midfield depth at all - as evidenced by Bedford being sub 5 weeks in a row and the Casey midfield disposal totals. So the most likely outcome is by the time Salem is back there's a spot open for him down back and/or Brayshaw has moved back to the midfield to cover a gap there anyway. If we are at full strength and there's no gap by the time Salo is right to go: Send Gus back to the wing playing 50% wing, 20% forward, even 5% or more on ball. JJ then becomes the 3rd winger with a similar break down of game time. Drop a key forward. The 2 rucks and Fritsch can get more involved as key forward targets. Harmes then plays more forward with some stints on ball and is fresher without the wing minutes. Viney and Oliver get a fraction more rest. Petracca attends centre bounces but otherwise sticks more forward. Sparrow provides some marking if needed, he's strong in the air. Oliver gets a little full forward time for something different, as does Brayshaw who's reading of the ball in the air hasn't ever been maximised deep forward.

I don't agree with the notion some are running with that "oh well, whatever the rule is, players will adjust". The rule does matter. Let's say there is a new rule that when lining up for a set shot, it doesn't count unless you close your eyes. Well, guess what, players will adjust to that too and will start taking set shots closing their eyes (otherwise the score won't count). So it's not simply a case of saying the players will adjust. The rule matters and has to be based in reasonableness and the look of the game. And the "arms out" automatic 50 rule is a horrendous look for the game. We are asking human beings giving their all in a brutal, physical sport, to not show any emotional body language of surprise or disappointment or frustration. A player may have just run his guts out all game to help win the game for his club and is not meant to show any body language response to a crucial last-quarter decision when mentally and physically fatigued? It is absolutely ridiculous. Arms out can be abusive if it's combined with swearing or yelling at an umpire. That should be punished. But simply holding your arms out in a non-threatening and non-abusive way is a human body language reaction. We don't want to strip the emotion and passion out of the game and have critical 50s paid for absolutely trivial incidents.

Too early to write off Hibberd, aka Premiership Defender. Hasn’t played a game yet. 200 games, hard body, quell a rampant Dusty.

Still think Smith is also in calculations. When he is fit, he is generally in the team - largely for his flexibility with speed and ability to play tall and small. Thinking of our GF side, I think he would be replacing Hibbo. Then it is a matter of Hunt and Jordon trying to squeeze someone out. Would love to see them in the team but no one deserves to go out (and Salem is an automatic in). Obviously part of this is once Salem is back does Brayshaw stay in defence or go back to the wing. I would think he'll go back to the wing but who knows? It's an absolute luxury - but more likely than not we will sustain a long term injury or two and so it won't be as much of a dilemma.

It’s probably a combination of out of sight, out of mind and wanting avoid making a difficult choice and needing to disappoint someone. Early on I tried to convince myself of a scenario where BBB doesn’t get picked for those exact reasons, but now that the dust has settled it’s clear to me that he’s the best of the three and must come in. Who goes out is down to a coin toss though. Tough choice, glad I’m not the one making it.

I like Weed. He wanted to remain a Demon which warms my heart. And his body language on the ground confirms his desire to play in this team. However, I do find his second efforts or lack of them, frustrating. At times, he reminds me of Jack Watts. Weed can be only metres away from an opponent with the ball but does not put any effort to attack the contest. It is noticeable compared to his team mates who keep chasing. A tall forward cannot rely on marking alone or relying on the one contest. That’s what impresses me about BBB. His chasing and pursuit of the contest when the ball hits the ground is exceptional. Always 100 per cent effort. Weed still has a future and we should persevere with him. However, at the moment and probably for the rest of the season BBB is our best option. And TMac still offers more versatility and effort than Weed.

It's blatantly obvious that the AFL, itself, has a real problem with respect for the umpires! Otherwise they would have appointed a retired VFL/AFL umpire to the position of 'rules maker', laws of the game committee!

Players have always been allowed to ask what a decision was for, this penalising raising of the arms is such an over reaction. To me raising raising the arms in itself only implies" what was that for" it does not imply dissent or abuse. Should only be penalised if the player mouths off or becomes overly demonstrative. Current situation is a complete farce and will cause the umpires and the AFL more derision.

In all seriousness, this is a legitimate question that should be asked. If the goal is to change the culture of the sport regarding treatment of umpires from the top down, then senior coaches are just as responsible as the players. Chris Scott should be heavily fined every time he gets busted doing this.

And imagine what we would have got if we were travelling as poorly as Essendon? 20k was seriously poor and we should have done better.

The arms out isn’t disrespectful - it’s an accepted non verbal form of questioning. The ‘respect’ dissent angle is an absolute joke.Stamp down on umpire abuse - no problem on that - but this latest infatuation with arms out is a bit over the top.

As usual, an interesting split of opinions on selection Everyone seems to agree that if BBB ( I believe he will) comes in then either Tmac or Weid goes. Again Weid tantalised . He did some good things but then went missing for a while. It was an almost game. Had he held on to those marks where he seemed to have decent purchase it would have been a good game. Tmac did probably an equal amount of positive things but also contributed more in between. He took a few ruck contests, went back and contributed some bullocking work, including a very solid hip and shoulder. In general, he looked more mobile than he has for a while. I'm tipping Tmac to stay.