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CHANGES: Rd 11 vs Adelaide

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5 hours ago, At the break of Gawn said:

Baker deserves another game - did some nice things and kicked 2. But I agree with the rest. 

Agree plenty to like

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3 hours ago, Deespicable said:

Like many of us, I've been gobsmacked that Preuss keeps being overlooked

For god's sake, he's a mediocre, one-trick player - even at Casey he's mediocre.

The bandwagoning on Demonland has to be seen to be believed.

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I don’t know how Omcd still gets a game. He was slow. Outmuscled.  Indecisive.  Made to look so substandard.  AGAIN 

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11 minutes ago, spirit of norm smith said:

I don’t know how Omcd still gets a game. He was slow. Outmuscled.  Indecisive.  Made to look so substandard.  AGAIN 

Because we have literally not one single other key defender available? We’ve got five on the list, two are returning from injury and the other two are also in the side.

Petty will be the first one to be dropped anyway.

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12 hours ago, Dee Zephyr said:

Smother the balls with vaseline at training all week. This is the humid of the NT games right?

Not sure what Smothering ones balls with Vaseline would do to assist footy performance . But there you go you learn many things on Demonland

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11 hours ago, praha said:

Goodwin said:

(Jake) Lever, (Mitch) Hannan, (Michael) Hibberd, (Christian) Salem, (Alex) Neal-Bullen, (Steven) May, (Kade) Kolodjashnij, (Sam) Weideman and (Jay) Kennedy Harris 

All to come back. 

Hibberd, Salem, ANB, Kade and Weeds were all in the side when we were arguably playing our worst footy for the hear.

Hannah helps, Lever is obviously a huge inclusion, JKH is okay I guess.

We have huge depth issues.

 

Why all the brackets (praha)?

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Posted (edited)

So this year is clearly done, if it wasn't already, But some players that are just not up to it and will never make it in my opinion:

The No good:

Petty - No Instinct, nothing stands out about him

Stretch - Panics with ball in hand, not quick.. no redeeming features

Oscar - he is just not very good

Corey wagner - tries hard - but thats it.

add to these players right on the line of no good:

T Smith - i like him, but he cant get a run at it.

Charlie Spargo - Whats his specialty? needs to kick 2 plus a game i reckon 

Jay Lockhart - hard to say really

Josh wagner - i think he is ok.. but just ok.

add theses to players horrendously out of form:

Tom McDonald - all year but we have to play him.. bit is it time to rest him

Angus Brayshaw - complete and utter breakdown of what he was and more importantly how we use him.

Nathan Jones - He is done. its brutal, but he is.

Bailey Fritsch - Plays AFLX, and somehow has never been the same.

Jeff Garlett - i dont expect him to be the bloke who hits players hard, but he is struggling and the forward line at the moment is a shambles.

 

So that's 13 players from yesterdays game that just can't and are not playing AFL standard footy. What hope do we have. Also at some stage it would have been nice to see Goodwin put Oliver at FF and clear the 50 out. 

Also hats happened to the Genius that was Craig Jennings? i mean surely the wraps he got last year means he shouldn't be immune to criticism.. if our players were bad yesterday, they were supported bu a shocking day in the coaches box.. a situation that has been evident a lot this year.

 

 

Edited by Demon3
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9 hours ago, Deespicable said:

Like many of us, I've been gobsmacked that Preuss keeps being overlooked but the dewy evening conditions up in Darwin won't suit him. That probably means he's a monty to play. 

I think most of us would agree that six players have to go after that dismal first three quarters - C.Wags, Lockhart, Petty, Spargo, O.Mac and Jeffy. But of the six, Jeffy should be given one final game in Darwin as a send off.

Lever will play unless his ankle is worse than expected. Salem and ANB are certain ins if fit and Jordy was the pick of the lads at VFL level so has to come back.

Hannan didn't have a great game in the VFL I believe, so probably needs another week.  JKH is another who may need another week. Both should play against the Pies.

So my five changes this week are:

In: Lever, ANB, Salem, Lewis and a decision on which of Weid or Preuss plays.

Out: C.Wags, Spargo, Lockhart, Petty, Oscar Mc

B: Salem Frost Hore

HB: Jones Lever J.Wags

C Stretch Harmes Lewis

HF: Baker T.Smith Petracca

F: Hunt T.Mac Garlett

Ru: Gawn Brayshaw Viney

Int: Fritsch, Oliver, ANB, Preuss/Weid 

 

Like it but would play Weid in lieu of Pruess. Also like Brayshaw as ruck rover. Can't understand why they play him on wing when he nearly won a Brownlow last year playing in the guts.

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1 hour ago, Demon3 said:

The No good:

Petty - No Instinct, nothing stands out about him

This has my attention too. I've been hearing allot about this guy for the last 18 months but in the guys games at AFL level I haven't seen much to excite. Hore and Baker have both come in and shown enough to suggest they could become regulars. Pettys still young and I haven't given up on him, but he still looks a long way off AFL level.

 

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2 hours ago, Docs Demons said:

Like it but would play Weid in lieu of Pruess. Also like Brayshaw as ruck rover. Can't understand why they play him on wing when he nearly won a Brownlow last year playing in the guts.

Brayshaw's late run of form in 2018 coincided with Viney being out for the final 7 weeks of the home and away season.

Therefore Viney has this year taken midfield minutes off Brayshaw.

 

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6 minutes ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

Brayshaw's late run of form in 2018 coincided with Viney being out for the final 7 weeks of the home and away season.

Therefore Viney has this year taken midfield minutes off Brayshaw.

 

Well Viney out & Brayshaw in please. 

Viney does my head in

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Let's bring in whoever we recruit tonight ;) :P.

All seriousness i expect JKH to be in from the VFL summary. Plus ANB and Salem back from concussion.

The maybe also occuring include:

  • C Wagner out for lewis (if Goodwin thinks we need him) or Hibbo if 2 weeks is enough time for his shoulder.
  • Tmac (cork) or smith (concussion lingering) out if they pull up bad post game to give them a rest and bring in pruess/weid (i'd like to see pruess personally as weid won't get good service (which he needs) and preuss can at least wrestle.

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1 hour ago, ArtificialWisdom said:

This has my attention too. I've been hearing allot about this guy for the last 18 months but in the guys games at AFL level I haven't seen much to excite. Hore and Baker have both come in and shown enough to suggest they could become regulars. Pettys still young and I haven't given up on him, but he still looks a long way off AFL level.

 

Petty needs to back himself more & go for his marks. Noticed him punching the ball on at least two occasions where he could have marked it. As for Omac, he couldn't even get near a contest.

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14 hours ago, bing181 said:

What's going on has nothing to do with the coaches, and everything to do with a decimated pre-season + injuries, and the flow on from that.

Would agree injuries have caused us much pain this year with basically our whole back line out for much of the season thus far, but it’s quite obvious that our forward structures are poor and our delivery inside 50 is extremely poor. This is a coaching issue not a personnel issue (plus I don’t believe our injuries to midfield and forward groups have been too bad. No worse than any other team). This is evidenced when we get a clean break out of a stoppage anywhere around the middle of the ground, race it, forward then bomb it hiiiiiiiiiigh up in the air hoping for a mark or spear pass it with deadly accuracy to the only opposition player standing stationary by himself inside our attacking 50.

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51 minutes ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

Brayshaw's late run of form in 2018 coincided with Viney being out for the final 7 weeks of the home and away season.

Therefore Viney has this year taken midfield minutes off Brayshaw.

 

JLT this year also confirms your point, Brayshaw smashed it in both games with Viney out of the side

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9 hours ago, bing181 said:

For god's sake, he's a mediocre, one-trick player - even at Casey he's mediocre.

The bandwagoning on Demonland has to be seen to be believed.

There have been many one-trick ponies over the years who have played in grand final wins. (Frawley for example) For my mind, it’s not so much that anyone thinks he is better than Weideman as an example, it’s just that his one trick makes many others around him better. I’ve explained this numerous times but when you stick a guy who is 206cm and 109kg in the goal square who can mark and who can kick, the opposition have no choice other than to play one of their best defenders on him, this means that the likes of Tmac and Weideman get the next best defenders. This is exactly what happened last year when hogan played, he naturally got the best defender (or double teamed) freeing up Tmac to be far more dangerous than he is now. Our game style all year has been to bomb the ball inside forward 50 and hope (or spear pass it directly to the opposition), Preuss gives us far more hope of a mark than anyone else in our club apart from Gawn who is better used to ruck and play spare man in defense rather than inside forward 50.

So in short Preuss is used as a foil which makes those around him far more dangerous as well as having the potential to be dangerous himself.

 

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59 minutes ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

Brayshaw's late run of form in 2018 coincided with Viney being out for the final 7 weeks of the home and away season.

Therefore Viney has this year taken midfield minutes off Brayshaw.

 

Jones is the other one. He has spent more time in the middle over the past month and it has coincided with Brayshaws fall. 

Brayshaw was averaging 28 touches a game in the first 6 weeks, he was moved out to the wing and that's crashed down to 19. I know disposals aren't everything but Brayshaws is an accumulator, that's what he is best at and they've taken that off him. 

I'd trial Jones or Viney as a defensive forward. Gives Brayshaw more pure midfield minutes. Even Oliver could benefit with some time forward, especially when he cops a heavy tag.

We need to find alternative options for the likes of Oliver, Viney, Jones and Brayshaw, 4 players that can all only play in one position

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1 hour ago, wizardinoz said:

Petty needs to back himself more & go for his marks. Noticed him punching the ball on at least two occasions where he could have marked it. As for Omac, he couldn't even get near a contest.

Agree. He could’ve taken a few intercept marks along with some spoils and had a pretty decent first half yesterday. Instead he went for some safe spoils. Then he cops a knock and looks limpy and slow.

He slow and lacks a physical presence at the contest but there’s still signs of talent with reading the play, quick hands and a nice kick. Needs to go back to Casey and show 6 weeks of consistent form rather than a couple of good weeks then a couple of quiet games. 

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, —coach— said:

our forward structures are poor and our delivery inside 50 is extremely poor.

Injuries = lack of time on the training track = lack of time training/working together = lack of time to consolidate structures, build connection.

Add to this the constant merry-go-round of players in the forward line (injuries + form), plus changes in forward personnel/structure (e.g. Hunt).

Which then feeds through further up the ground: a not-quite-functioning forward line leads to indecision and hesitation and exacerbates skill shortcomings. (confidence).

One great example yesterday was that second Baker goal: Petracca did well to get the ball in the clear and then had Baker open 20m or so in front of him - but couldn't hit him on the chest, the ball landed a few metres short and Baker had to go and get it. Had Petracca *known* who was likely to be where when he turned to kick, it would have been a different story, i.e., if he'd only had to focus on execution rather than decision + execution.

The difference between what was going on up the other end on Sunday couldn't be more stark, especially the complicity between Cameron and Himmelberg. Himmelberg has only been playing for 3 season, but ALL his games have been played alongside Cameron - they know exactly what the other is going to do (as do players further up the ground). That ball from Cameron into Himmelberg who was running towards goal, but where Cameron placed it behind him knowing he would turn and run back onto it ...  a thing of beauty and illustrative of all that we're not doing at the moment.

Injuries. Consequences.

Edited by bing181
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1 hour ago, —coach— said:

Preuss gives us far more hope of a mark

In his two AFL matches this year, Preuss has taken a total of 4 marks.

Tim Smith: 3 matches for 10 marks.

Sam Weideman, even down on form: 6 matches for 22 marks.

If you want to consolidate marking capability you pick those guys ahead of Preuss.

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1 hour ago, ArtificialWisdom said:

Jones is the other one. He has spent more time in the middle over the past month and it has coincided with Brayshaws fall. 

Brayshaw was averaging 28 touches a game in the first 6 weeks, he was moved out to the wing and that's crashed down to 19. I know disposals aren't everything but Brayshaws is an accumulator, that's what he is best at and they've taken that off him. 

I'd trial Jones or Viney as a defensive forward. Gives Brayshaw more pure midfield minutes. Even Oliver could benefit with some time forward, especially when he cops a heavy tag.

We need to find alternative options for the likes of Oliver, Viney, Jones and Brayshaw, 4 players that can all only play in one position

No. We just need to run Brayshaw into the ground as a midfielder. Dont care what we do with Viney. Oliver and Jones are effective resting forward. But how we are playing Brayshaw on the wing at present just shows a lack of understanding of basic footy. He is too slow to play wing, and he does not have the precision. Not only is it a waste but we need to be utilizing our wings with pace, as we have a slow midfield unit as it is. Putting Brayshaw on the wing just compounds that.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, bing181 said:

In his two AFL matches this year, Preuss has taken a total of 4 marks.

Tim Smith: 3 matches for 10 marks.

Sam Weideman, even down on form: 6 matches for 22 marks.

If you want to consolidate marking capability you pick those guys ahead of Preuss.

Bing I generally respect your view points, and have liked many of your comments over the years, however on this one I think you undervalue significantly what Pruess can bring to the side for all the points I raised above, not just the marks part. The only way we will ever know is if he gets a few games in a row in the seniors and we get to assess his value based on that.

PS this conversation is very similar to the ones had in the early stages of 2017 when some (myself included) were asking for Cam Pedersen to get a game. Many argued he was second rate and VFL standard, then once he came in people realized he brought more to the team than what the stats would show.

Edited by —coach—
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20 hours ago, Demons11 said:

I don’t understand this? If they are fit to play there is no reason not to play them. 

We need all the help we can get at this point.

Because we've played too many under-done players before

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19 minutes ago, one_demon said:

Because we've played too many under-done players before

Fair point 

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2 hours ago, KingDingAling said:

No. We just need to run Brayshaw into the ground as a midfielder. Dont care what we do with Viney. Oliver and Jones are effective resting forward. But how we are playing Brayshaw on the wing at present just shows a lack of understanding of basic footy. He is too slow to play wing, and he does not have the precision. Not only is it a waste but we need to be utilizing our wings with pace, as we have a slow midfield unit as it is. Putting Brayshaw on the wing just compounds that.

The is my opinion only not mail but I'm very confident in it:

Brayshaw's on the wing because he's too slow and lazy in transition running and butchered the ball in the midfield. He lost the trust of the coaches to be around the footy. It helps if your wingers are quick but it's not vital these days as long as they run hard and keep in position. Slower, unaccountable inside mids get torched and Gus wasn't keeping up with the play. He'd get 30 but they'd do nothing and his many would get 35. Decision making and transition running are easier on the wing.

Pacey wingers would be nice but Baker doesn't have the tank for it. Lockhart lacks the tank a little and the ball winning. Stretch knows how to play the position but is just going. Corey Wagner is meh. There's really not a lot of other options. 

With Salem and Hibberd back this week Fritsch should go back on the wing and give us one decent outside runner but we're still short other options. The preseason plans for Vanders and KK have fallen through.

Gus should go back on the ball at some stage but if he doesn't show defensive transition and better ball use I won't feel like the coaches are to blame. 

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