Jump to content

Posting Unsubstantiated Rumours on this Website is Strictly Forbidden
  • IMPORTANT: PLEASE READ BEFORE POSTING

    Demonland has made the difficult decision to not permit this platform to be used to discuss & debate the off-field issues relating to the Melbourne Football Club including matters currently being litigated between the Club & former Board members, board elections, the culture at the club & the personal issues & allegations against some of our players & officials ...

    We do not take these issues & this decision lightly & of course we believe that these serious matters affecting the club we love & are so passionate about are worthy of discussion & debate & I wish we could provide a place where these matters can be discussed in a civil & respectful manner.

    However these discussions unfortunately invariably devolve into areas that may be defamatory, libelous, spread unsubstantiated rumours & can effect the mental health of those involved. Even discussion & debate of known facts or media reports can lead to finger pointing, blame & personal attacks.

    The repercussion is that these discussions can open this website, it’s owners & it’s users to legal action & may result in this website being forced to shutdown.

    Our moderating team are all volunteers & cannot moderate the forum 24/7 & as a consequence problematic content that contravenes our rules & standards may go unnoticed for some time before it can be removed.

    We reserve the right to delete posts that offend against our above policy & indeed, to ban posters who are repeat offenders or who breach our code of conduct.

    WE HAVE BUILT A FANTASTIC ONLINE COMMUNITY AT DEMONLAND OVER THE PAST 23 YEARS & WE WOULD LIKE TO CONTINUE TO BE ABLE TO DISCUSS THE CLUB WE LOVE & ARE SO PASSIONATE ABOUT.

    Thank you for your continued support & understanding. Go Dees.


Norm Smith to Simon Goodwin


youami

Recommended Posts

I have been sitting on a theory for years about the tenuous link between Norm Smith and Simon Goodwin.

Having read the Red Fox, but certainly not being an expert, part of Norm Smith's strategy during his coaching career was to attack and demand the highest of standards from his best player.

During Norm Smith's coaching era, this player was Ron Barassi.  Result 6 premierships.

When Ron became a coach, he employed the same strategy, and his target was Malcolm Blight at North Melbourne. Result 2 premierships.

Malcolm had some of the craziest strategies, but I'm not sure he ever attacked Goodwin  the way Barassi did to Blight, and Smith to Barassi before that, you could reasonably argue Goodwin was the best player at the Crows during Blight's time as coach.  Result 2 premierships.

This legacy has netted 10 premierships.

And now, it has come full circle with Goodwin coming to Melbourne, which has never been the same since Smith was sacked.

Wouldn't it be great if Goodwin is the man to end the curse.

  • Like 24
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hey if you can blitz all that in a magic Bullet and bottle it. I'll buy some ;)

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The family tree approach to judging coaching is well respected. Whether it's the Tom Hafey family (Kevin Sheedy and Mick Malthouse followed by John Worsfold, for example) or the Norm Smith family (Ron Barassi followed by Malcolm Blight) or the John Kennedy family (David Parkin and Leigh Matthews subsequently followed by the Scott twins), etc, there is logic in the idea. Successful coaches teach future successful coaches. 

Of course, not every descendant in the family can be a success (Hardwick, Hird, Voss...and many more) but the opening post makes sense overall.

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 hours ago, youami said:

I have been sitting on a theory for years about the tenuous link between Norm Smith and Simon Goodwin.

Having read the Red Fox, but certainly not being an expert, part of Norm Smith's strategy during his coaching career was to attack and demand the highest of standards from his best player.

During Norm Smith's coaching era, this player was Ron Barassi.  Result 6 premierships.

When Ron became a coach, he employed the same strategy, and his target was Malcolm Blight at North Melbourne. Result 2 premierships.

Malcolm had some of the craziest strategies, but I'm not sure he ever attacked Goodwin  the way Barassi did to Blight, and Smith to Barassi before that, you could reasonably argue Goodwin was the best player at the Crows during Blight's time as coach.  Result 2 premierships.

This legacy has netted 10 premierships.

And now, it has come full circle with Goodwin coming to Melbourne, which has never been the same since Smith was sacked.

Wouldn't it be great if Goodwin is the man to end the curse.

The only issue I see with your argument is that the 2 Adelaide premierships were in Goodwins first 2 years on the list so I am not sure you could say he was their best. Blight may still have had the impact on Goodwin you are arguing though, especially as he was his first AFL coach and his most successful. 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Like your creative thinking Youami. I suppose the other obvious thing to say is that those coaches had great lists of talented and driven footballers as a result of great recruiting of young talent and experienced talent that was allowed to flourish in a successful environment. That was certainly the case with Smith at Melbourne and Barassi at Carlton and North. I would not put Blight in that same frame. For a period with Smith and Barassi, success built on success just as we see today with the top teams. Hopefully we are creating that environment at Melbourne. The other comment to make is that the coaches you mentioned had very strong values, and they imparted strong discipline and team rules. They made tough decisions and were uncompromising in their attitudes. They also had the respect but not necessary the love of their players. If you link Goodwin to these attributes he has a lot to live up to. He apparently is loved by the players but he had yet to gain the respect of his players, club and football world.  He will need to achieve early team success and show us that he is a leader and coach with strong values who is uncompromising in his quest for success. He will need to develop the right culture and a game plan that works. He will also need to break some players hearts along the way. 

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, hemingway said:

Like your creative thinking Youami. I suppose the other obvious thing to say is that those coaches had great lists of talented and driven footballers as a result of great recruiting of young talent and experienced talent that was allowed to flourish in a successful environment. That was certainly the case with Smith at Melbourne and Barassi at Carlton and North. I would not put Blight in that same frame. For a period with Smith and Barassi, success built on success just as we see today with the top teams. Hopefully we are creating that environment at Melbourne. The other comment to make is that the coaches you mentioned had very strong values, and they imparted strong discipline and team rules. They made tough decisions and were uncompromising in their attitudes. They also had the respect but not necessary the love of their players. If you link Goodwin to these attributes he has a lot to live up to. He apparently is loved by the players but he had yet to gain the respect of his players, club and football world.  He will need to achieve early team success and show us that he is a leader and coach with strong values who is uncompromising in his quest for success. He will need to develop the right culture and a game plan that works. He will also need to break some players hearts along the way. 

Well said hemingway and totally share your views.  Undoubtedly, he has many strengths that he brings to the club/team. 

The parts underlined are those on which he has a bit of work to do, imo.  He has some ?marks on his values in decision making which hopefully don't come back and bite him when it comes to earning respect.

While he will have a honeymoon period early success is essential to keep the media wolves at bay and to feed the optimism Roos has sown.

The club has done everything possible to 'set him up for success'.  We just have to wait and let it unfold.

 

Edited by Lucifer's Hero
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites


12 hours ago, youami said:

I have been sitting on a theory for years about the tenuous link between Norm Smith and Simon Goodwin.

Having read the Red Fox, but certainly not being an expert, part of Norm Smith's strategy during his coaching career was to attack and demand the highest of standards from his best player.

During Norm Smith's coaching era, this player was Ron Barassi.  Result 6 premierships.

When Ron became a coach, he employed the same strategy, and his target was Malcolm Blight at North Melbourne. Result 2 premierships.

Malcolm had some of the craziest strategies, but I'm not sure he ever attacked Goodwin  the way Barassi did to Blight, and Smith to Barassi before that, you could reasonably argue Goodwin was the best player at the Crows during Blight's time as coach.  Result 2 premierships.

This legacy has netted 10 premierships.

And now, it has come full circle with Goodwin coming to Melbourne, which has never been the same since Smith was sacked.

Wouldn't it be great if Goodwin is the man to end the curse.

Love the connections youve made......its very interesting. Well done on a quality original post. I have even more positive thoughts on all this now.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 hours ago, youami said:

I have been sitting on a theory for years about the tenuous link between Norm Smith and Simon Goodwin.

Having read the Red Fox, but certainly not being an expert, part of Norm Smith's strategy during his coaching career was to attack and demand the highest of standards from his best player.

During Norm Smith's coaching era, this player was Ron Barassi.  Result 6 premierships.

When Ron became a coach, he employed the same strategy, and his target was Malcolm Blight at North Melbourne. Result 2 premierships.

Malcolm had some of the craziest strategies, but I'm not sure he ever attacked Goodwin  the way Barassi did to Blight, and Smith to Barassi before that, you could reasonably argue Goodwin was the best player at the Crows during Blight's time as coach.  Result 2 premierships.

This legacy has netted 10 premierships.

And now, it has come full circle with Goodwin coming to Melbourne, which has never been the same since Smith was sacked.

Wouldn't it be great if Goodwin is the man to end the curse.

The Red Fox is my equivalent to the Bible! 

Classic!! 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Everything that goes around, comes around. In the 60's, and then with North in the 70's our premiership model was appropriated by the rising clubs. Ron Barassi, surely one of the last 'non-thinking coaches' was able to terrorise talented footballers into becoming premiership bullies, just like the Dees  under Smith did years earlier. As far as 6 degrees of separation and a tenuous S.A link are concerned, I think it all started with the post '64 premiership 'championship of australia', when melbourne defeated South Adelaide in Adelaide to win this unofficial title for the third time. South Adelaide revealed themselves to be a highly competitive unit, and showed that south australian footy was definitely on a par with victorian footy, it's just that we stole all the interstate footballers to make our code look good. we tried to bring in darren? jarman in the 90's from s.a  as one of our draft picks but he wouldn't come, proudly remaining home to help adelaide win their first flags. now all these years later simon goodwin steps into the hardest job in football - returning our club to their mythical, legendary status. 

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

Norm Smith could have been much more successful than what he was because the club knocked back the gret Poly Farmer(Geelong) and Darryl Baldock (St.Kilda). Hopefully Simon and co. get it right and continue with success.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...
6 hours ago, youami said:

Glenn Bartlett made the same link as me - Smith to Barassi to Blight to Goodwin at today's press conference.

I like Bartlett, does not seek the limelight and runs a very tight ship with the support of others.

Good luck Simon.

 

 

Maybe Glenn read your post and plagiarised it!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On ‎13‎/‎08‎/‎2016 at 2:48 PM, ENYAW said:

Norm Smith could have been much more successful than what he was because the club knocked back the gret Poly Farmer(Geelong) and Darryl Baldock (St.Kilda). Hopefully Simon and co. get it right and continue with success.

Swooper Northey could have been much more successful if his teams by necessity were not topped up with so many cast-off journeymen . His players really put-in for him ,  his 90-76 Win/Loss record  remarkable under the circumstances .

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The game has changed a lot and players and coaches get caught up in hip new theories and standards and whatnot.

But one thing lasts the ages and will never become obsolete: it doesn't matter how good you are, if you don't strive to be the best you'll only ever be last.

So many good players only ever go through the motions. Michae Jordan said that the guys he'd ride most in practice were the superstars because they were so complacent, that he would push them harder because it was so hard to get them to go that extra mile. He hated playing against the reserves because they were always fighting and scrapping. Read up on his brawl with Steve Kerr. Kerr was this white little stick who kept taking it to him in practice. It took taking it up to the best and not lying down to be respected by the best. 6 months later Jordan passed up a winning shot and gave it to Kerr for the gamer winner and championship. NBA fans will know this story well.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


He's achieved nothing since becoming coach.

I wonder if complacency has set in.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 4 years later...
On 8/3/2016 at 2:49 PM, youami said:

I have been sitting on a theory for years about the tenuous link between Norm Smith and Simon Goodwin.

Having read the Red Fox, but certainly not being an expert, part of Norm Smith's strategy during his coaching career was to attack and demand the highest of standards from his best player.

During Norm Smith's coaching era, this player was Ron Barassi.  Result 6 premierships.

When Ron became a coach, he employed the same strategy, and his target was Malcolm Blight at North Melbourne. Result 2 premierships.

Malcolm had some of the craziest strategies, but I'm not sure he ever attacked Goodwin  the way Barassi did to Blight, and Smith to Barassi before that, you could reasonably argue Goodwin was the best player at the Crows during Blight's time as coach.  Result 2 premierships.

This legacy has netted 10 premierships.

And now, it has come full circle with Goodwin coming to Melbourne, which has never been the same since Smith was sacked.

Wouldn't it be great if Goodwin is the man to end the curse.

Unashamed bump for this one. 

  • Like 3
  • Thanks 1
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Games are won by 22/23 players.

Premierships are won by over a hundred individuals across an entire club.

Sure, leaders play their role, but so do all. We play a role as supporters too, and everyone up to Max Gawn and Simon Goodwin has a part in getting us to this point.

And it all matters. Maybe even bumping this thread will be the thing that breaks the drought.

Probably not though.

  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 9/19/2021 at 3:06 AM, Chook said:

Games are won by 22/23 players.

Premierships are won by over a hundred individuals across an entire club.

Sure, leaders play their role, but so do all. We play a role as supporters too, and everyone up to Max Gawn and Simon Goodwin has a part in getting us to this point.

And it all matters. Maybe even bumping this thread will be the thing that breaks the drought.

Probably not though.

I know I've been doing my bit for the last 57 years. About time the players and the coach contributed!

  • Haha 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 8/3/2016 at 10:49 PM, youami said:

I have been sitting on a theory for years about the tenuous link between Norm Smith and Simon Goodwin.

Having read the Red Fox, but certainly not being an expert, part of Norm Smith's strategy during his coaching career was to attack and demand the highest of standards from his best player.

During Norm Smith's coaching era, this player was Ron Barassi.  Result 6 premierships.

When Ron became a coach, he employed the same strategy, and his target was Malcolm Blight at North Melbourne. Result 2 premierships.

Malcolm had some of the craziest strategies, but I'm not sure he ever attacked Goodwin  the way Barassi did to Blight, and Smith to Barassi before that, you could reasonably argue Goodwin was the best player at the Crows during Blight's time as coach.  Result 2 premierships.

This legacy has netted 10 premierships.

And now, it has come full circle with Goodwin coming to Melbourne, which has never been the same since Smith was sacked.

Wouldn't it be great if Goodwin is the man to end the curse.

I think your theory is a bit simplistic.  Smith was certainly tougher on his top players including Barassi but also on the others like Spencer, Ridley, Williams, Mithen etc. He won 6 flags because he had great teams & coached well.

Ditto with North - they won because they had a great team.  In fact Blight wasn't in the best players in either of their flag sides.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Unfortunately, your content contains terms that we do not allow. Please edit your content to remove the highlighted words below.
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Demonland Forums  

  • Match Previews, Reports & Articles  

    DEE-RUBBING by George on the Outer

    For the second week in a row, the Demons had to endure some particularly oppressive match conditions — this time, playing in 30 degree temperatures at the MCG, following the humid sticky Sydney atmosphere of last week.   The warmer conditions didn’t seem to worry the Dee’s since the ball was so much easier to handle, and handle it with surety they did in handing out a 45 point drubbing to the much fancied Western Bulldogs.   After a slow start that saw the Dogs out to

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Reports

    PREGAME: Rd 02 vs Hawthorn

    The Demons will return to the MCG next week to face the Hawks before 2 weeks on the road in Adelaide in the lead up to Gather Round. Who comes in and who goes out?

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 125

    PODCAST: Rd 01 vs Western Bulldogs

    The Demonland Podcast will air LIVE on Monday, 18th March @ 8:30pm. Join George, Binman & I as we analyse the Demons victory at the MCG over the Bulldogs in the Round 01. You questions and comments are a huge part of our podcast so please post anything you want to ask or say below and we'll give you a shout out on the show. If you would like to leave us a voicemail please call 03 9016 3666 and don't worry no body answers so you don't have to talk to a human. Listen & Chat

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 64

    POSTGAME: Rd 01 vs Western Bulldogs

    The Demons finally open their account in the 2024 Premiership Season with a 45 point win over the Western Bulldogs at the Home of Football the MCG.   

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 425

    VOTES: Rd 01 vs Western Bulldogs

    Last week Jack Viney polled the maximum number of votes to lead the Demonland Player of the Year Award. Steven May and rookie Blake Howes are equal second. Your votes for the win over the Bulldogs. 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1.

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 74

    GAMEDAY: Rd 01 vs Western Bulldogs

    On the back of a disappointing Opening Round loss to the Swans in Sydney the Demons return to the MCG today to take on the the Western Bulldogs in a bid to even the ledger early in the 2024 season.

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 467

    TRAINING: Saturday 16th March 2023

    Demonland Trackwatchers Kev Martin and Dee Zephyr wandered down to Gosch's Paddock on Saturday morning to bring you their observations from the Captain's Run in the lead up to Sunday's Round One match against the Bulldogs. KEV MARTIN'S CAPTAIN'S RUN OBSERVATIONS Rehab  is out early. A beautiful Saturday morning, though plenty of dew on the paddock  Verrall doing hard sprints along the boundary.  McAdam individual program and has started, ball work, change of direction drills,

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Training Reports

    CROSSING THE PICKETT LINE by The Oracle

    Melbourne’s performance in losing its Round Zero contest in Sydney has certainly caused the club, the coach and the players to come firmly under the watchful eye of the football world and exposed all of its aspects to a microscopic lens.   Much of the commentary surrounding them has been less than complimentary and, while some might argue that this is unfair after only one round, leaving aside some of the scuttlebutt that surrounds a lot of the discussion around the game, a fair amoun

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Previews

    TRAINING: Monday 11th March 2024

    Demonland Trackwatcher Kev Martin braved the scorching heat on a public holiday to bring you the following observations from Training. The set up, is being put up, for an 11.45am post review training session.   32 in the full session. Rehab: Spargo (runners and singlet), Turner, BBB, and Verrall (looks to be a test). Hunter doing his own program. Bowser in the arm sling. May looks fine. No McAdam.  As they gathered, they gave Melky a round of applause, he

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Training Reports
  • Tell a friend

    Love Demonland? Tell a friend!
×
×
  • Create New...