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i refuse to believe fraser rosman isn't actually 27 years old

Yes, Luke Jackson 18 points, 4 boards, 3 assists Petracca 15 points, 2 rebounds, 5 assists

This sums it up nicely.

Warren Dean was from Subiaco. Could roost it 60 metres off a step, struggled with accuracy and injury cut short his career. Loved himv in our 87 run

@4_Kent_Watts I think this is the major takeaway from here. This site has a cross section of people from real life and overwhelming majority are, at their core, really well intentioned even if we make mistakes. There are a couple of posters who might make that difficult to imagine, but sometimes you need to ignore some of the loudest voices and realise that those voices only reflect a small minority.

Love him or hate him you can admire him for the love he has for his club. To help his club when it was in financial trouble by becoming the President and building a solid foundation at Collingwood. Instigated and set up a home for the club at the old Olympic swimming pool and with help from the state government a training ground close to the MCG which they call home. 22 years as President I say Well done Eddie you went out help your club to survive and be viable. You certainly love your club.

ALEX DOCHERTY at The Mongrel Punt Bailey Laurie – Forward/Midfielder, 179cm, 78kg There are a few boys from the Oakleigh Chargers that will have their names called out and one of them should be Bailey Laurie; a clever little small forward who can also provide some run and dash through the middle. It’s hard to get a full-time gig in there when you had Matt Rowell, Noah Anderson and Will Phillips running the show in the square – they made getting to the Grand Final look like it was a kick at the park on a beautiful Sunday afternoon. But nonetheless, Laurie’s contribution to this amazing Chargers team shouldn’t be understated. He played seven games in return for six goals and averaged 15.3 disposals, three marks and 3.6 tackles per game playing more as a half-forward type. He puts in the hard yards as much as anyone else and has the innate ability to make things happen going forward with the footy, it would’ve been nice to see what he could’ve done in that Chargers midfield this year, he could’ve easily averaged 20 disposals per game.

Pretty good summation actually All the pieces are there ready to go, but.... Do we have the balls to stand up and fight?

Fair call

Those supporters who got to see Robbie were truly blessed. And I mean, truly blessed. Our regular team defeats were offset by the majesty of watching Robbie glide through the centre of the MCG or run the members wing. Every time he got near the ball or had the ball, a buzz of excitement went through our supporters like electricity. We rose to our feet, shouting just one word, “Robbie”. He was a freak. He was graceful. He ran like a gazelle and leapt like Rudolph Nureyev. He turned on a sixpence and kicked his long drop punts like the ball was from a slingshot. He was untouchable at his best. He slipped out of tackles like Houdini. He was truly unforgettable. Opponents never knew which way he was going to turn because he was ambidextrous. They never knew where the ball was going because he used both hands and both feet whilst pivoting and side stepping like a kid jumping across stones in a creek. And in a period of rough tough footballers and thugs, he was shaped like fine porcelain china. Arms and legs like a flamingo that you felt could snap at any time. The best of the best, that was Robbie. Above all his grace in defeat and his humility in victory were hallmarks of his personality. He was not only a great footballer but a great human being. Truly poetry in motion. A player of beauty.

They have a decent coach Clint.

ALEX DOCHERTY at The Mongrel Punt Jake Bowey – Midfielder, 174cm, 67kg As someone who has played at the same junior local club, I have to say I’ve grown a bit of a liking to little Jake Bowey. But when it comes down to crunch time, this kid has got moves. There’s not a lot of him in a body sense, but when called upon, he attacks the contest at speed. He’s also a very handy player on the outside, with some saying he’s the most talented to come out of the Sandy Dragons footy factory and that’s saying something with the talent they’ve produced in recent years. As one of the smaller players from this year’s draft class, he brings great pace which could see him start his AFL career more as a small forward. He did manage to snag two bags of three in the NAB league in 2019. He also averaged over three tackles per game for the Dragons last year, playing both as a forward and in roles higher up the ground, so he can be very dangerous player that adds class when he needs to be.

Gee, I like the look of Rosman. Has got “don’t fork with me” written all over him. 5 or 6 kgs of muscle and another cm or 2 and look out!

Premiership window vs premiership pane

Dean almost cruised around and was still getting used to AFL before his career was over. Over the years the Dees have not had much luck with "elite forwards' Injury snd other reasons have shortened their career so much so this I believe almost more than any other is a genuine reason Why this flag drought continues. Examples of the above are Schwartz Jurrah Jackovich Charles Farmer Dean Stephen Smith (his Hamstrings were dodgy ) Hogan Pike Mark Jackson a skinny tall player who kicked 6 one day surname or first name was Glen I think can't remember his Complete name) .Other fans could add but I are just remembering while typing this post. Biggest single factor was Schwartz whose 3 knee recos killed his amazing agility and movement. I will go to my grave confident that given a free reign from injury David would have been just as good as Wayne Carey and 1998 and 2000 and other seasons may have turned out different! BTW Schwartz played in the Reserves (or whatever they were called ) and showed his skill so much so that I said to my family at the time he would be our next CHF. We know his story and still feel for him as he was virtually cut Down in his prime but bravely played on really only a shadow of that 1994 glimpse. Letssee what happens in the next 5 Years starting in 2021.

Wrecker, I think that (unlike P2J) you are very genuine in your beliefs about this and data in the US has shown that there are many people in your position too, especially on the Republican side. However, I think that many of the facts that you've been bringing up are incorrect, which is skewing things. For instance, the quoted statement is not true. There has been no evidence (even through the many legal cases) presented that scrutineers were not allowed in to check votes. The legal fight on the night was about how far they could stand from the votes. The 'blue shift' depended entirely on when mail in votes were counted. Some states (like Ohio) counted them first, leading to it appearing that the Democrats were winning, but as the in person voting occurred (which skewed Republican) it showed that the Republicans were going to carry the state comfortably. The opposite happened in states that counted votes the other way around (most states), such as Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, Michigan, Georgia etc. That isn't an indication that there's fraud, it's just the way the elections normally work .... but COVID meant that many more people voted by mail that had previously. Like I said before, it's simply too hard to rig enough elections in the US to change the result. The voting systems of states are just too stupid and convoluted to make it work!! There are ways to rig the election (voter suppression, gerrymandering, electoral college) in the US because they have a terrible democratic system, but their presidential election is really difficult to rig in the ways the GOP are claiming.

Not much, he died a long time ago.

IMO 'premiership window' is just another one of those meaningless buzzwords used by pseudo-intellectuals on footy talk shows. Was the bulldogs window open in 2016? Tigers in 2017? We've been saying for a decade that Geelong's demise is imminent, but we're yet to see it. Flags are won by damn good sides; it really is that simple. We're not (yet) in the 'damn good side' category, but only the most pessimistic dees supporter would say that we haven't got most of the required pieces. When things click, other sides have shown that it's possible to contend for flags very quickly.

As open as it is for St Kilda. At the very least.

Big Benny Brown just stuck his foot in the door so it won't shut. ?

Thats a very big call IMV. Warren came over from SA with Stretchy and Obber, I think. And if not for trying to patch holes at CHB and HBF could have been another wingman of the ages. But it was the time of, "just clock him" and Gary Ayres at about 20Kg heavier seemed to do do it regularly. It was an era of seeing my favourite players Flower, Johnson and Dean who were all very light and ball players, get smashed by thug players responding to Jeans and Hafey. Still gives me the tom [censored]...

Couldn't be more thrilled with the off field moves. i think Alan Richardson into the GM role will prove to be a masterstroke, Mark Williams imo is the best development coach in the game outside of Brendan McCartney so very good to fill that role again, and Adem Yze is an absolute gun, he will absolutely sort our midfield out. three experienced and high quality football people walking in the door significantly improve our program. it's now or never for goody, he couldn't have a better team, the club is in good hands.

lol I think you missed the Jesus puns

No need to apologise most of us share your feelings. Sadly, it’s always been part of our human nature, worsened by the invisibility of social media where individuals say things in a manner they would never say face to face, and If they did, I would punch them very hard in the face. Remember, like in real life there are more good guys than bad. It seems you are on the right side.

Of course he is. If he hadn't put so much effort into winning four Premierships, he would have had a team much better placed this year. Possibly finishing as high as the bottom half of the eight.

No, I haven't experienced war. Except when someone disagrees with me on Demonland.... Perhaps you aren't aware of the histories of other civilizations because you can't or don't care to read Chinese or Russian or Farsi or Hindi or Urdu or Arabic or Japanese or whatever the Mughals spoke or the Mongols or the Ching or the Aztecs or the Khmer or the Han or the Qin or the Tang or the Ming or the Yuan or the Ottomans or the Romans or the Greeks or the Vikings or Soong or the..... there's a very long list. How could anyone possibly tally up all the deaths? I do know that the number of dead in the last 70 years of rule by the CCP is pretty similar to the total of deaths in WWI and II combined. They got nukes. How many did Stalin murder? Read the Gulag Archipelago and tell me life was better in the USSR. As for Afghanistan, the Russians invaded in 1979. The had already invaded or at least backed the oppressive regimes of the Eastern block. They got nukes. How quickly we forget. In any case, only in the West is there a free media over many generations that allows us approach historical events from a variety of points of view in English. We can compare official points of view with unofficial points of view. We can make all kinds of tv shows and films and stuff. You think the CCP allows people to write an accurate or critical history of China? Each successive Chinese regime rewrites history to suit itself. Unless you read Chinese, you'd have to read it in English to get the truth. Ironic that the culture you decry is the only one that allows open and unfettered examination and criticism of itself, such as you display above. Yes, the West lies, but it also tells the truth. There's nothing our government can do to stop us from telling it. That's why it is so good. If I was to say any one of your criticisms of the West about the govt where I live, I would be imprisoned, possibly tortured, and certainly deported. Freedom of expression is the greatest thing. One of our best characteristics. If you don't appreciate it, fair enough, but I do because while I haven't been bombed, I have been and am gagged. If I was to merely mention in public, or on social media etc, a country beginning with the seventeenth letter of the alphabet in public I would risk jail and deportation. Until recently, another country, the one beginning with the ninth letter of the alphabet, one which you freely type without a second thought (I assume), was in the same boat. My wife is a librarian; she is required to erase that county's existence from maps and books in her library. She uses a marker or white out. People from the govt come regularly to check, as they check for other banned forms of expression -- pictures of greek statues, for instance. The rationale for the use of the bomb against the Japanese is fairly rock-solid. Although, I would argue that they could have dropped them off-shore and asked the Japanese to take a look and when the waves subsided, see if they really wanted to go on... Might have worked. A number often bandied about is that the bomb spared 2,000,000 lives, but I'm open to other arguments. Here's some good info on the debate: https://www.atomicheritage.org/history/debate-over-bomb

I’d be curious to know where he ranked our three picks overall. Presumably higher than what we got them for but by how much?

So we shouldn't expect to see him until about age 30, where he will develop a cult following after displaying some freakish ability, before being brutally cut from the list? Guess after that we can re-draft him during the mid-season draft the following year to revive his career.

A close contact is on the Recruiting table of the Cats and whilst he never gives much away, he told me that the Cats moved to get ahead of the Dees because they had a strong belief that the Dees were taking Holmes with one of their first 2 Picks. ‘Personally, I found that amazing that at this stage of our list make-up and needs that we would use such a high pick on a speculative project player. He stated that he liked what the Dees had done, particularly the Jake Bowie selection. He didn’t have an opinion on why Jack Carroll had slipped so much.

Thanks Kenty. I find as I get older surrounded by death not too many people miss me. Even during my recent stay in hospital, the pretty nurses (yes, there are a few) ignored my ripping physique and special attributes and looked shocked when I told them my birthdate. My Caribbean nurse simply refused to believe that I took no medication. Strangely she did not ask me about hard liquor! When I ask today’s youth whether they have read any Hemingway, firstly, they ask who the hell is Hemingway, or, secondly, they sometimes have a vague idea and immediately Google the name on their smart phones, and tell me that they only read stuff on the net, and then nothing more than a few sentences. They appear to skim over anything more than two paragraphs. They also favour 15 minute quarters and T20 cricket. They tell me that watching Test Cricket and reading books is as boring as watching grass grow. Sadly attention spans and standards are dropping every year as more and more people seem to have acquired ADHD and are prone to control and manipulation by those with power and money. The evil doers who are multiplying every day. I have also tired of posters on this site attempting to one-up others for reasons that are beyond me. Is it simply ego or are they merely downtrodden types that no one listens to in real life? So that in this delusional vacuum known as social media and Demonland, they are under the strange belief that their opinions are important and valued. Poor souls. However, I find humour in many posts and also find value in the better informed scholars of the game that know much more than I do about what’s going on. I fluctuate between a crazy emotional state of thinking that footy, most importantly and solely that the MFC is important in my life still knowing that I will descend to hell before we win a flag ( there is something slightly meaningful about maintaining loyalty in the face of never ending failure). Continuity in suffering is one of life’s realities that feed my melancholy and allows one to reflect on the futility of human life and the futility of watching the Demons each week with this crazy feeling of hope. Anyway, thanks Kenty, it’s nice to be remembered despite the realisation that the sands of time will soon cover any traces of my existence in this broken world. A world increasingly peopled by fools, opportunists and snake oil salesmen (and women) who only want to look at their own reflection in the mirror. Returning to smart phones, Its a worry, when the medical staff of one of our best hospitals have to resort to google to provide answers and information on my maladies!

Was there genuine interest in Jack Carroll?

He will wear the number 43.5 then

All I can see here is Baker playing guitar and Petty on drums. Not sure either had the required capabilties.

Hope he doesn't turn into a whipping boy, and get crucified on DL on a weekly basis.

I've not come across a Jewish Mad as a Cut snake FAST BOWLER WITH A KILLER INSTINCT before. And I played a few games against Elsernwick ...

You don't need weapons to be in a war. China are at war right now with the U.S and to a slightly lesser extent, Australia. I was going to call it a 'covert' war but it is so blatantly obvious it needs to be called for what it is.

I wish we had a few blokes who could kick as well as Bennett!!

I have about 15 questions about the leaks and need to better protect our draft board but I’ll save those. 1. Obviously I’d like to know what role they see the new guys in and if he’s concerned about Bowey’s size or Laurie’s speed (he won’t be but it’s worth asking). 2. Plans for the 2 remaining list spots and train on players? 3. Tall and medium defensive depth and lack of list changes there. 4. ‘Targeting’ certain attributes in recruiting, why? Sounds like it goes against best available which is dangerous 5. A review of previous drafts. What’s his process? Did the clubs mantra of ‘competitors’ overshadow the need for skills and run and lead to us playing catch up?

MB there was some discussion earlier this year about the currency of this linguistic oddity, 'a jargon or buzzword whose repeated use has irritated listeners here. Annoyingly it appears to be spreading. According to discussion on English Language and Usage , "Actually, learnings sounds terrible to native English speakers." I never heard of it being used at all until I worked with people from ....." Perhaps propagators of its usage should be called Guru Bob or similar.' 'Its etymology, grammatically correct or otherwise, can be traced in print at least to Shakespeare. In Cymbeline (1623) i. i. 43 The king..Puts to him all the Learnings that his time... as coach allows' Trust this assists but we're not holding our collective breath, given today's propensity for mass followers of media 'influencers' to accept and use these 'frankenweenisms'. It's all fugazi! TC

Who did Jason like if we still had our first round pick. which ended up being Pick 11 (Adelaide)? Just curious Also, how does he see recruiting next year with so much footy missed in 2020? Thanks

I apologise if I've misled anyone and it wasn't aimed at anyone in particular, maybe sickened was a bit harsh. I know people have different opinions, that's why we have discussion forums but I've been reading Demonland for a number of years before I ever joined and quite a lot of the time I've opened a thread it seems the discussion aint about a differing opinion but a personal attack. I don't even let my boss personally attack me and I've known him for over 30 years. Sorry if I've blabbered on.

Bewick! Berwick was a nice village in the south east of Melbourne that has now been overrun by urban sprawl!

so Magpies paying 1.5 million for Treloar to play for Doggies..! fantastic.

I’m mates with someone very high up at Caulfield Grammar. Said he’s an absolute ripper who has worked his guts out to improve after getting a scholarship in year 10. Freakish skills that remind him of Caleb Daniel with how he uses the footy. Comes from a great family with great values. He also added Will Phillips will play 200 games and captain the Roos.

How did the recruiting team go about assessing the Victorian prospects given the lack of exposed form?

all the speculation in the lead-up to the draft had us grabbing max holmes; how serious was our interest in him and what was your reaction when geelong made the trade to bring him in and - theoretically - gazzump us by taking him?

Obvious one is who will we invite to train with view to list.