Norm Smith was sacked 50 years ago today

[Wadda We Sing 10,685]

It's been 51 years since Melbourne won a flag.

50 years since Norm was sacked.

We have 5 wins this season.

51 - 50 + 5 = 6

Smith won 6 flags. Illuminati?

6 flags, 8 Grand Finals, 10 straight Finals series.

10 - 8 + 6 = 8

8 - 5 = 3

Half-Life 3 confirmed.

Its a bit early in the day to be taking dr..................

[praha 11,123]

Its a bit early in the day to be taking dr..................

I'm on Pluto time.

[ManDee 7,124]

I'm on Pluto time.

[dee-luded 2,959]

wonder if nostradamus predicted this?

what, the fall of rome?

[Soidee 1,496]

It's an absolute indictment on this club that see us without a flag for 51 years. Since Daniher we have been irrelevant with a glimmer shining through the glass at the moment.

The club is still hopeless with self promotion and all the talk by Bartlett has come to zilch so far with getting our profile out of the toilet.

Roos and Jackson need to land a A Grade fish or 2 before their tenure is up, our club profile still stinks.

[Grapeviney 9,513]

[ManDee 7,124]

I am Melbourne and I'm Melbourne through and through.

Great man, thanks for the video GV.

[hemingway 7,615]

Norm was obviously a great coach for his time and a remarkable man. However, it is too simplistic to say that Melbourne's demise was due to his sacking. The parallel in modern times is probably the sacking of Mick Malthouse and the demise of Carlton.

Norm was arguably at the end of his coaching career. He had been coach for 15 years. He had a great record, however, the Demons in the mid 1960s were not the same side as that of the 1950s and early 60s. Many of the great players had retired or moved on, including the inspiration and lynch pin of the side, Ron Barassi who was at the end of his playing days. His list was aging and the club had got lazy and complacent and not recruited very well. W

[Wadda We Sing 10,685]

I think drawing a parallel between Norm Smith and MM at Carltank is a long bow.....just sayin

[hemingway 7,615]

not recruited very well. We had a poor list and a coach that was in poor health and poor disposition. The ill feeling between committee and coach had become unmanageable. Smith took no prisoners and committee were getting increasing frustrated at Smiths contemptuous manner toward them. Many of the younger players were not happy with Smiths authoritarian approach and strict discipline. Arguably, he was beginning to lose many players. Indeed when he went to South Melbourne, Norm was initially regarded with great reverence but this began to wane with both the committee and certainly some of the players. Very similar to Barassi in his final years. Malthouse the same. All coaches are a product of the times and have a use buy date. As we all do.

My point is that Melbourne was going to have a long time in the wilderness with or without Norm. No one would have thought that it would be 50 years, but it just goes to show that the good times never last and we should treasure the good times.

[chook fowler 19,251]

I think drawing a parallel between Norm Smith and MM at Carltank is a long bow.....just sayin

Yes because Carlton made the right call - we didn't.

Malthouse is not in the same league as the Red Fox.

[iv'a worn smith 1,979]

Norm was obviously a great coach for his time and a remarkable man. However, it is too simplistic to say that Melbourne's demise was due to his sacking. The parallel in modern times is probably the sacking of Mick Malthouse and the demise of Carlton.

Norm was arguably at the end of his coaching career. He had been coach for 15 years. He had a great record, however, the Demons in the mid 1960s were not the same side as that of the 1950s and early 60s. Many of the great players had retired or moved on, including the inspiration and lynch pin of the side, Ron Barassi who was at the end of his playing days. His list was aging and the club had got lazy and complacent and not recruited very well. W

For those that have the read the Red Fox, Norm also counselled the old school tie committee at the MFC that better recruitment methods and money would only attract good recruits. Even back then, Norm had emphatically tried to alert the committee that the days of Jim Cardwell giving a kid's old man a box of beer and the missus a box of Roses chocolates were fast disappearing and the MFC had to 'modernise' itself to keep up. Of course this was anathema to the likes of Dr. Duffy and his brigade of stuffed shirts.

History clearly informs us of our plight since those days.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,646]

Norm was obviously a great coach for his time and a remarkable man. However, it is too simplistic to say that Melbourne's demise was due to his sacking. The parallel in modern times is probably the sacking of Mick Malthouse and the demise of Carlton.

Norm was arguably at the end of his coaching career. He had been coach for 15 years. He had a great record, however, the Demons in the mid 1960s were not the same side as that of the 1950s and early 60s. Many of the great players had retired or moved on, including the inspiration and lynch pin of the side, Ron Barassi who was at the end of his playing days. His list was aging and the club had got lazy and complacent and not recruited very well. W

When drawing parallels, I wonder whether Malthouse and Collingwood is more apt? It seems to be commonly accepted that one of the reasons Collingwood moved Mick Malthouse on was to enable them not to lose Nathan Buckley. Conversely, does anyone know whether Ron Barassi wanted to coach Melbourne but couldn't do so because of Norm Smith's grip on the job and subsequently moved to Carlton to get that chance? I've never seen this suggested before, but I'm too young to remember.

[iv'a worn smith 1,979]

When drawing parallels, I wonder whether Malthouse and Collingwood is more apt? It seems to be commonly accepted that one of the reasons Collingwood moved Mick Malthouse on was to enable them not to lose Nathan Buckley. Conversely, does anyone know whether Ron Barassi wanted to coach Melbourne but couldn't do so because of Norm Smith's grip on the job and subsequently moved to Carlton to get that chance? I've never seen this suggested before, but I'm too young to remember.

At the time, Norm was seemingly comfortably ensconced in the coaching role at Melbourne. RDB desperately wanted to prove his mettle as a coach and thought it was best he left the MFC to ply his trade and not live in the shadow of his great mentor. The MFC wanted a similar succession plan to the Malthouse/Buckley model, but my recollection is Barass couldn't wait.

[edit]: RDB was devastated and dirty with what happened to Norm and it took him a long time to forgive and forget.

Edited July 23, 2015 by iv'a worn smith

[hemingway 7,615]

When drawing parallels, I wonder whether Malthouse and Collingwood is more apt? It seems to be commonly accepted that one of the reasons Collingwood moved Mick Malthouse on was to enable them not to lose Nathan Buckley. Conversely, does anyone know whether Ron Barassi wanted to coach Melbourne but couldn't do so because of Norm Smith's grip on the job and subsequently moved to Carlton to get that chance? I've never seen this suggested before, but I'm too young to remember.

interesting point La Dee. I think your supposition is correct. When he got the Carlton offer he went to Norm to discuss and got his approval. I think that Norm saw Ron as his logical successor but that he would have to wait a little longer to take over. Also, I seem to remember that Ron thought that if he stayed with Melbourne and took over from Norm that he would coach in the shadow of the great man, and that any success, would be seen as Norms rather than his own. This occurred when Norm took over from Chequer Hughes. In Norm's early years, the team was seen as Chequers rather than his own. Perhaps the same thing might be said when Goodwin takes over from Roos!!

[bush demon 2,003]

not yet, it lives in pretentiousness, & political correctness, the enemies of the razor tongued red fox... first rounds went to the redhead, but in the end he was knocked out by the growing soft attitudes of the time, which still prevail within so many unwitting carriers.

Don't forget Smith and Barassi were both shopping around in '64, according to Red Fox. Ultimately the business model collapsed cow of over-reliance on these two.

[bush demon 2,003]

interesting point La Dee. I think your supposition is correct. When he got the Carlton offer he went to Norm to discuss and got his approval. I think that Norm saw Ron as his logical successor but that he would have to wait a little longer to take over. Also, I seem to remember that Ron thought that if he stayed with Melbourne and took over from Norm that he would coach in the shadow of the great man, and that any success, would be seen as Norms rather than his own. This occurred when Norm took over from Chequer Hughes. In Norm's early years, the team was seen as Chequers rather than his own. Perhaps the same thing might be said when Goodwin takes over from Roos!!

And yet Checker was sitting in the coaches box in 64 gf, can't Have been too much of an issue. I think Smith counselled Barassi to do a Rossie Lyon, and go to a team on the up.

[dee-luded 2,959]

And yet Checker was sitting in the coaches box in 64 gf, can't Have been too much of an issue. I think Smith counselled Barassi to do a Rossie Lyon, and go to a team on the up.

Barass, was so ambitious... couldn't wait & wanted to take on the world. & make his fortune as well. he didn't want to cause smith to be moved on.

if Roosy's model was adopted a transition would have been organised. a smooth one.

but IMO, much more was in play, & I think off field, the committee were growing politically correct & precious, (as higher educated people have a habit of doing); about copping a tongue lashing from someone like the red fox... so imoo, they acted to punish him, with his exodus.

that same self preservation lives on today, in the very nature of the Northern Stand, to keep who wish to belong in there SAFE, from the the masses of UnRuly 's in the outer.

However keeping our fans in the outer, only distances our fans from the club, & eventually they will find new homes, where they all feel more welcome...

& so we a have dwindling support base & finances.

this same self preservation impacts our players, & they learn from those off field wealthy peers, the safe self preservation methods. the ruggedness is matured right out of them.

Edited July 26, 2015 by dee-luded

[picket fence 16,689]

Norm Smith was sensationally sacked by Melbourne 50 years ago on Thursday

The moment that sent the MFC into the footy wilderness.

And one from which we have never recovered!

Loyalty, shredded

Friendships, lost

Credibility, questioned

Unification, compromised

Mental anguish, exacerbated ( still felt today)

Success since, found wanting

Final word, ??

" A BLOODY DISGRACE"

[Jumping Jack Clennett 1,749]

We made the top four eleven, not ten, years in succession from 1954 to 1964.

Another factor in the end to our dominance was Richmond coming to the MCG. Before that, sides only experienced the MCG once a year, if they didn't make the finals. We played the finals on the ground where we trained, and played every second week.

Now with so many teams sharing the MCG , it is not just less of an advantage, we're at a disadvantage.

Rarely do we play home games with a partisan crowd (except against the strong interstate teams) This is a huge contrast to Geelong, and the Adelaide and Perth clubs.

It used to be advantageous to be based at the MCG, but Melbourne now has no territorial base, like Essendon, Richmond,Footscray,Geelong,Carlton and the stronger interstaters do.

[dee-luded 2,959]

And one from which we have never recovered!

Loyalty, shredded

Friendships, lost

Credibility, questioned

Unification, compromised

Mental anguish, exacerbated ( still felt today)

Success since, found wanting

Final word, ??

" A BLOODY DISGRACE"

its NOT the sacking we haven't recovered from.

its the takover thats been sucking our essence from us, ever since. the essence of 'checker' ; the red blooded fight like hell spirit, has been sucked dry

[RalphiusMaximus 6,012]

The worst thing this club has ever done.

[Whispering_Jack 29,209]

We were a victim of our own success and remained innately conservative clinging on to the ways of amateur sport when the direction everywhere else was towards professionalism. The club was run with an imperious air by a committee that thought it was born to rule and it brooked no change. The attitude to a loyal and successful servant in Smith was just part of the problems that were building up at the club but the sacking was the watershed.

On the Saturday, we played North Melbourne which had moved that year to the Coburg City Oval. Checker Hughes was our stand in coach and I remember it rained heavily and we lost. To North Melbourne - a lowly club and in normal circumstances we would never lower our colours to them. We were the reigning premiers. We won the first eight games of 1965 and the boat was being rocked.

[bjDee 1,249]

Unknown. Homo habilis relocated their franchise to the Gold Coast which caused prolonged expense and heartbreak, were not heard from after 1,800,000 BC.

Homo sapiens drafted all their best talent as free agents and the rest is history.

I believe Homo Flacidus was being driven out, tail between its legs, of its own habitat by Homo Repossessivus, when Homo Flacidus came across a field of Papaver Viagralis. After partaking in a little of the blue-coloured weed, Homo Flacidus suddenly transformed into Homo Erectus. And the rest, as they say, is history.....

[monoccular 17,321]

And one from which we have never recovered!

Loyalty, shredded

Friendships, lost

Credibility, questioned

Unification, compromised

Mental anguish, exacerbated ( still felt today)

Success since, found wanting

Final word, ??

" A BLOODY DISGRACE"

But surely 50 years is long enough for this curse to last

What better time for a Demonic exorcism than against a pack of Saints.