POSTMATCH: Rd 20 vs Richmond

[Deemania since 56 6,132]

8 hours ago, Jaded said:

Was brave and got better the wetter the day got. Sadly doesn’t impact the contest enough and doesn’t get the ball enough. Tried really hard but he’s just another average inside mid. Fine to keep as filler but he will never make it. 

Thought JKH was ok, just a little underdone but finds space and makes space to keep team possession. His handball is a weakness and at the contest, he can be easily managed physically. 

[Deemania since 56 6,132]

7 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Did you actually watch the game tonight?

Left a great deal to be desired, even in the early, competitive moments life was very shaky. Holes in method, all over the ground. 

[Bring-Back-Powell 13,148]

Dunkley’s set shots for goal were outstanding.

Hats off to him.

 

[Demonland 64,800]

Just a reminder for posters to leave the grammar policing to the grammar police  

This thread is for discussing the match. 

[Winners at last 4,727]

I had put $200 on the Tigers @ $1.17.  Money for old rope. Pays for my coffees this weeek.

 

 

[Docs Demons 1,658]

7 hours ago, jumbo returns said:

Wow

Not sure what everyone was expecting?

Premiership contender v 17th - the 2nd stringers tried hard and did ok

JKH was good, Petty can mark, Dunkley made space and Hibbo tried all night

Oliver and Gawn were fantastic and Fritta finally kicked straight

Let's go to the draft, get our forward line back and then reassess

Excellent comments. Not all is lost. Thought Frosty also gave his all albeit some brain fades but that is what we will get with him. Heart in mouth stuff..

Good finish in last 3 games which we can win and get to work in preseason and onward's and upwards in 20 with some clever drafting and de -listings

[DeeZee 6,731]

I thought JKH was a damn sight better than ANB as far as actually doing something with the ball. 

Dunkley will be great, just needs time.

Just need to find a tall Forward and a speedy winger in the off season and have a bit of luck with injuries, hopefully get Vanders on the park and a big preseason for all, with a killer instinct to start off next season.

[3183 Dee 2,602]

2 hours ago, Deemania since 56 said:

Another error of many from Goodwin, exemplified this year for too long. As I have always stressed, Fritsch is a forward and is not a backman. The guy's career has been hampered alongside the performance of the team. 

I just don’t understand why people keep harping in about this. Fritsch was put back out of necessity! No Lever, May, Jetta in the backline for the majority of the season meant that Goodwin had to put someone back who could at least jump at a contest and is a reasonably reliable kick out of defence. That is why Fritsch was played back - not because of any stubborn, misguided Goodwin decision. Who else could he have put there?

It’s no surprise that, now he’s able to revert to the forward line, we are starting to see why we recruited him.

[Demon Dynasty 15,405]

13 minutes ago, DeeZee said:

I thought JKH was a damn sight better than ANB as far as actually doing something with the ball. 

Dunkley will be great, just needs time.

Just need to find a tall Forward and a speedy winger in the off season and have a bit of luck with injuries, hopefully get Vanders on the park and a big preseason for all, with a killer instinct to start off next season.

I think you mean a quality tall forward DZ.  Unfortunately they dont grow on trees and everyone wants them.  Being a minnow club also means it is difficult to attract them and the AFL's free agency model ensures the stronger clubs just get even stronger (eg, Lynch to the Tigers, Ablett Jnr back to the Cats, Frawley over to the Hawks etc etc).

Never thought i would say this but in just a few matches Petty has looked more like a decent forward in work rate, general craft and finish than either of Weid and T-mac (other than his last match) in an entire season.  Might not be getting alot of attention right now though so not getting overly excited either.

We also need two super competitive speedy smalls to crumb, feed off any talls and pressure inside 50 so we can lock the ball in for more than just the initial entry.  The ease at which the opp has escaped this year is frightening.

[SPC 2,791]

Been very emotional and scathing of the side thus far this year.. I watched last nights game as a casual observer.

So many times we had the ball in great position with players making options, then we butchered it. We were poorly out of position and gifted easy goals. I actually agree with Goody. We are only 5-10% off, but it kills ours play. We look unaccountable and lazy, but in reality we have 12 blokes running to make position, who get burnt by errant kicks or handballs. 

I honestly think we will turn this around next year. 

[Demon Dynasty 15,405]

20 minutes ago, 3183 Dee said:

I just don’t understand why people keep harping in about this. Fritsch was put back out of necessity! No Lever, May, Jetta in the backline for the majority of the season meant that Goodwin had to put someone back who could at least jump at a contest and is a reasonably reliable kick out of defence. That is why Fritsch was played back - not because of any stubborn, misguided Goodwin decision. Who else could he have put there?

It’s no surprise that, now he’s able to revert to the forward line, we are starting to see why we recruited him.

Have to agree to disagree 3183

Could have used / triallled one of our better contested marks, with the strength to win one on one ground balls when the ball hits the ground in Tracc.  Tracc was having little to no impact up forward in first half of the season.   Both Tracc & Fritschkreig were off their 2018 levels of output up to the half way mark by 20% plus and could have done with the change up, even as a trial for a few matches.  Goody tried zip with Fritta to amend his poor form down back until very late in the season with nothing to gain/lose.

Or moved Tracc into the middle for longer stints/share this with Jones, play Salem in the HB role, again allowing Fritta to go forward in his usual role.

Weid & T-Mac completely innefective up forward.  Roll either of them through Fritta's posi and swap to try and get something happening up forward and the scoreboard ticking over.

Plenty of options if the coach thought about it and was willing to trial them in training and match day.

Outside of Tracc who started to play a tad more time through the middle as the seaaon progressed (tank slowly inproving....not sure why it needed 8 to 10 matches to do so!!??) and the odd block of minutes with T-mac in a defensive role, Goody played them in their same (or similar) positions / roles up to the half way mark and by that stage the season was pretty much shot.

While definetely restricted in terms of options, part of what sorts the ordinary from the good and the great is the ability to use one's imagination and adapt.  Clarko probably one of the best at doing so.  Worlds away in terms of experience but Goody is in to his third season and the "proactive" signs aren't great.  Too reactive till this point IMHO.

[At the break of Gawn 3,486]

I sometimes forget that Viney is one of our captains, but then I remember and just shake my head in disbelief. 

I really hope Gawn being sole captain gets some traction in the media to put some pressure on Goodwin.

[Dr. Gonzo 22,412]

4 hours ago, John Demonic said:

Why would you expect a belting? Is it psychological padding for the fade-out losses so they're more honourable? We haven't been belted all year. We do however repeat the same performance over and over where we're in the game for a few quarters (doing well) before falling away in the 3rd or last because of turnovers or poor inside 50 conversion. Irrespective of whether it's Richmond or St Kilda, the result is the same. At least our forward line has seen some improvement and converted a little more accurately though these past two weeks.

Tonight was an extremely predictable game that I expected would mirror our earlier match against the Tigers. We'd take it up to them until they wore us down and kicked away. No shame in the performance, but i don't think absence of players, umpires, or the weather had anything to do with losing the game. They would've kicked away, like they did last year.

We still have to make some big off-season changes to our personnel imo. 3 or 4 ready to go players on each line and playing 1 or 2 draftees and then i would guess that wed still probably be 1 more elite midfielder away from contending very deep in the finals, which also might mean another years development could see Oliver fill that need by excelling another level. Have seen some positive signs with the way we've been slowing up the game and switching, so i'm remaining positive too.

Because Richmond are the form team of the competition who were looking for percentage on their way to a top 4 finish and we were playing with a completely makeshift forward line and half a backline and are waiting for the season to end.

Did you not watch the Tigers dismantle Collingwood a couple of weeks back?

[Ugottobekidding 915]

Still asking myself why Fritch has only just gone forward when the season is dead?

[Dr. Gonzo 22,412]

4 hours ago, Forest Demon said:

On paper, you would think we would be ok in the wet, but we over possess it and continually bite off more than we can chew. We can’t move the ball in the perfect conditions, not sure how they expect to do it in the wet.

The number of times our play breaks down because a handball is at someone’s feet, or a kick that is A few metres off and bounces rather than hit a teammates chest is incredibly frustrating to watch. It invites pressure and it just builds until we inevitably turn it over.

Wet weather football is traditionally long down the line. When you're only marking target is a ruckman you're gonna be in trouble. Petty was good early and faded in the 2nd half with the conditions. Preuss was terrible all round. Fritsch tried but is undersized. We had noone else up forward and fell down when the game reverted to wet weather footy. Compare that to the Tigers who had Riewoldt, Lynch, Soldo and Chol as hit up targets and then plenty of small forwards swarming at their feet.

[sue 8,424]

I didn't read pages 3 to 6 but the earlier negative comments are really laughable.  Some posters just enjoy being miserable. 

Here we are 17th playing a premiership favourite team in hot form.  We lacked 2 of our best defenders, and no big forwards and yet kept with them till it rained.   Most expected us to lose by a huge margin.  Where's the evidence Richmond were playing in second gear - it's easy to say to fit a narrative, hard to prove.  In fact they had lots of motivation to thrash us but didn't.  Yes, we made errors in the first half. But it is not as if Richmond missed shots to keep us in the game.

Sure they may have run over us even if it had't rained, but we don't know for sure - many of the people saying that were also saying we'd be run over from the first bounce (as many of us expected), but we weren't.   

It is also clear that the style of play we had in the first half does not work when it is wet.  So not surprising Richmond took advantage.  Obviously this is something we have to fix (along with much else).

But in contrast with many posters here, I just hope the players look at what they were capable of in the first half and take some confidence from that. 

[Dr. Gonzo 22,412]

3 hours ago, Deemania since 56 said:

Left a great deal to be desired, even in the early, competitive moments life was very shaky. Holes in method, all over the ground. 

We were clearly playing a different style, holding on to the footy more and playing the angles into the corridor. It worked. We just couldn't maintain it when the rain came and the tigers mids started to get on top.

That's what I was responding to, the incorrect assertion that Goodwin refuses to change up his chaos game style (which is dumb because we haven't really played that way since the bye)

[picket fence 15,128]

1 hour ago, At the break of Gawn said:

I sometimes forget that Viney is one of our captains, but then I remember and just shake my head in disbelief. 

I really hope Gawn being sole captain gets some traction in the media to put some pressure on Goodwin.

Viney ain't a Captains Bootlace! There I've said it!

[Cards13 9,117]

13 hours ago, The heart beats true said:

I’d love to ask Glenn Bartlett what his criteria for an external revue is (if falling from top 4 to second bottom doesn’t justify it).

Turn up the heat Glenn. It’s your job mate.

It’s Mahoney’s job to do that really ie turn the heat up on a terribly underperforming footy dept. He has escaped the heat but it sits at his feet.

Edited August 4, 2019 by Cards13

[dazzledavey36 48,722]

14 minutes ago, Cards13 said:

It’s Mahoney’s job to do that really ie turn the heat up on a terribly underperforming footy dept. He has escaped the heat but it sits at his feet.

Where does Todd Viney sit in all this?  Another who has escaped the heat in my opinion.

[DeeZone 7,708]

Went along with other family members to try and win a Jag but really enjoyed the first half of footy only three points in it at half time despite some very poor none decisions by umpires who have no feel for the game and I am getting more uncertain whether they know the rules or maybe I have just lost the plot. Once the rain came the Tiges played some great wet weather footy in the third and iced the game. Thought our boys fought hard all night but so many disposals just off the mark or kicked with to much hang time making it easy for them to spoil. We now have a really good core of players and I thought that Petty, Dunkley, JKH, Corey W and Oskar B also showed a bit (Dunkley can kick), add Marty Hore and Lockhart to that list and we have found a few this year. Just need to get our big guns back next year.

[Cam Schwab's Whiteboard 209]

2 hours ago, 3183 Dee said:

I just don’t understand why people keep harping in about this. Fritsch was put back out of necessity! No Lever, May, Jetta in the backline for the majority of the season meant that Goodwin had to put someone back who could at least jump at a contest and is a reasonably reliable kick out of defence. That is why Fritsch was played back - not because of any stubborn, misguided Goodwin decision. Who else could he have put there?

It’s no surprise that, now he’s able to revert to the forward line, we are starting to see why we recruited him.

What about the forward half? Clearly that hasn't been a necessity all season.

[chookrat 3,776]

13 hours ago, The heart beats true said:

I’d love to ask Glenn Bartlett what his criteria for an external revue is (if falling from top 4 to second bottom doesn’t justify it).

Turn up the heat Glenn. It’s your job mate.

I suspect it's because the club has a good understanding of what has gone wrong and will address the issues during the off season.

[Sorry kids 635]

12 hours ago, olisik said:

Wouldn’t mind seeing us try some other players in the guts instead of Viney, give JKH or Dunkley a run through the midfield over next couple games. Or more time to Petracca, or Salem.

I agree, playing in the mid with Gawn gives you X amount of kicks for a start which always makes mids look better than others. Mix it around.

[Demonsone 1,596]

13 minutes ago, chookrat said:

I suspect it's because the club has a good understanding of what has gone wrong and will address the issues during the off season.

https://www.melbournefc.com.au/news/2019-08-01/clubs-addressing-all-issues-bartlett