Depth issues

[Watts Jurrah Dunn? 735]

Ultimately our depth will be fixed over the next 2-3 drafts, so that Bugg, ANB, Tyson, Melksham and Harmes spend most of their time at Casey, rather than being regular best-22 players. They're no good. When these guys are the ones you see after 4-5 injuries, we'll be on our way. Just give Taylor a clear run at first and second round picks and don't go burning 2 first rounders on a player like Lever, and we'll be ok in 2019.

[KingDingAling 3,758]

3 hours ago, Watts Jurrah Dunn? said:

Ultimately our depth will be fixed over the next 2-3 drafts, so that Bugg, ANB, Tyson, Melksham and Harmes spend most of their time at Casey, rather than being regular best-22 players. They're no good. When these guys are the ones you see after 4-5 injuries, we'll be on our way. Just give Taylor a clear run at first and second round picks and don't go burning 2 first rounders on a player like Lever, and we'll be ok in 2019.

Lever will sign at Adelaide. Looking forward to seeing who we draft though. Taylor is essentially putting the finishing touches on his list now. Anything he can prize out now is a bonus. He has had some time now and he has done a fantastic job IMO. We are due for a Fyfe, Cripps, Parker or Powell-Pepper. Every other side has managed to eek out a prime mover in the first couple of rounds. I hope it is our turn.

[solly21 91]

I don't care who you are any team that is missing 6 of their best 10 players are going to struggle. You can only hold on for so long before it gets you that on top of the three consecutive 3 day breaks & coming homing from perth. We wouldn't have got into this position in the first place at 8 & 5 before tonight's game if the recruiters hadn't recruited well i think they have recruited well over the last 3 years before that the recruiting was disaster.

[Demonstone 22,638]

8 hours ago, Elegt said:

max King wouldn't get a game at any other afl  club

Hard to believe that Max King is even on an AFL list.

[jacey 333]

Hahaha. Really.

White and Wagner are OK depth players and will play a role. They cannot become critical players we lose.

Why else would they be depth players. 

White and wag can replace the likes of Melk, harmes, nb, bugg etc but them all playing together to cover our best players. Yeah nah no team can cover their losses of key players. 

[beelzebub 23,380]

I think we're just a tad stuffed currently 

[Elegt 872]

7 hours ago, jacey said:

Hahaha. Really.

White and Wagner are OK depth players and will play a role. They cannot become critical players we lose.

Why else would they be depth players. 

White and wag can replace the likes of Melk, harmes, nb, bugg etc but them all playing together to cover our best players. Yeah nah no team can cover their losses of key players. 

They are solid vfl players but trash afl players, recruiting some mature ages would've been a better idea such as Petrie or barlow

[The heart beats true 18,128]

1 hour ago, Elegt said:

They are solid vfl players but trash afl players, recruiting some mature ages would've been a better idea such as Petrie or barlow

Give it a rest.

We have injury issues, not depth issues.

Take Franklin, Reid, Hannebery, Heeney and Rampe out of Sydneys team last night, and then have them lose Kennedy at half time and you have sense of who we've lost. We honestly have 6 of our best 10 out. No one can plan for that.

Barlow and Petrie are top up players for teams whose age demographic are flush with too many kids (why is we already have Vince and Lewis), or teams who are older and need to capitalise now.

We have to be brave and recruit for the future too. No point having a strong older group and finishing 4-8th. Just look at North.

[Elegt 872]

2 minutes ago, The heart beats true said:

Give it a rest.

We have injury issues, not depth issues.

Take Franklin, Reid, Hannebery, Heeney and Rampe out of Sydneys team last night, and then have them lose Kennedy at half time and you have sense of who we've lost. We honestly have 6 of our best 10 out. No one can plan for that.

Barlow and Petrie are top up players for teams whose age demographic are flush with too many kids (why is we already have Vince and Lewis), or teams who are older and need to capitalise now.

We have to be brave and recruit for the future too. No point having a strong older group and finishing 4-8th. Just look at North.

We are a team who needs to capitalise.. A win last night would've potentially put us in the top 4

[The heart beats true 18,128]

4 minutes ago, Elegt said:

We are a team who needs to capitalise.. A win last night would've potentially put us in the top 4

So why didn't Sydney recruit Barlow and Petrie then? They had 4-5 of their best 10 out for the first 6 and lost them all. Because you can't set your team up for the worst scenario in one season. You have to plan for the future and the immediate need. Otherwise you'd never take kids below pick 25 in the draft and just top up on experienced rejects. If we did that we'd have:

No TMac, Oscar, Hunt, Stretch etc.

[Elegt 872]

2 minutes ago, The heart beats true said:

So why didn't Sydney recruit Barlow and Petrie then? They had 4-5 of their best 10 out for the first 6 and lost them all. Because you can't set your team up for the worst scenario in one season. You have to plan for the future and the immediate need. Otherwise you'd never take kids below pick 25 in the draft and just top up on experienced rejects. If we did that we'd have:

No TMac, Oscar, Hunt, Stretch etc.

replace the players who have no future such as trengove white hullet etc. with mature ages

kids are good but you can't rely on them fully , need some experience too

[Dappa Dan 2,188]

20 hours ago, Elegt said:

VDB is not even a best 22 player when fully fit

Worst. Thread. Ever.

The depth is possibly the best I've seen in my adult life. And the age profiles are exactly where you want them. IMHO we have the best depth of any club in the league, besides GWS.

 

[whatwhat say what 22,783]

Strange opening post when you consider what we've seen over the last...I dunno, thirty years?

Even under Daniher when we were pretty okay we didn't have the depth that we do now - last time I can think of having relatively dependable afl-level players was under Swooper

We have been crueled by injury in the last three weeks in particular. Losing Gawn and Hogan for a huge stretch before hand was also far from ideal

We lacked the class against a super Swans side, and we will be under the pump in terms of sheer quality alone next week, but the likes of Petrie (who only played on cos he was going to be under Simpson) or Barlow (who can't hit a target by foot and isn't quick even when he's got two working legs, the poor bugger) were hardly going to help us have 'quality depth'

The only 'quality depth' we had a chance of recruiting last year and missed out on - considering that we got Lewis and Hibberd - was Scott 'that traitorous so-and-so' Thompson cos of his relationship with Goodwin, and in the end we prioritised Lewis and the traitor decided to stay home...surprise, surprise

[leave it to deever 17,511]

This is the first year we have had a great deal of depth.

Last year we cleaned house.

There are several players like weid who are still learning.

I dont get why we have 3 spare rucks in Filopic, KIng and spencer though.

Yea we need  a couple more players but we have also been smashed injury wise like few others.

[kurtneverdied 244]

Sam Landsberger ?‏Verified account @SamLandsberger 21m21 minutes ago

Four Demons were not considered for AFL selection last night after a drinking session. Broke club rules. Details @superfooty ...

[GoD's67 111]

To look at depth, I selected my best 22 no injuries (like Port Adelaide have been able to do nearly every week).

Jetta.     T Mac.     Hibberd.

Hunt.      Frost.      Salem.

Vince.     Oliver.      Melksham.

Harmes.  Hogan.    Petracca.

Garlett.    Watts.     Hannan.

Gawn.     Jones.      Viney.

Tyson. Brayshaw. O Mac. Lewis.

Depth

Key position/Talls: Pederson.  Weideman.

Flankers/mids/pockets: Stretch.   Bugg.   ANB.

Smith.     Kent.    JKH.   Wagner.  Vandenburgh 

Your done, the rest on the list either have to improve, or aren't good enough:

Maynard.  M King. Filipovic.   McKenna. Kelty.

Kennedy.    White.   T Smith.    Hulett.

Probably last season:

Trengrove (sad, too slow, injuries finished him)

Spencer (much rather use Pederson, T Mac etc)

Garland (too slow, others passed him)

All in all, we've probably got 32 players we can field, which is pretty good, but you lose half a dozen of your best 12 and it gets ugly, just like for most teams, unless your AFL sponsored like GWS!

[poita 3,902]

Our issues are what happens when you don't make every single spot on the list count. Consider the following:

• Lumumba is still taking up a spot
• We have two developing ruckmen on the list, both of whom are miles off playing senior football
• Mitch White is in his third year on the rookie list, and hasn't improved one iota since his first year
• (I'm a fan) but why is Trengove still on the list when the coach doesn't rate him? Same as Terlich last year
• JKH has done nothing in three years, gets a new contract and gives the club the middle finger by going out drinking
• We keep giving lengthy contracts to the likes of Kennedy, Melksham and Bugg who are not best 22 players and who have little incentive to perform until their next contract year

Yes we have injuries, and plenty of them, but aside from Weideman there is zero in the way of quality young talent developing at Casey.

So what's left at Casey is a group of players who have been tried and have failed over and over again, but are still on the list because we hope there will be a miracle at some point. You keep some of these because you have to, but the rest should be turned over on a regular basis.

[Wiseblood 24,637]

16 minutes ago, poita said:

Our issues are what happens when you don't make every single spot on the list count. Consider the following:

• Lumumba is still taking up a spot
• We have two developing ruckmen on the list, both of whom are miles off playing senior football
• Mitch White is in his third year on the rookie list, and hasn't improved one iota since his first year
• (I'm a fan) but why is Trengove still on the list when the coach doesn't rate him? Same as Terlich last year
• JKH has done nothing in three years, gets a new contract and gives the club the middle finger by going out drinking
• We keep giving lengthy contracts to the likes of Kennedy, Melksham and Bugg who are not best 22 players and who have little incentive to perform until their next contract year

Yes we have injuries, and plenty of them, but aside from Weideman there is zero in the way of quality young talent developing at Casey.

So what's left at Casey is a group of players who have been tried and have failed over and over again, but are still on the list because we hope there will be a miracle at some point. You keep some of these because you have to, but the rest should be turned over on a regular basis.

I would have thought we would be #1 on the 'turn over your list' chart over the last 3 years.

This is such a stupid thread, though.  We've shown we have terrific depth and a good mix of players on our list.  Not everyone can be a star, and you can't have a list full of them either.  Every team have long term depth players, developing kids and other NQRs plying their trade in the seconds.  It's the only way to stay under the cap.

[xarronn 380]

9 minutes ago, poita said:

Our issues are what happens when you don't make every single spot on the list count. Consider the following:

• Lumumba is still taking up a spot
• We have two developing ruckmen on the list, both of whom are miles off playing senior football
• Mitch White is in his third year on the rookie list, and hasn't improved one iota since his first year
• (I'm a fan) but why is Trengove still on the list when the coach doesn't rate him? Same as Terlich last year
• JKH has done nothing in three years, gets a new contract and gives the club the middle finger by going out drinking
• We keep giving lengthy contracts to the likes of Kennedy, Melksham and Bugg who are not best 22 players and who have little incentive to perform until their next contract year

Yes we have injuries, and plenty of them, but aside from Weideman there is zero in the way of quality young talent developing at Casey.

So what's left at Casey is a group of players who have been tried and have failed over and over again, but are still on the list because we hope there will be a miracle at some point. You keep some of these because you have to, but the rest should be turned over on a regular basis.

Poita, I think your passion has probably got you looking glass half full.

1. You have to have experienced players at VFL level. Even if Trengove isn't going to make it, you need hardened bodies to lead the way and provide support. That's why Terlich and some others were there last year.

2. Leaving aside his indiscretion, something has changed with JKH in the last month, as has his body shape. May not make it but he is a new work in progress.

3. Joel Smith you left him out, hardly tried and failed.

4. Maynard, you left him out, not tried and failed.

5. Wagner, certainly isn't zero talent or a failure yet.I know he played AFL on Friday, but he is still a developing player.

6. What do you expect from the 2 rucks, both essentially in their first year because of injury and one is only 18. (Mitch White was only recruited at the end of 2015).

7. Are you sure about lengthy contracts for Bugg and Kennedy? They're both in their second year on our list, at most I would think one more year left. I wouldn't accuse Buggy of not trying. I'm not surprised he had a bad game on Friday after the incident.

8. In any case not every player can be best 22/

 

 

[sue 9,107]

I can't believe I'm reading this.   When a team has a seccond level of depth players who can cover their depth players who can cover their run-of-the-mill players who can cover their team's best players, then I think you'll find some other club will come a-poaching before that happens.

Edited July 3, 2017 by sue

[Ouch! 2,266]

On 7/1/2017 at 5:00 PM, Elegt said:

We are a team who needs to capitalise.. A win last night would've potentially put us in the top 4

So easy to say this... ^^^

Every single poster on this forum a month ago if you had told them we would have won 3 of 4 games and in the process beat WCE away as well as playing both grand finalists and thrashing last years premiers would have taken it without question.

We came up against a physical, mature side on the back of 4 games in 18 days with a significant number of injuries and more to come. 

Perhaps you need to look at the other games over the weekend, perhaps instead of all of the doom and gloom, it's better to realise that almost every club is facing issues and uncertainty, and in any given week you might get done by the team you are facing.

Apparently whichever team has occupied 17th on the ladder has beaten teams 10 times this season, only beaten by one other 'ladder' position. In of itself it means nothing except this season is and continues to be crazy, and we just have to hold on and see where the ride takes us.

[Pates 9,660]

On 30/06/2017 at 3:02 PM, Elegt said:

I never expected us to win tonight but ideally our depth players would compete and make a contest rather than turning the ball over with every disposal and not manning up

I'll give you that regarding the players we brought in. They both had absolute mares of games, Wagner in particular was disappointing for me because he was playing well prior to him being dropped in favour of Salem. He's definitely better than what he showed on Friday. 

White I was less convinced about his selection but bare in mind that 4 players, 3 of which I feel have been in better VFL form, made themselves unavailable for selection by stupidity. So we were dipping even further into our depth. 

Unless your GWS, depth players are always going to be plodders and we have had our injuries directed straight out our best. As someone else pointed out we have also lost AvB and Brayshaw, both who I would consider at least in the best 25. 

So we are getting to the depth of our depth. 

[monoccular 17,432]

On 30/06/2017 at 11:40 PM, Elegt said:

All I'm saying is we shouldn't be relying on duds like Wagner and white to try fill those holes, these guys are hopeless at afl level , better recruiting would help 

Take Selwood, Dangerfield and Hawkins out of Geelong and see how they go.

It is the players who have been injured, not the total numbers that have killed our season.

They have done extremely well to cover so far but this latest will probably be terminal for our season.

FMD why???

Edited July 3, 2017 by monoccular

[bluey 1,103]

On 01/07/2017 at 0:51 AM, Watts Jurrah Dunn? said:

Ultimately our depth will be fixed over the next 2-3 drafts, so that Bugg, ANB, Tyson, Melksham and Harmes spend most of their time at Casey, rather than being regular best-22 players. They're no good. When these guys are the ones you see after 4-5 injuries, we'll be on our way. Just give Taylor a clear run at first and second round picks and don't go burning 2 first rounders on a player like Lever, and we'll be ok in 2019.

Three drafts, ? better add Lewis, Vince and Possibly Jones to that replacement list, it's now or never, beat Carlton, and we only need to eke out three more wins for finals and the chance to patch up the injured , a bye, and make a run for the flag.

[Diamond_Jim 12,596]

Must be some upside in Melksham I would have thought.

Time for him to show his wares perhaps