POST MATCH DISCUSSION - Round 9

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

3 hours ago, Clint Bizkit said:

Our decision making when we take a mark still annoys me more than anything.

There are four mistakes we continue to make:

1. Play on too quickly before assessing the situation
2. Handball sideways to a player who is under pressure and that player then does not have the advantage of a "free kick"
3. Don't get back behind the mark quick enough and are forced to kick on an angle and not directly over the player on the mark
4. Not aware of where the mark is an allow opposition players to creep over it and apply pressure to a kick that should have zero pressure on it

Just thought of a fifth mistake, we tend to drift off the line resulting in the umpire calling play-on leading to the kicker having to kick under unnecessary pressure.

[Wiseblood 24,637]

1 minute ago, Clint Bizkit said:

Just thought of a fifth mistake, we tend to drift off the line resulting in the umpire calling play-on leading to the kicker having to kick under unnecessary pressure.

Of course you did. 

[old dee 24,003]

31 minutes ago, McQueen said:

Holy [censored], we are the new Richmond.

Ninth again.

If we are ninth after round 23 I will be a happy boy.

one hell of an improvement over the last decade.

[Pates 9,679]

1 minute ago, old dee said:

If we are ninth after round 23 I will be a happy boy.

one hell of an improvement over the last decade.

It means we were in the mix for the finals which is what I want out of this year. Obviously finals is the main desired outcome but from where we've been to 9th would a good step ahead.

[Gorgoroth 13,184]

10 minutes ago, WAClark said:

not really a creative pursuit, but yeah, not an overly confident set shot at this stage.

He kept the same angle in run up.and slight kick across his body and kept putting his hands on his headlike he was out of ideas. I dont think there is much wrong, but he does slightly kick across himself (to the left) and he also slightly lines his body up to the left of goal.

[Earl Hood 6,142]

26 minutes ago, WAClark said:

Don't know if it has been discussed, but I think Watts was fantastic as second ruck. What a bonus that could be going forward!

I don't think it is sustainable WA, he is too valuable a forward commodity to risk getting taken out by a big gorilla ruck down the track. He did well today but he did look vulnerable against the likes of Martin, who is not a mongrel b**stard like some so he survived unscathed. 

[Macca 17,114]

"First you win and then you get better" ... not sure who said that but it makes sense in our case.

We're actually not a good* side yet but we're getting some wins ... on track for at least 10+ wins too.  What we need to develop is a strong belief system in winning whilst developing as much talent as we can. 

That means we need to be patient and expect some inconsistent results whilst on that journey ... those who are frustrated with certain players need to realise that we're lumping a number of inexperienced players into the team at the same time (in terms of actual games played)

From today's game Wagner, Hunt, Harmes, ANB, Stretch, Petracca, Oliver, O-Mac, Kennedy, Hogan, Kent, Newton & Michie have all played only a limited amount of senior footy and none of them are the finished product yet because of that lack of senior experience (whilst already a good player, Hogan will get better)

Being too judgemental on any of the above players is premature ... our senior players or those players who have had enough time in the system can be judged in a more definitive way.  Others such as Gawn, Bugg & Watts are still improving (or proving themselves/starting to stamp themselves on the game)

So that's 16 of today's 22 who should or can get better (to varying degrees)  Viney is trending upwards as well.

Plus, we've got more inexperienced players not in the current side who have varying degrees of upside ... Frost, Salem, Brayshaw, White, Weideman, Hulett and even JKH.  ... AVB has played only 17 games & Tyson has just 58 games under his belt.  Whilst older, Spencer has only played 36 games.

 

*A good side could be described as a near guaranteed finals team or a top 4 side.

[Coq au vin 755]

4 hours ago, bjDee said:

Well that's neither here nor there!

LOL

[Lord Ivanhoe 311]

2 hours ago, Wiseblood said:

Whilst I agree that, in the third term, the Lions could have put more scoreboard pressure on, we could well have done the same in the first when we had 11 scoring shots and only kicked 5 goals.  Had we kicked a few of those shots and been 8.3 at quarter time then the contest is probably already over.

Not arguing about the third term, just saying it well and truly works both ways.

I agree. In addition the disallowed  Petracca goal robbed momentum both from the Dees and the game, from which the Lions benefited. It took us at least 5 mins to get back into it but we still won the quarter!

[jayceebee31 768]

5 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Couldn't believe it I got inside switched on the TV and saw Petracca kick a goal. Went to the toilet came back to see Lions lining up for "their 4th in a row" according to the commentators.  Had to rewind it to see what the hell happened 

Gee you must take your time at the toot....go there during the commercials.

[jayceebee31 768]

1 hour ago, old dee said:

If we are ninth after round 23 I will be a happy boy.

one hell of an improvement over the last decade.

Agree- great improvement, with a solid base to go even further.

[Undeeterred 3,127]

2 hours ago, Clint Bizkit said:

True, but we smashed interstate teams in 2011 as well.

 

Such a negative nelly! God, lighten up a bit! We've also beaten Collingwood and Richmond this year, so it's not just interstate teams.

2 hours ago, WAClark said:

Don't know if it has been discussed, but I think Watts was fantastic as second ruck. What a bonus that could be going forward!

Takes so much structure out of our forward line, and energy out of Watts. Not the long term solution.

[chook fowler 19,694]

4 minutes ago, jayceebee31 said:

Gee you must take your time at the toot....go there during the commercials.

I recommend movicol or looking at a picture of James Hird

[bing181 9,425]

1 hour ago, beelzebub said:

First you need a backline

Agreed, but I don't know that the backline that's currently out there is the one we'd envisaged. An in form H (and he was good/very good for those couple of matches before concussion), plus Melksham - OK, say what you want, but that's what they have planned for him apparently, and if his upside is the same as what we've seen with Kennedy and Bugg, he'll be a solid first 22 - would make a difference, if only in experience. Hunt and Wagner have played 13 matches between them, and at times it shows.

Not forgetting an in-form Salem, and we also have White in reserve (worth watching) and even, cough cough, Terlich and who knows, Grimes. 

It'll sort itself out in time. We have the cattle, but for the moment yes, the backline is lagging behind the rest of the team.

[old55 23,837]

I liked Watts in the ruck.  He was competitive enough and it gets him involved in general stoppage play.  It adds another dimension to his already valuable contribution and frees a slot in the 22 for another runner or another genuine marking fwd e.g. Dawes.

[Undeeterred 3,127]

1 hour ago, Wiseblood said:

Of course you did. 

Ha, I LOLled.

[Red and Bluebeard 2,101]

2 hours ago, beelzebub said:

First you need a backline

So which comes first --- the backline or the backline coach? Or is that a question like the chicken or the egg-and-bacon roll? 

[McQueen 17,867]

1 hour ago, old dee said:

If we are ninth after round 23 I will be a happy boy.

one hell of an improvement over the last decade.

Ninthbourne??

[Grapeviney 9,909]

Hardly got out of second gear and still cruised in by 10 goals - I'll take that any day of the week. 

If Peders had been there and Watts not forced to pinch-hit in the ruck, the margin would have been considerably more. 

In spite of the makeshift forward set-up, Jesse did really well to snag his five goals and assist in a number of others. His work rate and competitiveness is second-to-none and he's playing every bit as well as he did last year in my opinion. 

[Red and Bluebeard 2,101]

13 minutes ago, Fifty-5 said:

I liked Watts in the ruck.  He was competitive enough and it gets him involved in general stoppage play.  It adds another dimension to his already valuable contribution and frees a slot in the 22 for another runner or another genuine marking fwd e.g. Dawes.

I don't think it will be a regular feature. One thing I thought was noticeable today was that when we got out the back, we seemed to choose some bad options, and almost stuffed things up a few times. The Garlett & Hogan "No, after you, I insist!" show had its amusing moments, but it did have me thinking how much better it would be to have Watts get the ball around the centre at such times. This happened a few times in the last quarter, and the ball movement looked a lot better. 

[Axis of Bob 11,908]

Hogan had a very good game, purely based on his work rate. But one thing that this game showed is that a second genuine marking tall forward would really help our forward line. I think we were a little short up forward. Hogan's work rate is one of his best attributes, but opponents can drop off him if he works up the ground too much because there isn't a credible second bomb option inside 50s, so the tall defenders can drop off and know that he can't really move the ball too quickly. 

Watts' ability to create is fantastic, but he's not a bomb target. This is where a ruck/forward with some workrate, or a genuine tall like Dawes/Weid would help us a lot. It means that Hogan can work up the ground and deliver the ball, but also that his opponent now needs to respect him up the ground to stop him being able to give the other tall opportunities inside 50. 

[beelzebub 23,390]

We're  critiquing  a win

Strange days

[RalphiusMaximus 6,105]

I'm still struggling with Watts getting hitouts at the centre bounce against real rucks.  He actually did a great job. 

I do agree that the margin should have been greater.  Petracca kicked four points and Oliver two.  You'd expect at least four goals from those shots any other day.  Watts missed one he'd normally nail as well.  Added to this we have a number of attacking moves which were derailed by a poor option being taken resulting in a turnover instead of an uncontested mark. 

For all that though, it was the second biggest margin of the season for us.  We played a team that has done well against us in the past and doubled their score (almost).  I'll take that. 

[Guest]

Just watched the song.
Happy to see that there was no screaming like quinces or experiencing orgasmic bouts of ecstasy (cue Biffen with a joke).
This winning deal seems to be becoming more natural and the boys are realizing that they may have bigger fish to fry in the future should the keep their work rate up.
 

[SaberFang 7,151]

Interesting fact but despite our encouraging 5-4 win/loss ratio, so far our 5 wins have all come from teams we'd already defeated last year (GWS, Collingwood, Richmond, Gold Coast, Brisbane). Our 4 losses were also losses last year, barring the Bulldogs at the G (who thumped us at Etihad later in the season). The only remaining 2015 victory was against Geelong.

Point is, I want us to start defeating some teams that have had the wool on us for years, rather than the same teams we already knew we could defeat. We've had some really honorable losses to Port Adelaide in recent years despite their immense form; it's about time we got one back against this mob!