POST MATCH DISCUSSION - Round 18

[rjay 24,202]

Just finished watching the replay.

Tyson has his limitations this year but is still working very hard for the team.

I checked the stats with 2 minutes to go, thinking he'd had about 6 tackles, he ended up with 9. Watching the game live I thought he was quiet, but he played brilliantly.

Creates space around the contest and quick hands when he gets an option. He gets into trouble here for holding on to the ball a bit long but my guess is it's a Roos instruction to take the tackle and not let the ball loose.

He hasn't had as good a year as 2014 but is still a valuable contributor.

[Watts Jurrah Dunn? 735]

You blokes are very generous with Tyson. Thought he was poor to half time. Missed that 35m set shot in the first quarter, got done a couple of times for holding the ball and once again so one-sided. Much better in the 2nd half.

Thank goodness we got Salem as part of the deal because he is looking like a good solid footballer. One-paced, ordinary kick. Not the sort of player pick 2 should be used toward.

Maybe Salem will be worth pick 2 and Tyson will be worth the pick 20-odd that we gave?

[Gator 16,921]

Tyson is down 10-12% on his key stats from last year and that makes a significant difference in output. If a team was down by that much from one year to the next it would be a significant drop off.

When he should be getting better, he's gone backwards. There has to be a reason. It's either mental or physical. I'm still excited by his future years and it's not uncommon for young players to experience this type of issue. Just ask Andrew Gaff, who had a very poor third year.

[chook fowler 18,602]

I'm sure that heavily strapped knee is part of Tysons' reduced output. Hopefully it will be fixed at seasons end.

[DemonOX 8,578]

Just watching the replay must admit Dunny had a really good defensive game.

[Lucifers Hero 37,524]

Fancy the pies getting a crowd of only 37,800 to their home game, at the MCG, in the prime 2.10 Saturday time slot and when they would have expected to comfortable beat us.

76,000 paid up members!!

Didn't take long for those 'loyal', fair weather supporters to fall off the bandwagon!

At least we get 55k to 65k.

No longer is the QB game 'Eddie's Gift'.

[Bay Riffin 1,434]

Just watching the replay must admit Dunny had a really good defensive game.

Sunny looked confident and in control. There looks to be cohesion down back with jetta Dunn McDonald garland playing their role. Salem back as well would provide some class.

[DemonOX 8,578]

Also watched Grimes closely and when in possession he either handballs to a player standing still or to a player who has someone on his hammer, kicks it out of bounds or runs into traffic. He does do some good things to but IMO these are outweighed by his negatives.

I was hoping he would improve a lot this season but doesn't seem to have.

I think he still has another yr remaining on his contract so hopefully after using this yr to adjust to the coaches demands next year it may fall into place for him.

If not I think he will be done at the MFC

[dazzledavey36 49,826]

Fancy the pies getting a crowd of only 37,800 to their home game, at the MCG, in the prime 2.10 Saturday time slot and when they would have expected to comfortable beat us.

76,000 paid up members!!

Didn't take long for those 'loyal', fair weather supporters to fall off the bandwagon!

At least we get 55k to 65k.

No longer is the QB game 'Eddie's Gift'.

Im all for taking a swipe at other supporters but this is a bit hypocritical.. alot of posters on here were saying during the week that they wouldn't be going to the game or to any games for the rest of the year because of our ugly game style. I would say reason why it was a low crowd was the lack of MFC supporters aswell.

[DemonOX 8,578]

Im all for taking a swipe at other supporters but this is a bit hypocritical.. alot of posters on here were saying during the week that they wouldn't be going to the game or to any games for the rest of the year because of our ugly game style. I would say reason why it was a low crowd was the lack of MFC supporters aswell.

Don't forget Dazzel we have had 9 yrs of poor performances, whereas other clubs have had buggerall when compared to us.

Us Dees supportes would have to be the most thicked skin supporters in the entire AFL.

Edited August 2, 2015 by DemonOX

[Lucifers Hero 37,524]

Im all for taking a swipe at other supporters but this is a bit hypocritical.. alot of posters on here were saying during the week that they wouldn't be going to the game or to any games for the rest of the year because of our ugly game style. I would say reason why it was a low crowd was the lack of MFC supporters aswell.

You missed the point.

My swipe was at Eddie. He thinks Dees having QB as our home game is a special 'gift' from Collingwood.

We get 55k - 65k to our QB home game even when we have been stuck at the bottom of the ladder.

They got 37.8k when a top 8 spot is up for grabs.

Pointing that out is not being hypocritical.

[Gorgoroth 12,447]

Sunny looked confident and in control. There looks to be cohesion down back with jetta Dunn McDonald garland playing their role. Salem back as well would provide some class.

Tbh is leave the backs as is, I'd bring Salem in as a winger or half forward.

Unless they want to put H back on the wing?

[dazzledavey36 49,826]

You missed the point.

My swipe was at Eddie. He thinks Dees having QB as our home game is a special 'gift' from Collingwood.

We get 55k - 65k to our QB home game even when we have been stuck at the bottom of the ladder.

They got 37.8k when a top 8 spot is up for grabs.

Pointing that out is not being hypocritical.

Yeah fair point.

[FireOath 290]

Surprised at the lack of love for Garlett here. Got goals at crucial moments in the game and has seen to gotten a really good team ethic now and passes it off when needed. That was one of Micks biggest gripes with Jeffy so whateva Roos has done has been golden.

Hope we can get a few others like Garlett this off seasok

He could really be challenging the big guns if he could kick a little straighter.

[3Dee 1,153]

If not I think he will be done at the MFC

To be fair he hasn't had an opportunity to string games together this season. Solid earlier in the year and unlucky to be dropped on a couple of occasions.

[CBDees 3,162]

You missed the point.

My swipe was at Eddie. He thinks Dees having QB as our home game is a special 'gift' from Collingwood.

We get 55k - 65k to our QB home game even when we have been stuck at the bottom of the ladder.

They got 37.8k when a top 8 spot is up for grabs.

Pointing that out is not being hypocritical.

It should be our home as of rights! We started life as the Melbourne Cricket Club Football Club and then generously allowed some of the other Melbourne-based teams to play their home games there as well (Richmond, Collingwood, Essendon, Carlton and now Hawthorn). Now they have abused it and assume an entitlement when they play us on our home ground. And, as if this wasn't bad enough, the AFL makes us play a home game at Etihad, even on days when the MCG is free!

[FireOath 290]

Lumumba's first accurate, releasing, attacking handball was the highlight of his year.

Obviously you have already forgotten his intercept mark and his goal in his 200th game.

Edited August 3, 2015 by Barra17

[SaberFang 7,141]

Tyson's carrying an injury, his reduced form this year is completely understandable.

We've seen what he's capable of when fully healthy; something to look forward to next year hopefully.

[pitmaster 3,162]

OK Finally had time to watch the replay as promised and while I said I would name names, I can't be bothered tracking them all down since I am supposed to be working so Adam Farr ("Grimes an absolute liability") will have to stand in for the Grimes haters.

Yes, he was caught twice with the ball and penalised in the first half, but in his defence he was trying to create some run in the first case.

Yes, he gave Gawn one of those 1 metre handpasses that put Max under pressure and resulted in a ball up.

Yes, he was out marked on the lead (twice).

Yes he kicked out on the full first possession.

BUT...He took at least four second half marks including a strong contested mark in the back 25 when they had the momentum late in the 3rd and cleared with a pass to T MAC.

He took an uncontested mark in the first term and with a pass to Garland started the possession chain that ended in Hogan's first goal.

He created run in the 3rd term with the ball ending with Garlett who kicked to the square resulting in another Hogan goal.

He consistently, so far as you can tell on the teeve, ran to space to create options for run out of defence and was still running late in the last when we were controlling the game with a possession game.

He cleared the ball out of defence, or assisted in an effective clearance, several times.

Stats, for what they're worth gave him 18 possessions, including 13 kicks at 85% effective, although that effectiveness figure probably overstates him slightly since a couple of hand passes simply went to team mates who were immediately wrapped up.

I admit I over-stated his worth but I was reacting to claims he is an outright liability. He clearly isn't. I don't know if indirect goal assists is a thing but he had a couple (see above). He was caught a few times but he is generally in the hot zone so that's going to happen.

T Mac I rate very highly, but he plays in the hot zone too and averages an outright clanger every week. But we don't label him an outright liability, rightly so.

I reckon what's going on with Grimes' critics at the moment is that some of us are primed to see him make a disposal blue (which everyone does, even Jones) so when he makes an error it is the thing his critics remember and they overlook the other stuff.

In psychology it's called 'confirmation bias'. Anyone condemning Grimes outright needs to take another look.

Edited August 3, 2015 by pitmaster

[Macca 16,174]

Fancy the pies getting a crowd of only 37,800 to their home game, at the MCG, in the prime 2.10 Saturday time slot and when they would have expected to comfortable beat us.

76,000 paid up members!!

Didn't take long for those 'loyal', fair weather supporters to fall off the bandwagon!

At least we get 55k to 65k.

No longer is the QB game 'Eddie's Gift'.

That's a furphy anyway LH

The Pies make heaps of cash from their away games at the MCG ... those full season memberships (which cost up to $864.00) grant free admission to their away fixtures at the MCG (often with an already paid for reserved seat in the Western stand)

And they sell a truckload of these type of memberships which also guarantee access to a GF ticket (perhaps in excess of 20k) 20k x up to $864 adds up to quite a princely sum. My estimation is it's at least 12-14 million which works out at about 660 - 770k per game (home or away)

We don't see that money on the QB but the finance dept at Collingwood does.

The so-called "gift" is just another myth - they'd walk away from the QB clash with a fair stash of the folding material.

Of course, one less game at the MCG (or Docklands) means one extra game interstate (where they'd make zilch) ... and they never have to travel interstate 6 times a year do they? More often than not it's 4 trips or less.

Eddie's worked it out quite well and will keep pushing the line that he's helping others out when in reality, he wants the Victorian teams to request home games against his team - more $$$$'s for his club that way.

.

Edited August 3, 2015 by Macca

[Damo 3,042]

Grimes work ethic is Jack Viney like. His contested marks are pretty good. If he could play on when he marks I think he would be a better player.

He doesnt take a 1st option, overthinks it, goes back, waits 5 seconds then kicks to a contest. If he could cut back this recurring issue he would be a regular 1st 18, IMO.

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

Fancy the pies getting a crowd of only 37,800 to their home game, at the MCG, in the prime 2.10 Saturday time slot and when they would have expected to comfortable beat us.

76,000 paid up members!!

Didn't take long for those 'loyal', fair weather supporters to fall off the bandwagon!

At least we get 55k to 65k.

No longer is the QB game 'Eddie's Gift'.

the reason why there were so many more at QB is two-fold:

1) the pies were up and about in the top4 at that time, not having lost 5 in a row

2) heaps of neutral supporters come to QB to make a day of it

very little to do with us

[Macca 16,174]

the reason why there were so many more at QB is two-fold:

1) the pies were up and about in the top4 at that time, not having lost 5 in a row

2) heaps of neutral supporters come to QB to make a day of it

very little to do with us

There are other "hidden" reasons

1) We support our club to a much greater degree than many other supporter groups - all things considered, the crowd numbers at the QB games have been phenomenal. Nearly all the games are stand alone fixtures these days so for them to only get 37k to their home fixture against us was pathetic. Just imagine what the crowd might have been if they'd spent the last 9 years at or near the foot of the ladder?

2) Their supporters with premium 18 game memberships (at least 20k?) might be more likely to use those memberships for away fixtures to "get their money's worth" ... we of course, don't get to see any of that money from those premium memberships and their club and members would know that.

Our dividend from the QB clash may well be dependent on the gate receipts and I reckon those gate receipts would be down because many of their members are not paying at the gate for the QB clash. Jackson would know the full story but we're probably never going to hear it.

[hemingway 7,608]

Grimes work ethic is Jack Viney like. His contested marks are pretty good. If he could play on when he marks I think he would be a better player.

He doesnt take a 1st option, overthinks it, goes back, waits 5 seconds then kicks to a contest. If he could cut back this recurring issue he would be a regular 1st 18, IMO.

Felt sorry for Jack on Sat. At times, he looked almost lost, or uncertain of himself, a little like a young recruit or an inexperienced player. Certainly did not have the bearing of an ex-Captain with nearly 100 AFL games under his belt. A number of times he called for the ball when he was clearly in the wrong spot to be rightly ignored by his team mates or ball carrier. I actually thought he did some good things and his intensity was good, but he did not inspire confidence with ball in hand. The club needs to be careful in how they deal with him at season end.

[jnrmac 19,511]

There are other "hidden" reasons

1) We support our club to a much greater degree than many other supporter groups - all things considered, the crowd numbers at the QB games have been phenomenal. Nearly all the games are stand alone fixtures these days so for them to only get 37k to their home fixture against us was pathetic. Just imagine what the crowd might have been if they'd spent the last 9 years at or near the foot of the ladder?

2) Their supporters with premium 18 game memberships (at least 20k?) might be more likely to use those memberships for away fixtures to "get their money's worth" ... we of course, don't get to see any of that money from those premium memberships and their club and members would know that.

Our dividend from the QB clash may well be dependent on the gate receipts and I reckon those gate receipts would be down because many of their members are not paying at the gate for the QB clash. Jackson would know the full story but we're probably never going to hear it.

errr of course it is. Its our home game. We get all the gate receipts and corporate function revenue etc.

Not sure of what you mean with "their members aren't paying at the gate". Why wouldn't they be? If they have a premium membership that allows away games I believe we still get a cut of that on the day.

Its a great day for us and we do very well out of it.