Bombers scandal: charged, <redacted> and <infracted>

[jnrmac 20,065]

They are trying to delay their response until after the Essendon court action to see what information might come out of that. Seems like a smart move to me. They haven't made a decision to take them in at this point just delaying their response to see what further information they can gather to inform it.

The problem with this strategy is that Ess are challenging the process and the validity of ASADA conducting a joint investigation. They are saying throw this thing out because the investigation was unlawful, They are not challenging the evidence and so the evidence won't be presented.

Its a massive red herring and cowardice personified. Akin to Capt Narcissus saying "I take full responsibility" ha ha ha ha Just like the Captain on the Costa Concordia

[Red and Bluebeard 2,084]

They are trying to delay their response until after the Essendon court action to see what information might come out of that. Seems like a smart move to me. They haven't made a decision to take them in at this point just delaying their response to see what further information they can gather to inform it.

Agreed, but the problem for me is the players asking to see the evidence is a bit rich. Yes, Hird, Dank, Robinson etc are the real villains, but surely the players can say when and where they were injected, and what they were told they were getting. If nothing else, the infamous waivers would be useful around now, wouldn't they?

[rumpole 515]

Anyone see AFL 360. Robinson was absolutely repulsive complaining about anti Essendon "propaganda" in a segment that was complete pro-Essendon propaganda.

Basically said the Essendon players had everything ticked off by their doctor but where does that leave Doc Reid?

[PJ_12345 1,098]

Anyone see AFL 360. Robinson was absolutely repulsive complaining about anti Essendon "propaganda" in a segment that was complete pro-Essendon propaganda.

Basically said the Essendon players had everything ticked off by their doctor but where does that leave Doc Reid?

Still in their Hall of Fame

[Damo 3,356]

Sufferin' Succotash, Batman!

Rohan Connolly and Mark Robinson's dramatics only sweeten the pot.

[Redleg 40,925]

Basically said the Essendon players had everything ticked off by their doctor but where does that leave Doc Reid?

Same as ever, Teflon coated.

[Redleg 40,925]

Anyone see AFL 360. Robinson was absolutely repulsive complaining about anti Essendon "propaganda" in a segment that was complete pro-Essendon propaganda.

He said one of the funniest lines I have heard in this saga. After banging on about Essendon and how they have been victimized for what seemed an eternity, he said a number of times to Gerard

" now don't take sides Gerard ". Hysterical.

I actually wonder if Robbo is simply just a moron with a loud voice.

[s-t-i-n-g-a 439]

Agreed, but the problem for me is the players asking to see the evidence is a bit rich. Yes, Hird, Dank, Robinson etc are the real villains, but surely the players can say when and where they were injected, and what they were told they were getting. If nothing else, the infamous waivers would be useful around now, wouldn't they?

Agreed they are trying to reverse the process by seeing the evidence first. That's not how it works but good luck to them for trying.

You would think that any concessions ASADA make between now and when the players respond it would impact the discounts on offer.

In any case the players are delaying their decision until the latest possible moment to see what transpires and exploring all options, fair enough.

ASADA may have made a mistake in the original agreement with the AFL for the joint investigation but that was corrected in week 2 of a 6 month process. Surely they can't claim to rely on the original agreement as a basis for their cooperation over that whole period?

[whatwhat say what 22,757]

it's farcical that they want to see the evidence.

i think them asking for an extension makes perfect sense, as it delays it until after the fed court action.

once again, the players are being forced to do something that might be ultimately deleterious to their position, all thanks to something essendon has done - regardless of that it now makes sense for them to do so to see what comes of that.

the most sensible course of action would have been for them to answer the show-cause notices in the first place, and the efc to have not got involved in that aspect of it; but no, it's all about protecting the players...what a joke!

going to the fed court does not help the players bring a resolution to proceedings.

i just can't see this whole thing ending well for anyone. except the lawyers, natch.

[BarnDee 287]

in world war 2 some bombers went Germany to crack a few dams , well they didn't need to travel so far this time did they then , lol

[whatwhat say what 22,757]

a litigator's perspective: http://www.bigfooty.com/news/2014/06/reading-between-the-lines-of-essendons-court-application-against-asada-a-litigators-perspective/

[biggestred 5,088]

So the afl and essendon and the aflpa are upset that asada reneged on an agreement not to punish the players.

why would they give a [censored] if they hadnt done anything wrong?

[Satan 2,871]

What I am finding difficult to understand is the constant whining from the Essendon camp about ASADA leaking information to the media when independent enquiries reveal that ASADA hasn't been leaking at all. That leaves the AFL and EFC as possible leakers and judging from some of the material leaking out, you don't have to be Einstein ...

Michael newton?

[CHAMP 347]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kyos-M48B8U

[Whispering_Jack 30,135]

a litigator's perspective: http://www.bigfooty.com/news/2014/06/reading-between-the-lines-of-essendons-court-application-against-asada-a-litigators-perspective/

Hickey's original article (quoted earlier) and the one published in bigfooty set out the issues very clearly. She argues that Essendon and Hird might not be able to demonstrate their "standing" or right to appear (neither have yet been served with show cause notices) and need to demonstrate a special interest in the case. I think the circumstances clearly are such that they can strongly show that this special interest applies to both. Middleton J would have to interpret special interest very narrowly to bar them on the basis of standing.

However, he could be doing them both a favour and saving them a lot of money and grief to all concerned (and especially the players) if he knocked this claim on the head as soon as possible because the rest of their case has little or no merit.

Not so long ago, those sympathetic to Essendon and the players were arguing that the whole saga was running far too long, was draining the players and tarnishing the image of the game at its elite level. Now they want this? Come on.

EFC and Hird should be careful about what they wish here. The supposed agreement (and whatever it is, it's been vaguely defined) by the AFL to give absolution to the players who co-operate would also get knocked on the head and they might get part of the so called joint investigation declared ultra vires leaving the investigation and show causes to proceed. The club, Hird and the players could possibly be in a far worse position if that outcome is achieved.

Middleton J has apparently opened up the directions hearing on 27 June for television. Directions hearings are normally as boring as hell (about as riveting as Young and the Restless) but in this case, some interesting material could come out. And if future hearings into the matter are also televised, the public might get to see and hear things that EFC and Hird don't want anyone to know about. Smart move by the judge - there is so much misinformation being put out there by the pro Essendon camp who are pushing the line that the Bombers "done nothin' wrong".

Read Rohan Connolly's piece in the Age, watch Robinson on AFL360 or follow their fans on twitter who try to portray ASADA as the reincarnation of Atilla the Hun while all at the EFC are innocent bystander victims and you'll see why it's a good thing for proceedings like this one to be played out fully in the public eye.

[jazza 1,323]

Weapon, who was an employee of the EFC. So ultimately it is EFC's mess.

who was working under Dank?

Asada do not have to prove anything. They have issued Show cause notices.

It's up to the player to explain his innocents, not the other way round.

If they can't prove they didn't get TB4 injected then infraction notices will be issued.

Because the majority are saying they don't know what was injected, they should be aiming to get the penalties reduced to a minimum.

If the plead not guilty of taking TB 4 there is a fair chance they will be found guilty and given a 2 year penalty.

If they plead guilty by association they may be able to bargain a lesser penalty.

Either way they are guilty.

This is my opinion only.

Anyone see AFL 360. Robinson was absolutely repulsive complaining about anti Essendon "propaganda" in a segment that was complete pro-Essendon propaganda.

Basically said the Essendon players had everything ticked off by their doctor but where does that leave Doc Reid?

I do realise the implications.My point was ,lets see a player enter asada and have a go.

And this wont happen,due to guilt {my opinion}.

Yes,i saw robbo last night also,the realisation has hit EFC,AFL and associates and now they are screaming for forgiveness and rolling out the press program on full tilt,Thet have just realised the amount of doodaa their in and its uphill with ashovel full of holes.

Thatrs why id like to see a player end the saga,"just walk in the front door son".

[SaberFang 7,151]

Couldn't believe just how bad 360 had gotten after last night. It's literally the most blatant pro Essendon, anti ASADA propaganda I've seen. It makes the Bolt Report look politically balanced!

And of course they use the age old propaganda techniques of being blatantly biased while also attacking the "other side" for being blatantly biased, discrediting everything Fairfax journalists are reporting.

Who at Fox has such a vested interest in Essendon? Because the propaganda machine is in full swing now, using every trick in the book to discredit ASADA. And the more you think about that, the more obvious their guilt becomes.

[biggestred 5,088]

Who at Fox has such a vested interest in Essendon? Because the propaganda machine is in full swing now, using every trick in the book to discredit ASADA. And the more you think about that, the more obvious their guilt becomes.

all of them. TV rights.

[Cards13 9,117]

all of them. TV rights.

The money they spend on the rights and then weekly on the shows they produce that relate to footy. Edited June 19, 2014 by Cards13

[ManDee 7,148]

A fairly impressive legal team assembled by ASADA.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/asada-confidence-built-on-heavy-hitting-legal-team-20140618-zsdt0.html

I cannot imagine them going ahead with show cause notices if they don't have sufficient evidence for conviction.

I spoke to an EFC supporter this morning who thought the AFL penalties last year covered the doping issues.

He didn't understand all the "ASADA fuss". When I told him the AFL penalties were for bringing the game into

disrepute ie failure to keep records etc.and that penalties for the actual doping are yet to be meted out he went ashen.

It hadn't occurred to him that the ASADA issue was separate. Then I mentioned WorkCover and explained that it

was also a separate issue. He was not happy.

The misinformation from EFC and their cronies is keeping many confused. When it all finally hits they will wonder

why it wasn't dealt with last year.

If you're wrong admit it. Say your sorry. Make changes so that the problem cannot happen again and move on. Simple

life philosophies, it's a shame EFC are still in denial. EFC cannot move on until they acknowledge the errors of the past.

Man up EFC. You are playing hardball with the umpires. And we know how well that works. The enemy to EFC is within.

You cannot eliminate cancer by arguing with the doctor or the AMA.

.

[SaberFang 7,151]

The reason they'll never admit their wrongdoing, and will always fall back to misinformation and litigation to prevent the release of the truth, is because if every player comes back to sue the club they will be absolutely [censored]. That is the single motivating force behind the actions of the EFC. Financially it's in their best interests if nobody can definitively prove what the players were injected with.

[Ted Lasso 19,518]

If and when the bombers cop bans from ASADA it will taint the image of the organisation for the next 25 years

They won't be able to shake the drug cheats label, the sooner they get rid of James Hird the better.

[Ungarie boy 233]

Acutally another signigicant factor would be any admission of finding or guilt will likely see the club suspended, which if not terminal will have them very well placed for relocation or amalamation.

This is not about the players, it's about Essendon's survival - regardless of the financial cost.

Essentially they are a cornered animal with only one option open to them - Fight to the Death; every other outcome will likely lead to the same result i.e. Death.

Pity the players can't see this, for it will likely cost them - if they continue to ignore the lifeboats and sail a sinking ship!

[Deeoldfart 8,033]

A fairly impressive legal team assembled by ASADA.

...........................................................................................................

Bug guns against weapon-less bombers!

[ManDee 7,148]

Bug guns against weapon-less bombers!

Not completely weaponless, they have a couple of feather dusters, some smoke and a mirror.