Some serious questions asked about Paul Roos ...

[Dr. Mubutu 866]

I just cannot accept all the Roos criticism.

You can't just fluke a premiership. His Sydney team were famous for their consistency, their adherence to the game plan, their "buy in" to their coach's message and their intensity out on the field. The bloke is a fantastic leader and he knows how to coach.

I also cannot accept the comments from those who suggest he is just a mercenary and doesn't really care about the club. What are they basing this on - his press conferences? Roos is a master at handling the press. He doesn't want to inflame the situation by getting angry and singling out players in public. He is too smart for this. He would do it all behind closed doors and out of the public eye. If you would prefer a coach that rants and raves and brings unwanted publicity then go hire a hothead - for me, I would take Roos' ability to stay measured and level-headed in a press conference every day of the week.

Now that's not to say there haven't been tactical errors. The loose man against Collingwood, the last 41 seconds against St Kilda, overuse of the footy in our defensive half of the ground yesterday...I can accept that there have been tactical errors.

However, as I said after the Essendon game, the reason for our woeful performances is the mental fragility of our players and our overall lack of class. In other words, it's the players. We cannot consistently bring our intensity week-to-week. When we bring it, and match the opposition in the contest and tackles, we can compete with most teams from about 6th down to 18th. We might and probably will lose out on class but if one of those teams is slightly off, like Richmond, Geelong and the Dogs were, we can snatch an upset.

However, when we don't bring it, given our skill/class levels are terribly low, we get shown up by even lowly teams like Essendon and St Kilda. Hawthorn can be off their intensity and still win out on the back of their class. When you are a team devoid of class like us, your attitude and intensity must be 100% to be able to compete.

People criticise our defensive game plan but what difference would an attacking one make. Based on the current skill level of the team, not much at all. We still have chances to score but we kick inaccurately (21.40 the last three weeks). We butcher the inside 50m kick. We start a chain of possession from half back and turn it over. All of this affects our ability to score and it all comes down to skill, not the game plan. Even when we are on top in games, our lack of class means we can't convert the dominance on the scoreboard.

Who currently gives us drive and precision kicking off half back? I can only think of Salem and he's out injured. Who gives us sheer pace and run and carry through the middle? Who nails targets with inside 50 kicks? Who other than a first-year player is a viable marking option inside 50? This is why we struggle to score.

We need players that are both desperate and aggressive and have the requisite level of skill. We simply don't have enough. And we will continue to be a poor footy team until we get them (and the young talent that we have who do display these attributes fully develop).

Do you accept the criticism of Neeld as a coach? Many of these excuses (yes, let's call them what they are) could be applied to his tenure, and he was sacked by this stage.

Roos is not coaching Sydney, he's coaching the Melbourne Football Club.

What he did in Sydney 10 years ago is completely irrelevant.

There are question marks over what he's doing here, as well there should be. If he was so infallible as coach, there should be no reason we're not playing finals this year. To blindly accept what Roos is doing, without the results to back it up, is fraught with danger.

If the rest of the year is as putrid as the weekend was, I would fully back an investigation into the football department, and just what the hell they are doing.

[praha 11,240]

If the rest of the year is as putrid as the weekend was, I would fully back an investigation into the football department, and just what the hell they are doing.

I agree with your post, but this would be a futile exercise.

On game day you can see that this is not a football department issue. It's just a bunch of blokes with the wrong mindset. We have a different team off-field now. How can the team be just as bad? It might be time to start looking at the players who have been at the club for more than five years, because they seem to set the tone: when they have a down day, it's like a virus that slowly moves through the rest of the team.

I don't think any amount of investigating or million-dollar coaches is going to teach a bunch of losers how to be winners. It might just be a matter of moving on the likes of Dunn, Garland, Jamar, even Jones, and build around a new core.

I don't accept that a "rebuild" has fully taken place until those from the club's worst ever period have been moved on. I just can't fathom how our worst performers on a bad day are those with 8, 9, 10 years experience.

Since the Neeld years I have been saying that all of those part of the 186 point loss -- "the protest" match -- must be moved on. If they held contempt for the club then, I can't imagine that they all of a sudden have fall back in love with the environment. It must play on the mind.

The rebuild hasn't truly begun yet. Harsh reality but without the pieces in place, it's hard to move on lockeroom cancers. I'm sure Dunn and Garland are great, but they epitomise what was the worst period in the club's history. These days in this current media climate, you can't shake that off. There is a stigma associated with pulling on the jumper, and so long as the virus remains, anyone who pulls it on will be smothered by it.

Edited July 28, 2015 by praha

[jumbo returns 6,741]

Roos needed to leave the past, in the past.

There was no need to talk about the damage and how the players were 'feeling' at the start of the year.

Many on this forum thought that the article that appeared in the paper at the time was appropriate.

It was never appropriate.

[timD 994]

I agree with your post, but this would be a futile exercise.

On game day you can see that this is not a football department issue. It's just a bunch of blokes with the wrong mindset. We have a different team off-field now. How can the team be just as bad? It might be time to start looking at the players who have been at the club for more than five years, because they seem to set the tone: when they have a down day, it's like a virus that slowly moves through the rest of the team.

I don't think any amount of investigating or million-dollar coaches is going to teach a bunch of losers how to be winners. It might just be a matter of moving on the likes of Dunn, Garland, Jamar, even Jones, and build around a new core.

I don't accept that a "rebuild" has fully taken place until those from the club's worst ever period have been moved on. I just can't fathom how our worst performers on a bad day are those with 8, 9, 10 years experience.

Since the Neeld years I have been saying that all of those part of the 186 point loss -- "the protest" match -- must be moved on. If they held contempt for the club then, I can't imagine that they all of a sudden have fall back in love with the environment. It must play on the mind.

The rebuild hasn't truly begun yet. Harsh reality but without the pieces in place, it's hard to move on lockeroom cancers. I'm sure Dunn and Garland are great, but they epitomise what was the worst period in the club's history. These days in this current media climate, you can't shake that off. There is a stigma associated with pulling on the jumper, and so long as the virus remains, anyone who pulls it on will be smothered by it.

The leaders set the tone. In every organisation, everywhere. Followers figure out how to 'work' with the leaders that they get. There is no doubt that we have the weakest set of on-field leaders in the AFL - both in terms of man-management and competence-in-game. But we need them to protect kids. Only when dunn, garland, jones etc are replaced by kids able to out-perform them will we see meaningful change - but that requires talented kids with the right make-up. There is no evidence from anywhere that the MFC has figured out how to recruit yet. We are in a hellhole of our own creation. So as supporters we have to endure this situation. Our 'talent management' is just non-existent.

Jones is a good example. He should never have been made captain...except there is no-one better. So we deal with it. But a leader? Really?

If I get one more of Peter Jackson's "suck it up" speeches, I'll spew.

[Samael 560]

Since the Neeld years I have been saying that all of those part of the 186 point loss -- "the protest" match -- must be moved on.

Maybe they could be moved here.

"Point Cook has inflicted the worst possible pain upon Masala, keeping them scoreless and defeating the struggling side by 187 points at Saltwater Reserve. 52 scoring shots to nil is one of the most unbelievable score lines one is ever likely to read"

[Leoncelli_36 2,264]

This article from Roos sounds like a massive whinge. As if the supporters expect too much...http://www.melbournefc.com.au/news/2015-07-28/i-understand-your-frustration-roos

“I get very few [emails] when we win. But when we lose, people say ‘it’s the same old, same old and we’ve seen this before etc’. It’s hard not to get affected as a coaching group"

“Have we improved? Clearly we’ve improved, but has it been enough for the Melbourne supporters. Probably not on the back of the last six or seven years – [and they say] ‘here we go again, here we go again and here we go again’. We get caught up in that and that’s just the reality of it".

it feels like an us against them positions and given the way he is around fans I am hardly surprised. pretty ordinary.

[Gator 17,449]

I think most supporters agree that Roos was the right man to galvanise the club at the time.

But some, like Scoop, sheet home nearly all of the blame to the players. Perhaps they think he's got the most out of the group and that they're performing at the level they should be - at prerequisite levels. I can't agree. I believe they're performing below expectations and that the game-plan is either too complicated, or deficient. In the preseason there was evidence they were going to use the corridor more and focus on faster ball movement. Clearly, this was short lived. Either the players can't follow instruction or the message isn't getting through. Ultimately, this falls at the feet of the coach.

The boys from Champion Data show that Melbourne start their attacks from near the last line of defence. Simon Goodwin acknowledged this a few weeks ago in a prematch interview and stated we wanted to start attacks from near the middle of the ground. It's not happening.

I acknowledge we have talent deficiencies, who doesn't, but I also see a club like the Dogs, who sacked their coach and CEO, had their captain walk out, and lost their best mid with a knee. Are their talent levels so superior to ours, or do they have an easier to understand and implement game-plan ? The answer seems obvious to me. Roos may not want to coach like Beveridge, I get that, but I also remember him in year 1 stating that by round 6 supporters should start seeing what type of footy we were going to play. Yeah, I see it and it's unedifying.

Roos would rightly accept the accolades if we were winning. Conversely, it's a nonsense to absolve him of criticism when nearly 2 years in we're regularly seeing performances like the weekend.

[Pennant St Dee 13,304]

The team will bounce back, collingwood are struggling and has a worse record then us in the last 6 weeks.

in the last 6 weeks the Pies have played good sides and performed really well and whilst they have lost 5 in a row they could quite easily be 4 & 2 from that run of games

Dogs - beaten and beaten well score flattered them a bit

Meth Coast - as above they were very brave and showed some grit to stick with meth Coast for so long

Port - were certainly in the game and peppered the forward 50 for the final quarter but just couldn't land that killer blow

Hawthorn - they lost this Hawthorn didn't win it Pies kicked themselves out of this and it was a very very good performance

Freo - I was at this game and as above they kicked themselves out of it and how Jesse White didn't put them in front late is beyond me

Bye

GWS - They gave GWS a fairly decent touch up

The statistic which says we have a better record than them because we beat the Cats and Lions is meaningless, whilst we were impressive against the Cats I do not think our performance was any more impressive than any of the Pies displays against Fremantle, Hawthorn or Port

[Slartibartfast 17,625]

I think most supporters agree that Roos was the right man to galvanise the club at the time.

But some, like Scoop, sheet home nearly all of the blame to the players. Perhaps they think he's got the most out of the group and that they're performing at the level they should be - at prerequisite levels. I can't agree. I believe they're performing below expectations and that the game-plan is either too complicated, or deficient. In the preseason there was evidence they were going to use the corridor more and focus on faster ball movement. Clearly, this was short lived. Either the players can't follow instruction or the message isn't getting through. Ultimately, this falls at the feet of the coach.

The boys from Champion Data show that Melbourne start their attacks from near the last line of defence. Simon Goodwin acknowledged this a few weeks ago in a prematch interview and stated we wanted to start attacks from near the middle of the ground. It's not happening.

I acknowledge we have talent deficiencies, who doesn't, but I also see a club like the Dogs, who sacked their coach and CEO, had their captain walk out, and lost their best mid with a knee. Are their talent levels so superior to ours, or do they have an easier to understand and implement game-plan ? The answer seems obvious to me. Roos may not want to coach like Beveridge, I get that, but I also remember him in year 1 stating that by round 6 supporters should start seeing what type of footy we were going to play. Yeah, I see it and it's unedifying.

Roos would rightly accept the accolades if we were winning. Conversely, it's a nonsense to absolve him of criticism when nearly 2 years in we're regularly seeing performances like the weekend.

I started to write something like this and couldn't get it right. You have. Thanks.

[Sir Why You Little 37,125]

I don't accept that a "rebuild" has fully taken place until those from the club's worst ever period have been moved on. I just can't fathom how our worst performers on a bad day are those with 8, 9, 10 years experience.

Since the Neeld years I have been saying that all of those part of the 186 point loss -- "the protest" match -- must be moved on. If they held contempt for the club then, I can't imagine that they all of a sudden have fall back in love with the environment. It must play on the mind.

The rebuild hasn't truly begun yet. Harsh reality but without the pieces in place, it's hard to move on lockeroom cancers. I'm sure Dunn and Garland are great, but they epitomise what was the worst period in the club's history. These days in this current media climate, you can't shake that off. There is a stigma associated with pulling on the jumper, and so long as the virus remains, anyone who pulls it on will be smothered by it.

Totally agree with this.

Players from 186 have to go, always said it.

You cannot allow that stain to continue

Maybe those players who still remain thought winning at the Cattery had erased the guilt of that shamefull day.

But have we backed up the performance since?

No. Not even close. The players are not mentally up to it.

I bet the MFC team get plently of lip during a game from oponents. They know they will collapse under pressure...

[PaulRB 6,411]

I think the AFL needs to bring in a new initiative where for one round, the top teams play in the jumpers of the bottom teams. Simple!

I know it's a sad sad sad concept, that could only be cooked up in a Demons fevered mind...

but I'd like to enjoy the footy for one week.

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,939]

I think this weekends loss was the lowest point in this period of low points. We hit rock bottom.

You didn't think losing to a third year franchise 99-39 last year and managing just 3 goals on our turf was rock bottom?

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,939]

We had to beg a man into taking a job he didn't even want.

Anyone surprised how it's turning out?

[What 18,810]

You didn't think losing to a third year franchise 99-39 last year and managing just 3 goals on our turf was rock bottom?

I remember that game.,

I told everyone on here it was a must win game and was ultra important. I was howled down by a few posters and told it was a meaningless game and some people who obviously haven't learnt anything from our dark years even suggested it would hurt our draft position.

And what happened? We got embarrassed on the MCG by a hobbled GWS team that was down to only 18 fit players in the final quarter. Yet they still ran us off our feet and smashed us.

That loss set us back another 12-18 months I have no doubt.

Some people still dont get that winning is all that matters and every single game is important

Edited July 28, 2015 by hogans_heroes

[Roost It 1,434]

It would be very hard for any coach to coach a group of players with such skill deficiencies as I saw on Sunday.

Dawes, Tyson, Jones, Dunn, Garland, Jetta, Viney all caused St. Kilda goals or ruined a chance for us to score one with atrocious disposal.

That's the 6 goals we needed right there.

The gameplan appears problematic but the disposal is so often sub standard.

I heard we were going after Wines. I hope we get some clean disposers into the cub as well.

[rpfc 28,770]

Nah, nah, nah - we have improved by 25%!

Wins are all that matter, right?

[Roost It 1,434]

We also lack talent in the all important 23 - 27 year old age group.

That is not Roos' fault

[Leoncelli_36 2,264]

It would be very hard for any coach to coach a group of players with such skill deficiencies as I saw on Sunday.

Dawes, Tyson, Jones, Dunn, Garland, Jetta, Viney all caused St. Kilda goals or ruined a chance for us to score one with atrocious disposal.

That's the 6 goals we needed right there.

The gameplan appears problematic but the disposal is so often sub standard.

I heard we were going after Wines. I hope we get some clean disposers into the cub as well.

The supporters are in need of several bottles each weekend.

Why in Gods name would Wines come to us? We had that chance, totally blew it.

[Roost It 1,434]

The supporters are in need of several bottles each weekend.

Why in Gods name would Wines come to us? We had that chance, totally blew it.

It's just what I heard

[What 18,810]

I

I heard we were going after Wines.

Please dont tease us we have been tortured enough

[poita 3,902]

The biggest problem Roos has (in my opinion) is that he has a game plan that is unsuited to his playing list. Asking unskilled footballers to play a high possession game is just plain dumb.

What we should be doing at every opportunity is kicking long and quick to a marking target 50 metres down the line and, if we can't get a mark, force a stoppage. If Dawes is incapable of taking contested marks, or at least making a contest, then Spencer would be a better option. At least if we move the ball quickly Hogan and co can compete one out with their direct opponent, rather than one on five.

And if there is greater certainty surrounding our first option, we won't need to have the likes of Dawes & Hogan chasing kicks on the half back line.

Instead we play hot potato with 1 metre handpasses to stationery targets, or chip backwards and sideways to players under pressure. All that does is increase the likelihood of a turnover happening 50 metres closer to the opposition goal. Or it allows opposition players to flood back for the inevitable kick down the line a minute too late.

If Roos is committed to the possession game he needs to stop recruiting the likes of Riley & Michie, and bring in some blokes who can kick and handpass.

[P-man 13,366]

Nah, nah, nah - we have improved by 25%!

Wins are all that matter, right?

I'm loath to accept the Brisbane win. It certainly didn't feel like a win.

They threatened to actually beat us towards the end, which quite simply would've been the equivalent of being beaten by a one legged man in an arse kicking competition.

[old dee 23,872]

The reason I wanted Mr. Roos was that he had built in credibility.

We knew that it was going to take some time to fix the list and we needed someone who would not have their ability to coach questioned in the first couple of years.

Irrspecitive of his coaching ability that has IMO been achieved.

Is he still a good coach?

To be honest I don't know and I don't think anyone here does either.

We seem to have improved the list a bit but it still has someway to go.

He will step away at the end of next year and if all that has been achieved is that the list has been repaired I will be happy with him.

He will in my view have achieved what I hoped for.

[WhyAlwaysMe 237]

Roos can't lose, if Goodwin has success they will say how wonderfully Roos set up the club for success, if Goodwin fails it will be because he is a crap coach.

[CityDee 738]

anyone who thinks Roosy aint up to it is a muppet. play on- Roos 5 wins

Have a look at the ladder 6 wins - Stkilda Richardson?

Port 7 wins _ Hinkley ?

Pies 8 wins Buckley ?

Teams we all have been in or should have been in winning positions against this season. wouldn't happen if the game plan or coach was inept.

Its the players who have not taken opportunities, faded lost the plot. This will change with additions of quality players experience , time together as a group.

seriously get a grip. Anyone who emails the club asking questions of a highly talented proven coach who is putting his all into bringing quality into the club and implementing a lasting culture in my opinion is as wrong as it gets.