POSTGAME: Opening Round vs Sydney

[demon3165 1,944]

Well that was interesting to watch, some conclusions with this game, we are one skilled quick midfielder short, River's, ANB and Sparrow are not quick thinking and rush themselves when under pressure, Salem won't last all season in the midfield not because he's not skilled but because he is not an endurance runner and the forward entries changed instead of high ball in the pocket it was high ball in the middle, even May kicked out to the right that was a shock.

Now it's only the first game and we should wait to see if it's a transitional thing with a new midfield coach regarding set-ups but when are they going to realise Max struggles against anyone who runs or jumps into him, time to change tack in how he sets up against those type of ruckman. We at times transitioned the ball well and then we had no clue how to do it to create the overlap and create fast play.

Now I'm not big on Schache he has skills but lacks of dog in his play, but he at least tried to make a contest and with the type of delivery and how it was done is going to be hard to for any forward but would like to see how McAdam and Fullarton go first.

But gee the game plan had the same old feel about it but I always wait till around 5-7 rounds when the intensity drops off a little with teams.  

 

 

 

[kev martin 9,215]

1 hour ago, leave it to deever said:

Hopefully next year we play our first game at home.

I believe the fixture is to oppose the NRL, the O (opening) round will probably stay and we should continue to claim the first game against Sydney in NSW.

 

[Superunknown 3,331]

17 minutes ago, Earl Hood said:

All that happened points to just that conclusion. The refusal to select Grundy in the last 5 weeks or so tells me something went wrong at the club. The original plan was for Grundy to ruck and Max to go forward and pinch hit in the ruck. Max didn’t work up forward. By round 18 it was Grundy who was sent packing to work on his forward craft because it wasn’t working up forward. And that was it for Grundy. It’s a team sport but I have had a suspicion that the captain spat the dummy on this. 

Now this is very interesting

how else could one explain his absence in those games and much more importantly the Carlton game

[Demonland 65,542]

 

[Fromgotowoewodin 741]

42 minutes ago, Earl Hood said:

All that happened points to just that conclusion. The refusal to select Grundy in the last 5 weeks or so tells me something went wrong at the club. The original plan was for Grundy to ruck and Max to go forward and pinch hit in the ruck. Max didn’t work up forward. By round 18 it was Grundy who was sent packing to work on his forward craft because it wasn’t working up forward. And that was it for Grundy. It’s a team sport but I have had a suspicion that the captain spat the dummy on this. 

I agree it had gone bad when they went with “we’re dropping him so he can learn forward craft” - he’s an all Australian ruck and we knew what we were getting when we signed him. That was a weak cover story.

There was a choice to be made, get 60-70% out of Max and 60-70% out of Grundy or get 100% out of Max and send Grundy to the 2s. Choice was made. I’m disappointed it didn’t work as we now have stuff all back up but it didn’t cost us last night, ****house forward line work cost us.

[CHF 2,607]

Disappointing start to the season but I am not one to write off the whole of 24 on such a small sample size. I want to see how we respond to this.

Selection was baffling in my view as was he selection of Billings as Sub. I have wanted Bailey Laurie to succeed and have seen some good bits and pieces of ply from him. I have to say that I would not have him in the gameday 23 until he has absolutely battered the door down with a succession of dominating game at Casey. 

The forwards have been a problem for a number of seasons and I do not see any improvement in the situation. Delivery has been blamed but if you do not have movement or a dominating target to kick to then it does not matter how well it is delivered. Last night I saw a forward line group that did not look to have a clear plan to work too. Schache really did not give us anything worthwhile and I would look at playing anyone else and put Schache in the same basket as Laurie. Here are half a dozen doors marked Casey..... let me know when you have knocked them all down and then we can talk.

Our small forwards were nowhere at the fall of the ball at contests. Chandler and Spargo have to be better than that to have any sort of influence on the season.

Ben Brown is having a run at Casey today as is Fullerton. Bring in either of them or both. 

Bowey is out for a time by the looks of it and My was tentative in the second half. there may be a number of changes on all lines of the team for the next game.

Howes looked good and not out of place. I hope he can bulk up a bit over the next few years. A lot to work with. Same with Windsor. He looks able and the more games we get into him, the better.

A shoutout to Tomlinson..... he was very good and did his job. 

Petracca had a patchy game and Max was outplayed and out thought. sure he lacks protection from the umps, but that is par for the course for him and he usually sorts it out during the game.

Clarry did what he could and was effective. 

Viney BOG. He was at his best. I liked the games of Salem and Sparrow but after that lot we had no grunt or cover from others that worked through there.

Sydney picked us apart with quick accurate passing by foot and a load of pressure and running. We did not cover them and our pressure on the ball was very uneven. 

Now let us discuss the coaching.... I saw nothing from them during the game in response to the way Sydney were playing or in response to the situation in the game. With Yze gone, who is calling the game from on high with Goody on the boundary? it worked well the last couple of seasons but did not look to have the right level of understanding last night. The coaching group have a lot to work on. not just the team and the tactics, but also their own game time performance.

So on to round 1 against the Bulldogs...... what to do?

[gs77 3,338]

9 hours ago, Roost it far said:

Spargo’s Achilles will trouble him all year

Not if we don't play him. 

[The heart beats true 16,238]

38 minutes ago, Superunknown said:

Now this is very interesting

how else could one explain his absence in those games and much more importantly the Carlton game

I’ll explain it to you. Grundy was the only ruckman picked for the 6 rounds Max didn’t play last year, and he was very average. He was dominated by Essendon, and it was embarrassing. He showed none of the agility or presence he showed last night. 

He then got annoyed by lack of rucking options when Gawn was available, and didn’t offer enough around the ground. I’ve heard he made himself unavailable for us in the finals, as he wanted out.

He’s a good player, but he brought none of the necessary intensity required for us last year. That’s not the clubs fault. 

Trying to blame Gawn for it seems like an odd thing to do to our best player of the last decade.

[Superunknown 3,331]

16 minutes ago, The heart beats true said:

I’ll explain it to you. Grundy was the only ruckman picked for the 6 rounds Max didn’t play last year, and he was very average. He was dominated by Essendon, and it was embarrassing. He showed none of the agility or presence he showed last night. 

He then got annoyed by lack of rucking options when Gawn was available, and didn’t offer enough around the ground. I’ve heard he made himself unavailable for us in the finals, as he wanted out.

He’s a good player, but he brought none of the necessary intensity required for us last year. That’s not the clubs fault. 

Trying to blame Gawn for it seems like an odd thing to do to our best player of the last 

Edit: CBF 

 

Edited March 8 by Superunknown

[gs77 3,338]

4 hours ago, ElDiablo14 said:

Oh look that "balmy" 24 C, so hot! 🔥🥵

It might surprise some on here, but it turns out that thermal comfort is not solely a function of air temperature, exhibiting an appreciable inverse correlation with humidity.  Refer to the table below.  The air temperatures of 23 to 24 deg C and humidity of 85-90% straddle the "uncomfortable" and "very uncomfortable" regimes.  

 

 

[ignition. 1,413]

At the end of last season I made a thread 'Operation Key Forward'. We failed to acquire and generate the much-needed talent and depth we desperately require up there. Last night it showed.

[Superunknown 3,331]

6 minutes ago, gs77 said:

It might surprise some on here, but it turns out that thermal comfort is not solely a function of air temperature, exhibiting an appreciable inverse correlation with humidity.  Refer to the table below.  The air temperatures of 23 to 24 deg C and humidity of 85-90% straddle the "uncomfortable" and "very uncomfortable" regimes.  

 

 

I was going to comment before about the dew point comment - 10-15 is comfortable. Really? Image DP of 10-15 and freezing cold southern ocean wind. Can these things be looked at in isolation? Maybe rhetorical, given your post! 😄

[titan_uranus 22,458]

2 minutes ago, Superunknown said:

I was going to comment before about the dew point comment - 10-15 is comfortable. Really? Image DP of 10-15 and freezing cold southern ocean wind. Can these things be looked at in isolation? Maybe rhetorical, given your post! 😄

I don’t think you understood a single thing about my post. 

[Superunknown 3,331]

32 minutes ago, CHF said:

Disappointing start to the season but I am not one to write off the whole of 24 on such a small sample size. I want to see how we respond to this.

Selection was baffling in my view as was he selection of Billings as Sub. I have wanted Bailey Laurie to succeed and have seen some good bits and pieces of ply from him. I have to say that I would not have him in the gameday 23 until he has absolutely battered the door down with a succession of dominating game at Casey. 

The forwards have been a problem for a number of seasons and I do not see any improvement in the situation. Delivery has been blamed but if you do not have movement or a dominating target to kick to then it does not matter how well it is delivered. Last night I saw a forward line group that did not look to have a clear plan to work too. Schache really did not give us anything worthwhile and I would look at playing anyone else and put Schache in the same basket as Laurie. Here are half a dozen doors marked Casey..... let me know when you have knocked them all down and then we can talk.

Our small forwards were nowhere at the fall of the ball at contests. Chandler and Spargo have to be better than that to have any sort of influence on the season.

Ben Brown is having a run at Casey today as is Fullerton. Bring in either of them or both. 

Bowey is out for a time by the looks of it and My was tentative in the second half. there may be a number of changes on all lines of the team for the next game.

Howes looked good and not out of place. I hope he can bulk up a bit over the next few years. A lot to work with. Same with Windsor. He looks able and the more games we get into him, the better.

A shoutout to Tomlinson..... he was very good and did his job. 

Petracca had a patchy game and Max was outplayed and out thought. sure he lacks protection from the umps, but that is par for the course for him and he usually sorts it out during the game.

Clarry did what he could and was effective. 

Viney BOG. He was at his best. I liked the games of Salem and Sparrow but after that lot we had no grunt or cover from others that worked through there.

Sydney picked us apart with quick accurate passing by foot and a load of pressure and running. We did not cover them and our pressure on the ball was very uneven. 

Now let us discuss the coaching.... I saw nothing from them during the game in response to the way Sydney were playing or in response to the situation in the game. With Yze gone, who is calling the game from on high with Goody on the boundary? it worked well the last couple of seasons but did not look to have the right level of understanding last night. The coaching group have a lot to work on. not just the team and the tactics, but also their own game time performance.

So on to round 1 against the Bulldogs...... what to do?

A marvellous effort, that.

a really super effort, all round.

old jungle saying: when jungle drums start banging, Head coach brain better not stand still

[At the break of Gawn 3,519]

17 minutes ago, The heart beats true said:

I’ll explain it to you. Grundy was the only ruckman picked for the 6 rounds Max didn’t play last year, and he was very average. He was dominated by Essendon, and it was embarrassing. He showed none of the agility or presence he showed last night. 

He then got annoyed by lack of rucking options when Gawn was available, and didn’t offer enough around the ground. I’ve heard he made himself unavailable for us in the finals, as he wanted out.

He’s a good player, but he brought none of the necessary intensity required for us last year. That’s not the clubs fault. 

Trying to blame Gawn for it seems like an odd thing to do to our best player of the last decade.

To be fair, Grundy has a very good record at the SCG. The smaller dimensions suits him and his limited tank isn’t exposed. I remember one time he got like 65 hit outs there in 2019

[Earl Hood 5,789]

35 minutes ago, Fromgotowoewodin said:

I agree it had gone bad when they went with “we’re dropping him so he can learn forward craft” - he’s an all Australian ruck and we knew what we were getting when we signed him. That was a weak cover story.

There was a choice to be made, get 60-70% out of Max and 60-70% out of Grundy or get 100% out of Max and send Grundy to the 2s. Choice was made. I’m disappointed it didn’t work as we now have stuff all back up but it didn’t cost us last night, ****house forward line work cost us.

But I worry it will cost us longer term. Let’s face it we will be on the edge every game hoping Max doesn’t get injured. 

[Superunknown 3,331]

6 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

I don’t think you understood a single thing about my post. 

i understood yours plenty - but feel free twisting your knickers into knots for whatever reason 

 

isn’t the internet grand?

the outrage!

the misundertandings! 
 

 

Edited March 8 by Superunknown

[IRW 1,246]

23 hours ago, DeeZee said:

It’s just Groundhog Day every time with this team.

It really doesn’t matter how many times you get the ball , you’ve got to be able to do something with it.

We still have the same forward line coach in Stafford, surprise surprise!

Horrible to watch, fumbly and wasteful and zero connection with the forwards.

If Schache gets another game next week I will not be there.

Ground hog  day..a perfect summary. 

Only one thing needs to change and it's name is Goodwin.

All the reasonable observations  the frustrations and theoretical possible fixes are really just blah blah blah.

Still ,its a good movie if you like a  complete lack of authority  and hoping the dice will fall correctly every so often to keep you at the table 

 

Edited March 8 by IRW

[Fromgotowoewodin 741]

42 minutes ago, Earl Hood said:

But I worry it will cost us longer term. Let’s face it we will be on the edge every game hoping Max doesn’t get injured. 

No argument here, we’re hanging on by the width of either Max’s knee ligament or May’s hamstring tendon - either of them go and we’re cooked. 

My main worry is that even if they hang on we’re still short a tall forward. 1min to go, 5 points down, kick to the hotspot and McKay takes a mark and puts them in front - we could’ve tried that 30 times and not got it to work. 

[monoccular 16,136]

6 hours ago, Jjrogan said:

There is no question our forwards don't move enough.  But equally,  if we have a 3 on 2 or 4 on 3 with a 'fast break', I still not confident we score.     We don't make the right decisions or run to the right spots.  I'm sure they do a lot of work on this at training but imho it's a 'skill' that you either have or you don't.  If you're going to run with an undersized forward line you simply have to be able to take advantage of 3 on 2s.  Conversely, our back line is excellent at defending when outnumbered or out positioned. 

A question that I am sure has been asked and answered before:  what special skills as a forward does Greg Stafford bring to our club?  Surely someone who has played and excelled as a forward would be worth calling on.  Is Neita anywhere on the footy scene these days?  Carey?  

2 hours ago, Earl Hood said:

All that happened points to just that conclusion. The refusal to select Grundy in the last 5 weeks or so tells me something went wrong at the club. The original plan was for Grundy to ruck and Max to go forward and pinch hit in the ruck. Max didn’t work up forward. By round 18 it was Grundy who was sent packing to work on his forward craft because it wasn’t working up forward. And that was it for Grundy. It’s a team sport but I have had a suspicion that the captain spat the dummy on this. 

To me it seems pretty obvious that either Brundy or Max spat the dummy - no glimpse of Brundy in the final 6 or so weeks of the season was unfathomable unless one said he couldn't work with the other.  It is a sad fact that nobody could get this "dream combo" to work.  

[rpfc 27,507]

2 hours ago, Demonland said:

 

It’s not irrelevant but sure whatever. 
 

We should get better as forwards return to the forward line and push out the runners that don’t know how to utilise space or have effective leading patterns.

Cant tell if we have connection issues yet until Fritsch has some friends down there. Petty, McAdam, Pickett - get those four for a few months and we will see what our ball movement is like.

JVR gets a pass as a young tall but I watched him closely at games last year and he didn’t impress me with his movement and craft. 

[Binmans PA 26,231]

3 hours ago, WheeloRatings said:

 

Pressure

Team pressure

Quarter	For	Against
1	193	202
2	177	171
3	195	186
4	159	204
Match	182	190

Source: Herald Sun

 

So team pressure went out the window in the 4th. It did look that way. That's a very ordinary number. I wonder how much of it speaks to interrupted pre season of certain players. 

Thanks for these numbers as always mate.

[monoccular 16,136]

8 minutes ago, rpfc said:

I.......

JVR gets a pass as a young tall but I watched him closely at games last year and he didn’t impress me with his movement and craft. 

JVR was in effect a solo tall in the forward line. A solo tall target for our upfield players and a more so a single tall target for the opposition to concentrate on. He desperately needs a tall helper, one with bit of passion and competitiveness so not the nice guy Schache.   Trouble with that question is who can fill that role?

[defuture15 844]

Composure is the missing element

[Wrecker46 2,672]

I've always backed Goodwin and never written a negative thing about him. I think the game plan works as evidence by our continual top 4 finishes BUT if he doesn't find a way to support Gawn getting smashed off the ball my support stops. One game i can forgive but if it becomes a trend Goodwin has to go. Greasy conditions didn't suit Gawn but the rosdmap to beat Melbourne this year was well and truly written.

Demonlanders don't think Laurie has a standout strength to make it. He is not big, he is not fast, he is not a penetrating kick etc.. I think (hope) his strength is being an elite link player. When he is involved in a chain i see it time and time again he makes the right decision and nails the handball. Watch Widsors goal against Carlton in the prac match. He will always look bad when our midfield is loosing and we are not creating chains moving forwards. In a team that normally dominates inside 50's i think he has a place.

Oliver - used to be maligned for handballing too much now its because he just bombs it. The greatest demon of them all making the greatest comeback, lets get around him