POSTGAME: Rd 07 vs Hawthorn

[Clintosaurus 6,467]

1 hour ago, Go the Biff said:

TV angles make it hard to be definitive but it appears we are keeping one forward deep. At different times it was Weid, Fritta or Jackson. This means the oppo defence has to defend at least 50 metres of space and they're forced to adjust their zone to what we're doing. More green grass for them to guard, more green grass for us to run into.

It would also be I'd say with an eye on Brisbane this week. Harris Andrews needs to be isolated deep so he can't come over the top of every marking contest in the forward 50. He will kill it every time if our forwards are too close together.

[old55 21,356]

55 minutes ago, Nasher said:

This is just inventing what happens in the box, just to suit narrative/agenda. Goody’s started listening to his assistants and now we’re good. Or Goody’s stopped listening to his muppet assistants and become an authoritarian, and that’s what has made us good. Or, the most likely thing, the relationship with the assistants is the same as it always was, and they’ve arrived at the right chemistry by chipping away at the problem together.

We don’t know though, so we shouldn’t guess. In my view if we’re prepared to unreservedly put the blow torch on Goodwin when we’re struggling then we have to be prepared to give him all the credit when we’re flying. Anything otherwise is complete double standards.

For the record, I do neither.

No it's very clear what's going on.  He finally started listening to the experts in the "is he the right guy thread?". Thank heavens we have them on board.

[drdrake 3,038]

It was a good win but Hawthorn were witches hats, that is the first time in a very long time that we just bullied a team, broke tackles took contested marks, Hawthorn was just dis-interested.

The last 2 weeks our set up has been better, we don't seem to be pushing forwards into the midfield as much and we seem to have 1-2 deep options that are getting a crack at it one on one rather than 3 on 1.

Still work to do, we are making silly turnovers, got away this this yesterday but this week we will get hurt.

 

[Hellaintabadplacetobe 4,090]

1 hour ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Anyone else notice some of our midfielders (Oliver, Petracca, Bennell, AvB) prowling in our d50?  Hawks didn't follow them; not sure GCS did either. 

Big help to defenders and I reckon that is a key to our recent effectiveness of our attacking from the back 50 and getting our running game going.   Need to watch the replay again but it looked as if defenders didn't have to defend so high up the ground.

Our mids are two-way running, at last!

 

Edit:  Anyone know on which website player 'heat maps' are located and how to gain access?  Cheers.

AFL app. 

Click on the match day tab for Haw v Melbn,  then ' players'. You can then click on the individual players and find the heat map along with some other useful stats. 

[binman 38,372]

18 hours ago, Brownie said:

Trac's kick to Weid in the square was just incredible. A real highlight for me.

I cant do those fancy giphs.

Can someone help a fella out with one of that kick.

That kick was heaven on a stick.

[binman 38,372]

Some key stats that go a long way to explaining our dominance (from this article with a bunch of other stats on the MFC website):

 Inside 50’s:

Melbourne: 54 | Hawthorn: 33

Inside 50’s from centre bounces:

Melbourne: 12 | Hawthorn: 6

Marks inside 50:

Melbourne: 15 | Hawthorn: 5

[CHF 2,607]

Watched it live over breakfast. (Europe)

Have to say it was the best I have seen the team play since the finals run in 2018. A very complete team performance with a general lift across the board from a number of players that allowed the likes of Gawn, Petracca, Viney and Oliver to perform at their best. 

The defence looks very well structured and settled. I like the way that Omac and May are beginning to work together and develop and understanding. May's disposal was better this week and Omac is getting to run out of defence a bit to hit up a  link. All very encouraging. I thought Jetta was better than last week and Lockhart is developing. I was doubtful about him but he is showing a bit. Lever and Hibberd are travelling well. Lever hass been improving over the lat two weeks.

The midfield is going to put the scare into a few more opposition teams in the future. Petracca had a day out with just about everything working for him. A couple of his kicks to team mates were as perfect as you could wish to see. I pass to Fritsch in the last was one that will live in the memory for a while. Also enjoyed Oliver and Viney's work at the feet of the Big Man. we have come to expect the way Gawn goes to work but I took the time to watch the replay and concentrate on his game. It was a beauty.

Langdon on the wing had a good one and I want to see him produce that a bit more. Brayhaw, Harmes and AvB are worth persevering with. Brayshaw and AvB both seem to be going through delivery nightmares but, to me, do not look too far off. I think Harmes is doing ok but  needs to be a bit more involved. It my be the way the coaches are playing him.

The forward performance was a revelation for me and I hope that it is not a one off performance. I would like to see this structure given a chance to develop. Wiedeman playing deep and Jackson playing further up the ground with a couple of mid size in Melksham and Fritsch leading and providing a link is looking good. Add Bennell and Pickett for a bit of speed, imagination and variety and it has the makings of a hard forward line to match up on. Add in Petracca rotating through there for e 'rest' and it creates problems.

No chnges for next week for me but it would depend on aches and pains after the game and also the fixture list going forward.

[pitmaster 3,064]

8 hours ago, binman said:

No?

How many players, moving through traffic (having set up the scoring chain in the center) could hit a player 20 metres away with a handball fired from round his head to set up a gimme goal?

And his first goal back  though easy  will certainly make his end of career highlight reel.

(Note: the above sounds a bit argumentative - it wasn't meant to)

It was fine work, but his highlight reel is something else. I consider that play  covered by my comment that he is coming into the pace of the game and making a contribution but have you seen his highlight reel? If he begins to replicate that demonland will go through the roof.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,443]

23 hours ago, Sigil said:

In the last two weeks the structure and game plan have been changed.

Even the negatives (other than the first few minutes of the game) the players were actually trying to hit targets. Gus was pretty bad with disposal today, but even when it didn’t come off it was the right decision. You can practice the skills, just long bombing it has shown where we fall down for the last eighteen months.

Even Viney’s HTB towards the end of the game I was happy with, he was looking for good options and unfortunately the tackle stuck. At least that gives our defenders the chance to position, rather than the typical bomb that rebounds to the other side of the ground and we are out of position.

Our hard as nails midfield does work, as soon as we lower eyes. There will be mistakes cos I think they are playing a different style compared to the beginning of the year, but I’m not going to complain when we compete and play like we did today.

 

Apart from on-field personnel changes there have been two noticeable game style changes in the last two weeks. Firstly, Oliver has stopped handpassing most of the time and is now kicking the ball much more often. Secondly, there has been a clear change in the way the players deliver the ball to the forward line. The long bombs, for the most part, have been replaced with targetted passes.

I'm interested in knowing why. I find it too much of a coincidence that both those changes happened at once. Have we changed our coaches? Were the players getting mixed messages from the coaches previously but are now getting clarity? Is hub life giving the players more time to absorb and understand instructions?  

I recall that Essendon made a successful change mid-season (was it 2019 or 2018?) when they removed the hapless Mark Neeld because they found that the coaching structure didn't work. (I know that Neeld is an easy target, but I think everyone involved at Essendon was at great pains to say it was a structural problem, not a personnel problem.) Have we done something similar?

[Clayton van Oliver 1,682]

What a beautiful way to spend a Saturday morning (also Europe) and a Sunday morning with the replay. Few things to add (though I’m sure it’s all been said)

last week the team disposal was up a notch but Tracc’s was down despite his huge influence otherwise. This week his standard was up with most of the rest of the team and it had a big impact.

I reckon the same is coming from Brayshaw. He is getting in good spots, seems to be running back harder, but had three shocking kicks in the first three qtrs. That being said, he also put that absolute bullet onto Weid’s chest in the third, which the weed unfortunately missed. It shows that Brayshaw does still have it, is still developing, and given our general resurgence I wouldn’t be surprised if he turns the corner really soon. 
 

Speaking of resurgence, I am just so proud of the culture at the club. Of note are some of the little connections between certain players after goals or when on the bench. I am loving the Harley and Kozzie big and little brother thing that is going on. Harl’s just seems so proud of Koz every time he does anything, but Bennell also has a maturity about him that I never saw in his previous iterations at the suns and freo. I reckon he, as well as Uncle Nev, are working hard to keep kozzie in line and on track to fulfill his immense potential. 

Just stoked. Love the winning feeling and may the Hawks be in for six decades of let down and mediocrity.
 

 

 

[The Swimming Dee 1,858]

I loved Harley Bennell's goal. He was clear, on the angle, running at goal about 30 metres out. I loved it because as soon as he had ball in hand I just knew he would nail it. He is still growing in confidence but he adds some real class as both a deliverer and a finisher - an elite ball user!

[binman 38,372]

34 minutes ago, pitmaster said:

It was fine work, but his highlight reel is something else. I consider that play  covered by my comment that he is coming into the pace of the game and making a contribution but have you seen his highlight reel? If he begins to replicate that demonland will go through the roof.

Fair nuff

No argument from me about his talent. One of the most talented players I've seen play 

[DEE fence 4,495]

5 hours ago, nosoupforme said:

Watching the game noticing Bolton saying something to Clarkson in the coaches box, Clarko looks despondent looking away.

What could he have said to him?.

My Version........  Bolton says, It doesn't look good Boss, I remember  that  censored  club lost me my job. If l were you,  I would be resigning asap before you get the sack. 

 

My thought was that Bolton had brought Carlton's intellectual property to Hawthorn....

[DEE fence 4,495]

5 hours ago, A F said:

Agree with it all except this.

I'm not Vanders' biggest fan, but the one thing he does bring that Tom doesn't is tackling pressure.

I think we're a better, more balanced side without Tom. There, I said it.

It's a valid point, his tackling pressure is a definite asset and more than Tmac, and he is faster that he has been for a long time, I just think Tmac was so close in the last two weeks to his 2018 game, and that would be something.

I also think VDB turnovers against a Brisbane/Collingwood type outfit could really hurt us, our back six did a sterling job yesterday both at setting up and pressuring the ball carrier and that saved red faces.

I would argue lets see what it looks like with Tmac back? Only other option would be Melksham for Tmac, but he showed more spark yesterday, although I wasn't sure if that was because of the downhill slope he was on.. I guess I should switch this to changes for Brissie thread?

[Mazer Rackham 14,969]

2 minutes ago, The Swimming Dee said:

I loved Harley Bennell's goal. He was clear, on the angle, running at goal about 30 metres out. I loved it because as soon as he had ball in hand I just knew he would nail it. He is still growing in confidence but he adds some real class as both a deliverer and a finisher - an elite ball user!

He's one of those guys where you think "thank god, he will know what to do with it"

Oliver another. (Execution doesn't always match the promise, but his football brain is something to have faith in)

Now Tracc. I now trust him to attempt the right thing.

 

Gus going the other way: "oh no!"

[Robot Devil 1,895]

FOX NEWS HEADLINE:

SHOCKING FOOTAGE : WILDLIFE PROTECTION OFFICERS CALLED IN AS 22 HAWKS BRUTALLY BEATEN IN WESTERN SYDNEY

WATCH THE SHOCKING VIDEO BELOW:

 

Edited July 20, 2020 by Robot Devil

[Pates 9,537]

8 minutes ago, Mazer Rackham said:

He's one of those guys where you think "thank god, he will know what to do with it"

Oliver another. (Execution doesn't always match the promise, but his football brain is something to have faith in)

Now Tracc. I now trust him to attempt the right thing.

 

Gus going the other way: "oh no!"

My main frustration about Oliver is he seems to be working his brain too fast at times and he gets this rush to just handball it off without seeing if the play is in a better position. He burned Smith with it against Richmond when the momentum was swinging our way and cost a goal, he did it to Viney against GC and he was forced into an error, and did it to Max this week with him not even slightly expecting it. 

He’s still quite young so I’m hoping this will improve, but I’d just like him to take ownership of the ball at times rather than play hot potato. 

[low flying Robbo 979]

On 7/19/2020 at 7:06 PM, Deestroy All said:

Smashing Hawthorn makes the apocalypse feel way better. 

Oscar has come in and said listen [censored], don’t listen to what Simon says, this is my world and this is how you’re setting up. 

Petrecca is something else. The balance and movement plus  explosion stands out likes dogs balls in an era of ugly footy. Really bringing the joy back for me. 

Gawn took the [censored] all day. 

Oliver and Viney were a driving force. Bullies. 

Brayshaw half good half awful. Which one is really him?

Jackson played a better game than Tomald has for 12 months. Promising stuff. Bennell and Kozzie also played really well up forward. 

So good to see Weed making a difference. 

And Langdon played like what Scully should’ve become. 
 

Speaking of Scully, best part was when a 200 kilo Italian ran away from him like he wasn’t there. 

I preferred Maxy giving him the dont argue and getting away from him. I need to go find that footage.

[Binmans PA 26,209]

1 hour ago, DaisyDeeciple said:

It's a valid point, his tackling pressure is a definite asset and more than Tmac, and he is faster that he has been for a long time, I just think Tmac was so close in the last two weeks to his 2018 game, and that would be something.

I also think VDB turnovers against a Brisbane/Collingwood type outfit could really hurt us, our back six did a sterling job yesterday both at setting up and pressuring the ball carrier and that saved red faces.

I would argue lets see what it looks like with Tmac back? Only other option would be Melksham for Tmac, but he showed more spark yesterday, although I wasn't sure if that was because of the downhill slope he was on.. I guess I should switch this to changes for Brissie thread?

Fair enough. I'd really like to see Jackson retained and an unchanged line up, but each to their own, mate. 

[Binmans PA 26,209]

1 hour ago, Mazer Rackham said:

He's one of those guys where you think "thank god, he will know what to do with it"

Oliver another. (Execution doesn't always match the promise, but his football brain is something to have faith in)

Now Tracc. I now trust him to attempt the right thing.

 

Gus going the other way: "oh no!"

Haha, I like the way you've put this, although I'd argue something slightly different with Trac. The two aforementioned I feel safe watching, but with Trac I feel he tries to create even more than those guys, but now what he tries to create comes off. So I'd say I now trust Trac to pull off the outrageous that he so often tried and failed to do in the past.

It's certainly a good feeling to have some genuinely elite players on your list, isn't it?

[Pickett2Jackson 3,904]

3:45 for some Dee porn

 

https://www.afl.com.au/video/467730/the-moment-blues-blew-it-how-selection-calls-have-saved-a-season?videoId=467730&modal=true&type=video&publishFrom=1595233241001

[RalphiusMaximus 5,993]

OK, I just have to vent on my one great complaint from this game.  Bloody Max Gawn.  He could have had GOTY sewn up and he passed it off.  The guy roves his own hitout, breaks a tackle and runs the ball out of the square.  All he had to do was take it to 55m or so and belt the hell out of it for a goal.  Why did he do the team thing and look for a pass?  Why? 

5 hours ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Anyone else notice some of our midfielders (Oliver, Petracca, Bennell, AvB) prowling in our d50?  Hawks didn't follow them; not sure GCS did either.

Interesting.  I wonder if this contributed to the space our forwards were finding? 

[Engorged Onion 9,323]

2 hours ago, binman said:

I cant do those fancy giphs.

Can someone help a fella out with one of that kick.

That kick was heaven on a stick.

 

[binman 38,372]

7 minutes ago, Engorged Onion said:

 

there_you_go2.mov

What.

 A.

Kick.

[binman 38,372]

7 hours ago, binman said:

Anyway i digress. As i mentioned a few times last year and the year before people with the AFL live pass  (tesltra customers and i assume AFL subscribers? - not sure how that works) can access AFL stats pro on AFL.com where you can of watch vision every involvement of every player.

Fantastic tool. I assume the clubs and players use this vision to reflect on individual player''s games

I have used it this year (in 2018 and 2019 i was mostly on Omac watch) but might have look at Harmes' or Smith's involvements because i wondering who was on Smith too. Did bugger all. 

I''m also curious who Lochart and Jetta played on. And who was on Sicily (or vice versa)

i'll have a look tonight and post my findings!

Modern footy is a million miles away from the one on one game it was in the 80s and not the 90s. It will never go back there. Deal

I just looked at the vision of every involvement for Harmes and could not for the life of me work out who he played on. The best guess was Blake Hardwick.

So i looked at his vision and  Harmes was nowhere near him for almost all his involvements. 

So i looked at Smith's vision! And bugger if if could tell who was on him. The player most regularly in screen was Langdon so perhaps they didn't run directly anyone on him? Or at least not a tag. Either way he was useless.

Perhaps you need the down the ground vision to really track who is on who. 

I'll check Jetts and Lockart at some point but i'm going to watch tracc's involvements now. Juts coz