Farewell Jack Watts

[Cheap Seats 3,310]

9 minutes ago, rpfc said:

If that is the case, maybe we should look at recruiting that tall fella with application issues who has elite skills and had a ripper 2016?

Seriously though, as @Clint Bizkit says later in this thread, you and Goodwin are talking like we will give him up for absolutely anything from the club of his choice.

That is not how you build and maintain a list. He has 5 years of good footy left in him if a club backs themselves to get him in the mindset he had the most of the last two seasons. I will not accept, as a supporter and member and Lander, any old pick for Jack Watts.

What a load of speculative bs.

Jack Watts is no better then Jenkins or Lynch who both got no where near it yesterday, which was due to  the pressure, and because they couldn't win their own ball.. In fact I'd rate those 2 easily ahead of JW.

If as per prior years teams copy the Tigers and go for all out pressure - JW will continue to get no where near it. No point being a great kick if you can't get the ball.

Players come to and leave clubs every year.... JW is no different. There is no solid evidence who out of the MFC and JW decided to explore other options. Goodwin has said JW is welcome at the MFC and it's rumoured JW said he was getting kicked out.... So you're all speculating in accordance with your own agendas

A lot of the arguments here are emotional rubbish... JW would be lucky to be top 15 player at the club.

I am not going to get upset by a non top 15 player moving on

Edited October 1, 2017 by Unleash Hell

[Dee tention 616]

Essendon also interested in Jack.

Jayden Laverde?

Edited October 1, 2017 by Dee tention

[Lil_red_fire_engine 11,177]

This quote says a lot to me from Don Pyke after yesterday's game.

"One of the things that is very hard from a coaching viewpoint is to provide effort," Pyke said. 

"The players are responsible for effort.

"We try and encourage that, we try and demand that.

[Redleg 40,926]

5 minutes ago, big_red_fire_engine said:

This quote says a lot to me from Don Pyke after yesterday's game.

"One of the things that is very hard from a coaching viewpoint is to provide effort," Pyke said. 

"The players are responsible for effort.

"We try and encourage that, we try and demand that.

If Goodwin said that, plenty on here would say he is slagging off at the players and making it an us and them. Not an all in together team. He has separated the Coaches from the Players and blamed them exclusively.

I didn't think the Crows coaching was great yesterday. 

However, Pyke was slagging off at the players and it was a them and us statement. Poor from a coach.

What he could have said instead, was maybe " the Tigers had better effort than "US" today, or "OUR" effort wasn't as good as the Tigers.

Edited October 1, 2017 by Redleg

[Redleg 40,926]

22 minutes ago, Dee tention said:

Essendon also interested in Jack.

Jayden Laverde?

Aaron Francis, a brilliant player who hasn't got fit enough. Might be a good swap for JW.

Edited October 1, 2017 by Redleg

[whatwhat say what 22,770]

francis' application to training and second efforts makes jack watts look good

let him go back to south australia like troy menzel and jimmy toumpas before him

[Lil_red_fire_engine 11,177]

10 minutes ago, Redleg said:

Aaron Francis, a brilliant player who hasn't got fit enough. Might be a good swap for JW.

What would his role be? 

[binman 42,980]

13 minutes ago, big_red_fire_engine said:

What would his role be? 

DL whipping boy. Straight swap.

[Macca 16,972]

There was an expectation of greatness with Jack (an assumption in many cases) but many are now at a point where they want to hang on to Jack because they still believe he can be great (or at least very good)

Conversely, there are any number of people who want to discard Jack because he didn't come up their expectations.  B- or C+ just isn't going to cut it. 

It's one side against the other and because of that, we don't see a lot of the middle ground.

Judge the player, not the number has always been my motto.  That way,  even a 3rd round rookie has the same chance of succeeding as does a top-end draft pick.  Any decent coach along with his FD would judge all their players that way.

My thoughts on Watts are based on completely ignoring his draft pick number.  He's of value as an outside runner who can use his pace and finishing skills to help a team.  But even as an outside runner, he has some glaring weaknesses. 

Plenty before him have been like that so there's a place for players like Watts.  I doubt it will be with us though.  And I'll be neither devastated nor completely happy with that outcome. 

 

Edited October 1, 2017 by Macca

[spirit of norm smith 16,461]

Despair for all if Watts is traded.  We have seen the impact of the decisions on Woey, Green , McDonald and the Neeld years

[Wells 11 5,406]

Im a Watts fan but feel as internally divided as this thread about the decision. Watching Watts kick the winning goal v pies was one of THE highlights of the season for me....seemed to right a few wrongs from the past. I, like many here, are invested in him. He has class and is definitely imporving.

Against that, when I watched the game yesterday, I was reminded about how  hard youve got be as a team to win a GF. Honestly I think Jack would hardly have got a kick. Even Taylor walker struggled and, with due respect to Watts,  he's not near that class. The game seems to be trending to smaller forward lines ( I feel again the pain of the choice of Weid over Curnow) and while I think Watts could win us ( or whoever he plays for) a few games in the home and away season I dont see him standing up in finals. 

If we trade him I want value for it...he's way more than a throw away. As I said Ive invested in him and like him so It hurts my heart a bit to say it..... but I think , if we're serious about a flag, hes a trade. Yesterdays game convinced me. 

[Redleg 40,926]

1 hour ago, big_red_fire_engine said:

What would his role be? 

Jack's or being on traded to Crows.

[Redleg 40,926]

I have the answer to all the angst, don't trade or delist any fan favourite. 

Enjoy the continued success. 

[Wells 11 5,406]

Just now, Redleg said:

I have the answer to all the angst, don't trade or delist any fan favourite. 

Enjoy the continued success. 

lol..... sums it up well Im afraid. The tigers missed Vickery this year thats for sure. 

[mo64 5,874]

1 minute ago, Wells 11 said:

lol..... sums it up well Im afraid. The tigers missed Vickery this year thats for sure. 

And Deledio.

[Wells 11 5,406]

Just now, mo64 said:

And Deledio.

yep...their lack of loyality really came back to bite them didnt it!  But I have to say they DID get a good deal on lids. We need a decent trade on Watts....or it will hurt. 

[Macca 16,972]

2 minutes ago, Wells 11 said:

lol..... sums it up well Im afraid. The tigers missed Vickery this year thats for sure. 

Except Vickery was never a fan favourite ... every Tiger fan I know wanted him out not long after he arrived there.  

Same deal for Deledio ... seen as soft by nearly every Tiger fan I know.  But lets face it,  they don't get called ferals for nothing.

[loges 6,767]

11 minutes ago, Wells 11 said:

Im a Watts fan but feel as internally divided as this thread about the decision. Watching Watts kick the winning goal v pies was one of THE highlights of the season for me....seemed to right a few wrongs from the past. I, like many here, are invested in him. He has class and is definitely imporving.

Against that, when I watched the game yesterday, I was reminded about how  hard youve got be as a team to win a GF. Honestly I think Jack would hardly have got a kick. Even Taylor walker struggled and, with due respect to Watts,  he's not near that class. The game seems to be trending to smaller forward lines ( I feel again the pain of the choice of Weid over Curnow) and while I think Watts could win us ( or whoever he plays for) a few games in the home and away season I dont see him standing up in finals. 

If we trade him I want value for it...he's way more than a throw away. As I said Ive invested in him and like him so It hurts my heart a bit to say it..... but I think , if we're serious about a flag, hes a trade. Yesterdays game convinced me. 

Exactly the point I was trying to make yesterday albeit too bluntly for some. Doesn't mean I don't find the situation sad though.

[DaveyDee 421]

2 hours ago, spirit of norm smith said:

Support of the club to explore options at 17 other clubs.  That means Goodwin wants him to go. That means you are unwanted.  How does he stay?

He signed a 3-year contract 2017-19. Then after 1 year, ‘go explore your options elsewhere’. 

Thats not support.  That’s clearly means go elsewhere. 

That is not the case you are way too much black or white - this scenario still has some grey in it. Its only 90/10

[beelzebub 23,377]

1 minute ago, DaveyDee said:

That is not the case you are way too much black or white - this scenario still has some grey in it. Its only 90/10

Im not sure there's any grey in it at all. but your figures might be prophetic.. 90/10

90% gone 10% stays

[DaveyDee 421]

On 9/21/2017 at 11:47 AM, DaveyDee said:

I'm a huge Watts supporter, but I think he is 90% gone few details to work out. 

 

[rpfc 28,436]

2 hours ago, Unleash Hell said:

What a load of speculative bs.

Jack Watts is no better then Jenkins or Lynch who both got no where near it yesterday, which was due to  the pressure, and because they couldn't win their own ball.. In fact I'd rate those 2 easily ahead of JW.

If as per prior years teams copy the Tigers and go for all out pressure - JW will continue to get no where near it. No point being a great kick if you can't get the ball.

Players come to and leave clubs every year.... JW is no different. There is no solid evidence who out of the MFC and JW decided to explore other options. Goodwin has said JW is welcome at the MFC and it's rumoured JW said he was getting kicked out.... So you're all speculating in accordance with your own agendas

A lot of the arguments here are emotional rubbish... JW would be lucky to be top 15 player at the club.

I am not going to get upset by a non top 15 player moving on

Mate, shut up, I am trying to up his value!

[Dr. Gonzo 24,221]

14 hours ago, spirit of norm smith said:

So much crap being spun here.

Form: Watts had a great 2016.  In first half of 2017, clearly in our best 6-7.  Took on ruck role. Starred in 3-4 games. 

Had a great QB game. Sealed victory!

His hamstring injury led to 3 weeks out and loss of form.  

One of the best in round 23.  Many many others were rubbish. 

why being traded?

I think it is salary cap related. Goodwin thinks he can jettison Watts.  

Neeld killed the club culture. Did we learn anything. Be careful here!!

Tigers showed results of backing in your loyalty

If you think it's salary cap related you've got no idea. 

Do you think it's acceptable for a senior player to take an unprofessional approach to his preparation? Do you think it's acceptable for a senior player to turn up to preseason in less than acceptable condition after his first solid season since being drafted 9 years earlier?

Watts did not have a "great" 2016 he did not have a "great" 2017 or a "great" Queens Birthday game. He didn't even poll votes on Queens Bday. 

His form in this period should be the benchmark not the ceiling. The fact supporters think his form was great is only evidence of the way he has continually underachieved throughout his career.

[rpfc 28,436]

2 hours ago, Unleash Hell said:

What a load of speculative bs.

Jack Watts is no better then Jenkins or Lynch who both got no where near it yesterday, which was due to  the pressure, and because they couldn't win their own ball.. In fact I'd rate those 2 easily ahead of JW.

If as per prior years teams copy the Tigers and go for all out pressure - JW will continue to get no where near it. No point being a great kick if you can't get the ball.

Players come to and leave clubs every year.... JW is no different. There is no solid evidence who out of the MFC and JW decided to explore other options. Goodwin has said JW is welcome at the MFC and it's rumoured JW said he was getting kicked out.... So you're all speculating in accordance with your own agendas

A lot of the arguments here are emotional rubbish... JW would be lucky to be top 15 player at the club.

I am not going to get upset by a non top 15 player moving on

But seriously, you are absolutely right - he is not a top 15 player; our fortunes will rise and fall with our core group of players and our midfield.

What I know is that this team needs some outside skill and vision and the FD just have to get a replacement for the role that is earmarked for Watts. If they strike out then I would not trade him.

No emotions required.

[Bobby McKenzie 2,385]

2 hours ago, Redleg said:

What did Goodwin say that was slagging?

I thought he said we had given him the option of looking around and that if he was unable to get a better deal he could stay with us.

That is not slagging a player.

Have I missed something else he said?

 

Read between the lines Redleg. Look at his comments more thoroughly. Slagging in a polite way. I'm losing faith in Mr Goodwin as a coach. Fantastic player but coach? Not so sure. Bring back Roosy.