POST MATCH DISCUSSION - Round 10

[Bates Mate 3,986]

I8Leave harmes in the team he shows the effort that is required and sets a standard others follow

[Nasher 33,177]

3 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Then what is yours ?

I've already said twice in this thread that I didn't see the first half. Literally all I saw was a complete MFC annihilation. 

I thought it interesting that the skipper and the coach said the same thing about the first half. I realise Jones generally just regurgitates what Goodwin says - although in this case he was interviewed first - but I've also heard them comment with disappointment. Goodwin for example was clearly seething after the Hawthorn game. Obviously their responses are measured by design, but I have not seen any evidence that they flat out lie.

I've watched enough footy to know what it's like to see the red mist when the opposition is kicking goals. It truly does feel like nothing is going right. I know that. So until I watch the whole replay, I am going to take the coach and the skipper on their word that the first half wasn't as dismal a state of affairs as a heap of angry supporters would have me believe.

[Gator 16,921]

Despite the glad-handlers enthusiasm i cannot unsee what I saw in the first half.  It was utterly disgraceful.

i like winning, so I'm naturally pleased for the 4 points and that we live to fight another day.  And I also realise we'll have other efforts that mirror the Adelaide game.

We have half a dozen players that are simply not good enough to take us where we need to go.

I like Goody and have faith that the 'Vacancy' sign will soon be removed.

[Hellaintabadplacetobe 4,110]

If we`d have won just one of our 5 winnable losses, we`d be 4th on the ladder this evening.

Considering we`ve done it without a ruckman for the majority of the losses, we are in a pretty good space right now.

[BarnDee 287]

lot of sooking going on here  who won  ? 

[binman 39,130]

2 minutes ago, Nasher said:

I thought it interesting that the skipper and the coach said the same thing about the first half. I realise Jones generally just regurgitates what Goodwin says - although in this case he was interviewed first - but I've also heard them comment with disappointment. Goodwin for example was clearly seething after the Hawthorn game. Obviously their responses are measured by design, but I have not seen any evidence that they flat out lie.

I've watched enough footy to know what it's like to see the red mist when the opposition is kicking goals. It truly does feel like nothing is going right. I know that. So until I watch the whole replay, I am going to take the coach and the skipper on their word that the first half wasn't as dismal a state of affairs as a heap of angry supporters would have me believe.

From http://www.melbournefc.com.au/news/2017-05-27/goodwin-praises-leaders-in-win:

The Dees trailed by 30 points midway through the third quarter before completely dominating the final 50 minutes to run away 35-point victors.

Goodwin said despite the big discrepancy, he was always confident his team would fight back.

"We were really happy with the way we were playing in the first half, and that sounds a little strange, but we had 32 inside 50s," he said.

Imagine if Goody was posting this on Demonland?  As you say Nasher lets take him at his word. Why would he bother saying it if he thought it wasn't true. It wasn't even in response to a direct question about his view of our performance in the first half. Intensity was fine. The problem remains the same it has been for a long time. We turn the ball over way too often. Even Lewis seems to have caught the dees bug. 

Goody made the point about our kicking when he said:

"I think our connection with our ball use changed in the second half and we found a way to impact the scoreboard, where early that wasn't the case.

[beelzebub 22,376]

1 minute ago, Nasher said:

I've already said twice in this thread that I didn't see the first half. Literally all I saw was a complete MFC annihilation. 

I thought it interesting that the skipper and the coach said the same thing about the first half. I realise Jones generally just regurgitates what Goodwin says - although in this case he was interviewed first - but I've also heard them comment with disappointment. Goodwin for example was clearly seething after the Hawthorn game. Obviously their responses are measured by design, but I have not seen any evidence that they flat out lie.

I've watched enough footy to know what it's like to see the red mist when the opposition is kicking goals. It truly does feel like nothing is going right. I know that. So until I watch the whole replay, I am going to take the coach and the skipper on their word that the first half wasn't as dismal a state of affairs as a heap of angry supporters would have me believe.

Look forward to your view after watching the whole game.

Maybe your glib reactions wont be so glib.

The comments of capt and coach to the first half debacle in all reality are worthy of Sorbent !! Mind you the play of the team mirrors that.

I frankly give little weight to anything commented about games by players or coaches, they have their ' straight and narrow' to follow. It's the new 'one week at a time' !!

That is footy speak for nothing really to say. The new versions are just as substantiate of anything meaningful.

I don't like to berate them but our club , like all, treat us as idiots. 

Those with two peepers are quite capable of discerning a game as it unfolds. Strangely the scoreboard is THE indicator.

So again watch the game. Inform yourself before being glib.

[Wiseblood 24,636]

1 minute ago, beelzebub said:

Look forward to your view after watching the whole game.

Maybe your glib reactions wont be so glib.

The comments of capt and coach to the first half debacle in all reality are worthy of Sorbent !! Mind you the play of the team mirrors that.

I frankly give little weight to anything commented about games by players or coaches, they have their ' straight and narrow' to follow. It's the new 'one week at a time' !!

That is footy speak for nothing really to say. The new versions are just as substantiate of anything meaningful.

I don't like to berate them but our club , like all, treat us as idiots. 

Those with two peepers are quite capable of discerning a game as it unfolds. Strangely the scoreboard is THE indicator.

So again watch the game. Inform yourself before being glib.

And it indicates that we won, and won well.  If that's all the indicator we need then it works for me.

[Mydee 288]

42 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Really thats your best Nash ?

 

Nothing more (of any sense)could be said

[bringbackthebiff 646]

The whole win loss debate is boring. Reckon you need to look through to the actual game performances/effort of players rather than checking the scoreboard at the end of the game. History will always show that up and coming teams don't just start winning flags overnight. We are super competitive however need to iron out somethings along the way. A couple of years ago I was really hoping we would we get a midfield that gets its hands on the ball more than the opposition - tick. Elite ruckman - tick. One of the most promising forwards - tick. I often wonder about the psyche of the Melbourne supporter. I assume our concern is not about this year but it's if our potential is only a top 8 team and not a top 4. Time will tell, but keeping this exciting core together, some strategic recruiting and a large slice of luck (massively underrated ingredient) - we are on our way

[beelzebub 22,376]

15 minutes ago, ProDee said:

Despite the glad-handlers enthusiasm i cannot unsee what I saw in the first half.  It was utterly disgraceful.

i like winning, so I'm naturally pleased for the 4 points and that we live to fight another day.  And I also realise we'll have other efforts that mirror the Adelaide game.

We have half a dozen players that are simply not good enough to take us where we need to go.

I like Goody and have faith that the 'Vacancy' sign will soon be removed.

I find myself strangely in agreement.

There's too much of what was good enough now found not so.

EOS looms darkly for more than 6 id think. Not that some aren't handy, but handy isn't the bar any more.

[Die Hard Demon 1,154]

3 hours ago, Petraccattack said:

Tom Bugg  0 goals 7 behinds the last 2 games

Sorry... that's probably my fault.. as he lined up for his first goal last week I was very confident as he had been a fairly reliable set shot in the past & i did the unthinkable & said "it's all good! Buggy doesn't miss" .. since then .. 0 & 7.. my bad. 

[beelzebub 22,376]

6 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

And it indicates that we won, and won well.  If that's all the indicator we need then it works for me.

Howd you feel at halftime ?

Coach reacted...30 mins late .so-so 

Team reacted ...good

We won ...good

Method ..hmmm

Hows that scoreboard in other games.. Hawthorn, Richmond, Geelong , North , Freo ??

The scoreboard telks a story. It says we won today....woke up got there late. Twas only GC after all

 

QB will be interesting...it is after all our GF 

[Diamond_Jim 12,054]

Question.... does today's game make you more or less confident about the Collingwood game

For me it tends to make me less confident ...... Collingwood are a 6 goal better team than GC especially if Moore contributes a couple of goals.

[Wiseblood 24,636]

1 minute ago, beelzebub said:

Howd you feel at halftime ?

Coach reacted...30 mins late .so-so 

Team reacted ...good

We won ...good

Method ..hmmm

Hows that scoreboard in other games.. Hawthorn, Richmond, Geelong , North , Freo ??

The scoreboard telks a story. It says we won today....woke up got there late. Twas only GC after all

 

QB will be interesting...it is after all our GF 

Or in the Crows, Essendon, Saints, Blues and GC games?

I never quite know what your point is these days.  It's like you have an idea and vomit it all over your keyboard.

[The Chazz 4,077]

8 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Howd you feel at halftime ?

Coach reacted...30 mins late .so-so 

Team reacted ...good

We won ...good

Method ..hmmm

Hows that scoreboard in other games.. Hawthorn, Richmond, Geelong , North , Freo ??

The scoreboard telks a story. It says we won today....woke up got there late. Twas only GC after all

 

QB will be interesting...it is after all our GF 

Not any more.  Time you moved on.

Good teams are winning playing bad this year.  It's the 2017 thing.  Best you get with it or you will be in a depressed state for a while.

[titan_uranus 22,853]

7 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Howd you feel at halftime ?

Coach reacted...30 mins late .so-so 

Team reacted ...good

We won ...good

Method ..hmmm

Hows that scoreboard in other games.. Hawthorn, Richmond, Geelong , North , Freo ??

The scoreboard telks a story. It says we won today....woke up got there late. Twas only GC after all

 

QB will be interesting...it is after all our GF 

If you're not prepared to accept that we can play well and lose (which you were not after our loss to West Coast last year), you (and you're not the only one) are IMO hypocritical in arguing that we can play poorly and win.

You either need to put aside today's 2.5 quarters of tripe or, alternatively, next time we play well but lose, acknowledge the positives in that loss.

[Demon trucker 1,786]

we are 1 of 3 teams to have over a 1000 PF and that is without Hogan playing many games,

[Demon trucker 1,786]

we are a team that never gives up.

[Demon trucker 1,786]

for a team to beat us  they have to score over 95 points

[titan_uranus 22,853]

1 minute ago, don't make me angry said:

we are a team that never gives up.

It does seem we've developed a good degree of resilience this year.

We were 24 points behind St Kilda (won by 30), 24 behind Fremantle (had the lead with 90 seconds to play), 35 behind Hawthorn (drew level in the fourth), 28 behind Adelaide (won by 41) and 26 behind North (margin reduced to 2 points in the fourth).

[Binmans PA 26,529]

5 hours ago, Stretch Johnson said:

Neal-Bullen breakout game?

Composure, decision making and execution were excellent.

Thought he spudded it up in the first term and thought he'd kick a point from 25m out directly in front, but he managed to kick it on the full.

But in the second half, I'd agree. He was very good. Made a couple of clutch decisions and managed to execute by foot like he's never been able to do before. So that was pleasing. Could well be his breakout game. Certainly gets a game against Collingwood.

If there are any changes, it'll be Bugg that makes way. You'd expect Salem to return. Couldn't see anyone from down back being dropped, unless of course Oscar, who was terrible, let's be honest.

You know, Oscar may well get the axe given Collingwood's smaller forwardline. Depends if they play Cox. If not, it'll be Frost to Moore and Salem for McDonald.

5 hours ago, daisycutter said:

another great game by #pedomyths

Think he's had a lot better games than that one. In fact, I thought he was soundly beaten in the ruck and apart from structurally straightening us up and taking a good defender, he was near hopeless up forward. The game turned when he went out of the ruck. Witts murdered him.

5 hours ago, leave it to deever said:

He bleeds red and blue. 

On a side note...I just noticed we have the 4th highest percentage.

Fifth highest. Which is a strong indicator that we're still on track for finals.

5 hours ago, bing181 said:

Main difference first/second half was swapping Tom Mac and Pedersen (ruck/forward). Tommy is not a forward.

Pedo is not a ruck... he was killing us more in the ruck than Tom was by playing forward.

Edited May 27, 2017 by A F

[Binmans PA 26,529]

5 hours ago, ProDee said:

In all seriousness, we are no hope of winning a Grand Final with the McDonalds.  Nil.  Zilch.  

It's a major worry.

I was happy to let OMac get games last year and even this year, but his decision making with ball in hand and his inability to lay tackles is simply not good enough for an AFL footballer, let alone a KPD. 

I'm in the he'll take time camp, but I'm not sure he should be the #1 or even #2 KPD defender in the 22 after his last fortnight. 

It doesn't help when Wagner has barely hit a target since his return; Tommy McDonald is no better with ball in hand and liable to turn it over at any moment; Frost is a bit heart in your mouth stuff; Melksham is hit and miss with his disposal; and Melbourne Lewis seems to turn it over a lot more by foot than Hawthorn Lewis. 

He's not a great judge of the flight of the ball either, which spells danger for a KPD in the modern game. 

We desperately need to get a cool headed KPD to support Frost and Hibberd, and then Omac can develop as the intercept marker or as back up KPD.

May was pretty ordinary today and doesn't play particularly smart football, but his kicking might be a weapon for us. I'd probably just go harder at Lever, though that means Frost has to play #1 KPB.

Edited May 27, 2017 by A F

[Dr. Gonzo 22,641]

1 hour ago, beelzebub said:

Yes and no

For today the win sufficient

Tomorrow.... Where the f were we for half the game ?

That was a win

But would Goodwin consider it a good win ?

I don't doubt the coaches and players will go through the game as they do every week and focus on things to improve on and things we did well.

But I'm a supporter and I have no ability to impact how the team plays next match other than to turn up and support so I'm not gonna sit here metaphorically whipping myself in some kind of perverse repentance gig because the team didn't win the way I wanted them to.

[Dr. Gonzo 22,641]

1 hour ago, beelzebub said:

Seriously...you buy that rubbish... it's spin for we weren't effective, we were more incapable than capable.

Thats humourous if you really want to play that card.

Scoreboard says we were rubbish. Scoreboards rarely lie.

We played well early but didn't take the smart options. We kept bombing it forward when we had no marking options. We struggled to adjust to the conditions early too so kept under/over running the ball. 

Second quarter we had plenty of shots but missed too many easy opportunities. Missed a couple of sitters in the first too. Suns took advantage of their opportunities 

So no, it wasn't all doom and gloom at half time.

But if scoreboard is all that matters then you should be happy. Games go for 4 quarters and at the final siren we were 35 points to the plus side of the ledger. That's all that matters.