The 2013 Finals Thread

[Chook 15,013]

Not inconsistent, just poor.

How many Grand Finals in recent years have been decided by poor goal kicking? Still such an important part of the game.

I agree with you on the goalkicking. One year a team is going to spend every available second practicing this most important skill, and then they'll win the premiership despite being a statistally average side.

15.10 beats 10.25 every day of the week.

[DemonOX 8,791]

I bet Rivers is happy with his move.

Good on him hope it works out for him.

Well maybe it didn't work out they way he would have hoped but at least he played in the finals. Edited September 20, 2013 by DemonOX

[DemonOX 8,791]

32 to 22 shots at goal.

Hawks and their supporters would have spat the dummy big time if they had lost it.

They were the better team and deserved to win.

Edited September 20, 2013 by DemonOX

[DemonOX 8,791]

Oh how I long for the day the Dees are playing finals again.

It's been such a long time between drinks.

[Gippsland Dee 367]

YES! geelong are out of the finals

[dazzledavey36 54,947]

Could you imagine if we appointed Jeff Kennett as our president.

[Demon Dynasty 17,109]

Then Geelong slow the game down, should have put the foot down.

They'll be putting their foot up Chappy's bum I wld think. May have cost them a shot at the flag. Pathetic umpiring in the last 20 minutes of the 2nd which brought the Hawks back from the brink (they were rattled) and some poor play from experienced players like Hunt and Kelly didn't help. Rivers started the doubts/rot going as well with his woeful kick on the full when under no pressure. They played panick footy after that. Pods and Hawkins had little impact overhead and pods gave them nothing higher up the ground like he usually does. Both got towelled up by their opponents once the ball hit the deck.

The Hawks won more of the clearances out of the middle and with a strangling forward press in that last quarter. Fresher legs probably played a part as well. IMO Scott also managed the older brigade poorly by not resting a heap of them just before the finals a la Lyon (Freo).

I cant think of a worse GF than Hawks vs Freo. Freo will eventually get trounced and the game itself will be an absolute yawn for the first half until the Hawks finally break the shackles after half time. Oh, my mistake there's an equally worse GF match up looming and thats if the Swannies somehow scrape through. They'll get smashed from the 2nd quarter onwards I reckon.

Cant see either team getting within 8+ goals of the Hawks at this point. I cant watch another round of Hawks backslapping their way into the rooms yet again after running around the G with another cup. Such a bunch of chuckers/cheaters and arrogant pricks.

2014 roll on.

[Wadda We Sing 10,685]

They'll be putting their foot up Chappy's bum I wld think. May have cost them a shot at the flag. Pathetic umpiring in the last 20 minutes of the 2nd which brought the Hawks back from the brink (they were rattled) and some poor play from experienced players like Hunt and Kelly didn't help. Rivers started the doubts/rot going as well with his woeful kick on the full when under no pressure. They played panick footy after that. Pods and Hawkins had little impact overhead and pods gave them nothing higher up the ground like he usually does. Both got towelled up by their opponents once the ball hit the deck.

The Hawks won more of the clearances out of the middle and with a strangling forward press in that last quarter. Fresher legs probably played a part as well. IMO Scott also managed the older brigade poorly by not resting a heap of them just before the finals a la Lyon (Freo).

I cant think of a worse GF than Hawks vs Freo. Freo will eventually get trounced and the game itself will be an absolute yawn for the first half until the Hawks finally break the shackles after half time. Oh, my mistake there's an equally worse GF match up looming and thats if the Swannies somehow scrape through. They'll get smashed from the 2nd quarter onwards I reckon.

Cant see either team getting within 8+ goals of the Hawks at this point. I cant watch another round of Hawks backslapping their way into the rooms yet again after running around the G with another cup. Such a bunch of chuckers/cheaters and arrogant pricks.

2014 roll on.

Yes, good on Rivers 4 playing, but I gulped when I saw that......years of bad/no training rearing its ugly head....sorry cats. (ha)

[Whispering_Jack 30,173]

Hawthorn are blessed with their recruiting. They picked up Shaun Burgoyne at the end of 2009 when he was 26, going on 27 and his career was in a rut. He's now been an important member of his team for four years but last night, without his efforts, they would have been celebrating Mad Monday on the day after next.

[ucanchoose 1,816]

Hawthorn are blessed with their recruiting. They picked up Shaun Burgoyne at the end of 2009 when he was 26, going on 27 and his career was in a rut. He's now been an important member of his team for four years but last night, without his efforts, they would have been celebrating Mad Monday on the day after next.

Stuart Dew says hi too! It's more than blessed

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

Hawthorn are blessed with their recruiting. They picked up Shaun Burgoyne at the end of 2009 when he was 26, going on 27 and his career was in a rut. He's now been an important member of his team for four years but last night, without his efforts, they would have been celebrating Mad Monday on the day after next.

The amazing part is even though they chose well with Franklin, Roughead and Hodge they had big busts with Thorp, Dowler and Ellis.

[PJ_12345 1,098]

Could you imagine if we appointed Jeff Kennett as our president.

[dazzledavey36 54,947]

If Freo win today is anyone giving them a sneaky chance next week?

Hawks were poor defensively and we all knkw how freo can really choke teams up.

Freo by 10

[titan_uranus 25,020]

They'll be putting their foot up Chappy's bum I wld think. May have cost them a shot at the flag. Pathetic umpiring in the last 20 minutes of the 2nd which brought the Hawks back from the brink (they were rattled) and some poor play from experienced players like Hunt and Kelly didn't help. Rivers started the doubts/rot going as well with his woeful kick on the full when under no pressure. They played panick footy after that. Pods and Hawkins had little impact overhead and pods gave them nothing higher up the ground like he usually does. Both got towelled up by their opponents once the ball hit the deck.

The Hawks won more of the clearances out of the middle and with a strangling forward press in that last quarter. Fresher legs probably played a part as well. IMO Scott also managed the older brigade poorly by not resting a heap of them just before the finals a la Lyon (Freo).

I cant think of a worse GF than Hawks vs Freo. Freo will eventually get trounced and the game itself will be an absolute yawn for the first half until the Hawks finally break the shackles after half time. Oh, my mistake there's an equally worse GF match up looming and thats if the Swannies somehow scrape through. They'll get smashed from the 2nd quarter onwards I reckon.

Cant see either team getting within 8+ goals of the Hawks at this point. I cant watch another round of Hawks backslapping their way into the rooms yet again after running around the G with another cup. Such a bunch of chuckers/cheaters and arrogant pricks.

2014 roll on.

Mitch Duncan in the fourth quarter didn't help. Twice took marks in defensive 50 and turned it over from his kick out by bombing long and without purpose. Leigh Matthews summed it up - Geelong was playing like there was only 30 seconds left even when there was 3 minutes to go.

I disagree with you on your predictions of the GF. Fremantle is a worthy opponent, and will take it up to Hawthorn. Under real pressure, like last night, Hawthorn can buckle. Crowley is capable of nullifying Mitchell, without whom Hawthorn would have lost by 4 or so goals last night. Up forward, Pavlich is capable of tearing Lake/Stratton apart. Fremantle's midfield pressure will keep the contest tight, too.

[DeeSpencer 25,713]

The week off made all the difference for Hawthorn. They had all the running for the last 15 minutes. Geelong started bombing the ball because they had zero run.

Now the Hawks had earned the week off and the cats threw it away.

But we need to change the finals system I believe. It's crazy to have the most important final in the first week and then the 2nd and 3rd weeks the games are either way lopsided due to either talent of a week off.

Considering Freo rested all their players in round 23 it seems Geelong have fallen victim to 2 teams who played them coming off a week off. And all power to them.

[old dee 23,792]

The amazing part is even though they chose well with Franklin, Roughead and Hodge they had big busts with Thorp, Dowler and Ellis.

CB I could handle that sort of success rate.

50% champions and 50% failure.

Sure beats 10% average players and 90% failures.

Might have a little to do with the selectors do you think?

[old dee 23,792]

Hawthorn are blessed with their recruiting. They picked up Shaun Burgoyne at the end of 2009 when he was 26, going on 27 and his career was in a rut. He's now been an important member of his team for four years but last night, without his efforts, they would have been celebrating Mad Monday on the day after next.

Not sure we are much worse WJ

We took Gillies and Pedersen.

Oh yes i see.....

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

But we need to change the finals system I believe. It's crazy to have the most important final in the first week and then the 2nd and 3rd weeks the games are either way lopsided due to either talent of a week off.

The current finals system is fine, the old system was a disgrace, you just need to look at 1998 as an example of why it didn't work.

[Machsy 2,858]

The amazing part is even though they chose well with Franklin, Roughead and Hodge they had big busts with Thorp, Dowler and Ellis.

Beau Muston too.

They wasted Zac Dawson.

Ellis for pick 3 has been a fair bust.

Brent Renouf is fairly ordinary.

Jarryd Morton.

They let JPK go.

Jordan Lisle was poor, can't believe Lions took him off their hands.

Rhan Hooper was no good, lasted about 5 seconds.

They haven't all worked, but it's what they've done with the players that did work.

[titan_uranus 25,020]

The week off made all the difference for Hawthorn. They had all the running for the last 15 minutes. Geelong started bombing the ball because they had zero run.

Now the Hawks had earned the week off and the cats threw it away.

But we need to change the finals system I believe. It's crazy to have the most important final in the first week and then the 2nd and 3rd weeks the games are either way lopsided due to either talent of a week off.

Considering Freo rested all their players in round 23 it seems Geelong have fallen victim to 2 teams who played them coming off a week off. And all power to them.

Don't agree at all.

Geelong got the game at Simonds. How much more advantage did they need? They lost because Fremantle was (and is) better than them, not because Ross Lyon rested some players.

Then, they lost to Hawthorn because Hawthorn was (and is) better than them. Don't forget Hawthorn had more inside 50s, more clearances, more of the ball, and more scoring shots.

The current finals system rewards teams who finish top 4. You get the shot at the week off, which history shows is the key to getting into the GF. Also, preliminary finals aren't 'lopsided' - Hawthorn was down by 20 at three quarter time and only took the lead with 5 or so minutes remaining, and only won by 5 points, with Varcoe missing a shot in the last minute that would have forced the game into overtime. Last year Hawthorn beat Adelaide by 2 points. The year before, Collingwood beat Hawthorn by 3 points.

Make the top 4, get a shot at a week off and a preliminary. Propping up teams 4-8, or even 3 and 4 at the expense of 1 and 2, diminishes the home and away portion of the year.

[Nasher 33,616]

The current finals system is fine, the old system was a disgrace, you just need to look at 1998 as an example of why it didn't work.

Why is 1998 such a great example of why it didn't work? I didn't follow the machinations of the finals that closely back then, but looking it it now I can't see why it's such a disaster. Adelaide in their run to the flag beat Sydney (3rd after H&A), Western Bulldogs (2nd) and North Melbourne (1st). If they hadn't have rolled Sydney in the semi, then by Prelim stage, it'd be 1st vs 4th, 2nd vs 3rd just as it is in the existing system. Under the current system Adelaide (5th) would have played Essendon (8th), which you think they'd have won, so any "they got a second chance when finishing 5th" argument is largely moot IMO.

It looks a little bit quirky from the perspective that they progressed further than Melbourne even though they lost to Melbourne in the first round of the finals, but after that they beat three teams ranked higher than both themselves and Melbourne (including the team that beat Melbourne), so I think you'd be hard pressed to argue that the system didn't work on that occasion. Where it would have been really balls is if the bottom sides had all won, in which case the 3rd an 4th ranked sides would be eliminated and the 5th and 6th ranked sides go through to prelims.

The current system is better in that it eliminates weird results, but I don't think the old system was the abomination that people make it out to be. At least, not due to any of the results that actually occurred.

[Cards13 9,117]

Amazing amazing game!! Cats ran out of gas slowed it down and turned it over. Hawks had if kicked straight would have been over earlier.

Freo in a canter tonight... I'm going for 0-2 on that front

[dees64 104]

Bloody Haw another Flag coming up!

Freo will get smashed & Swans 2 many injuries

Sorry Hate Hawks due to damage done to me in 87 prelim & 88 GF

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

Why is 1998 such a great example of why it didn't work? I didn't follow the machinations of the finals that closely back then, but looking it it now I can't see why it's such a disaster. Adelaide in their run to the flag beat Sydney (3rd after H&A), Western Bulldogs (2nd) and North Melbourne (1st). If they hadn't have rolled Sydney in the semi, then by Prelim stage, it'd be 1st vs 4th, 2nd vs 3rd just as it is in the existing system. Under the current system Adelaide (5th) would have played Essendon (8th), which you think they'd have won, so any "they got a second chance when finishing 5th" argument is largely moot IMO.

It looks a little bit quirky from the perspective that they progressed further than Melbourne even though they lost to Melbourne in the first round of the finals, but after that they beat three teams ranked higher than both themselves and Melbourne (including the team that beat Melbourne), so I think you'd be hard pressed to argue that the system didn't work on that occasion. Where it would have been really balls is if the bottom sides had all won, in which case the 3rd an 4th ranked sides would be eliminated and the 5th and 6th ranked sides go through to prelims.

The current system is better in that it eliminates weird results, but I don't think the old system was the abomination that people make it out to be. At least, not due to any of the results that actually occurred.

The main issue is they finished fifth but got a second chance after being thrashed by Melbourne.

[45HG 1,539]

The main issue is they finished fifth but got a second chance after being thrashed by Melbourne.

I think people's consternation relates to us having beaten them but them getting an easier prelim final matchup. Not that that couldn't happen again, though.

I like that 5th or 6th no longer have a double chance - I can't see how it can be argued they deserve one. The argument could be made that the finals should just be a top 4 affair. That, of course, would never happen.