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I’m sorry Dazzle but you sound like Tom Morris here. Please don’t report things as fact and as if you are in the know here. at no stage has Clayton’s family become disillusioned with the club, both Steve and Michelle Oliver have said quite the contrary. There was no blindsiding at all, Clayton’s management teed up the meeting with Stanley. understand you have heard this third hand from some random guy in Shepparton which is not really near Echuca, but you are reporting this as if it’s fact. Your knowledge around draft and u18s is outstanding, but you’ve missed the mark here. Said it before but the personal connection I have with the family, your source couldn’t be more wrong. pert on the other hand I believe will be gone.

The problem with this theory is it discounts the actions of the main players, ie the club and it's players and their public statements. If there was nothing to the Petracca rumours, they could've been shut down in a split second with one public statement. If there was nothing to the Oliver rumours they could've been shut down in a split second with a public statement. The fact neither Petracca or Oliver spoke publicly until it was clear there was going to be no trade done and the story had been allowed to feed on itself for a week or more (especially so in Petracca's case) speaks volumes. I don't doubt what you're saying about the media and especially these types who feed off the rumours and off field drama. That doesn't necessarily make them wrong though. Another part I think youre discounting in this dialectic is the club supporter who won't hear a bad word about the club and passionately defends them to the hilt. This feeds into the cycle you've mentioned because it invites continued debate/discussion (for want of a better term) particularly on social media. So these mongers as you've coined them throw fresh meat into the water and watch the two opposing groups of supporters go at it. My position is I don't trust these new age media types and find them all pretty cretinous. I also don't discount everything they say just because they are the ones reporting on it. I consider their story and then look to see how the club/the other actors in whatever the story is react to it. If they let the story fester and refuse to publicly deny allegations, especially when they are as charged as a clubs best player who is signed to a long term deal wanting out of the club, then I conclude that yeah, there probably is something to the story. I love the club, I don't always love it's administrators. They are human and prone to faults or sometimes just not up to the job. That doesn't make them bad people it just means they are not the right people to lead the club (or maybe they were but have overstayed their welcome). When things stack up over a period of time then you have to ask questions and hope those who are in positions to actually hold them accountable do so. Supporters should demand success and part of that is not accepting management that has presided over poor governance, culture or whatever otherwise the club is doomed to fail. Edit - also I was never worried about Oliver leaving, I was about Petracca but quickly realised no club would satisfy a trade. These may come to fruition in 12 months they may not, but at the end of the day my concern was more with WHY they wanted out of the club rather than whether they would actually leave.

Those few days when the the Oliver thread was locked were the best of times

Fairly big risk, which I have heard from a few

Yet public statements by him and the club suggest he’s fine, we’re fine. Etc. Everyone’s within their rights to explore options without it meaning the sky is falling. Remember when Brayshaw was weighing up his future at contract time. The sky was falling then for a brief moment. Clubs, players, managers do play games with each other, clearly. Doesn’t necessarily add up to much. Dusty was nearly gone. Now he’s the greatest tiger ever. A lot of things happen within teams and groups of people who work together for long periods of time in high performance, stressful environments. You can spin it a million ways and read tea leaves and join dots and come up with theories forever. The truth is none of us know exactly what is what. Only those who seem to believe the media have complete theories that conveniently fit their prior narratives about us being a [censored] of an organisation. Meanwhile players keep signing on and extending. Players who are forced to leave for personal reasons seem genuinely upset that they have to move on from a club they love. It is possible that we have both some internal issues and are at the same time doing a lot right. Like every other club in the land. Recent history suggests we’ve done plenty right in my view. No other club can boast two top four finishes after winning a flag recently. despite that I still think we have some glaring holes/problems as well. I’d be looking at Sydney’s under performance in grand finals and collingwoods lack of follow up and their genuinely poor culture that keeps rearing its ugly head if I was the media. Not to mention Carlton’s constant underachieving given their amazing list and potential. What about west coasts constant mismanagement and weirdly poor performance recently. Maybe when looking at the league as a whole without taking cues from Bottom feeding scumbags we are just fine.

'21 MFC Premiership player '22 Casey Premiership player (the only player to do both) '22 AFLW Premiership assistant coach. All time fantastic human being. What an amazing contribution (still going) to our club. Proving good guys don't always finish last. What a privilege to call him a Dee. 🏆🏆🏆

Scoop’s in the stairwell making some new medicine Morris pounds the pavement, looking for acknowledgment Robbo in a trench coat, smokes out, laid off Breakfast show with Harf, not as good a pay-off Lookout tweets, it’s something you did God knows when but you’re losing all your friends You better duck to the US looking for the new Trac The man in a big branded cap in a big pig pen Wants 11 million followers, you only got 10. Oh Purple, Ralphy, Caroline and Cleary Gather round the ink well, quality is hard to tell Try hard, get barred, get volkaneo’d, get railed Get sacked, get mail, join Seven if you fail Lookout tweets, it’s something you did God knows when but you’re losing all your friends You better duck down the alleyway looking for an ambulance Don’t wanna look dumb, walk and chew gum Don’t follow leakers, or forget to feed the meter.

So proud that this guy spent time at our club. You could tell that his mind and desire was as sharp as ever but the body just wouldn't allow him to do what a needed to. This was really evident in the seasons following the flag where he would have ripping pre seasons and first few games but then tail off once the wear and tear kicked in. Wasn't through a lack of trying. Never forget 21.

Thank you. It’s late. My editor went to bed.

Wow ... that's a seriously long paragraph.

Good points, well made. But I think you have misinterpreted what I was saying. I wasn't making a case for the clarry situation all being a media creation, or that the mongers are the big bad wolf. As I have previously noted, I don't blame the mongers for their nonsense, I blame the collective us - they are simply giving us what we want. A demand and supply equation. I never suggested there wasn't some veracity to the monger's gossip, or their narrative was created out of whole cloth. And because i didn't mention the club or the players doesn't mean I don't think they have contributed to the palaver. They have. Like you, i don't discount what the mongers say. Their is clearly some stuff to sort out. But what that stuff is, where the truth lies, who is the problem etc etc isn't the point I was making. My point was about the Heisenberg observer effect's ("the act of observing a system will influence what is being observed") relevance for how dramas in footy is covered. Perhaps it is a stretch, but the analogy I'm making is the mongers 'observe' a scenario or situation, like clarry's, and influence what is being observed - ie create a narrative. Pull together theories, supposition and hearsay and bind them with some facts (eg clarry met with the cats). Footy fans 'observe' that narrative, but always want more (just look at how the tracc and clarry threads exploded and grew as evidence of that). And the mongers, keen for clicks are happy to give then more - even if it means less facts and more supposition and 'my sources say'. So the fans influence what is being observed. And that feedback loop keeps looping. For example "Pert unilaterally shopped clarry". True or false? Who knows. But a monger suggests it is true, fans accept it and amplify it all over the place. It soon becomes accepted as fact, when there is zero hard evidence it happened (which doesn't mean it didn't of course). Conjecture has matatisised into fact. Perception is reality. "Oliver hurt he was shopped and wants out" True or false? Who knows. But lets say its true - logic suggests all the white noise would have played a part in clarry wanting out. The observers have influenced what is being observed. And we end up with a story that feels much bigger than in reality it actually is. I mean the proof is in the pudding - the bloke is staying.

The cost of living crisis is biting us all it seems.

Hello Steve the Man Jordan, aka Jimmy Gadson, aka middle aged Demon. Weed delisted, and likely stranded on 76 AFL games (can't see another club picking him up, though stranger things have happened). Meanwhile, my boy Omac, keeps keeping on, and with a bit of luck with injury will play his 100th game of AFL footy next season.

He does a form guide based on ranking at the moment. He does a phantom draft based on his intel right before the draft and it's usually 90% accurate for the top 10-15 picks. He's the only journo worth listening to when it comes to the draft. All others are liars making up rubbish for clicks. Cal is actually interested, has connections, and doesn't want to be a Kornes style shock jockey.

Would’ve just kept Schache if we had any interest in a back-up back-up forward. Check out their career stats below (for full stats, see the link), basically the same player (height and weight(ish) included): https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_player_compare?playerStatus1=I&tid1=6&pid1=4171&fid1=C&playerStatus2=I&tid2=12&pid2=4164&fid2=C&type=T

The best and most consistent player i have ever seen including robbie (and Adrian Battison). He can talk like a gimp on magic mushies for all I care. As long as the the manic and devoted ADHD ielement s back I am cool.

I wouldn't be surprised at all if we selected Bo Allan for our number 9 pick over Lindsay. After watching Allan on the Preliminary Final and Grand Final in the WAFL. Allan would be very much in the mix ready to play Round AFL Round 1 2025. I did mention that I had a discussion with Tim Lamb when we played against GWS on that very cold Saturday night. During half time break, I was standing next to him watching swimming Finals (Olympics) and we were talking about draft prospects and the Championship Carnival. Tim did mention to me he was very impressed with Bo Allan and spoke very highly of him having excellent leadership qualities as well. I do like Lindsay's elite kicking skills and efficiency. I believe it is very much a 50/50 between Allan and Lindsay. I believe we will be selecting 2 midfielders ready to play in the very early rounds in 2025.

They should not be referred to as Collingwood, or the Pies. No term other than "the filth" is appropriate.

Losing Mitch White and Roan Steele a year after losing Jimmy Munro and George Grey, and even Jack Hutchins before that, makes a huge difference to the experience and composure provided by the VFL listed players. Who's going to even be captain next year? There are no ideal candidates that I can see. For reference, here's our Grand Final winning side:

A mate of mine is a life member of West Perth, so I follow them closely. They had a poor year this year, but generally are contenders for a flag. Their primary mids Aaron Black and Connor West have played AFL footy for the WCE, but they're slow and average users. I suspect that they want to regenerate their midfield, hence they targetted Roan Steele. In my view, the decline of Casey over the past couple of years has been due to the influx of ageing rejects from other clubs, and whether they are motivated to play at Casey. These players are sold a role in the AFL starting 23, but once they are dropped to Casey, they revert back to the players they were at their former club. Many Demonlanders seem to think that these players are fine because they were cheap acquisitions, but imho they are having a negative affect on the younger Dees players at Casey, and the Casey affiliated players. It was pathetic watching a Casey team with 8-10 AFL listed players who were over 27 getting towelled up. It's not surprising to see a mass exodus of Casey players. Hopefully the review of the Football Department includes the Casey affiliation.

Langford at 5 and Lindsay at 9

We really are spoilt for choice in regards to who the Demons could successfully snare at pick #5 in the 2024 AFL National Draft. Jagga Smith Murphy Reid Harvey Langford Sam Lalor Sid Draper Bo Allan Finn O'Sullivan Josh Smillie We can't really go wrong with any of those choices can we? That's 8 midfield young guns to choose from. Nevertheless, the discussions that Jason Taylor, Tim Lamb, Simon Goodwin and the rest of the Melbourne Demons recruiting team are having would be quite fascinating. You would go overall best talent before specific need this high up in the 2024 AFL National Draft. I recall Jason Taylor saying that they often do a few mock drafts themselves with an overall ranking system for players. So that would definitely be fascinating to observe. We as Melbourne members and supporters just need to sit back and relax, lick our lips and speculate who we think will be our choice for pick #5. But to be brutally honest most of us are pretty clueless and don't really have the expertise to know exactly what the Demons really need. It's certainly fun to guess though!

So did Liam Stocker and Matthew Bate 🫠 Having said that, don't mind Lindsay at 9 as a skilled rebounder if we take a gun midfielder who can win their own ball at 5 (Lalor, Langford, Draper, Smith, Smilie)

A post from Thomastown’s Facebook page - Deakyn is keen to get back to his best having committed to Casey Demons VFL and Thomastown for season 2025.

12 disposals. 0 percent efficiency

Yes we seem to be a club who backs ourselves. Things can always change once you get settled into an environment and the day to day training and with a new group. Just passing on what I have heard

Tauru is almost a bull.

What is it good for Saty? What is it good for..

But you asked proof all along and all I did was give you the info to follow up. This in this case is prime evidence from the horses mouth ( albeit a summary of the events from his perspective). That you obviously seem to ignore this information is mind blowing. Yes it’s different from parts of what happened but let’s be honest a friendly meeting of some players on a farm ( without the Club dynamo Mackie I believe) is about as social as Geelong could provide. At least they didn’t tour the first 30 kms of the Great Ocean Rd and show him a potential property!! Let’s all accept that Clarry is now in his most certain phase and has parked as experience his Geelong adventure for now. As a Club we need to move heaven and earth to ensure that our results are as good as possible ( Finals and deep into even a Flag) are attained. One year is not going to alter the money equation drastically. Important to note that Harry Petty was going to leave for Adelaide this time of the year and excited a Club extension after all. Let’s look at all the resignings this year. While our results and some mistakes both Board and football have been made we have succeeded in retaining only ANB hs left for genuine reasons. Grest credit for the list to stop And think about our 2022 to 2024 follow up and while injuries have played significantly other things like game plan, selection and mind set on not to lose rather than to win ( complete opposite of Lions philosophy) it is changeable thank goodness as is the players inner most thoughts towards 2025.

Haven't seen any proof Pert bypassed others without consent? Maybe he was asked to do it so others could maintain their relationship with clayton. Who really knows

I am still keen on Xavier Lindsay. He is an excellent kick and the Demons are crying out for players that are great kickers. Forward line "connection" is still a huge issue we need to desperately rectify!

I had a dream last night. We win the flag next year, with Tracc winning his second Norm Smith, after Clarry won the Brownlow, with Max breaking records with another AA and our pick 5 winning the Rising Star, after JVR wins his first Coleman. How quickly would all this media garbage last if my dream came true?

I reckon the kid is a gun and I rate highly. Apparently is a bit of a professional with the way he conducts himself with his training standards. I would like to see him get more of a go next year and maybe attempt to cement his spot with the ANB position.

Kynan's VFL stats from Casey vs Frankston earlier this season 27 Disposals 24 Tackles 1 Goal 175 Fantasy Points

While I understand they Pert has done what he did in conjunction with the FD List Cttee. It was a search to test the waters as remember last pre season Clarry was warned that he had to tick s few boxes. While I thought he had done a good job according to the FD advice publicly may be some cracks appeared. In the end it hopefully is alls well that ends well. Fitness is the key to Clarry in running and the clearing up of his hand leg and ribs for all the preseason. Regarding Perty I believe that he has some credits still and he is crucial to the success of the Caulfield Training base development till its completion. Let’s see what the Reviews bring up in the public domain before we throw too many babies out with the bath water.

does make one wonder if something re co13 happened around that time all i'm aware of is something on brownlow night, but i've heard little detail and even that was on socials. msm crickets.

Trying to unravel the mysteries of the salary cap will send you bonkers There are so many deals that are: back/front loaded Based on games played Dependent on finishes in awards tied to increases in the general salary cap etc Tracc and Oli I imagine would have signed deals that gave them an increase when the TPP increased (ie its percentage of TPP based) or some might even have clauses which say I have to be in the top 3 players at the club etc Good luck with the project

Yeah I don't participate in this anymore. I get that these forums are meant for the overly dramatic types but some of the infighting these days on here is getting to Carlton/Filth territory.

Sport at the highest level is all about bouncing back from adversity. Many a player has made a mistake which has cost a team a win. If that moment defined Sam's career, then he obviously wasn't cut out for high level sport. You can't blame the media for broadcasting a player's emotions.

Me too, he plays with rage and as if every game is his last. Hopefully a bit more size and it will be great to see what he can do.

That moment broke him. He wept in the change rooms, and the broadcaster chose to put cameras on him. Was a vile decision from them to add public humiliation on top of the personal misery of a young kid still trying to find his feet in the game. He never found the confidence to bounce back from that.

Sans sheriff

Didn't realize you were the Sheriff of Semantics

The difference between ‘depth’ and ‘list clogger’ is a successful season…

AFL players usually make up 10-14 members of the Casey team. Realistically around 10 Casey listed players are getting a weekly game. It must be soul destroying to play in a comp where you are performing well but can be replaced by a lesser performed AFL player simply because they are AFL listed. Similarly how do you train when over half of the team (the AFL listed members) never train with you. Overall it's just a weird dying competition

Clarrie may not be the most articulate Demon but the overall thrust of the article is positive and that is terrific news !!!!

Tom Morris’ article tomorrow - Oliver out to Pasture? ‘Clayton is so desperate to leave Melbourne he’s contemplating becoming a race horse, according to 2 sources who spoke on the condition of anonymity (well one of the sources more gestured with its front hoof, but we all know what that means).’