Post Match Discussion - Round 3

[DeeSpencer 26,301]

The 2 big boys in Oscar and Frost have their limitations and Lever has made plenty of mistakes but it's the midfield pressure that still worries me the most.

Oscar is not quick and especially a bit heavy footed when he has to make a few repeat efforts but he plays a huge time on ground so that will happen. He's still young enough to get stronger and a little fitter and that combination will mean less fatigue.

Frost is going to make anywhere between 1 and 10 dumb mistakes a game but his effort is great and his pace fixes some of them up.

Lever's kicking should be good not great. That's ok. His handballing should be very good and he can use his left and dance through defenders as well. His narrow base with his feet leaves him off balance one on one or over the ball and that's something I hope coaches have picked up on but didn't seem to have done in preseason. What he does have is really nice ability to close on the ball by reading the play and that should pick up.

All of the positives and negatives of the talls can be exposed when the players up the field aren't slowing the opposition down and hemming them in to the boundary and slow long kicks. Viney is the big loss in midfield pressure. Oliver, Petracca and Salem are only young to the midfield and building tanks and those first 2 really hunt the ball. Salem is important because he can sit off and be attacking or defending. Jones will probably always be a ball player first, hard to change that and for that reason I hope he goes to half forward or an attacking half back rather than the wing but we aren't there in the midfield yet.

My biggest concern is the wings where Lewis just doesn't have the pace any more or truly elite endurance to stick with outside runners. Neither does Tyson. The extra ball winners on the wing gives us an edge around the contest but it costs us in transition. Personally I think we can use Oliver, Petracca, Jones and Salem now and hopefully Viney to win more than our share of inside ball and get some great outside runners to take advantage of that inside wins by spreading hard in attack and defending. But right now the list isn't quite balanced and the midfield seems easy to expose. Billy Hartung running free led to North's clean inside 50's and goals in the first quarter on the weekend. If we don't find a match up for Isaac Smith and similar level players in the comp then we'll get chopped up in the midfield and the backline will get exposed.

[Clayton van Oliver 1,826]

4 hours ago, Skuit said:

He called him 'a specimen of a man'. And you could almost hear his blood pressure drop wondering if the butchered phrase would see him back in hot water.

As to @Dr. Gonzo's question re. the 'Melbourne club'  - I think Eddie is just a canny marketeer and is emphasizing the blue-blooded angle. I recall he even dropped in a few rib-ticklers of the nature.

Oh god weren't they hilarious: "that's the sound of their jewellery clanking". Go [censored] yourself Eddie.

You heard him tremor at the possible PC furore when he said of Majak "plays like tarzan looks like Jane". Had to cover his arse pretty quick. 

In short. [censored] Eddie McGuire.

[Deemented Are Go! 3,704]

9 minutes ago, AmDamDemon said:

Oh god weren't they hilarious: "that's the sound of their jewellery clanking". Go [censored] yourself Eddie.

You heard him tremor at the possible PC furore when he said of Majak "plays like tarzan looks like Jane". Had to cover his arse pretty quick. 

In short. [censored] Eddie McGuire.

Hey! You’re stealing my material, pal! 

(See post 2 hours ago) 

[Demon trucker 1,800]

On 07/04/2018 at 8:01 PM, ProDee said:

Were you at the game, or watching on TV ?

Does not matter he played a good game yes he drooped 1or 2 marks, yes he  sprayed one kick at goal, but the siren put him off on that kick, when a player plays poor then I will call for anyone to get dropped, but he played well so lay off him your comment is based on you hate him, there is no other  explanation for  you calling him to be dropped.

[D4Life 2,579]

Yes, I’m looking forward to the positive three thread. Demons are improving each week. We are not perfect but the signs are positive.

Bugg kicks 4 and applies pressure, he deserves to be praised.

I don’t like Wagner, but admit he played well, so good on him.

At four goals down playing against 25, it looked bad, Demons steadied the ship to go in 13/14 points down, that was positive.

All teams have their issues, without Viney and TMac we’re going along pretty well.

[Demon trucker 1,800]

8 hours ago, Deemented Are Go! said:

Eddie also went on with a ‘tarzan’ comparison- I think the phrase ‘if you look like Tarzan don’t play like Jane’.

i could imagine the mouse turning the wheel in his little brain : Majak....jungle....Tarzan.....

Like you said, I reckon he panicked and made a disclaimer along the lines of ‘well in the AFLW they sure don’t play like Janes’...

oops, be careful again, Eddie! 

His subconscious managed to merge racism and sexism into one thought pattern before the mouse pulled the handbrake: ‘put down the shovel Eddie’! 

 

And yes yes he made a few MFC jibes  including when Dees fans were cheering for whatever, he said ‘listen to the Melbourne fans, and that just their jewellery rattling!’. 

 

 

Wait, Eddie, wait...I’m not done holding my sides. 

Ya JACKASS 

Give the man a break, it is over the top analysing every single word somebody says, Eddie said Jane these days plays harder than  Tarzan, is what he said nothing racists or sexist in what he said

[Demon trucker 1,800]

Our defence is not that bad over 4 qtrs, I heard  commentators refer to Hawthorn having the best defence in the league and guess what we've got less points scored against  then them.

The win against lions should be rated a bit higher then it is, they were 3 meters short of beating port in boganville 

[Delusional demon 82 1,197]

Apparently we can be both “soft” and “the real deal” according to Danny Frawley... just when it suits him to change his narrative. 

Too many wannabe journos looking for click bait headlines 

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2018/04/08/melbourne-the-real-deal-says-frawley/

[Clayton van Oliver 1,826]

8 hours ago, Deemented Are Go! said:

Hey! You’re stealing my material, pal! 

(See post 2 hours ago) 

Yea [censored] I saw it just after but thought I'd get away with it. Great minds, fella. Great minds.

[Clayton van Oliver 1,826]

11 hours ago, picket fence said:

IMV We will not win a final with Oscar and Lever in the team. In all honesty I reckon Lever is not at all suited to our defensive structures and so IMV I reckon he will struggle. Happy to be proven wrong but I have serious doubts.

What's great is that you will likely be happy. Good for you, pickett

[david_neitz_is_my_dad 4,084]

11 minutes ago, Delusional demon 82 said:

Apparently we can be both “soft” and “the real deal” according to Danny Frawley... just when it suits him to change his narrative. 

Too many wannabe journos looking for click bait headlines 

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2018/04/08/melbourne-the-real-deal-says-frawley/

The problem with most of this rubbish is it was said on radio were it goes in one ear and out the other. Most likely just dribble to fill time. Then for what ever reason the broadcaster makes a small piece on it and it gets posted here. Nothing in it or any 'articles' from a radio station.

[brendan 3,445]

28 minutes ago, Delusional demon 82 said:

Apparently we can be both “soft” and “the real deal” according to Danny Frawley... just when it suits him to change his narrative. 

Too many wannabe journos looking for click bait headlines 

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2018/04/08/melbourne-the-real-deal-says-frawley/

Yep same as Carey said we couldn’t win round 1 after we cancelled the camp, yet tipped us round 2 with no mention of the camp, if your going to make outlandish statements like that at least have the balls to follow it through, the AFL Media has been a joke for a long time 

[Mazer Rackham 14,971]

10 hours ago, Deemented Are Go! said:

And yes yes he made a few MFC jibes  including when Dees fans were cheering for whatever, he said ‘listen to the Melbourne fans, and that just their jewellery rattling!’.

 

8 hours ago, AmDamDemon said:

Oh god weren't they hilarious: "that's the sound of their jewellery clanking". Go [censored] yourself Eddie.

 

Oh, Eddie's just establishing his working man credentials.

You know he was born in Broadie? And he ever remains, a Toorak resident Broadie boy.

He's just quoting John Lennon, another hero of the working masses and enemy of Big Everything. Just like Eddie with his Lexus Centre. Ok, maybe not that. How about his Westpac Centre? Wait, scratch that. His Holden Centre? Holden, car of the working masses. That's it!

I've heard whispers from C'wood supporters that supporter functions are increasingly for the "Legends" and other high paying members, and the run of the mill supporter feels forgotten about.

Ha ha! Jewellery rattling! Good one. Some leisure time reading material about this hero of the downtrodden: Eddie McGuire’s latest $12 million Toorak purchase    Eddie McGuire has a net worth of $55 million      Eddie McGuire has scored a $10 million cliff-top base in Portsea

So Eddie, Broadie Boy, we'll rattle our jewellery. If we all band together, maybe the noise will drown out that of your jewellery.

[Mazer Rackham 14,971]

35 minutes ago, Delusional demon 82 said:

Apparently we can be both “soft” and “the real deal” according to Danny Frawley... just when it suits him to change his narrative. 

Too many wannabe journos looking for click bait headlines 

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2018/04/08/melbourne-the-real-deal-says-frawley/

Dummy Frawley's never seen an opinion too good to adopt for himself. The guy's a windsock.

[Demons11 7,097]

23 hours ago, juzzk1d said:

I said to my friends at half time at the game that Oliver needs to be played and isolated at full forward as he was getting held well by Jacobs. 

Why did it take Goodwin up until 3 minuets left in the last quarter when the game was iced to tactically make this move? As soon as he did as well, he kicked two goals. Baffles me how Goody didn’t proactively do this earlier. 

Maybe he wanted to see Oliver work through it.  You don’t take the easy way out all the time. 

[Cards13 9,117]

12 hours ago, picket fence said:

IMV We will not win a final with Oscar and Lever in the team. In all honesty I reckon Lever is not at all suited to our defensive structures and so IMV I reckon he will struggle. Happy to be proven wrong but I have serious doubts.

Well we won’t win a final under Goody then, he and this coaching team have nailed there flag to the Oscar/Lever led back line. I disagree and think they will be key to us playing deep into finals, Frost is the linchpin to it all.

If frosty can maintain that rage every game he will be our best defender. He has pace other lack, he can really break a zone when he takes off and can defend both talls and smalls.

One thing I did notice in our defensive 50, if we had a free or mark, is we went down the line often on the weekend. Most teams are trying to go around the zone out the back but our defenders rarely made the “effort” to run back into space in the def 50. They stayed high or fwd of where the player with the ball was who then went down the line with a long kick. 

Tommy Mc and Viney are keys for a) our structure and b) midfield/resting ruck options, they will put us in a very strong position going into the back half of the season.

It feels like we are going ok but 20%-30% of really clicking and being a very dangerous side to play against. We do some things very well and have plenty i50s but lapses that lead to goals that we need to improve on. It’s early doors in the season and a number of players (Frost/Kent etc) have not played senior footy in some time so plenty of upside. 

Edited April 8, 2018 by Cards13

[Guest]

While he got the last laugh on us last year, one of my happiest memories as a Demon supporter was that it was US who shut down his idiotic 'Press Red for Ed' broadcast.

The sight of him sulking it up, muttering something about Mount Buller and storming out of the commentary box almost made the five other times he hijacked the commentary box worth it.

I would have found it funnier of we found 3 of the worst Melbourne supporting stereotypes you could find to run a competing broadcast next door. 

[Cards13 9,117]

9 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

The 2 big boys in Oscar and Frost have their limitations and Lever has made plenty of mistakes but it's the midfield pressure that still worries me the most.

Oscar is not quick and especially a bit heavy footed when he has to make a few repeat efforts but he plays a huge time on ground so that will happen. He's still young enough to get stronger and a little fitter and that combination will mean less fatigue.

Frost is going to make anywhere between 1 and 10 dumb mistakes a game but his effort is great and his pace fixes some of them up.

Lever's kicking should be good not great. That's ok. His handballing should be very good and he can use his left and dance through defenders as well. His narrow base with his feet leaves him off balance one on one or over the ball and that's something I hope coaches have picked up on but didn't seem to have done in preseason. What he does have is really nice ability to close on the ball by reading the play and that should pick up.

All of the positives and negatives of the talls can be exposed when the players up the field aren't slowing the opposition down and hemming them in to the boundary and slow long kicks. Viney is the big loss in midfield pressure. Oliver, Petracca and Salem are only young to the midfield and building tanks and those first 2 really hunt the ball. Salem is important because he can sit off and be attacking or defending. Jones will probably always be a ball player first, hard to change that and for that reason I hope he goes to half forward or an attacking half back rather than the wing but we aren't there in the midfield yet.

My biggest concern is the wings where Lewis just doesn't have the pace any more or truly elite endurance to stick with outside runners. Neither does Tyson. The extra ball winners on the wing gives us an edge around the contest but it costs us in transition. Personally I think we can use Oliver, Petracca, Jones and Salem now and hopefully Viney to win more than our share of inside ball and get some great outside runners to take advantage of that inside wins by spreading hard in attack and defending. But right now the list isn't quite balanced and the midfield seems easy to expose. Billy Hartung running free led to North's clean inside 50's and goals in the first quarter on the weekend. If we don't find a match up for Isaac Smith and similar level players in the comp then we'll get chopped up in the midfield and the backline will get exposed.

Watching live and again in replay you can see on occasion players jogging when chasing rather than a hard chase allowing the likes of Hartung to just waltz through the centre of the ground. Salem and Clarrie stood out a couple of times but they both are still building. 

Side note is Cunnington one of the most underrated players in the comp? He just always seems to bob up with the ball and delivers it well most times. 

[buck_nekkid 6,068]

After watching the replay for a different perspective from what I got at the ground, there is a lot to like - but still a lot to do - for us to be contenders.  We lack outside speed, although Frosty had a few turbocharged blasts, but nothing like BillyHartung was able to achieve.

Petracca is gold.  Hogan is an absolute beast.  Max just went and went all day - what a warrior.

We absolutely butchered the inside 50 play all day.  We can do this against the Roos, but we cannot do it against the Hawks, and less so against the Tiggers, who will run it out and down the other end for a score.  We really need at least one stay at home tall, TMAC or Weids, and the half forwards working off them.  We could easily have TMAC, Weids and Hogan in the one team - Hogan got his possessions everywhere, so could be a roaring HF, TMAC and Weids owning the 50.  As long as they can also add defensive pressure.

The backline will settle.  I see our biggest problem on Saturday was allowing Sideshow stager to be one-out.  Oscar did well in most contests, but isolated it is difficult for him to win with the UMPs and the way they called (or didn’t call) stuff.  Lever was involved, and will continue to improve.  We play a very different defense to Adelaide (our press is so much higher) that the intercept game against a fast break is almost impossible.

If we go 3 from the next 4, we will be a serious contender.  2-2 and we are mid table.  Anything less should not be mentioned when there are sharp objects nearby.

[Deestar9 1,773]

On 08/04/2018 at 7:48 AM, ProDee said:

I've been pretty positive this year, however, I left the game a little disappointed.  It was a bit of a reality check for me.  We need to get a lot better if we're going to be a serious challenger in 2018.  We have far too many ordinary players.

Our skill level still isn't great and teams still get out the back far too easily, which means our defensive structures still need plenty of work.

The only saving grace is that there are no real standout teams.  All teams have issues and ordinary players.  But we're a fair way off being a really organised unit.  There are way too many holes and our ball movement needs a lot of work.   

That said, I think Viney will make a big difference around the ball when he gets back in.  We miss him around the stoppages.

I know I'm being a little negative and I expect we'll continue to get better and more familiar with the tweaks in the game-plan.  I'm just not sure we've got the personnel to do much this year.  I certainly don't see a top 4 side.

After Round 3 I couldn’t say with any certainty that any current side will be top 4 .  So much angst after our win against Brisbane yet they nearly knocked off Port on Port’s  deck without their Captain....Richmond got towelled up by an undermanned Adelaide ....many fancied teams are winless & other maligned teams are doing better.  What it says to me that it is only Round 3 & pretty much most teams will improve & some won’t.  We have incredible depth ...lots of new players & at the moment it is all about getting used to each other.....different running patterns etc .....with continued game time players confidence & abilities improve & there will be very exciting times ahead.  We won’t get it right all the time but we will get it right more often than not.  With so many young players with so much improvement and growing to come ....I fail to see how you can state already that we won’t be top 4.   Until it is a mathematical impossibility.....the sky is the limit for me. 

[Demon_JB 1,389]

44 minutes ago, Demons11 said:

Maybe he wanted to see Oliver work through it.  You don’t take the easy way out all the time. 

Assistant coach: “I think we should stick Oliver at Full Forward and isolate him. See if he can snag any goals and put us up by more”

Goodwin: “LOL, nah that’d be too easy for us. Let’s see if he can get over the tag physically and mentally even though the game is well and truly on the line”

Yeah, makes sense.  

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

1 hour ago, Delusional demon 82 said:

Apparently we can be both “soft” and “the real deal” according to Danny Frawley... just when it suits him to change his narrative. 

Too many wannabe journos looking for click bait headlines 

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2018/04/08/melbourne-the-real-deal-says-frawley/

Danny Frawley is physically painful to listen to.

[Lucifers Hero 40,524]

2 hours ago, Delusional demon 82 said:

Apparently we can be both “soft” and “the real deal” according to Danny Frawley... just when it suits him to change his narrative. 

Too many wannabe journos looking for click bait headlines 

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2018/04/08/melbourne-the-real-deal-says-frawley/

What I took from that article was more about Clarrie:

“I think the most impressive thing from yesterday was the way Clayton Oliver got through the heavy tag from Ben Jacobs yesterday,” Adam Cooney said.

“It was really smart the way he went about it, he wasn’t his usual prolific self in the midfield, but he just kept trying and working and when you’re a young player it’s hard mentally to deal with a tag and he just showed great maturity.

“That’s what Aaron Hall didn’t do at the Gold Coast yesterday, he raised the white flag as soon as Bailey Banfield went to him.”

Clarrie never takes a backward step!  Can't see him ever raising a white flag to a tagger. 

 

1 hour ago, juzzk1d said:

Assistant coach: “I think we should stick Oliver at Full Forward and isolate him. See if he can snag any goals and put us up by more”

Goodwin: “LOL, nah that’d be too easy for us. Let’s see if he can get over the tag physically and mentally even though the game is well and truly on the line”

Yeah, makes sense.  

Going on Adam Cooney's comment quoted above he dealt with the tag just fine!

Hopefully, he will soon get the same reward Adam Cooney did.  We could do with another Brownlow medalist

Edited April 9, 2018 by Lucifer's Hero
Changed 'Clooney' to 'Cooney'

[Mazer Rackham 14,971]

8 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Hopefully, he will soon get the same reward Adam Clooney did. 

Playing for Essendon????

 

9 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

 We could do with another Brownlow medalist

Oh thank god. my heart stopped.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

13 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Hopefully, he will soon get the same reward Adam Clooney did.

George's brother?