It's now totally conclusive

[goodwindees 2,379]

That Melbourne has wasted years and years with Spencer.

Have never understood how Spencer has been on an AFL list for more than 1 season, 2 at the most and his non selection proves he must be moved on at seasons end.

Selectors won't even choose him over a 193 cm key position journeyman!!

The Spencer experiment must surely be nearly over. 

[rjay 24,608]

Not really, he's one week back from injury and his form was scratchy at best last week.

He hasn't deserved a call up, if he has a good game this week then he will be looked at for next week.

Just because he plays ruck it doesn't make him an automatic call up when Max is out...

Having said that, we definitely need to strengthen our ruck stocks next year, whether with Spencer or not.

[SFebes 4,860]

I'd say it's more horses for courses, we don't want to go in too tall against a nippy dogs outfit, especially with Cloke out now also.

[martin 727]

Spencer is arguably the worst ruckman in the league.

[Pates 9,625]

44 minutes ago, martin said:

Spencer is arguably the worst ruckman in the league.

Actually I'd say there are far worse ruckmen getting regular games at other clubs, but Spencer has had bad luck over the years.

This year at VFL level (and in the pre-season) he was actually showing a bit, Gawn went down and Spencer does his shoulder after one and a half games. He has had one game at VFL level returning from injury and was scratchy, we are playing a club that doesn't have a big man ruck so his is the perfect time to play Pederson as he has battled very well in the absence of Spencer and Gawn.

I also believe that back when Jamar was with us and he got injured Spencer also copped an injury the same week. Sometimes it's about taking your opportunity, and sometimes it's about the the gods giving you the luck to be able to to take your opportunity.

He's a back up ruckman, he plays at VFL level. That's his lot in life.

[Chris 2,892]

If we were playing a team with a good tall ruck I think it would be a different story. 

[Wiseblood 24,637]

I think it's simply down to one thing - we have played good footy without a recognised ruckman, and unless we have a very talented player returning (Gawn) then I don't think the FD see any reason to change it. 

I've said in other threads that Spencer doesn't necessarily improve us as a side, and although it may straighten us up a little I don't think it improves our chances of winning.  The players are used to not have one at the minute and with the Doggies only going in with a part time ruckman as well (Roughead) there is no real need to play someone like Spencer.

[leave it to deever 17,456]

MFC's experiment with no ruck (or necessity) has been much discussed by commentators. Our midfield has done well to negate tap outs and not get smashed in clearances.Spencer is not the worst ruck but hes not great in other areas.

I wouldn't go as far to call him a list clogger but his tenure will no doubt be actively and justly challenged at the end of the year or contract. The guy has never had a clear run at AFL level being second fiddle to one of the best.

[TeamPlayedFine39 8,379]

I think if we'd delisted him at the end of the season he'd be picked up by someone else pretty swiftly.  Has looked good when fit this year.

[Satyriconhome 10,339]

1 hour ago, goodwindees said:

That Melbourne has wasted years and years with Spencer.

Have never understood how Spencer has been on an AFL list for more than 1 season, 2 at the most and his non selection proves he must be moved on at seasons end.

Selectors won't even choose him over a 193 cm key position journeyman!!

The Spencer experiment must surely be nearly over. 

He is on a list coz the FD keep offering him a contract and he signs it

[Nasher 33,607]

I find it hard to believe that we're not better off with Spencer as the chief ruck instead of TMac and TMac as key defender instead of OMac, although I'm less convinced of the latter than I was last week. I think that stands even if WB don't have a ruck either.

Struggling with this one, I've got to say. I don't buy that it's because they don't rate him - this setup would have been unfathomable prior to Spencer getting injured. Must be concerns over his form, it's the only answer that makes sense to me.

It might be that we see the ruck as being redundant now and won't bother with one unless he's a star (Gawn). Sucks to be Spencer if that's the case, but again I have doubts.

I acknowledge that I don't know squat and I trust team Goodwin's judgement. 

[leave it to deever 17,456]

1 minute ago, TeamPlayedFine39 said:

I think if we'd delisted him at the end of the season he'd be picked up by someone else pretty swiftly.  Has looked good when fit this year.

Just like poor L. Dunn who couldnt get a game last year for us. Im not sure Pedo would have had a look in without our injury problems. He was on the outer for a while.

[Wiseblood 24,637]

10 minutes ago, TeamPlayedFine39 said:

I think if we'd delisted him at the end of the season he'd be picked up by someone else pretty swiftly.  Has looked good when fit this year.

Did he?  I'm not so sure about that.  He was serviceable against the Dockers but Pedersen has given us more, outside of hitouts, than Spencer has and we've been fine.

If we were playing against someone like Goldstein then I could see the merit in selecting him, but the Dogs don't really have a ruckman either so I see why they didn't select him.

[chook fowler 19,251]

Spence just doesn't do enough around the ground. That doesn't cut it in modern day footy.

[Go the Biff 3,360]

23 minutes ago, Nasher said:

I find it hard to believe that we're not better off with Spencer ..........................

It might be that we see the ruck as being redundant now and won't bother with one unless he's a star (Gawn). Sucks to be Spencer if that's the case, but again I have doubts.

I acknowledge that I don't know squat and I trust team Goodwin's judgement............ 

I hold some similar thoughts to yours.

Thought Spencer looked really, really rusty last week.

I also believe that nonetheless, against any other opposition he'd have been playing. 'Dogs are nearly as light on as we are for ruck strength. Roughead plays more like a Pedersen role than a dominant ruck role despite his height, Good player but rarely dominates. T Boyd has played 2 decent games in his career. I suspect as others do that Goodwin is taking the run & gun approach to this game.

I expect Spencer to play in Perth next week, whether Gawn is fit to resume or not. I also expect him to get a contract with us next year, much to the chagrin of the OP who I suspect is clueless - but that's inconclusive. Totally

[stevethemanjordan 6,952]

Meh.

[deeko 952]

2 hours ago, Chris said:

If we were playing a team with a good tall ruck I think it would be a different story. 

Agree 100% with this. 

If we were up against a Mummy, Jacobs, Goldstein or Sandy I'm sure he'd be in there to compete.

Im still a bit surprised he's not in, thought having Pedo up forward would assist Trac and Watts and allow T Mac to go back.

[Adzman 2,153]

We would have won the north game he he had played.  I'm not saying Spencer is a world beater, but if he didn't get hurt he might have helped us win another 2 games this season.

He was always a backup to cover Gawn,  and the fact Spencer hasn't been fit is just bad luck.

 

[Cards13 9,117]

Jeesus give him a chance once fit, if he can get a game. He's 1 week back after 2 injuries at once and sits behind one of the best ruckman in the comp.

The FD obviously want fully fit players rather than "someone tall", happy to stick with that choice. 

Horses for courses has been rolled out few times this week. Malarkey, the team the FD believes will give us best chance to win is selected each week.

[dpositive 1,649]

5 hours ago, Pates said:

Actually I'd say there are far worse ruckmen getting regular games at other clubs, but Spencer has had bad luck over the years.

This year at VFL level (and in the pre-season) he was actually showing a bit, Gawn went down and Spencer does his shoulder after one and a half games. He has had one game at VFL level returning from injury and was scratchy, we are playing a club that doesn't have a big man ruck so his is the perfect time to play Pederson as he has battled very well in the absence of Spencer and Gawn.

I also believe that back when Jamar was with us and he got injured Spencer also copped an injury the same week. Sometimes it's about taking your opportunity, and sometimes it's about the the gods giving you the luck to be able to to take your opportunity.

He's a back up ruckman, he plays at VFL level. That's his lot in life.

Usually agree with you Pates and do again but with a difference

"He's a back up ruckman" Yup and that's what we want.

Hisalmost gawcky unorthodoxy can unsettle opponents and if he can play without injuring himself could be valuable just for ring a big lump that the doggies have to get around.

Pedersen can play the big bodied role at CHF and do the rucking forward allowing Spencer to drop back and play the big defensive wall presence.

Weeds still a bit young and green but may be worth playing the smaller body against the dogs where he can use his mobility to keep them unbalanced.

Watts can rest his injuries a little by being interchange only if we need some match winning moments.

Bugg gets the ball and is mobile but hope he takes some goal kicking lessons from Watts 

[Skuit 9,965]

6 hours ago, Nasher said:

I find it hard to believe that we're not better off with Spencer as the chief ruck instead of TMac and TMac as key defender instead of OMac, although I'm less convinced of the latter than I was last week. I think that stands even if WB don't have a ruck either.

Struggling with this one, I've got to say. I don't buy that it's because they don't rate him - this setup would have been unfathomable prior to Spencer getting injured. Must be concerns over his form, it's the only answer that makes sense to me.

 

I'm working on the theory that the football dept. are working on the theory that it's better to either win or lose all the taps than set-up for a random distribution in the middle. Either enjoy the silver-service or concentrate on the sharking.

Though I also believe that the lack of a ruckman is putting an extra top-down strain on the team across the board and is a flawed approach for season-long sustainability.

[deelete my account 1,194]

8 hours ago, Pates said:

He's a back up ruckman, he plays at VFL level. That's his lot in life.

 

2 hours ago, dpositive said:

"He's a back up ruckman" Yup and that's what we want.

Except he wasn't a backup ruckmen for more than 2 games when needed to be called upon for 10. Why would we assume Spencer wont get injured again if Gawn was injured next year? He's not the most reliable back up. I said this earlier after the richmond game but Spencer was reckless in getting injured. Did not need to be diving with his shoulder into the oncoming Richmond player.  We didnt need TWO ruckmen acting like midfielders. Gawn said himself that he shouldnt have overextended himself to tackle Selwood. Why on earth would a backup ruck follow suit and copy Gawns style of injury (diving into contact) ? Unreliable backup imo. 

The q is would we be better off bringing in another ruckmen or ruck /fwd as BACKUP and delisting him rather than delisting Spencer and not making anymore list additions. I think we would be better off with a different backup.

Edited June 16, 2017 by DominatrixTyson

[bandicoot 1,395]

12 hours ago, martin said:

Spencer is arguably the worst ruckman in the league.

He is the best back up ruckman in the league

[Dees2014 2,377]

10 hours ago, Wiseblood said:

I think it's simply down to one thing - we have played good footy without a recognised ruckman, and unless we have a very talented player returning (Gawn) then I don't think the FD see any reason to change it. 

I've said in other threads that Spencer doesn't necessarily improve us as a side, and although it may straighten us up a little I don't think it improves our chances of winning.  The players are used to not have one at the minute and with the Doggies only going in with a part time ruckman as well (Roughead) there is no real need to play someone like Spencer.

Yes, in this case ((Bulldogs at Etihad) they are not only fast as a team, it will be played on a dry fast deck. All the more reason to select accordingly. If we were playing NM, Carlton or Fremantle at the G, I have no doubt it would be different.

[Dees2014 2,377]

10 hours ago, Nasher said:

I find it hard to believe that we're not better off with Spencer as the chief ruck instead of TMac and TMac as key defender instead of OMac, although I'm less convinced of the latter than I was last week. I think that stands even if WB don't have a ruck either.

Struggling with this one, I've got to say. I don't buy that it's because they don't rate him - this setup would have been unfathomable prior to Spencer getting injured. Must be concerns over his form, it's the only answer that makes sense to me.

It might be that we see the ruck as being redundant now and won't bother with one unless he's a star (Gawn). Sucks to be Spencer if that's the case, but again I have doubts.

I acknowledge that I don't know squat and I trust team Goodwin's judgement. 

So do I. There might well be a quite simple explanation why he is not playing ie he simply is not yet fit enough to play out 4 quarters at the senior level (as well as my post above about the conditions on Sunday). 

I don't go along with the posters on here who say he is not up to AFL standard. He actually has played some very good games for us in the past (eg Geelong at Geelong two years ago). 

If Max is not ready next week,  I would be very surprise if he were not selected.