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This thread needs some more love! May again showed on the weekend how important he is to our structure and his long term replacement is very important for any sustained success. Jed is coming along nicely and offers a bigger body than Turner in a post-May world. Good luck! (No pressure)

This week Melbourne takes on Hawthorn hot on the heels of a six-day break after its encouraging response to a disappointing season opener in steamy Sydney. The Hawks were disappointingly wasteful last week, but they also failed to bring sufficient pressure into the contest and, as a consequence, the Bombers scored goals at will. Against the Demons, a repeat would be fatal. The Hawks are still in the rebuilding phase and need everything to go right against Melbourne which is gradually building up to overcome some of the deficiencies felt by its fall from grace in departing last year’s finals series in straight sets. Hawthorn is no pushover. Despite being in development mode, the Hawks managed to upset both 2023 grand finalists, Collingwood and the Brisbane Lions during the home and away season. Against the former, they completely took apart the Magpies’ system including shutting down a rampant Nick Daicos until he was injured. The problem was that which many young, inexperienced teams face - a lack of consistency. But more about the Hawks later. One of the consequences of the Demons’ tumultuous offseason has been the debate about its standing in the competition. While some observers were willing to write the club off even before a single ball was bounced, others believed the intrinsic strength of the list, coaches and support staff ensures its status as a premiership contender. I read a piece this week that was critical of the Demons for their lack of key forwards, an explanation for its poor “forward connection”, and for its aging list with most of its elite players being in the mid 20s and over. I’m not impressed by these lines of criticism because neither can be validated statistically. Melbourne’s forward woes in the latter part of last season were more in terms of conversion and the absence of key forwards through injury. As for aging, there are several other clubs with far worse age demographics (Geelong and Collingwood for example) and Sunday’s outing showed the club’s mix of players to be in solid shape. I tend to look at the playing group in terms of its binary nature with many of the club’s qualities coming in twos:- Leadership - ruckman Max Gawn, the best ruckman in the country, and the toughest midfielder in the game, Jack Viney leading by example. Midfielders - Christian Petracca and Clayton Oliver, the best midfield duo going around and still young enough to be in that mix for half a decade. Defenders - How can anyone go past key defenders Jake Lever and Steven May? Mature age recruits - Jack Billings and Marty Hore are great mature age pick ups, adding to the club’s needs in attack and defence respectively. Emerging talents - Trent Rivers and Tom Sparrow are premiership players. Each is primed for a break out season. Debutants - Blake Howes and Caleb Windsor made their respective AFL debuts less than a fortnight ago and are already making an impact. Comeback kids - how about Ben Brown (key forward) and Tom McDonald (key back), both of who were virtually written off over the summer? The odd couple - Alex Neal-Bullen, a relentless running machine in the forward line and Jake Bowey who doesn’t cover as much ground but has great disposal skill. Second year talent - Judd McVee and Jacob van Rooyen. Both were kept on the back burner in the VFL in their first seasons, both were outstanding debutants last year and both are kicking on in 2024. Small forwards - the attack looked so much more potent with Kozzy Pickett in the team and Kade Chandler back in form and kicking goals. There’s more of that in the club’s armoury but let’s return to Saturday afternoon and Hawthorn who face up to Melbourne and a game plan that works in modern football. A team that dominates defensively and through the middle and is now primed to play more directly when going forward. I believe the six day break should not worry the Demons as it will be offset by the benefit of the extra game in their legs at this stage of the season. Hawthorn has a long injury list including Will Day, Denver Grainger-Barras, Changkuoth Jiath and Chad Wingard and are lucky to have James Sicily after his visit to the AFL Tribunal. The Hawks still have a decent midfield but will have their hands full with the Melbourne engine room. In the last encounter between the teams, tagger-in-chief Finn Maginness was given the task on Clayton Oliver and fulfilled it admirably but that was in the early days of Clarrie’s return from a long term injury. Even if Maginness gets the job again and succeeds in keeping him down, there are plenty of options available to the Demons which is something the Hawks lack. That’s where the club’s binary kit bag makes it such a difficult proposition to overcome and why the Demons will win this after a tough tussle. Melbourne by 31 points. THE GAME Melbourne v Hawthorn at the MCG Saturday 23 March 2024 at 4.35pm HEAD TO HEAD Overall Hawthorn 87 wins Melbourne 82 wins 1 draw At the MCG Hawthorn 46 wins Melbourne 42 wins 1 draw Last 5 meetings Hawthorn 0 wins Melbourne 4 wins 1 draw The Coaches Mitchell 0 wins Goodwin 2 wins THE LAST TIME THEY MET Melbourne 13.9.87 defeated Hawthorn 9.6.60 in Round 23, 2023 at The MCG The Demons locked in a top four spot on the AFL 2023 ladder on Sunday with a 27-point victory against the Hawks in the penultimate round of the season. It was a tough, hard tussle with barely a goal or two in it until the Demons broke the shackles in the final term. Jake Melksham was the their best player with three telling three goals. THE TEAMS HAWTHORN B J. Weddle, S. Frost, J. Sicily HB J. Impey, J. Scrimshaw, M. D'Ambrosio C K. Amon, D. Moore, C. Macdonald HF J. Ginnivan, M. Lewis, C. Nash F L. Breust, M. Chol, Nick Watson FOLL N. Reeves, J. Newcombe, J. Worpel I/C B. Hardwick, C. Mackenzie, F. Maginness, J. Ward SUB J. Gunston EMG H. Hustwaite, H. Morrison M. Ramsden NO CHANGE MELBOURNE B J. McVee, S. May, B. Howes HB T. Rivers, J. Lever, C. Salem C E. Langdon, C. Petracca, A. Neal-Bullen HF T. Sparrow, B. Brown, K. Pickett F B. Fritsch, J. Van Rooyen, K. Chandler FOLL M. Gawn, J. Viney, J. Billings I/C T. McDonald, C. Oliver, H. Petty, C. Windsor SUB M. Hore EMG T. Fullarton, B. Laurie, T. Woewodin IN H. Petty OUT T. Woewodin (omitted) Injury and Suspension List: Round 2 Harrison Petty — toe/ available Ollie Sestan — concussion/ 1 week Lachie Hunter — calf/ 2 weeks Daniel Turner — hip/ 5 - 6 weeks Jake Bowey — shoulder/ 8 weeks Shane McAdam — hamstring/ TBC Jake Melksham — knee/ TBC Charlie Spargo — Achilles/TBC Joel Smith — suspended/ TBC

So hoping for them to lose again this round. I'm enjoying their losses almost as much as our wins. Go Saints.

He was an All Australian at Under 16 level last year so he is more than "any good". He can play at his father's old club and has the opportunity of learning ruck craft at Melbourne under Max Gawn. Is there anything else that he needs to know?

So we earmark Petty as a forward, bring TMac in as the third tall defender and then we bring Petty in and he plays back and TMac goes forward. I’m sorry but that’s insanity

Surely they'd be Fullo, Jeddo, Willo, Kyo, Hunto and Shano? ☺️

Full credit to him but it is kind of annoying that Bobby Hill's two best games are the difference between Collingwood's entire McRae era being a failure or not. I would be well pleased to see that arrogant parasite-on-a-throne club drain away to the gutter it crawled out of. There are already credible rumours of rifts within the club and when the paint starts to scratch off you can bet we'll get another look at all the unresolved racism, sexism and drug issues their clout enabled them to suppress without resolving. Holy [censored], I really do hate Collingwood.

Except for the fact that had we drafted Mac Andrew, we would have missed out on JvR so I don't think we were screwed over at all. GC17 did us a favour taking him.

Given the travel and short break, might need a squad mentality for Adelaide. Rest one or two and rotate. Perfect for Petty.

Also Declase, Dunkley and Grey as Exes. Unless I missed some others. Well done Mitch White. Always a favourite.

Trapper would be right up there too

But Fritsch did produce the Handball of the season to set up Trac for the sealer. He has the odd very quiet game but could kick 6 this week

Melbourne have been in his ear for about 4 years now, and he's often in the rooms with Gawn. How could you pass up the chance to learn from one of the all time great ruckman and play at the MCG in front of a big crowd for the club your father played for... when the alternative is playing for the Gold Coast Suns Would be shocked if he picked the academy route over the F/S.

He and his Dad have been guests of the Dees a few times. Loves the Dees. I am pretty sure he will pick us. Jeff also has twin boys probably around 12/13 years old or so. One was selected for the State Team and the other picked up a B & F last season. So i would say Jason and the team are doing all the right things. I have a peek at Jeff White's X account from time to time. Started a Ruck Tuition business called First Use which features on his account X frequently. Dees get loads of mentions. Last season Kaliani got quite a few mentions.

There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary numbers and those who don't.

Funny you should mention bails. He came to my mind too. I was thinking about the irony of roos saying, after the dees, coached by bails, ran up a cricket score against the swans at the g (iirc, Roos' biggest losing margin as coach?) that we were going to be a power team. I think I'm right in saying that roos sad that game was a factor in his decision to coach us. And roos gave us goody. So we have bails to thank for our flag! Bails was so unlucky to get sacked. I understand the impact of the 164 game, but that was 100% on the players and was a manifestation of our woeful, shambolic governance. And also a manifestation of our toxic culture in the playing group (anyone seriously knocking our culture now only need to think about that period to understand what a poor culture really looks like - and it's corrosive impact). Under bails, when on, we played exciting, attacking footy. Great to watch. But as you suggest the defensive issues (that bails would have addressed if given time) we also got opened up But we still had an outside chance of making finals when bails got sacked. Bails was the classic scapegoat an was treated appallingly by the club. And his players hung him out to dry with their pathetic display agains the cats. Still makes me furious.

Kicking is distasteful to say the least , up there with eye gouging, spitting and squirrel gripping, should not be tolerated no matter what the force, bad look for the game.

For so many years, this head-to-head has been skewed badly against us (true of surprisingly many rivalries, actually, for a 13-premierships team!) But, at 87-82, parity is now within reach. Get 83 done on Saturday, boys, and squaring of that ledger becomes tantalisingly close.

Without being in the inner circle, from the outside looking in, he's both right and wrong. We were horribly dysfunctional from end 2006 until probably 2018... and then we've still got some serious issues in the background at the moment. However the Viney's and Gawn's are the men that drive standards. It's no bad thing to use them as a yardstick. But he didn't put his hand up and say the cliche' if it's to be, it's up to me' No blame game here. We let him down, and he let himself down. Maybe if he was drafted into a better org he'd have been a better player... or maybe not.

Brent Moloney once got rubbed out for missing a bloke completely. A kick is a kick. It's dirty and deserves a suspension.

I think identification would be the problem

BBB has done us a huge favour. I’d imagine the FD were hoping he would be a stop gap for us and help us eke out a win before we could bring Petty back. Instead he was so outstanding he gives Harrison another week to gain form and fitness in the VFL. Brown’s marking and competing in the air were brilliant as always but his work on the ground was the best it’s been since 2021. If he can play 10-15 games like that this year look out! Windsor, TMac and Billings were also a revelation. Unless someone is sore and needs a rest no change this week. Hopefully Harrison can dominate at VFL level and demand his spot as I think Petty-JVR is our best tall forward mix and Brown will need done managing. Still buzzing from that win and very much hoping we can smash those Hawks!

Imagine the salvage operation. Rescuers would just be going through the motions.

I find it hard to understand why some are calling for Petty to come into the team for the Hawks. He has had one run in the practice match for Casey where, from reports, he played for 3 of the quarters and did not get very much of the ball. Meanwhile, we beat the Doggies by 7 goals in a meaningful 4 point match with a well functioning forward structure. I would hope that the selectors put together a team to win this Saturday by looking at the possible structure of the opposing team, the expected conditions and the form of the players and their ability to execute the game plans. Petty does not have any sort of form line that would justify selection and I would doubt his match fitness at this stage of his comeback. I would play him at Casey until his form improves as I would a number of other players.

Great news for the young backman. Adams signs on for two more years

The White family are still massive Dees fans... I'd be pretty surprised if he decided to go to the GC. I guess that decision would be more if he really wanted to stay up there, but still think the lure of playing for Melbourne will outweigh that.

He's never suggested so. In fact he's always hinted at the f/s route. It just happens that under AFL rules he is eligible for 2 clubs under different categories. This is nothing new ... been known for quite a few years.

That was Ray Ellington… I quote: “Ray Ellington's stage name reportedly comes from his love of Duke Ellington, the famous jazz musician, having seen him in the early 1930s.”

I'm not a moderator. I'm just a lowly Administrator. Post the thread and I will take it up with the mods at our AGM.

What about 'Bulb', a young Tulip?

Likened to Kozzy by his coach and will be given midfield minutes early in Coates league. What an exciting prospect. Hope he doesn't play too well 🤐

Ship started to slowly turn upon the arrival of Roos. Roos obviously driving much higher standards. Long overdue and Wattsy certainly copped the rough end of the pineapple in his first 5 seasons. I recall meeting Jack at Chaddy on the eve of the season that Roosey took over... early 2014. He was sitting in a photo studio waiting to get his promo shots done for the club. I said hello and asked him how he felt after we'd landed one of the best coaches in the land? His response was the usual happy-go-lucky one with a big grin. One of the great smiles (on anyone) which i remember to this day. I thought he improved under Roosey somewhat but by that stage the old habbits (under a very poor system/culture & just a lack of support / talent in general) may have been too hard to break. Jack gave me the impression he was just happy playing the game and having fun doing so. He had oodles of talent but the madness & intensity of the high performance side and pre-season slog might not have been his cup of tea. I'll never forget the QB 2016 match and his great run around the southern stand finishing with the sealer. One of the most satisfying moments i'd had in 45 years of watching the mighty Demons to that point. We let the Pies supporters behind us know about it who'd been ragging Jack all day! I really thought he might have turned the corner at that point but sadly it wasn't to be. The old saying "you can lead a horse to water...."

I've said a similar thing about girlfriends dumping me in the past. It doesn't mean they were wrong, other than being attracted to me in the first place and persisting for too long due to a misguided hope of 'potential'.

Looks like Harry on the right.

That has musically unfortunate connotations 🥺 A better fate awaits Jed, we trust.

So I should just make the post as a normal post, and ask a moderator if they could pin it, assuming of course they think it is pin worthy? Could I save time by asking you now if it is indeed pin worthy or that I’m wasting my time😁

Got to love a Harry Petty look alike! Going early with a prediction that he will eventually play forward. Just have a feeling.

I agree with this. But the AFL has difficulty with the concept of "intent" preferring to judge on "outcome"*. For example, "kicking in danger" appears to be paid only if a player is actually kicked. It ought to be paid whether a player is physically kicked or not. Too many players are putting their hands and heads at serious risk because their opponents are allowed to kick the ball off the ground as long as they don't actually connect with the player. And we all know what will happen...the AFL will consider changing the rule only after someone is concussed after receiving a kick to the head or has badly broken bones in their hand. *The exception is the "insufficient intent" rule.

Noah Yze looked great at training when i attended.

Only 19!

Ashcroft is a father/son prospect and is here by virtue of the fact that the family moved here from Brisbane a few years ago. Marshall is a Queenslander who came to Melbourne to study at Melbourne Grammar but he remains a Lions Academy member and therefore tied to that club. I agree however, that it’s time to overhaul the NGA rules which provide very little incentive for southern clubs to nurture footballers if there’s open slather for those good enough to be picked in the first 40 in the national draft. That said, watch out for one such player on the MFC list, Andy Moniz-Wakefield, to make his debut with Melbourne in the very near future.

Sorry if it's a stupid question, but how are two Brisbane academy members playing for Sandringham? How is that nurturing "local" talent and their pathways?

Jack was a guest on the ABC Kat & Matt show a few Saturdays back. Kat is apparently good friends with Jack’s sister. Jack gave the club a wack. Spoke of having his love for the game drained from him during his time at the dees. Said the same happened to Jeremy Howe, and how much happier Jeremy was after joining the pies (2021 says hello!). Mentioned he was not the Jack Viney or Maxy Gawn the coaches wanted him to be. Felt he was accepted for who he was at Port. I switched between felling embarrassed and angry at the club, to also being peed off at Jack for bringing it all up again and not mentioning his role in his career outcome. Sad all round really.

Just kick him apparently that’s ok now

wait till next year, od. there is talk of a round -1

as a carlton supporter, maclure has a vested interest. he is trying to get blues out of playing at docklands so they can play more games at the g. docklands deal means someone has to play there so need another team to swap with. so media pressure on demons poor attendance is his agenda with the aim of carlton playing more mcg games at the expense of melbourne.

On the commentary, for me was a breath of fresh air compared to a Brayshaw or BT etc, Matt Hill calling the game (race caller as someone said) wasn't perfect, and confused a couple of players, Chandler and Ed etc, but didn't have the grating effect the other Fox callers have. Also huge kudos to Brad Johnson who is extremely fair to MFC in play when obviously a WB fan, praises all appropriately.

Windy, even the Yarra has waves, warm and humid. They are doing plenty of warm ups, then a game of soccer, now run throughs. I think keeping it simple. May, ANB, Hore, Max. TMac, Billings, Sestan, on modified programs. BBB, Spargs, Turner, McAdam (own program, talking to Whelan) in rehab process. No Hunter, Melky, or Verrall. Max, TMac, BBB, Spargo, Billing, left the field early. May, Sestan, ANB, Hore, all running. Sestan last man running, and Alex practising goal kicking, the rest of modified group have left for the sheds. 26 full training (Petty as well), the drills are close kicking and handball, one with low ball gets and an element of competition. 30 minute run and they are back to the sheds. Those who did not play Sunday are running laps, all 7 of them.

Have read the article and think it's about time that the media take note and exercise some 'duty of care' of their own when reporting on issues of a personal nature to players. Some of the stuff on Clarry and Joel Smith has been ridiculous. The same story rehashed multiple times over with a different headline just to get a few extra clicks. It's money for jam for the media outlets, but has a meaningful impact on the people at the centre of it, that they are selfishly profiting at the expense of.