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I'll let everyone else argue the point, but I'm already heading in to next year with a modicum of optimism. I won't convince those on the opposite side to think otherwise, but to those who do, then I'm with you all the way. Even if there is only one other person in that group. Bring on the review, bring on the tough decisions and bring on finals in 2020. Book it.

DD, there are some of us that have direct connections to AFL contacts that range from slight to extremely extensive. Just last week I was told by Josh Kennedy of the Swans due to my extensive AFL contacts stemming primarily from Xavier College that several Swans players were stunned at the verbal barrage that Oliver gave Fritsch for not handballing to him. This verbal barrage contained a C bomb which was incomprehensible to the Swans players. Why am I raising this now? Well, I just want to make the point to you that some of us hear quite sensitive & interesting feedback and I for one only chose to pass on a fraction of what I hear. Interestingly, when I posted at the start of the year that Tom Sparrow was going to be a late replacement and would debut well before anybody else had reported it, a number of posters thought it was so unlikely that I remarkably came under criticism. DD, rather than criticise other posters for posting stuff that you don’t like, just accept it is a discussion forum and go with it. Posters will soon be known by their accuracy.

If Trac is unhappy he hasn’t shown it in games. Very good season and can hold his head high in my view. I’d hate to lose him.

[censored] hell. Mahoney simply cannot win with some of you lot. You blokes kick and squeal for changes to be made and yet Mahoney and co go and snag Burgess and Alan Richardson and its still not enough. [censored] unbelievable some of you blokes

Hell no. A prerequisite for playing AFL football is the desire to win a contest and wear some physical pressure. Garlett's had no interest in any of that for a couple of years and is only getting slower and more brittle.

Max Gawn. Our champion. Another magnificent season by Max. He is at the peak of his powers and talk of Grundy being better is like saying Polly was better than Big John or vice versa. Loved by the fans, coaches and playing group and the whole footy community. Hopefully the Club soon realises here is the bloke to lead us to glory. Nothing so far has been too much of a burden for Max, he has the intellect to cop the blows, work on his body shape without prompting, readjust his goalkicking and forward positioning. A reason to watch the Dees in a dismay year.

I thought he was finished last year but 9 goals from 7 games means he was on track for a 30 goal season - even with a dodgy shoulder. He is still a mile ahead of any other small forward we have so I would give him a performance based one year deal. Lets not throw out the baby with the bathwater.

Nuffies on AFL Page

Hire a shrink, in the last five games we've led at three quarter time we've then kicked 5.23 in the last quarter and lost four times.

Frosty kept that clown from winning the Coleman medal. Sweet justice, flops around too much.

Team played with more freedom, bit like the caretaker coach who just tells the players to take the game on and have a crack, without being consumed by defensive structures as a premium. Happens in a lot of end of season games when caution is thrown to the wind. Max Gawn gave Goldstein an absolute bath, dominant player on the ground, 3 Chas votes Fritsch really good game and starting to haveca bit of Brad Green about him, good leading patterns going to make it difficult for defenders by playing in front Frosty did a job on Brown, whose 2 goals came from a downfield free and a mark on the lead from a turnover when Salem, Harmes and Brayshaw didn't get back quickly enough to fill the hole in front of Brown Viney tagged Cunnington winning the battle and reducing his influence- this is where Viney needs to be used Nibbler, JKH and Stretch weren't to bad but Nibblers skills let him down and should have nailed a goal on the run to level the game but these 3 are VFL/Depth and you don't want to many of them Jones for the most part was ok forward but a player ofchis experience should be kicking down the line and not trying to hit someone up through the corridor with under 2 minutes to go with the lead, basic stuff down the line and start again with a throw in or ball up at worst Lever and Frost intercepted well but Levers turnovers were very costly Trac very good early but still a burst player, makes very good decisions Salem poor 1% player and something has happened with his kicking last month or so, not sure whether he's carrying a niggle or not, along with Brayshaw, Harmes and Clarrie needs to work harder to run with/find his opponent or fill holes when we turn the ball over Hore has had a good first year but skills need a lot of work, but good depth to have if our defenders are all fit Overall better performance than some predicted with some decent chains of ball movement and handballs with depth to break congestion but poor delivery inside 50 was still there. Turnovers/general decision making, accountability for your opponent(eg 2 way running), 1%ers and groundball improvement inside 50 the weaknesses to be worked on and the focus, which along with a decent pre season and improved confidence should see improvement next season

Firstly we need to stop using numbers instead of letters to spell words and then can have an adult conversation.

Baker - showed some signs Brayshaw - a downward spiral Chandler - not enough evidence Dunkley - needs significant development Fritsch - a classy forward Frost - consistent and passionate Garlett - didn’t seem interested Gawn - our singular champion Hannan - cruelled by injury Harmes - success as tagger Hibberd - seemingly rarely fit Hore - courageous and promising Hunt - rarely beat opponent Jetta - never got going Jones - time has elapsed Keilty - didn’t show out Kennedy-Harris - probably exhausted chances Kolodjashnij - ruined by injury Lever - will be better Lewis - professional until end Lockhart - a bit player May - will be important O.McDonald - rarely surprised supporters T.McDonald - our biggest disappointment Melksham - best rarely seen Neal-Bullen - rarely justified selection Oliver - prolific, rarely outstanding Petracca - exciting in bursts Petty - showed some promise Preuss - rarely justified selection Salem - disappointing second half T.Smith - tried but deficient Spargo - just a schoolboy Stretch - has exhausted chances Viney - never got going C.Wagner - only Casey standard J. Wagner - like his brother Weideman - poor before injuries

I'm happy to delist him at 10:01 or 11:01 if it makes you happy. Ideally package him up and trade him to some other battling team. Honestly I'll keep him if he's willing to play VFL and get paid minimum chips and that would be a decision made through loyalty, but it will also take loyalty from Jones to put his hand up and be honest about where he's at. And some strength of character from Goodwin to back in younger players with a healthier list next year. Unfortunately Jordan Lewis' career at Melbourne has shown Goodwin is incredibly soft on declining older players. So I don't trust him to manage Jones. Jones lost us the game yesterday and I'm angry at him but the whole club should be because it's complete trash for a captain to just throw away a game with an awful error but that's where we are at as a footy club.

Simpson & Clarkson? You’d like them to take a demotion to come to MFC from their current head coaching positions? We had Roos, and he had no desire to continue in the position, and it would only serve to undermine Goodwin or anyone else for that matter, considering he personally held the head coach position himself. Or Lyon, Malthouse, and Choco, all 3 of which would be actively harbouring desires to fill a new head coaching position themselves, again undermining Goodwin (or any other head coach’s) standing and authority. You’re clearly far too clever for the rest of us mate. Well done.

Amusingly, our tight win against Hawthorn cost them finals. ?

Jack ... Watts I mean. Could probably get him for peanuts and who knows what he might do for us.

Perhaps if the club apply a bit of George Constanza logic and do the absolute opposite of everything they did in 2019 , every instinct that comes to mind , then do the opposite ... for example , when they get the urge in November to use pick 3 to draft a promising inside mid .... then don’t just draft some outside mid with speed , Another example , when Goody thinks it’s a good idea to continue with the current leadership group and keep plugging away at getting better with that connection thingy to make ourselves more accountable .... no , no , back up.... let’s change things up a little , let’s make Gawn sole captain and spend most of the summer doing kicking drills , and let’s see how that turns out So if we do the opposite, we make finals, and I suppose it’s an even year too , which helps ! Simples !

When he goes Rufus, who the hell on our list can break a tackle? Kent at speed was difficult to grab. Petracca is currently 2nd hardest to tackle in the comp. He will get Dusty in 2 years. We are currently the easiest team to tackle in the comp. No speed, no momentum, 1 bull. Good luck without him.

I like it. “If you go after Petracca, we’ll go after your best player sooooo there. And your mums smell” (Then run off).

Jones is respected in AFL levels for staying with a crap team, reality is no one was really ever interested or enquired about him, and he always stood to earn almost 100% more staying at Melbourne than another club at the next highest salary. From a playing perspective he is well passed it, our Ritchie Vandenverg equivalent and it is time he is moved on. I have said it for years that we won't truly be able to move on from the Bailey and Neeld years until any and all leaders from that era are moved on. Jones' leadership traits appear at odds with Gawn's, and I can't imagine seeing -- nor have I ever seen -- the likes of Oliver, Petracca, Brayshaw following Jones' leadership. I've long been of the opinion that Jones is of an old-school brigade of ol' Melbourne boys, the boys club is gone and you have a new brigade coming through. If we want to keep the likes of Oliver, Trac and Brayshaw, we need to let this new brigade take charge. Thanks for your service, here is your life membership, bye Jones. Let's stop wasting time money and list space on momentum killers and spuds. We have done more than enough to support and empower Jones to be the best player and bloke he can be. It's time to move on. We finished 17th ffs, and his leadership quality and body language this season was poor. He is a perennial loser.

With Lewis gone, we have how many players over 30? Oh that's right, only one. He of course won 3 B & F's in a row and stayed loyal while we were sh-t. He is not in our worst 8 players and therefore on a number of grounds deserves another year. Would hurt the club massively through the AFL if we dumped him this year.Would speak volumes of our culture. Hardly soft I would have thought. PS. Don't bring up Hodge, Lewis and Roughhead, as the Hawks have half their list over 30.

Owe him what? What would he add if he stayed on? Certainly not leadership or class, we cant afford any passengers no matter how “feel good” the story is In a perfect world everyone gets to play 300 games.

He’s too busy swimming and breasts.

Mission statements are just another example of corporate wankery invading sport... They dont do a damn thing to improve performance, and the vast majority of employees couldnt tell you what their organizations Mission Statement was. We dont need one. Actions speak louder than words so the saying goes.

I will be peeed off if this club loses Petracca. We cannot afford to lose talent like this. Screw Geelong and Hawthorn! They keep on getting players at the expense of lesser clubs. Might as well be the EPL!

May I also add that a bulldogs win will see the end of Hawthorn. So there is something good to come out of this year.

Delist ANB, JKH, Stretch, Garlett, Keilty and Jones. Trade Salem, Viney

Thank God it’s not up to you!

We probably need to make about 8-10 changes, so besides the obvious few, some more players will be moved on. Maynard and Lewis are gone, Keilty, JKH and Garlett are likely too. Tim Smith and Josh Wagner could also be added and Walker the rookie is probably gone. That is 8 and maybe another 1-2 could and should be traded, like ANB who IMO has no future with us. His mate Billy might get another year, with Josh's brother Corey.

I knew we would start the season slow due to the preseason but fully expected us to become a dominant team on way to a Grand Final berth at the very latest by midway through the year. I actually wrote our season off after our first win against Sydney. They were awful and somehow we were marginally less awful. I knew we were doomed for the year. I've been indifferent about the season and surprisingly non caring about how bad we've been up until last week against Sydney when I was ropable. The attitude of our footy department with team selection , the pizzweak lazy and selfish efforts on the field , the seemingly dumbfounded look on Goodwin's face who looked like he was out of his depth, pushed me over the edge. Yesterday my heart rate did not change one little bit for the whole match apart from that last 30 second forward foray when my heart yearned for a useless draw. How sad and pathetic am I..... On par with this footy club.

Blah , blah forken blah. Seriously, how often do we gotta hear the same sheet. Game after game, year after year. This Club learns nothing. https://www.melbournefc.com.au/news/2019-08-24/we-take-full-responsibility-jones?fbclid=IwAR3jNRWqpPqUp1B9TlcTSYF5UDOV7JnAMyY0NIXJFx93sIbD9wEnmHKaY5I

And just like that, our season is now over . I think now that it’s finally come to an end I can now feel the gravity of my disappointment , and am left now with quite an empty and hollow feeling to be honest. After the loss to the saints in Rd 5 I had written off the possibility of contending this season, and simply road the bumps of the season not often overly disappointed nor surprised, and far less emotionally invested in wins and losses than in recent years , just simply putting it down to a string of disaster injuries , lack of fitness and drop off in form and confidence, and that this year was simply a write off and that’s it’s now all about 2020. There have been very few positives , and plethora of negatives as well as speculation to what has gone wrong internally with the coaching group and playing group, which has all been well documented and debated on dland. I’ve wanted this season to be over for ages, so the club could finally put a line through 2019 and move forward, hopefully set things right , fix the leadership group , fix the coaching panel , hit the draft and hit the training track with a full preseason , with a favourable draw , and maybe, just maybe, there is something to look forward to in 2020. However, at the moment we’ve just reached the finish line and all I can do now is look back and wish it hadn’t turned out like it did ... we were supposed to be contenders. Another year , and still waiting for my football dream to one day come true.

If ever there was a pic to sum up grand final day every year ...

You mean in the 5 games this season where we were leading at 3/4 time? Anyway there is 5 games lost through poor goal kicking and there were a few others where we kicked horribly in the first half and lost so even though we haven’t played well at all this season some accuraacy in front of goal might have seen us on 10 or 11 wins for the season and maybe more as winning builds confidence and form.

This Chook dissociates himself from you, Chookrat.

So Mahoney has employed a failed senior coach to an as yet un named position while he does an internal review into amongst other things our coaching panel and deficiencies. Is this an episode of UTOPIA. Some speculate he may be a mentor or head of coaching. Masterstroke, get a recently sacked unsuccessful coach to mentor or oversee our struggles coach. You could not make this stuff up. As for highly regarded, please, not by St Kilda. Always highly regarded on the way out the door.

Jones is a club stalwart but also a perennial loser. Like Viney, they speak in corporate jingo and PR speak, and in cliches. It's exhausting. "We take full responsibility." Obviously you do? Who else takes responsibility if you don't? The supprters? lol so condescending. If 2019 told us anything it's that our leadership is weak.

Ok then Einstein, who is this mythical candidate for the director of coaching with the exemplary track record that you speak of? Who should Mahoney have signed? Obviously Richo is not good enough for you, so you must have someone in mind. All ears here champ.

Sam Frost - Must be re-signed.

Can see the Hawks challenging well before the mfc.. unbelievable how they haven’t bottomed out & bring in new players & continue the culture vs the pathetic culture we have

Culture at hawks continues & go over to the west & beat WC by 5 goals with a chance to play finals. They will get a Patton & or Conniglio & end up winning a flag whilst we ponder & recruit players who end up injured or lose form, overweight etc etc. pessimism yes .. the mfc way

Brilliant GIF.

Season over for the Casey Demons. Box Hill Hawks trailed for most of the game but got up to win in the final quarter. Moral of the story - never rely on Collingwood.

Ok then, let's go for people held in terrible regard...

While agreeing there seems to be potentially more at play than just injuries, it surely has to be the major factor in what has happened this season. There are a couple of reasons: - The pre-season surgeries naturally put teams behind, but we also had our shortest pre-season ever. With the majority of the core of the team sitting with between 50-120 games (Gawn, Viney, Trac, Harmes, Brayshaw, Salem, Oliver, Lever, Weid and with the majority of the fringe players also in the same boat) means they don't have the 'miles in the legs' as some of the teams that have competed regularly in finals. We've seen in the past Geelong, Hawks, Richmond, the Eagles and the dogs have a down year/s when they've gone deep into finals with younger squads, those mentioned (with the exception of the dogs (yet)) have all come back again and been successful. - Add on the in-season injuries, it was in another thread - and don't quote me on exact figures - but up until the Richmond game we'd lost something like 120 games to our best 22 players, the tigers had lost 90 and the Pies 60. Those teams were used as examples as they were discussed at the time as teams with large injury lists. On top of that the injuries seemed to be very concentrated at one end each week, early in the season we'd be missing 4 or 5 of our best defenders then as the season progressed it transferred to the forward half. Very hard to build anything in season when we've got such deficiencies. I'm not saying there aren't other factors but a limited pre-season and in-season injuries are certainly big factors. I'm very happy there'll be limited off-season hold ups and we've got Burgess to hopefully get them super fit. Only then will we be able to reliable assess if some of the issues are (as discussed on the many forums here) - the coach, game plan, the captains, selection, Pert, selling games to the NT etc.