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CHANGES: Rd 18 vs Port Adelaide

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  On 12/07/2022 at 01:57, deespicable me said:

Van Rooyen who I'm a huge fan of was possibly earmarked for an earlier debut but played in the early game at the 'G' against the Swans and fair dinkum hardly touched it. Was hugely dissapointing. Given that he is just a kid, that is entirely excusable, but I think he was pumped up for a big game, seemed to be played as the key forward and the coaches looked at that and thought he needed a fair bit more time in the VFL, maybe even the rest of the year. 

Agree on Laurie,  but for JVR that game was 6 weeks ago and his first game in 3 weeks, potentially with a covid absence? 6 weeks is a long time for a first year kid.

He’s since played in the ruck to learn some new skills and travelled with the team as an emergency.

Expecting him to perform super well is foolish given his age but I think he can provide some spark in limited minutes.

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      On 12/07/2022 at 02:40, mo64 said:

    The idea of playing Petty at CHF is exciting, but based on what we've seen of Tommo at VFL and AFL level this year, he's not the player to fill Petty's spot. Barring another horrific run with injuries to our key backs, we shouldn't be seeing Tomlinson in the AFL again this year.

    Turner would be the beneficiary here i'd imagine, maybe something to consider in 2023 - Wouldn't change the backline too much this season

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      On 12/07/2022 at 01:57, deespicable me said:

    Just a couple of cautionary tales about Laurie and Van Rooyen.

    Laurie probably shouldn't debut this week. He reminds me of Brock McLean who was also slow but had very good games on wet decks. The only proviso to this is if the game in the heat slows down. But early on the game will be too quick for him. Just a note on this . The medi-sub becomes very important up in Alice and should be chosen and used wisely.

    Van Rooyen who I'm a huge fan of was possibly earmarked for an earlier debut but played in the early game at the 'G' against the Swans and fair dinkum hardly touched it. Was hugely dissapointing. Given that he is just a kid, that is entirely excusable, but I think he was pumped up for a big game, seemed to be played as the key forward and the coaches looked at that and thought he needed a fair bit more time in the VFL, maybe even the rest of the year. 

    Happy for either to debut but they are both players that need and should be given circumstances as much in their favor as possible. Someone suggested that Port and Dogs have weakish back line talls so this may be a good week for Van Rooyen but I'd rather see us in winning form and they force their way in as opposed to when we have come off a loss and just want to see something different.

    You're dismissing Laurie as an AFL standard player without seeing him play at that level, and pigeon holing him as a wet weather specialist. 

    Anyone who doubts Laurie's ability to cover the ground or fitness levels should re-watch the last quarter of Casey v Geelong. He goes from disposing of the ball to the next contest in a blink of an eye. And his clean hands in wet conditions, and overall disposal is sublime.

    We're coming to the pointy end of the season with a top 4 position at stake. We've tried Weid and M Brown in the T Mac role with no success. We've changed the structure, and played an extra small in Bedford, with limited success. We need a change of personnel in our forward half, and IMO Laurie and JVR have to play this week.

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      On 12/07/2022 at 02:40, mo64 said:

    The idea of playing Petty at CHF is exciting, but based on what we've seen of Tommo at VFL and AFL level this year, he's not the player to fill Petty's spot. Barring another horrific run with injuries to our key backs, we shouldn't be seeing Tomlinson in the AFL again this year.

    Bring in Joel Smith when fit.

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    Hunt is such a spark off HB. Salem, May, Brayshaw and Bowey dominate touches and want to open up the game with their boot rather than their feet. Hunt runs lines and can make mistakes but he gets us going when we are inert. And we are inert.

    ANB, Harmes, Spargo, and Sparrow need to lift as the lower rung of players responsible for bringing the ball up the ground and into the forward line. Don’t know if any of those will get dropped however. So poor Bedford I guess but I can feel a debut coming in my bones…

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      On 11/07/2022 at 22:14, DeeZone said:

    Well Dlanders my wife and I are about to board our flight to Uluṟu and heading to the game in Alice on Sunday so dearly hope that the Dees are on fire on Sunday. It’ll be a sad flight home on Monday otherwise.!!!

    Lucky bastard !!!!!

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      On 12/07/2022 at 04:30, Ethan Tremblay said:

    I’d like to bring in Rivers, Tomlinson and Hunt. 

    I'd agree... mostly for Tomlinson. Essentially he would be familiar with the 2nd tall up forward role, and has around 2-3 months to prepare for it. I'm not sure that has happened of course.

    He'd be looking elsewhere if he doesn't get a gig soon surely?

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      On 12/07/2022 at 01:57, deespicable me said:

    Just a couple of cautionary tales about Laurie and Van Rooyen.

    Laurie probably shouldn't debut this week. He reminds me of Brock McLean who was also slow but had very good games on wet decks. The only proviso to this is if the game in the heat slows down. But early on the game will be too quick for him. Just a note on this . The medi-sub becomes very important up in Alice and should be chosen and used wisely.

    Van Rooyen who I'm a huge fan of was possibly earmarked for an earlier debut but played in the early game at the 'G' against the Swans and fair dinkum hardly touched it. Was hugely dissapointing. Given that he is just a kid, that is entirely excusable, but I think he was pumped up for a big game, seemed to be played as the key forward and the coaches looked at that and thought he needed a fair bit more time in the VFL, maybe even the rest of the year. 

    Happy for either to debut but they are both players that need and should be given circumstances as much in their favor as possible. Someone suggested that Port and Dogs have weakish back line talls so this may be a good week for Van Rooyen but I'd rather see us in winning form and they force their way in as opposed to when we have come off a loss and just want to see something different.

    If Laurie is as slow as you suggest, we should be prioritising Chandler for AFL selection?

     

    Edited by 1964_2

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      On 12/07/2022 at 05:14, 1964_2 said:

    If Laurie is as slow as you suggest, we should be prioritising Chandler for AFL selection?

     

    I'm not sure if you are being sarcastic, but Chandler is clearly one of our top performers at VFL level. Laurie is a year behind Chandler in the system and last year he had a bad injury. He is having a great year at VFL level and still improving. He is probably equal with Chandler now and they are just below Bedford who is coming off a poor showing against Geelong. Spargo as a 50 gamer and Premiership player is well ahead of these 3 but at times goes missing. I would love one of Bedford, Chandler or Laurie to put their hand up to take Spargos spot or alternatively go with a taller classy player like a Salem, Hunt or Rivers even. It's all still a work in progress. Spargo has the runs on the board. It's his spot.

    Just for the record I think Moniz-Wakefield has the best chance of owning that spot in time.

     

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      On 12/07/2022 at 05:40, deespicable me said:

    I'm not sure if you are being sarcastic, but Chandler is clearly one of our top performers at VFL level. Laurie is a year behind Chandler in the system and last year he had a bad injury. He is having a great year at VFL level and still improving. He is probably equal with Chandler now and they are just below Bedford who is coming off a poor showing against Geelong. Spargo as a 50 gamer and Premiership player is well ahead of these 3 but at times goes missing. I would love one of Bedford, Chandler or Laurie to put their hand up to take Spargos spot or alternatively go with a taller classy player like a Salem, Hunt or Rivers even. It's all still a work in progress. Spargo has the runs on the board. It's his spot.

    Just for the record I think Moniz-Wakefield has the best chance of owning that spot in time.

     

    No sarcasm, was a genuine question. 

    I haven't watched enough of the VFL, for a read on Laurie being fast or slow. But, can obviously get away with a lack of pace easier at VFL level. 

    Have seen enough of Chandler to know that he is not far away, but Laurie more of an un-known for me. 

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      On 08/07/2022 at 21:26, Ungarieboy said:

    It's about structure and players playing there role to allow it to work.  A good structure will cover perceived dips in form.  This then feeds the "soldier in soldier out" approach to success.

    Unfortunately these last few weeks we've lost a bit of this structural shape: 

    To date we have not found a player to come in and do Tmac's role. This had consequently made things harder for BBB, forced Fritsch to play a different role, which meant there's also no (soldier in) to play his role. Combine these two factors and suddenly our smalls are struggling to "be offensive" - but that's not due to form, as any replacement will suffer the same fate.

    We also suffered a similar problem with May out, as no-one could fill his role (backline general, gorilla keeper, interceptor and long release kicking)  - resulting in weaknesses elsewhere as other defenders tried to cover this.

    To keep the structure working, I'd bring in JVR to play Tmac's role in place of Bedford; or conversely Tomilson to replace Bedford and swing Petty into Tmac's role.

    Dunstan for Oliver is a no brainer if injuref, though he could also come on for Sparrow.

    And that's about it. More than a couple of changed will only further erode the structure?

     

    Couldn't agree more.   Fritsch needs to play his usual game where we often get 4 goals from him - I think its time for JVR as his mobility is similar to TMac and he hits packs hard so at least the ball comes to ground.  Dunstan for Oliver  Rivers for Salem wouldn't upset the system and give it more energy.   Wish either Turner or Smith weren't injured.

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      On 12/07/2022 at 03:54, rpfc said:

    Hunt is such a spark off HB. Salem, May, Brayshaw and Bowey dominate touches and want to open up the game with their boot rather than their feet. Hunt runs lines and can make mistakes but he gets us going when we are inert. And we are inert.

    ANB, Harmes, Spargo, and Sparrow need to lift as the lower rung of players responsible for bringing the ball up the ground and into the forward line. Don’t know if any of those will get dropped however. So poor Bedford I guess but I can feel a debut coming in my bones…

    Hunt hasn't really been a spark of halfback for a couple of years. They seem to prefer using him to lockdown the opposition's quickest forward which he has done mostly a good job at when required. I think they prefer to have the ball in boweys and Salem's hands due to more reliable kicks. Issue is neither have been that great lately at being attacking with their kicks and we are paying for it with very slow, safe ball movement into our attacking half

    Edited by Bates Mate

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      On 12/07/2022 at 05:59, stinga said:

    Couldn't agree more.   Fritsch needs to play his usual game where we often get 4 goals from him - I think its time for JVR as his mobility is similar to TMac and he hits packs hard so at least the ball comes to ground.  Dunstan for Oliver  Rivers for Salem wouldn't upset the system and give it more energy.   Wish either Turner or Smith weren't injured.

    A bit optimistic. Fritsch has played 101 games and kicked 4 goals in 5 games (plus 6 goals in 2 games and 7 goals in 1 game). So, just on 8% of the times he plays he kicks four or more goals. I don't think that's "often".

    How times have changed, though. Peter Hudson has the highest average of all comers with 5.6 goals per game over 129 games. Imagine going to the football knowing your full forward is more likely than not going to kick 5 or more goals every game.

    Note: I know Fritsch is not our full forward.

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      On 11/07/2022 at 21:50, picket fence said:

    He is more a forward than Spargo or Bedford!

    πŸ€£πŸ€¦πŸΌβ€β™‚οΈcmon mate you have to be kidding.  Spargo was instrumental in us winning a flag and has more forward craft in his little toe than what Hunt has.

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      On 12/07/2022 at 01:57, deespicable me said:

    Just a couple of cautionary tales about Laurie and Van Rooyen.

    Fair enough, and not disagreeing with you, but development of young players is rarely linear. Even on the cusp of selection in the firsts, younger players can still have what look like dud games.

    Suspect though that the FD isn't necessarily watching for what we are, so who knows how close the likes of JVR and Laurie are. But if they are going to be in contention, surely better to get them in sooner rather than later with a view to finals?

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      On 12/07/2022 at 09:44, Kick_It_To_Pickett said:

    Out: indigenous guernsey 

    In: Traditional home guernsey 

    Yeah, that’ll do it…

    You Got It Ok GIF

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      On 12/07/2022 at 03:07, cantstandyasam said:

    Bring in Joel Smith when fit.

    IF and when, poor guy.  So many opportunities this year - defence, attack - but never available. Feel so sad for the guy.

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    Assuming with training today, we might see at least one social media clip of a debutant announcement.. hopefully two! 

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      On 13/07/2022 at 00:19, SPC said:

    Assuming with training today, we might see at least one social media clip of a debutant announcement.. hopefully two! 

    Expectation:

    In: JVR, Laurie

    Out: Bedford, Spargo

    Vs

    Reality

    In: Melksham, Mitch Brown

    Out: Bedford, Oliver.

     

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      On 12/07/2022 at 10:03, chook fowler said:

    Time for another lockdown - it worked for us big time last year.

    But just one of those short ones please.

    Not the ones that extend through to October like the last 2 years.

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      On 13/07/2022 at 01:28, dazzledavey36 said:

    Expectation:

    In: JVR, Laurie

    Out: Bedford, Spargo

    Vs

    Reality

    In: Melksham, Mitch Brown

    Out: Bedford, Oliver.

     

    Sounds about right

    • Like 1
      On 13/07/2022 at 01:28, dazzledavey36 said:

    Expectation:

    In: JVR, Laurie

    Out: Bedford, Spargo

    Vs

    Reality

    In: Melksham, Mitch Brown

    Out: Bedford, Oliver.

     

    Oh god I can see it already πŸ˜…

    I think we really need to commit to using players who at the very least are going to be on our list next year. Whether that is Weid and Dunstan or LVR and Laurie.

    Far be it from me to criticise Goody and co's selections, but I think I speak for most people when I say the time for selecting M. Brown and Melksham over players with longer term futures at the club is just about over.

    No disrespect to those two however - they've been great servants of the club and in their own ways have contributed to the success we are seeing now.

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