10 hours ago, 58er said:

Spargo deserves the time as he is a clever footballer who uses the ball and generally tackles well. Does need to be more consistent but I believe his upside is good enough in his 4 th year to give him this year to improve further. 

10 disposals from him are more useful than the same fir Hannan AVB ANB ( different style of player admittedly ) and Bedford ( at this stage). Kossie is of course the pick of the smalls.

The post was regarding the previous poster had given him to 2031( I know it was a typo)

2 hours ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

I was being a little facetious.  To be fair to the coaches the votes were very close from 3rd to 5th.

3rd:  Viney, 311

4th:  Langdon, 296

5th:  Oliver, 291

I really think 5th being an issue for Oliver is a furphy

Yes I do as well, however IMV Oliver's season was much better than Viney's!

Here we go Head to Head Clayton Oliver CLEARLY HAD a much better season than Viney !!!

CLAYTON OLIVER

Season 2020 Totals/Averages     GM K HB D M G GA B T HO FF FA CL CG I50 R50 AF * SC *  Total 17 195 230 425 57 3 9 1 92 0 22 22 110 69 64 27 1,559 2,078  Average 17 11.5 13.5 25.0 3.4 0.2 0.5 0.1 5.4 0 1.3 1.3 6.5 4.1 3.8 1.6 91.7 122.2

* AFL Fantasy (AF) and Supercoach (SC) stats only include regular season.

2020 Statistical Rankings     ●  Ranked 15th in Total Inside 50s   ●  Ranked 5th in Total Handballs     ●  Ranked 6th in Total Disposals   ●  Ranked 5th in Total Tackles   ●  Ranked 5th in Total Supercoach Score   ●  Ranked 7th in Total AFL Fantasy Score   ●  Ranked 1st in Total Contested Possessions   ●  Ranked 7th in Total Effective Disposals   ●  Ranked 2nd in Total Clangers   ●  Ranked 1st in Total Clearances   ●  Ranked 6th in Total Centre Clearances   ●  Ranked 1st in Total Stoppage Clearances   ●  Ranked 13th in Total Turnovers   ●  Ranked 6th in Handballs Per Game   ●  Ranked 9th in Disposals Per Game   ●  Ranked 8th in Tackles Per Game   ●  Ranked 3rd in Supercoach Score Per Game   ●  Ranked 6th in AFL Fantasy Score Per Game   ●  Ranked 2nd in Contested Possessions Per Game   ●  Ranked 9th in Effective Disposals Per Game   ●  Ranked 6th in Clangers Per Game   ●  Ranked 1st in Clearances Per Game   ●  Ranked 6th in Centre Clearances Per Game   ●  Ranked 2nd in Stoppage Clearances Per Game   ●  Ranked 18th in Turnovers Per Game

Season Highlights      ●    31 disps (17 kicks 14 hballs), 3 marks, 5 tackles and a goal in Rd 11 57-pt win over North Melbourne at Adelaide Oval (9 Aug 2020)    ●    34 disps (17 kicks 17 hballs), 5 marks, 6 tackles and a goal in Rd 10 51-pt win over Adelaide at Adelaide Oval (5 Aug 2020)    ●    28 disps (12 kicks 16 hballs), 5 marks and 10 tackles in Rd 8 4-pt loss to Brisbane at Metricon Stadium (26 Jul 2020)    ●    29 disps (16 kicks 13 hballs), 6 marks and 6 tackles in Rd 7 43-pt win over Hawthorn at GIANTS Stadium (19 Jul 2020)    ●    28 disps (12 kicks 16 hballs), 5 marks and 5 tackles in Rd 2 1-pt win over Carlton at Marvel Stadium (13 Jun 2020)

JACK VINEY

Season 2020 Totals/Averages     GM K HB D M G GA B T HO FF FA CL CG I50 R50 AF * SC *  Total 16 166 152 318 40 5 10 4 67 0 28 15 82 55 68 13 1,207 1,593  Average 16 10.4 9.5 19.9 2.5 0.3 0.6 0.2 4.2 0 1.8 0.9 5.1 3.4 4.2 0.8 75.4 99.6

* AFL Fantasy (AF) and Supercoach (SC) stats only include regular season.

2020 Statistical Rankings     ●  Ranked 13th in Total Inside 50s   ●  Ranked 16th in Total Contested Possessions     ●  Ranked 13th in Total Clangers   ●  Ranked 15th in Total Clearances   ●  Ranked 9th in Total Centre Clearances   ●  Ranked 20th in Total Stoppage Clearances   ●  Ranked 8th in Total Turnovers   ●  Ranked 8th in Inside 50s Per Game   ●  Ranked 11th in Contested Possessions Per Game   ●  Ranked 12th in Clearances Per Game   ●  Ranked 13th in Centre Clearances Per Game   ●  Ranked 20th in Stoppage Clearances Per Game   ●  Ranked 2nd in Turnovers Per Game

Season Highlights      ●    27 disps (14 kicks 13 hballs) and 5 tackles in Rd 16 14-pt loss to Fremantle at Cazaly's Stadium (7 Sep 2020)    ●    34 disps (14 kicks 20 hballs), 5 marks, 6 tackles and a goal in Rd 1 27-pt loss to West Coast at Optus Stadium (22 Mar 2020)

Edited October 6, 20204 yr by picket fence

Wth do we have to go through this every couple of years when we have a star on our list?

3 minutes ago, jumbo returns said:

Wth do we have to go through this every couple of years when we have a star on our list?

Because we perennially underperform and thus attract a minimum loyalty bonus. The chance of a premiership is worth 10-20% salary wise. Interstate clubs have a similar benefit when trying to recruit or retain players "native"to their state.

Carlton would be into everything other than brown plastic bags, but i think that i could make a clear choice between the  value to MFC of one on baller over another. I hope that works out....

23 minutes ago, picket fence said:

Yes I do as well, however IMV Oliver's season was much better than Viney's!

Here we go Head to Head Clayton Oliver CLEARLY HAD a much better season than Viney !!!

CLAYTON OLIVER

Season 2020 Totals/Averages     GM K HB D M G GA B T HO FF FA CL CG I50 R50 AF * SC *  Total 17 195 230 425 57 3 9 1 92 0 22 22 110 69 64 27 1,559 2,078  Average 17 11.5 13.5 25.0 3.4 0.2 0.5 0.1 5.4 0 1.3 1.3 6.5 4.1 3.8 1.6 91.7 122.2

* AFL Fantasy (AF) and Supercoach (SC) stats only include regular season.

2020 Statistical Rankings     ●  Ranked 15th in Total Inside 50s   ●  Ranked 5th in Total Handballs     ●  Ranked 6th in Total Disposals   ●  Ranked 5th in Total Tackles   ●  Ranked 5th in Total Supercoach Score   ●  Ranked 7th in Total AFL Fantasy Score   ●  Ranked 1st in Total Contested Possessions   ●  Ranked 7th in Total Effective Disposals   ●  Ranked 2nd in Total Clangers   ●  Ranked 1st in Total Clearances   ●  Ranked 6th in Total Centre Clearances   ●  Ranked 1st in Total Stoppage Clearances   ●  Ranked 13th in Total Turnovers   ●  Ranked 6th in Handballs Per Game   ●  Ranked 9th in Disposals Per Game   ●  Ranked 8th in Tackles Per Game   ●  Ranked 3rd in Supercoach Score Per Game   ●  Ranked 6th in AFL Fantasy Score Per Game   ●  Ranked 2nd in Contested Possessions Per Game   ●  Ranked 9th in Effective Disposals Per Game   ●  Ranked 6th in Clangers Per Game   ●  Ranked 1st in Clearances Per Game   ●  Ranked 6th in Centre Clearances Per Game   ●  Ranked 2nd in Stoppage Clearances Per Game   ●  Ranked 18th in Turnovers Per Game

Season Highlights      ●    31 disps (17 kicks 14 hballs), 3 marks, 5 tackles and a goal in Rd 11 57-pt win over North Melbourne at Adelaide Oval (9 Aug 2020)    ●    34 disps (17 kicks 17 hballs), 5 marks, 6 tackles and a goal in Rd 10 51-pt win over Adelaide at Adelaide Oval (5 Aug 2020)    ●    28 disps (12 kicks 16 hballs), 5 marks and 10 tackles in Rd 8 4-pt loss to Brisbane at Metricon Stadium (26 Jul 2020)    ●    29 disps (16 kicks 13 hballs), 6 marks and 6 tackles in Rd 7 43-pt win over Hawthorn at GIANTS Stadium (19 Jul 2020)    ●    28 disps (12 kicks 16 hballs), 5 marks and 5 tackles in Rd 2 1-pt win over Carlton at Marvel Stadium (13 Jun 2020)

JACK VINEY

Season 2020 Totals/Averages     GM K HB D M G GA B T HO FF FA CL CG I50 R50 AF * SC *  Total 16 166 152 318 40 5 10 4 67 0 28 15 82 55 68 13 1,207 1,593  Average 16 10.4 9.5 19.9 2.5 0.3 0.6 0.2 4.2 0 1.8 0.9 5.1 3.4 4.2 0.8 75.4 99.6

* AFL Fantasy (AF) and Supercoach (SC) stats only include regular season.

2020 Statistical Rankings     ●  Ranked 13th in Total Inside 50s   ●  Ranked 16th in Total Contested Possessions     ●  Ranked 13th in Total Clangers   ●  Ranked 15th in Total Clearances   ●  Ranked 9th in Total Centre Clearances   ●  Ranked 20th in Total Stoppage Clearances   ●  Ranked 8th in Total Turnovers   ●  Ranked 8th in Inside 50s Per Game   ●  Ranked 11th in Contested Possessions Per Game   ●  Ranked 12th in Clearances Per Game   ●  Ranked 13th in Centre Clearances Per Game   ●  Ranked 20th in Stoppage Clearances Per Game   ●  Ranked 2nd in Turnovers Per Game

Season Highlights      ●    27 disps (14 kicks 13 hballs) and 5 tackles in Rd 16 14-pt loss to Fremantle at Cazaly's Stadium (7 Sep 2020)    ●    34 disps (14 kicks 20 hballs), 5 marks, 6 tackles and a goal in Rd 1 27-pt loss to West Coast at Optus Stadium (22 Mar 2020)

Viney works hard for an average of only 20 disposals. 

3 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

Oliver’s bad habits - 1m handballs, inability to absorb contact then handball to space, rash playing on in traffic, refusing to drive forward from a stoppage and kick to space - have to be corrected to make him the player he should be.

If the coaches know this and there’s tension with Oliver then good, he’ll be a better player for it.

If Oliver knows it and the coaches can’t help him then maybe we’ll wake up and fix the coaching. 

 

A good mate of mine who played 200 odd games of VFL/AFL made an "Astute" observation to me on the phone the other night.

He said he detected a noticeable increase in Clayton Olivers decision making at around the half way part of the season. In essence he believes he made much better decisive decisions to Accelerate out of the packs rather than the obligatory dishoff handball. He believes Clayton Olivers peripheral vision to be as good as ANY in the game and a key factor in his split second footy nous. Now yes I know some of his handballs have been erroneous but the other aspect that my mate suggested is that too many teammates are standing flat footed instead of being as aware as they should be.

Interesting stuff! He also said put Oliver in a top 4 side and he stressed top 4 and he said he would become Extremely elite and win a Brownlow!

Edited October 6, 20204 yr by picket fence

7 minutes ago, picket fence said:

A good mate of mine who played 200 odd games of VFL/AFL made an "Astute" observation to me on the phone the other night.

He said he detected a noticeable increase in Clayton Olivers decision making at around the half way part of the season. In essence he believes he made much better decisive decisions to Accelerate out of the packs rather than the obligatory dishoff handball. He believes Clayton Olivers peripheral vision to be as good as ANY in the game and a key factor in his split second footy nous. Now yes I know some of his handballs have been erroneous but the other aspect that my mate suggested is that too many teammates are standing flat footed instead of being as aware as they should be.

Interesting stuff! He also said put Oliver in a top 4 side and he stressed top 4 and he said he would become Extremely elite and win a Brownlow!

Picket - I know you're happy enough being the class clown but I also know you're astute enough to already know the above without the backing of a VFL/AFL veteran. The only difference in my opinion is putting Oliver in a top-4 team to realise his potential. His potential will put us in the top-4. Trac didn't need to go to Richmond to step up and take responsibility. 

12 minutes ago, picket fence said:

A good mate of mine who played 200 odd games of VFL/AFL made an "Astute" observation to me on the phone the other night.

He said he detected a noticeable increase in Clayton Olivers decision making at around the half way part of the season. In essence he believes he made much better decisive decisions to Accelerate out of the packs rather than the obligatory dishoff handball. He believes Clayton Olivers peripheral vision to be as good as ANY in the game and a key factor in his split second footy nous. Now yes I know some of his handballs have been erroneous but the other aspect that my mate suggested is that too many teammates are standing flat footed instead of being as aware as they should be.

Interesting stuff! He also said put Oliver in a top 4 side and he stressed top 4 and he said he would become Extremely elite and win a Brownlow!

Totally agree. He is now ready to become a man. Like Trac did this year, I believe he can be top ten in the comp in the next year or two. I know Trac took a year longer than many hoped and hopefully Clayton can do it next year and we are the top 4 side your mate is talking about.

16 minutes ago, picket fence said:

A good mate of mine who played 200 odd games of VFL/AFL made an "Astute" observation to me on the phone the other night.

He said he detected a noticeable increase in Clayton Olivers decision making at around the half way part of the season. In essence he believes he made much better decisive decisions to Accelerate out of the packs rather than the obligatory dishoff handball. He believes Clayton Olivers peripheral vision to be as good as ANY in the game and a key factor in his split second footy nous. Now yes I know some of his handballs have been erroneous but the other aspect that my mate suggested is that too many teammates are standing flat footed instead of being as aware as they should be.

Interesting stuff! He also said put Oliver in a top 4 side and he stressed top 4 and he said he would become Extremely elite and win a Brownlow!

Agree with this. Oliver had a few poor games early in the season where he was flicking handballs around too quickly. Then he made the change to take more responsibly and run out of packs. Made a massive difference. 

3 hours ago, Deemania since 56 said:

Amusing thing is that the more Sam says to feel relevant, the further he steps back in the realm of reality of which, relevance is an essential. As a journalist in sport, he must be encouraged to quote on the occurrences, the post-game reviews because he is way off the mark when it comes to cause and effect. Speculation is no reliable ally when credibility is at stake. All the rest is pillow-talk.

 

Do you know who Sam's mentor is Caroline Wilson, he says she is the best in the game, and  he says she only tells the truth

2 hours ago, picket fence said:

Yes I do as well, however IMV Oliver's season was much better than Viney's!

Here we go Head to Head Clayton Oliver CLEARLY HAD a much better season than Viney !!!

CLAYTON OLIVER

Season 2020 Totals/Averages     GM K HB D M G GA B T HO FF FA CL CG I50 R50 AF * SC *  Total 17 195 230 425 57 3 9 1 92 0 22 22 110 69 64 27 1,559 2,078  Average 17 11.5 13.5 25.0 3.4 0.2 0.5 0.1 5.4 0 1.3 1.3 6.5 4.1 3.8 1.6 91.7 122.2

* AFL Fantasy (AF) and Supercoach (SC) stats only include regular season.

2020 Statistical Rankings     ●  Ranked 15th in Total Inside 50s   ●  Ranked 5th in Total Handballs     ●  Ranked 6th in Total Disposals   ●  Ranked 5th in Total Tackles   ●  Ranked 5th in Total Supercoach Score   ●  Ranked 7th in Total AFL Fantasy Score   ●  Ranked 1st in Total Contested Possessions   ●  Ranked 7th in Total Effective Disposals   ●  Ranked 2nd in Total Clangers   ●  Ranked 1st in Total Clearances   ●  Ranked 6th in Total Centre Clearances   ●  Ranked 1st in Total Stoppage Clearances   ●  Ranked 13th in Total Turnovers   ●  Ranked 6th in Handballs Per Game   ●  Ranked 9th in Disposals Per Game   ●  Ranked 8th in Tackles Per Game   ●  Ranked 3rd in Supercoach Score Per Game   ●  Ranked 6th in AFL Fantasy Score Per Game   ●  Ranked 2nd in Contested Possessions Per Game   ●  Ranked 9th in Effective Disposals Per Game   ●  Ranked 6th in Clangers Per Game   ●  Ranked 1st in Clearances Per Game   ●  Ranked 6th in Centre Clearances Per Game   ●  Ranked 2nd in Stoppage Clearances Per Game   ●  Ranked 18th in Turnovers Per Game

Season Highlights      ●    31 disps (17 kicks 14 hballs), 3 marks, 5 tackles and a goal in Rd 11 57-pt win over North Melbourne at Adelaide Oval (9 Aug 2020)    ●    34 disps (17 kicks 17 hballs), 5 marks, 6 tackles and a goal in Rd 10 51-pt win over Adelaide at Adelaide Oval (5 Aug 2020)    ●    28 disps (12 kicks 16 hballs), 5 marks and 10 tackles in Rd 8 4-pt loss to Brisbane at Metricon Stadium (26 Jul 2020)    ●    29 disps (16 kicks 13 hballs), 6 marks and 6 tackles in Rd 7 43-pt win over Hawthorn at GIANTS Stadium (19 Jul 2020)    ●    28 disps (12 kicks 16 hballs), 5 marks and 5 tackles in Rd 2 1-pt win over Carlton at Marvel Stadium (13 Jun 2020)

JACK VINEY

Season 2020 Totals/Averages     GM K HB D M G GA B T HO FF FA CL CG I50 R50 AF * SC *  Total 16 166 152 318 40 5 10 4 67 0 28 15 82 55 68 13 1,207 1,593  Average 16 10.4 9.5 19.9 2.5 0.3 0.6 0.2 4.2 0 1.8 0.9 5.1 3.4 4.2 0.8 75.4 99.6

* AFL Fantasy (AF) and Supercoach (SC) stats only include regular season.

2020 Statistical Rankings     ●  Ranked 13th in Total Inside 50s   ●  Ranked 16th in Total Contested Possessions     ●  Ranked 13th in Total Clangers   ●  Ranked 15th in Total Clearances   ●  Ranked 9th in Total Centre Clearances   ●  Ranked 20th in Total Stoppage Clearances   ●  Ranked 8th in Total Turnovers   ●  Ranked 8th in Inside 50s Per Game   ●  Ranked 11th in Contested Possessions Per Game   ●  Ranked 12th in Clearances Per Game   ●  Ranked 13th in Centre Clearances Per Game   ●  Ranked 20th in Stoppage Clearances Per Game   ●  Ranked 2nd in Turnovers Per Game

Season Highlights      ●    27 disps (14 kicks 13 hballs) and 5 tackles in Rd 16 14-pt loss to Fremantle at Cazaly's Stadium (7 Sep 2020)    ●    34 disps (14 kicks 20 hballs), 5 marks, 6 tackles and a goal in Rd 1 27-pt loss to West Coast at Optus Stadium (22 Mar 2020)

In the year that Jack has had to experience with being in a hub with a newborn and still trying to perform every week would have been incredibly difficult.  Not sure how many have kids but they would have been up every 2-3 hrs to feed and that’s if the baby was a good sleeper.  There is no doubt this would have impacted his 2nd half of the year 

I hope this is in the realm of New Idea reporting. You know the sort of story, A friend of a friend's cousin's hairdresser's sister told me.......

 

7 minutes ago, Dame Gaga said:

I hope this is in the realm of New Idea reporting. You know the sort of story, A friend of a friend's cousin's hairdresser's sister told me.......

Got to expect it when you have a player of Oliver’s ability with massive upside, look at Fyfes name thrown round every year round this time. Trades for players of his value almost never happen outside of free agency, it’s just not worth the cost to the team chasing . Look how much even mid tier players go for in trades, ie Lever. Judd would be the last one and look how that worked out for WC

Edited October 6, 20204 yr by Garbo

This rumor is trash.

Oliver is a gun inside midfielder and will only get better as he matures further and expands his skill set to become more damaging forward of centre.

“Extremely elite”... that’s is great, extremely great!

4 minutes ago, Lord Travis said:

This rumor is trash.

Oliver is a gun inside midfielder and will only get better as he matures further and expands his skill set to become more damaging forward of centre.

There seems to be a bit of Chinese whispers going on I think. There's a bunch of rumours that have become intertwined and turned into something else.

Not super reliable sources for all this, but the different elements are:

- Sketchy rumour that Cripps may request a trade to WA due to an illness of his partner. (Not a good source at this stage)

- Carlton approached Melbourne about Oliver (perhaps knowing the above) but were immediately shot down. (Good source)

- Oliver was 'angry' about his Bluey placing. However it wasn't anger at the club/coaches, it was just a reflection of his competitiveness and maturity (or lack thereof). (Tom Morris, who obviously has MFC connections, spoke about this a few days ago)

I think those things have merged into 'Oliver is angry about his BnF placing and has requested a trade to Carlton'.

3 minutes ago, Lord Nev said:

There seems to be a bit of Chinese whispers going on I think. There's a bunch of rumours that have become intertwined and turned into something else.

Agree.  Carlton have offered a bucket load of cash to Saad and Williams, both are reasonable players, but Clarrie would want at least double what they are going to get which would blow their TPP out of the water. 

17 minutes ago, Lord Nev said:

 

- Sketchy rumour that Cripps may request a trade to WA due to an illness of his partner. (Not a good source at this stage)-

Not the first time I’ve heard this

22 minutes ago, Lord Nev said:

There seems to be a bit of Chinese whispers going on I think. There's a bunch of rumours that have become intertwined and turned into something else.

Not super reliable sources for all this, but the different elements are:

- Sketchy rumour that Cripps may request a trade to WA due to an illness of his partner. (Not a good source at this stage)

- Carlton approached Melbourne about Oliver (perhaps knowing the above) but were immediately shot down. (Good source)

- Oliver was 'angry' about his Bluey placing. However it wasn't anger at the club/coaches, it was just a reflection of his competitiveness and maturity (or lack thereof). (Tom Morris, who obviously has MFC connections, spoke about this a few days ago)

I think those things have merged into 'Oliver is angry about his BnF placing and has requested a trade to Carlton'.

The Cripps one has been doing the rounds on Bigfooty for a week or so. 

13 minutes ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

The Cripps one has been doing the rounds on Bigfooty for a week or so. 

Cripps is a poor mans Clayton Oliver 

12 minutes ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

The Cripps one has been doing the rounds on Bigfooty for a week or so. 

BF = Fake News -  unlike our very own trade breaker!

12 hours ago, Demons11 said:

I feel your frustration but there is a chance of him leaving, so this thread will continue for a long time unfortunately 

....but there's no chance he's leaving. nothing of fact has even come out. in fact, the reporter that initially reported it when backwards on it very quickly when he realised how big the outrage/speculation was going to be. 

3 hours ago, Dame Gaga said:

I hope this is in the realm of New Idea reporting. You know the sort of story, A friend of a friend's cousin's hairdresser's sister told me.......

If it was New Idea, Clarrie would have been spotted with a diamond engagement ring and is suspected to be pregnant.

2 minutes ago, Mazer Rackham said:

If it was New Idea, Clarrie would have been spotted with a diamond engagement ring and is suspected to be pregnant.

With a black haired baby.