PREGAME: Rd 13 vs Collingwood

[Deefender 232]

No doubt the four points count.

But there’s more to be gained by beating Collingwood when they’re at full strength. 
 

 

[beelzebub 23,379]

The Royal Weekend's Game  will be won by the better defence.

Who ever is selected,  or not, needs to be part of a 'one minded'  seemless team effort down there. 

We've no discernable or obvious plan of attack ( other than Hail Mary be thy name) but we can possibly cobble up something to get the leather thing through the sticks.

We simply need to thwart any ability of the Pies to get creative.

In that vein i dont mind loading it with May, Lever, Hibberd, Salem,  throw in Tommo , Rivers McVee

[Bitter but optimistic 22,241]

3 minutes ago, deefender said:

No doubt the four points count.

But there’s more to be gained by beating Collingwood when they’re at full strength. 
 

 

No ! I'd quite enjoy kicking the [censored] out of them while they're down.

[deanox 9,931]

3 hours ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

I watched a local match yesterday and was surprised to see a couple of players get yellow-carded and another was given a red card. I didn’t know that was a thing. I think it’s necessary and should be adopted at AFL level. Dude who was red-carded will think twice next time. 

I'd be open to a red card system only with a couple of caveats:

- It needs to be administered by a live, offfield MRO, not on field umpire and not a powerless "tv ref". Red card must also equal suspension/tribunal. We can't have MRO downgrading a red card incident after the fact.

-Intentional assault type, off the ball, can be a red card.

-In play activities should only be red card if another player is ruled out of the game through injury as a result of the reportable action.

[BDA 22,755]

16 minutes ago, deefender said:

No doubt the four points count.

But there’s more to be gained by beating Collingwood when they’re at full strength. 
 

 

I'd prefer if half their team was injured or suspended.

[Jjrogan 1,420]

2 hours ago, Sydney_Demon said:

I disagree entirely. Who cares that every other game has a red card? Irrelevant. Nearly every other country doesn't have compulsory and preferential voting. We do and are all the better for it. Don't change something that doesn't need fixing. What exactly is your argument for the red card? I assume that that will somehow change behaviour and punish the perpetrating team. Kossie got rightfully suspended earlier in the year which is what he deserved and it punished the team. The same will happen for De Goey and Colingwood (as it should). That is appropriate deterrent and means quick assessments on-field that are subsequently overturned won't have unjust consequences.

The relevance to pointing to other codes is that it's not something that's going to destroy the fabric of a sporting contest not because we should be like them.  The game has enough uniqueness regardless.  

My argument is twofold

A) if a player is doing something that is against the rules/spirit of the game, there should be immediate consequences. The game has been played for over a  century and yes guys dont go around punching blokes but the fact junior levels of the game have them tells me it is used as a deterrent. What we now know about concussions the penalties need to be greater quite simply.  As far as I can tell the penaltty right now is still getting paid, sitting out a few weeks, getting your body in good shape and coming back to the claps of your supporters.   If you a big reason you lose a match, now that is a deterrent. 

B) the relatively fairness of one team having an extra player. In the old days, Hewitt would have kept playing. Maybe to his detriment. But now that there is a concussion protocol and the player cannot take further part, its grossly unfair that a team can be penalised for doing the right thing (subbing him off), whilst the infracting team is essentially "rewarded" by doing the wrong thing (fresher legs).  JDG's actions gave the Filth an advantage.

5 years ago I was in your camp, but what's changed is that both concussion needs a stronger deterrent and the unfariness of what is not an accidental act.  

Of course, what is accidental, what is clumsy etc needs to have immediate decision but as I mentioned its not rocket science.. Mistakes may be made but by and large with video now they dont.    Anyway, thats my logic. 

Fwiw, I hope he gets 4*

*Years 

Edited June 4, 2023 by Jjrogan

[jnrmac 20,097]

1 hour ago, Diamond Tim said:

Am interested in match ups in the backline - May on Mihocek / Lever takes Ash Johnson / Hibbo tags Elliot / Thommo sits Cox with support from Gawn and Gundy....

Simply cannot let Cox run and jump at the ball. Must get body on him.

[SPC 3,549]

2 minutes ago, jnrmac said:

Simply cannot let Cox run and jump at the ball. Must get body on him.

Agree, but bloke flops when he feels body pressure and umpires can’t blow whistles quick enough. 

[loges 6,767]

Yellow card anyone ?

[Graeme Yeats' Mullet 6,778]

1 hour ago, Bitter but optimistic said:

No ! I'd quite enjoy kicking the [censored] out of them while they're down.

Great sentiment 👏 

[titan_uranus 25,020]

1 hour ago, deefender said:

No doubt the four points count.

But there’s more to be gained by beating Collingwood when they’re at full strength. 

This reads like you are already laying the foundations to be pessimistic if we win.

[monoccular 17,432]

On 6/3/2023 at 1:08 PM, Wadda We Sing said:

None of the Ins and Outs here seem to include Viney as a possible Out. Is it not line ball as to whether he gets a fine or a week? (or has this been resolved?) We desperately need his hardness at the ball for this game.

I dont like the idea of Moore on JVR, please bring in another tall if possible. Collingwood will look to do a Watts on him, Ill never forget that rag doll stuff.

Much will depend on Clarrys training this week. Lets hope its not too early for his return.

Im not too worried if we dont win, as long as its under 3 goals.

 

WWS - JVR isn’t JW. 

[titan_uranus 25,020]

3 hours ago, Sydney_Demon said:

I accept your argument that structure is important but don't accept that having both Hibbo and Tomlinson in the side, presumedly because Bowey is out, will work. That wil negatively affect our structure imo. Hibbo in for Tommo, Deakyn Smith for Bowey, JJ in for Harmes.

I'm in the opposite camp, in that I think going with May + Lever, then Hibberd, then smalls, is a worse structure than May + Lever + Tomlinson/Turner/Petty, then Hibberd, then smalls.

When we play sides with at least two good tall forwards the former structure requires either/both of Lever to play with less freedom and Hibberd to play taller than he is. I've seen enough from Hibberd this year to believe he has enough run and gun to be a smaller defender than a taller one, and the addition of a third tall helps allow Lever to zone off.

[beelzebub 23,379]

2 hours ago, deefender said:

No doubt the four points count.

But there’s more to be gained by beating Collingwood when they’re at full strength. 
 

 

We only get to play who turns up.

So who ever it is...we better TURN UP.

Just need a win. 

[beelzebub 23,379]

2 minutes ago, monoccular said:

WWS - JVR isn’t JW. 

And it's not his first game ;) 

[binman 43,020]

4 hours ago, Sydney_Demon said:

I disagree entirely. Who cares that every other game has a red card? Irrelevant. Nearly every other country doesn't have compulsory and preferential voting. We do and are all the better for it. Don't change something that doesn't need fixing. What exactly is your argument for the red card? I assume that that will somehow change behaviour and punish the perpetrating team. Kossie got rightfully suspended earlier in the year which is what he deserved and it punished the team. The same will happen for De Goey and Colingwood (as it should). That is appropriate deterrent and means quick assessments on-field that are subsequently overturned won't have unjust consequences.

I agree with all of those points.

But I support a red card, in very clearly defined scenarios (which by their nature are relatively rare), when it results in the opposition losing a player.

That hit happened near the end of the second quarter. The kid was playing well. And then knocked out, and can't come back on. Dog act.

They lost hurn and West and with hewiit off, were down to two on the bench for a big chunk of that game. 

Losing hewiit was a huge disadvantage for the Eagles. Unlikely to have been a difference between winning and losing, but there's plenty of examples where it has.

And I'm persuaded by the argument, what if that happened 5 minutes in to a grand final - let's say de Goey knocks tracc out cold. 

Play on?

Edited June 4, 2023 by binman

[rjay 24,939]

On 6/3/2023 at 8:30 PM, JimmyGadson said:

Injuries also to Hoskin-Elliott and McCreery although I'm not sure of the severity. 

De Goey gone also helps. 

Collingwood showed weakness today and whilst I said less than 24 hours ago that I don't think we could win on current form, I think we csn give them a shake if we bring serious heat all game. 

I would prefer to play them with both teams at full strength.

That's where the real lessons are to be learned.

Looks like De Goey will be having a well earned mid season break so there goes that idea.

It's still going to be a great challenge and should set us up well for the 2nd half of the season.

[Stiff Arm 4,419]

This a game worth 8 premiership points 

Win and we're back in the hunt for top 2. 

Lose and we are a strong chance to miss out on top 4

[Dr. Gonzo 24,225]

1 hour ago, binman said:

I agree with all of those points.

But I support a red card, in very clearly defined scenarios (which by their nature are relatively rare), when it results in the opposition losing a player.

That hit happened near the end of the second quarter. The kid was playing well. And then knocked out, and can't come back on. Dog act.

They lost hurn and West and with hewiit off, were down to two on the bench for a big chunk of that game. 

Losing hewiit was a huge disadvantage for the Eagles. Unlikely to have been a difference between winning and losing, but there's plenty of examples where it has.

And I'm persuaded by the argument, what if that happened 5 minutes in to a grand final - let's say de Goey knocks tracc out cold. 

Play on?

Then Viney and Sparrow go berserk.

[binman 43,020]

1 hour ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Then Viney and Sparrow go berserk.

The Malachi crunch

 

Edited June 4, 2023 by binman

[John Demonic 5,804]

2 hours ago, Stiff Arm said:

This a game worth 8 premiership points 

Win and we're back in the hunt for top 2. 

Lose and we are a strong chance to miss out on top 4

This sounds more like the the voice over for the fox footy round intro.

Lose and we'll still by in the top 4, either by percentage or by 4 points and percentage.

[Deestar9 1,635]

10 hours ago, Gawndy the Great said:

I heard there was some tendon involved - so much bs in the media don’t know what to believe.

With De Goey out maybe we just give him the extra 2 weeks to get cherry ripe. 

Maybe we just trust our fitness team 🤔

[Tolstoys Nudge 1,672]

On 6/2/2023 at 11:18 PM, DeelightfulPlay said:

My mail is that BBB will come in after the bye.  Apparently he is doing a mini pre-season again like in 2021 and they want him firing for end of year

Yup, as I mentioned 2-3wks back BBB 💯 in after bye has always been plan! When is dependant on swelling of knee being right.. Melksham would’ve come in ahead of Smith but now Smith has the spot so he’ll keep it, he helped Fritta immensely, added some speed for pressure, contested at height with leaps & offers versatility if needed so wouldn’t shock me if Tommo goes and Smith plays fwd & heads back if Lever is needed to be freed up! But BBB isn’t done with —- played great footy early this year & finishes well. Right now I’d back Chandler to go for BBB round 13-15ish.

[Kent 2,910]

20 hours ago, kev martin said:

Collingwood seem to want to choose when they "go" or not. If they play that kind of arrogant game plan, we will easily beat them. Especially without De Goey effecting the midfield battle.

I expect them to be "going", and we have to be "going" with them. If they get a good lead we will be done. This year we are better at playing for the 4 quarters. We've lost the capacity to put several goals on in short periods regularly (can't rely on a good burst) . 

If we sustain our pressure, effort and complete the fundamentals well for the 4 quarters, then we go a long way to beating them.

My question is, can the Woods play a hard fought 4 quarter game, as I think we can?

Go Dees

I don't think they can West coast pressure third quarter had them worried

DEES will bring manic pressure unrelenting and the Pies will fall

[pitmaster 3,561]

11 hours ago, monoccular said:

WWS - JVR isn’t JW. 

Neither in terms of his physical development nor in his mental approach to physical contests.