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Who would you have taken with pick # 3 - recruiters



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9 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Yeah was told his game against WA was far from flattering. I think that and lack of pace. If you aren't bursting off half back and breaking the lines then there's only so many places you can kick the ball. Even at 100% efficiency good teams don't leave huge gaps the same way the under 18's do.

The Grant Birchall comparison probably is about right and people forget how good Birchall was but at the same time are you racing out to use pick 3 on Birchall?

The most interesting part of the comments about Young was the recruiter who loved his midfield game and thought he could be Pendlebury based on one game. 30 touches of sublime ball use and decision making across the ground sure does sound nice - but why wasn't he given more midfield time in the NAB League?

After the championships, the Stingrays decided to push him up to a wing in the pointy end of the year and see if he could add a whole new element to his game. Within 3 weeks he was moved back to a half back flank because his body of work in the midfield wasn't probably wasn't up to a standard as they would have liked. 

That's the main query for me. If he struggled to make the adjustment to a midfield role in the Nab league, will he be able to do it at AFL intensity level?

Time will tell.

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In my view this is a very overplayed issue for us.  It's easy to forget that in 2018 we were the highest scoring team in the comp but some margin.  You don't do that unless you've got skill, move the

We only scored under 80 six times in 2018, and it was against Hawthorn, Richmond, Port Adelaide, Sydney, Geelong (EF) and West Coast (PF). Three good teams (although we were still runaway victors in t

I'm told we cooled on Young due to him going into his shell on the rare occasions he was up against it. And mids/flankers being available in every draft all throughout - opportunities to acquire uni

No disrespect to Luke but I would have taken Young or Green any day.

Big bodied defenders/midfielders & skillful at that, is an area we can obviously improve on. I cant help think that whilst this is an exciting time for any draftees,  unfortunately Luke  will be lucky to play any senior footy for 2 to 3 years. Good luck to him though......

Dylan Stephens rated as one of the best kicks, fast, amazing endurance, inside & outside player......obvious choice for a team that lacks pace & skill.

I just don't get it.

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1 hour ago, Laughing Goat said:

No disrespect to Luke but I would have taken Young or Green any day.

Big bodied defenders/midfielders & skillful at that, is an area we can obviously improve on. I cant help think that whilst this is an exciting time for any draftees,  unfortunately Luke  will be lucky to play any senior footy for 2 to 3 years. Good luck to him though......

Dylan Stephens rated as one of the best kicks, fast, amazing endurance, inside & outside player......obvious choice for a team that lacks pace & skill.

I just don't get it.

I'm with you ridens capra! Its as though the footy department are very very happy with the list as it is.  Neither Jackson of Kickett will play 2020. I thought perhaps if 2019 was an aberration then we would be filling holes and needs to make another tilt at finals

Obviously not>

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5 hours ago, Lord Travis said:

I’m a Young fan and was disappointed we didn’t take him at 3, but it’s done now.

Fremantle were the big winners last night. Young, Serong and Henry is about the best collection of prospects you could ever hope to draft at those picks. They’re building a superb list now. Very jealous.

As a MFC supporter - Melbourne were the big winners last night. We gained a real prospect in Jackson and a talented Pickett. MInd you I am biased due to the fact I follow the Demons.

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1 hour ago, Laughing Goat said:

No disrespect to Luke but I would have taken Young or Green any day.

Big bodied defenders/midfielders & skillful at that, is an area we can obviously improve on. I cant help think that whilst this is an exciting time for any draftees,  unfortunately Luke  will be lucky to play any senior footy for 2 to 3 years. Good luck to him though......

Dylan Stephens rated as one of the best kicks, fast, amazing endurance, inside & outside player......obvious choice for a team that lacks pace & skill.

I just don't get it.

There’s more chance Jackson plays round 1 than doesn’t play at all next year. 

94kg and runs a very solid 2km time trial. He’s raw but has the size and endurance to play against men straight away. If there was a betting line on games played I’d put it at about 8.5 if not higher.

Stephens was my pick of the rest but he’s 183cm and very light. A lack of aerial ability or contested ground ball ability could see him struggle to play inside or outside early. He projects as a half forward early in his career in my opinion. 

Every year a number of top 10 picks thrive early and plenty don’t. And you get guys who don’t debut who go on to be Tom Mitchell and you get others who play every game and become Lewis Taylor. That’s why you draft best available and develop a list instead of attempting to fill gaps. 

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2 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

There’s more chance Jackson plays round 1 than doesn’t play at all next year. 

94kg and runs a very solid 2km time trial. He’s raw but has the size and endurance to play against men straight away. If there was a betting line on games played I’d put it at about 8.5 if not higher.

Stephens was my pick of the rest but he’s 183cm and very light. A lack of aerial ability or contested ground ball ability could see him struggle to play inside or outside early. He projects as a half forward early in his career in my opinion. 

Every year a number of top 10 picks thrive early and plenty don’t. And you get guys who don’t debut who go on to be Tom Mitchell and you get others who play every game and become Lewis Taylor. That’s why you draft best available and develop a list instead of attempting to fill gaps. 

Yep fair call DS but size , weight, aggression etc doesn't seem to be an issue at our club.....speed, poise & skill definately is an issue &  highlighted by SG on numerous occassion's at the back end of 2019 season.

I'm not sure who's spot Jackson takes in round 1 (I hope he proves me wrong)

Stephens already dominated at SANFL which is clearly the second best competition outside of the AFL. Elite speed & endurance suggests that he's a midfielder, but your right with our coaches lofty opinions of our current midfield, no one drafted this year will break into that mix.

Just for a comparison.....Dylan Stephens: 184cm & 73kg & Ed Langdon: 182cm & 78kg

I'm not sure MFC have the time & luxury to develop a list'......especially after last years horror show & with Tomlinson, Langdon, Bennell, Brown & Vanders now available, I think  Goodwin is suggesting results & results quickly.

 

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3 minutes ago, Laughing Goat said:

Yep fair call DS but size , weight, aggression etc doesn't seem to be an issue at our club.....speed, poise & skill definately is an issue &  highlighted by SG on numerous occassion's at the back end of 2019 season.

 

In my view this is a very overplayed issue for us.  It's easy to forget that in 2018 we were the highest scoring team in the comp but some margin.  You don't do that unless you've got skill, move the ball quickly and know what you're doing.  There was a lot made of the "chaos" ball but again that was overplayed.

Last year we weren't fit, hadn't practiced and had around 15 injured most weeks.  That led to our lack of speed and poise.

I'm very excited about Jackson and Pickett.  I think we've drafted well and safely over the last 5 years but we've lacked flair, particularly once Garlett faded.  Now we have two very high octane X factor players, we have Bennell in the wings and we're fit for this time of year.

It's all pretty positive as far as I can see. I don't get excited over highlight tapes usually, but these guys really do have some tricks.

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5 minutes ago, Laughing Goat said:

Yep fair call DS but size , weight, aggression etc doesn't seem to be an issue at our club.....speed, poise & skill definately is an issue &  highlighted by SG on numerous occassion's at the back end of 2019 season.

I'm not sure who's spot Jackson takes in round 1 (I hope he proves me wrong)

Stephens already dominated at SANFL which is clearly the second best competition outside of the AFL. Elite speed & endurance suggests that he's a midfielder, but your right with our coaches lofty opinions of our current midfield, no one drafted this year will break into that mix.

Just for a comparison.....Dylan Stephens: 184cm & 73kg & Ed Langdon: 182cm & 78kg

I'm not sure MFC have the time & luxury to develop a list'......especially after last years horror show & with Tomlinson, Langdon, Bennell, Brown & Vanders now available, I think  Goodwin is suggesting results & results quickly.

 

None of Petty, Weideman or Preuss have locked down a spot, in fact there will be a 4 way battle with Jackson for 1-2 spots depending on how the team wants to play. Jackson has speed and skill for his size that will create opportunities for the little guys. 

I'm not sure that the SANFL is the second best comp outside the AFL, but sure it's a good state league. Stephens had 1 excellent game but averaged 18 disposals in a fairly open competition. Langdon knows what he needs to do to win the ball against AFL players, most outside mids struggle with that transition early. Whitfield - who is bigger, faster, more skilled than Stephens - took a number of years to truly be comfortable at the top level. 

Good clubs win games with senior players whilst developing kids at the same time. If they stop developing kids it's only because they run out of good draft choices. There will be plenty of opportunities to develop our kids. 

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6 minutes ago, Baghdad Bob said:

In my view this is a very overplayed issue for us.  It's easy to forget that in 2018 we were the highest scoring team in the comp but some margin.  You don't do that unless you've got skill, move the ball quickly and know what you're doing.  There was a lot made of the "chaos" ball but again that was overplayed.

Last year we weren't fit, hadn't practiced and had around 15 injured most weeks.  That led to our lack of speed and poise.

I'm very excited about Jackson and Pickett.  I think we've drafted well and safely over the last 5 years but we've lacked flair, particularly once Garlett faded.  Now we have two very high octane X factor players, we have Bennell in the wings and we're fit for this time of year.

It's all pretty positive as far as I can see. I don't get excited over highlight tapes usually, but these guys really do have some tricks.

We'd score 120+ on bad teams and 60 on good teams though, our system wasn't sustainable against good teams for most of the year. Only the last round against GWS and the first 2 finals pointed towards it working against top clubs.

That said.. I don't think long bombs to Hogan (as a full forward), ANB's flat track specials or Garlett really worked against good teams, so it was relying on Tommy Mc, Melksham and maybe Hannan . There's a chance we get Weid (like in the finals), Petty or Jackson as the 2nd tall, a big dose of Fritsch, Pickett crumbing alongside T Mc and Melk for a better forward line that makes so much more of the opportunities.

Then the wings didn't seem to work until Vanders came back in. He could be the missing ingredient but Langdon and Tomlinson might help. And more midfield Petracca to create high quality and quantity chances.

Sustainable defensive plan + the best parts of 2018 ball movement without the worst part (inefficient inside 50's) = success. 

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45 minutes ago, Laughing Goat said:

Yep fair call DS but size , weight, aggression etc doesn't seem to be an issue at our club.....speed, poise & skill definately is an issue &  highlighted by SG on numerous occassion's at the back end of 2019 season.

I'm not sure who's spot Jackson takes in round 1 (I hope he proves me wrong)

Stephens already dominated at SANFL which is clearly the second best competition outside of the AFL. Elite speed & endurance suggests that he's a midfielder, but your right with our coaches lofty opinions of our current midfield, no one drafted this year will break into that mix.

Just for a comparison.....Dylan Stephens: 184cm & 73kg & Ed Langdon: 182cm & 78kg

I'm not sure MFC have the time & luxury to develop a list'......especially after last years horror show & with Tomlinson, Langdon, Bennell, Brown & Vanders now available, I think  Goodwin is suggesting results & results quickly.

 

I think Jackson could very easily slot in alongside McDonald and Weideman and play 70-80% forward and 10-20% ruck.

This will allow us to play McDonald as the 3rd tall/roaming player that he is perfect for. Weid and Jackson can then rotate deep forward, keeping in mind both are very mobile also (Jackson obviously a lot more than Weid).

I think Petty could potentially lock down a spot in the backline if Oscar is struggling again also and I like the fact he is 197cm but also fairly mobile for his size.

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30 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

We'd score 120+ on bad teams and 60 on good teams though, our system wasn't sustainable against good teams for most of the year. Only the last round against GWS and the first 2 finals pointed towards it working against top clubs.

We only scored under 80 six times in 2018, and it was against Hawthorn, Richmond, Port Adelaide, Sydney, Geelong (EF) and West Coast (PF). Three good teams (although we were still runaway victors in the EF with a score of 10.15.75, accuracy a big factor in the low score) and three bog averages teams.

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I don’t mind the Jackson decision, I can understand them taking a risk on his potential as a fwd/ruck. I am nervous about the go home factor, Peter Sumich being his biggest footy  mentor and he loves Nic Nat. 🤷🏼‍♂️
 

I would’ve loved Kemp at 10 though.

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Article says 12 club recruiters and list managers. All are anonymous, of course. Might have been 2 list managers and a bunch of recruiting scouts. Easy to say when you don't have the pick and don't have to put your name to the comments.

Coulda, shoulda, didn't. 

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1 hour ago, Nasher said:

We only scored under 80 six times in 2018, and it was against Hawthorn, Richmond, Port Adelaide, Sydney, Geelong (EF) and West Coast (PF). Three good teams (although we were still runaway victors in the EF with a score of 10.15.75, accuracy a big factor in the low score) and three bog averages teams.

Up until round 21 the only finalist we’d played were Hawthorn, Richmond and Sydney who we all couldn’t score on, the Pies who we only put up a score through accurate kicking and a Geelong team that were the exception.

The stats might not be exactly accurate but it looked a lot like we could score for fun against the lesser teams but would bomb our way for nothing against the top sides. 

I think we saw last season with the complete lack of scoring and mid year changing of the forwards coach that it was more than just an underdone midfield. 

Anyway, Pickett should provide classy delivery not just goal scoring and Jackson can help scoring as either a ruck or forward. 

If we don’t draft another classy mid/forward player tonight it will be interesting to see if the run of Tomlinson and Langdon opens room for mids and forwards. Goodwin mentioned today they plan for Oliver to get out running in space more which in turn will have him kick more.

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30 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Up until round 21 the only finalist we’d played were Hawthorn, Richmond and Sydney who we all couldn’t score on, the Pies who we only put up a score through accurate kicking and a Geelong team that were the exception.

The stats might not be exactly accurate but it looked a lot like we could score for fun against the lesser teams but would bomb our way for nothing against the top sides. 

Getting a low(ish) score in 6 games out of 24, including return games where we got good scores again the same teams, suggests we scored freely in all games against all opposition. Yes, obviously we scored more heavily against the really poor teams than the good teams, but that is a self-fulfilling prophecy, that’s why they’re the poor teams. Unless you can show me a case where a team scores freely against good teams and with difficulty against poor ones then the “we got bigger scores against bad teams” is irrelevant, that’s just situation normal for any team.

I think you’ve re-written history a fair bit in your posts and I think the evidence backs me up.

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28 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Up until round 21 the only finalist we’d played were Hawthorn, Richmond and Sydney who we all couldn’t score on, the Pies who we only put up a score through accurate kicking and a Geelong team that were the exception.

The stats might not be exactly accurate but it looked a lot like we could score for fun against the lesser teams but would bomb our way for nothing against the top sides. 

We scored 10.18 against Sydney. If you're going to write off the 91 we scored against Collingwood because we were accurate you don't get to include the Sydney score despite its inaccuracy.

You're seeing too much 2019 in our 2018. We had 2019 problems (inside 50 inefficiency) but we made it work in 2018 in a way that stood up most of the time.

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Quality talls are rare. That's why Jackson was an obvious choice. My choice would have been Young but he slipped to 7 so a few clubs didn't rate him that highly and we picked up a possible Young replacement anyway in Rivers so it's a win win IMO. Kossie will be great pick up for us also he will probably be in our best 18 by rnd 1 if Bennell doesn't play. We done well in the draft.

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On 11/28/2019 at 8:55 AM, Lord Travis said:

So clubs just give them a free ride instead of bidding and driving them into a large points deficit?

It’s weak. Sydney is the latest a bid should have come for him. 

I was hoping we were going to bid on Green at pick three.

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On 11/28/2019 at 9:20 AM, drdrake said:

Would have been great to get Young and Jackson, then make our social home Young and Jackson pub.

Spoke to a couple of contacts in WA about this kid most said think Jeff White great leap good mark but more agile.  Wasn't a fan of taking him at 3 as we need players that can kick and keep the football, hopefully he can have that impact we need early as a forward ruck, then later as a Ruck.  

 

This is exactly who I've been thinking about as a comparison,  in relation to the talk of Jackson at 3.  A taller version of JW,  and hopefuly a harder unit.

I'd like to see the curl, show some mongrel in his game.

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On 11/28/2019 at 4:24 PM, DeeSpencer said:

None of Petty, Weideman or Preuss have locked down a spot, in fact there will be a 4 way battle with Jackson for 1-2 spots depending on how the team wants to play. Jackson has speed and skill for his size that will create opportunities for the little guys. 

I agree totally DS.  And am looking forward to Weide having to force his way into the team, in 2020.  Its his time, to start to pull some decent weight in the team, now.

Preuss has to get fitter, build the aerobic capacity.  Lets hope he forces the selectors hands.

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I don't think there's ever been a player like Jackson. 199cm with the ground ball skill and agility of a midfielder.

Some might say Brodie Grundy but I challenge those people to compare footage of Grundy and Jackson at the same age - Jackson is closer to Pendlebury around the stoppage than Grundy.

That's not to say he'll be as good or better than either of those players but it simply highlights what a unique player he is.

It would have been very hard to say no to that for another half-back, as good as Young's foot skills are.

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3 hours ago, Cheesy D. Pun said:

I don't think there's ever been a player like Jackson. 199cm with the ground ball skill and agility of a midfielder.

Some might say Brodie Grundy but I challenge those people to compare footage of Grundy and Jackson at the same age - Jackson is closer to Pendlebury around the stoppage than Grundy.

That's not to say he'll be as good or better than either of those players but it simply highlights what a unique player he is.

It would have been very hard to say no to that for another half-back, as good as Young's foot skills are.

Taylor has been bold & adventurous. This period has been one of high risk especially with Bennell, but we have been played it too safe for a long time & not gotten  any reward so win loose or draw I commend this approach and hope that we play an attacking brand this year and get some respect back.  Exciting times  ahead!

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2 hours ago, mfcrox said:

Lots of recruiters said they'd have picked Young at 3... then he slips to Pick 7.  Makes sense.

Yes well not GWS, Sydney or Adelaide recruiters.  Who might they have taken I wonder?

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