Are we the worst marking team in the league?

[Umpire Please 120]

I watched it last year and we are starting the same this year. We don't judge the flight and /or drop of the ball well as a total team. 

Today Geelong out marked us by nearly 50!!! Yes I know there were a few good ones but over the whole game and across the team I see this as a weakness that has not been addressed in the off season.

[daisycutter 29,616]

are you referring to all marks or contested marks?

jelong did pick up a lot of cheap marks from chipping the ball around

but, yes i did get the impression they had a lot more contested marks

we also have a dearth of genuine talls in our best 22

[biggestred 5,105]

I dunno but we are very good at just bombing the ball forward inside 50 to a pack

[praha 11,240]

We were third last ahead of GC and Brisbane with 9.4 a game. We averaged 11.1 in 2016, and 12.5 in 2015.

Today we had 7. That said, Port had 5, and the Hawks, 6. 

Today's mark differential is more a reflection of how much space and cheap possessions Geelong were getting.

They smashed us in the air regardless, though.

[dl4e 5,851]

I saw on one of the screens at 1/2 time the top 10 marks for the game and the first 9 were all geelong players.

[DV8 2,271]

58 minutes ago, Umpire Please said:

I watched it last year and we are starting the same this year. We don't judge the flight and /or drop of the ball well as a total team. 

Today Geelong out marked us by nearly 50!!! Yes I know there were a few good ones but over the whole game and across the team I see this as a weakness that has not been addressed in the off season.

Marking the footy consistently is a great pressure relief valve.  They can't touch us when we mark the footy.

 

If under the pump, the ability to catch the ball under pressure is a get out of jail free card.

[Mach5 4,767]

Vastly different game styles. Ours is obviously heavy with draw, handball, run, repeat.

Geelong's speed of ball movement comes from precise kicking.

[DSP 1,488]

Geelong had spare men and space, simple as that. Loads of easy uncontested marks.

We had all our eggs in the contest, so we had no choice but to bomb it long to congestion just about all day.

My biggest frustration.

[poita 3,902]

No, but we're not a great kicking team.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

2 hours ago, DSP said:

Geelong had spare men and space, simple as that. Loads of easy uncontested marks.

We had all our eggs in the contest, so we had no choice but to bomb it long to congestion just about all day.

My biggest frustration.

It was like that game against Collingwood a few years ago when they just dropped someone back and we didn't think to play someone forward to counter it.

[Earl Hood 6,086]

18 hours ago, Umpire Please said:

I watched it last year and we are starting the same this year. We don't judge the flight and /or drop of the ball well as a total team. 

Today Geelong out marked us by nearly 50!!! Yes I know there were a few good ones but over the whole game and across the team I see this as a weakness that has not been addressed in the off season.

I mentioned in another post that we seemed to be continually running under the flight of the ball in marking contests leaving the Geelong guys to take an easy overhead on our backs. We were absolutely smashed in the air after the first quarter and wouldnt punch to make a contest at ground level in our forward 50.

geelong did rack up the marking stats chipping it around in the first quarter but that was to slow down our momentum, soak up time and look for an opening forward. That is exactly the tactics we should have deployed in the last 10 min of the second quarter when Geelong were on a role, scoring at will. Maintain possession to slow their momentum. Used to be called tempo footy, we don’t have it our game plan. 

[DeeZee 7,397]

We still don’t have any brutes in the backline, maybe Petty, Kielty or Frost can be that person as we really were out bodied in a lot of marketing contests .

Lever played a lot one in one and he looked like a skinny 12 year old kid to me.

[Mach5 4,767]

21 hours ago, poita said:

No, but we're not a great kicking team.

It's not our aim. We're not going out trying to pick teams apart with precise kicking.
It's about moving the ball quickly to give our forwards more chance of catching their opponent off-guard.
We aim to attack with run & carry in waves, weight of numbers at the contest, keep moving the ball forward.

If we were trying to chip it around to move forward, then you'd have a point.
We aren't.

[Fork 'em 6,984]

On 25/03/2018 at 11:06 PM, DV8 said:

Marking the footy consistently is a great pressure relief valve.  They can't touch us when we mark the footy.

 

If under the pump, the ability to catch the ball under pressure is a get out of jail free card.

Sure is, but then you need the majority of your teammates to be able to kick the ball to your advantage.
Which we don't got.

[Demon Dynasty 17,109]

On 25 March 2018 at 11:06 PM, DV8 said:

Marking the footy consistently is a great pressure relief valve.  They can't touch us when we mark the footy.

 

If under the pump, the ability to catch the ball under pressure is a get out of jail free card.

You have to be able to make space on your opponent to get a lot of uncontested marks also DV.  I womder if we lack break away speed in general in order to spread and provide those options.  Are we hand balling in close too often because players just don't have those options on the outer in congestion? 

Or do we just have too many at the contest?  Is it our set up?  Other teams making sure they have one or two outliers always, so they have options once the ball escapes congestion.  I think Geelong in particular do this forward of play as they are so confident in their ability to gain possession on the outside and overlap forward of congestion.

Having a free man (or two) forward is risky as you can get caught out badly on the turnover but if it works the ball moves very quickly into your 50 giving the op less time to get numbers back and/or man up.  Going out the back / laterally generally is a steadier/slower (somewhat safer?) alternative but may not reap as many rewards.

Can we learn from the Cats here?

Edited March 27, 2018 by Rusty Nails

[Demon Dynasty 17,109]

25 minutes ago, Fork 'em said:

Sure is, but then you need the majority of your teammates to be able to kick the ball to your advantage.
Which we don't got.

And the Cats kicked to the advantage of their team mates beautifully on many occasions on Sunday Fork.  There were one or two beauties to Menzel against Nev that gave Menzel every opportunity to out mark Nev....which he did to aplomb.

Our game has yet to go to this next level in general field kicking.

Imagine if we were giving this sort of feed to Tracc and Hulk up forward with Jeffy at the drop!  Clear out the forward 50 as much as possible with this set up.  We would rule most opponents!

Edited March 27, 2018 by Rusty Nails

[DV8 2,271]

8 minutes ago, Rusty Nails said:

You have to be able to make space on your opponent to get a lot of uncontested marks also DV.  I womder if we lack break away speed in general in order to spread and provide those options.  Are we hand balling in close too often because players just don't have those options on the outer in congestion? 

Or do we just have too many at the contest?  Is it our set up?  Other teams making sure they have one or two outliers always, so they have options once the ball escapes congestion.  I think Geelong in particular do this forward of play as they are so confident in their ability to gain possession on the outside and overlap forward of congestion.

Having a free man (or two) forward is risky as you can get caught out badly on the turnover but if it works the ball moves very quickly into your 50 giving the op less time to get numbers back and/or man up.  Going out the back / laterally generally is a steadier/slower (somewhat safer?) alternative but may not reap as many rewards.

Can we learn from the Cats here?

Not just uncontested, we need to be better in the air, generally.

 

This is where I hoping 'Weide' comes into his own when he's ready to roll. 
 

This is why TMc & Pedo were so successful for us last year, it changed our attitude across the team,,, with those guys mobility thru the mid part of the ground; as well as forward.

But the tall support thru the mid-ground is key to us feeling confident, & backing ourselves to run to receive. Its not just the height but the Bulk of the tall and the strength.  Helping our runners out.

 

Don't worry about the kicking, we have players who will come in when they're ready, who can kick; but need to learn to play the game in a suitable Devilish way... and we need to recruit more good kicks.  Sloane?

And then some kids strong overhead.

 

I'm hoping 'Weide' man will be a wood'chip off the old DNA linage. Follow me?

[YesitwasaWin4theAges 6,703]

On 25/03/2018 at 10:12 PM, biggestred said:

I dunno but we are very good at just bombing the ball forward inside 50 to a pack

No composure forward of center and inside 50 its what cost us the game, we will get them next time.

[DeeZone 9,861]

Like most supporters sitting at the game on Sunday I could not believe the number of times that the ball either slipped through our hands or bounced off our hands during critical times of the game whereas Geelong players were marking the ball so consistently all over the ground that it made us look a bit ordinary. Bring out the Resin for our ham fisted group. Apart from that element of the game I thought the Dee's played some good tough gritty footy.

 

Go Dee's!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Spelling error

Edited March 27, 2018 by DeeZone

[DV8 2,271]

28 minutes ago, Rusty Nails said:

You have to be able to make space on your opponent to get a lot of uncontested marks also DV.  I womder if we lack break away speed in general in order to spread and provide those options.  Are we hand balling in close too often because players just don't have those options on the outer in congestion? 

Or do we just have too many at the contest?  Is it our set up?  Other teams making sure they have one or two outliers always, so they have options once the ball escapes congestion.  I think Geelong in particular do this forward of play as they are so confident in their ability to gain possession on the outside and overlap forward of congestion.

Having a free man (or two) forward is risky as you can get caught out badly on the turnover but if it works the ball moves very quickly into your 50 giving the op less time to get numbers back and/or man up.  Going out the back / laterally generally is a steadier/slower (somewhat safer?) alternative but may not reap as many rewards.

Can we learn from the Cats here?

It's all over the ground, we are lacking generally in field play & perceived pressure, in all ways.  we are just green.

We lack offensive perceived pressure, cause we're green, Not dominant.

We lack midfield pressure for same, and a bit of pace wouldn't hurt. but we are green.

Similarly down back we have green holes, and make mistakes, cause of inexperience and players haven't played a hundred games together under the same footy plan. when we become a tight Unit down back that can rip sides with outr run from the back, then we will find we are using more perceived pressure against any opposition

They will have to spend more of their thoughts worrying about us, and that will give us some more time.

 

atmo we're All green.

 

We are a young list on the UP, but maturing will take time.  We will hopefully play finals this year, and get that kick along with it, but we will plateau I expect for a while, while we mature further.

Which is all good, because we can still add further talent during any plateauing, from recruiting; and building from underneath.

Sure as Hell all other clubs will keeping building from grass roots up, and we Must not stop doing this:  see Saints under Lyon.

Edited March 27, 2018 by DV8

[DubDee 25,901]

No Henderson and then no Taylor, we needed to exploit this with marking inside 50 and the lead/  Hogan and Peedo were poor on sunday regarding marking.  hopefully it improves

[Deemania since 56 6,653]

On 25/03/2018 at 10:15 PM, praha said:

how much space and cheap possessions Geelong were getting

Absolutely and the lack of talls was highly evident, even for spoiling. Frost had to be in the team against Geelong. TMac was sorely missed. Of our smalls, if Brayshaw had been in, and Tyson, and Kent, I'd reckon we would have spoiled far better and prevented many of the little chip-kicks that the Catty Puts succeeded in to keep possession and then progress goalward. We could have been celebrating a win - it was that close - but for poor selections at both ends and across the midline. Someone, please take Goodwin aside and let him know his mistakes...

[Deemania since 56 6,653]

34 minutes ago, Win4theAges said:

No composure forward of center and inside 50 its what cost us the game, we will get them next time.

The composure problem seems to be at the centre and chf areas. Given timely and triangulated fast leads, this could be augmented by the three good runners and passers that we have (Hunt, Melksham, Harmes and now, Wagner) aided and abetted by Mr Conflict Resolution: Bugg. Our forwards need to do the same ... triangulated leads for the likes of Garlett, Hogan and now, Fritch ... aided and abetted by Hannan and Pedo.

I cannot see the likelihood of any team beating that style of combination. Other players could just join in with their contributions, as required. It would sure beat the current system of sitting on your heels trying to guess where the 'bomb' is going to land and then running into a congested pack mentality to shoot at goal from any residual angle - if at all. These leads, particularly those not selected as an avenue forward could realistically act as shields against defenders left, right and centre, whatever the case in need might be. 

[Dappa Dan 2,188]

On 25/03/2018 at 10:06 PM, Umpire Please said:

I watched it last year and we are starting the same this year. We don't judge the flight and /or drop of the ball well as a total team. 

Today Geelong out marked us by nearly 50!!! Yes I know there were a few good ones but over the whole game and across the team I see this as a weakness that has not been addressed in the off season.

Hogan was guilty of running under balls on at least a half a dozen occasions. You can put some of that down to close checking and good aggressive KP defence by the Cats, who were really good in this area all day. But I anticipate Hogan will find form over the next couple of weeks, and get some confidence. His three goals will contribute to that... He normally reads the ball beautifully coming into the forward line.

Aside from that, the cats have a focus on uncontested footy. That's why they had so many possessions and marks. We could improve in this area, but Goody has clearly decided bomb it long is the way to go.

[Deemania since 56 6,653]

57 minutes ago, DV8 said:

You have to be able to make space on your opponent......

The game, in a nutshell. Don't give it an elaborate name folks, 'Uncontested...", just call it '...run into space..." all over the place. Lead your opponent to redundancy.