Farewell Jack Watts

[jumbo returns 6,741]

1 hour ago, ProDee said:

So many on this site are governed by their "feelings".

Thankfully, those making decisions aren't.

Haha....what a load of bs

[faultydet 7,612]

25 minutes ago, sue said:

 

Geez this thread is descending into madness. Now we can tell a person's political leanings by their position regarding Watts.    Good grief.   

Dreamers come from both sides (as well as the waverers) in this discussion.    But I have to admit to being emotional.  Originally I thought trading Watts might be a good idea, but the arrogance of some of the posters here has made me change my mind.  How's that for emotion over logic.  I must be a communist.

Don't you read?

It was in response to someone whining about Trump supporters. I didn't start it.

 

If you are changing your mind about Watts simply based on the perceived arrogance of the pro-trade lobby, I would suggest you are not communist, but more likely a lefty  

 

I will miss Jack, but I'm looking forward to seeing who Goody brings in. I will bet they will improve the team.

[Skin Deeamond 339]

3 minutes ago, faultydet said:

Don't you read?

It was in response to someone whining about Trump supporters. I didn't start it.

 

If you are changing your mind about Watts simply based on the perceived arrogance of the pro-trade lobby, I would suggest you are not communist, but more likely a lefty  

 

I will miss Jack, but I'm looking forward to seeing who Goody brings in. I will bet they will improve the team.

Please explain your understanding of the difference between a communist and a “lefty”.

[daisycutter 29,622]

2 minutes ago, Skin Deeamond said:

Please explain your understanding of the difference between a communist and a “lefty”.

i would have thought one was a subset of the other, but that's just a guess 

[Demon Dynasty 17,109]

2 hours ago, Sir Why You Little said:

I don’t see how else this could have been handled, as in it handled itself. 

As soon as Jack was “Door Stopped” at Adelaide Airport, it then becomes open

Gone are the days of keeping information like this in house. 

24 hour Sports Radio will always sniff out whats going on regardless of moral cred. 

What i find interesting is that the MFC has not put a price on Watty’s head 

even now i would not be suprised if he stays with us and this whole excercise is a premeditated rocket placed up Jack’s backside to get him fired up

Just a hunch, but usually there is a specific amount on a players head for starters. 

If it is that premeditated SWY then it must go all the way to his manager who has been reported as saying he will never allow Jack to return to the MFC given the way he's been treated?

[faultydet 7,612]

12 minutes ago, Skin Deeamond said:

Please explain your understanding of the difference between a communist and a “lefty”.

Lefty - Take from the rich, give to the poor

Communist - Take from everyone, keep for yourself

[worldwideweb_demon 90]

3 hours ago, Lord Travis said:

The club has handled this whole situation poorly. People are laying into Jack for not performing well 100% of the time... did they not see the rest of the players this year? They were up and down like a yo-yo! Put in the effort when they felt like it, and couldn't be bothered other weeks if it seemed it would be too hard. Jack is being made a scape goat (again) despite him clearly not being the worst performer in the team, and putting in efforts consistent with all his teammates. At the end of the day, Goodwin and his coaching staff have a top 8 quality list and failed to motivate them all, including Jack. 2017 in reflection is a year where Goodwin got found out as an inexperienced coach and poor motivator. If Roos or another experienced coach had been in charge of the list we had available this year, we would've made finals and likely top 4. If Goodwin is trying to force Jack out to make another statement, and it fractures the playing group and we lose Hogan in the process etc. then as a people manager he is no better than Neeld. There's a time and place to be a hard ass, and he clearly hasn't learnt when that is yet. 

2018 is massive for Goodwin. If we miss finals again I'd say he deserves the chop. If Jack is injury free, he will have yet another good year regardless of which club he is at. Jack deserves better treatment than the club is giving him and if I was him I'd move on. For the clubs sake I hope he doesn't though, as we lack good kicking skills and smarts going forward. Losing him would only add to our biggest problem!

Yes! Agreed. Why can't others see that Goodwin the rookie coach actually failed this year. This does not mean he won't end up being a great coach. Even a lousy coach like Buckley took the pies to 4th in his first year cause of a strong premiership list he inherited. I believe he has been coaching better every year despite the results.

Not Jack's fault that we started so slow in so many games this year including the last one where everything was on the line against Collingwood which had half its best team out.

[Sir Why You Little 37,052]

13 minutes ago, Rusty Nails said:

If it is that premeditated SWY then it must go all the way to his manager who has been reported as saying he will never allow Jack to return to the MFC given the way he's been treated?

Which was right out of line, considering Watts had already said he doesn’t want to go anywhere

Connors works for Watts & not the other way around, although in todays world it is sometimes hard to see

[Skin Deeamond 339]

34 minutes ago, faultydet said:

Lefty - Take from the rich, give to the poor

Communist - Take from everyone, keep for yourself

So in your view communist politicians are corrupt and ‘lefties’ are not?

[Gator 17,383]

41 minutes ago, Rusty Nails said:

If it is that premeditated SWY then it must go all the way to his manager who has been reported as saying he will never allow Jack to return to the MFC given the way he's been treated?

Where was this "reported" ?

I'm interested in reading this report.

[faultydet 7,612]

4 minutes ago, Skin Deeamond said:

So in your view communist politicians are corrupt and ‘lefties’ are not?

In my view most politicians are corrupt in some way. Or at a minimum self serving.

This is not the thread for it however.

 

Jack Watts.

[Crystal Dees 372]

4 hours ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

Who will play Watts? 

Bruce Spence

[Guest]

1 hour ago, ProDee said:

Where was this "reported" ?

I'm interested in reading this report.

It wasn't.   It was Denham that said it in reference to what he thought Connors would advise. This hysteria has gone past ridiculous.

 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Rusty Nails said:

If it is that premeditated SWY then it must go all the way to his manager who has been reported as saying he will never allow Jack to return to the MFC given the way he's been treated?

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/amp.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/jack-watts-hopeful-of-staying-with-demons-20171003-gyt96i.html

What was actually said. 

[the fork 357]

2 hours ago, Rusty Nails said:

If it is that premeditated SWY then it must go all the way to his manager who has been reported as saying he will never allow Jack to return to the MFC given the way he's been treated?

This completely contradicts comments I heard him make on Trade Radio last week in which he stated that he thought Melbourne couldn't  have handled what is an unfortunate situation any better. Mentioned both coach and Josh positively. 

[Wiseblood 24,637]

5 minutes ago, the fork said:

This completely contradicts comments I heard him make on Trade Radio last week in which he stated that he thought Melbourne couldn't  have handled what is an unfortunate situation any better. Mentioned both coach and Josh positively. 

This is exactly what I heard as well.  Unless someone can provide evidence to the contrary, I don't believe his stance on the matter has changed.

[KingDingAling 3,758]

2 hours ago, Skin Deeamond said:

Please explain your understanding of the difference between a communist and a “lefty”.

No difference anymore. They are practically the same thing nowadays.

[Atholwebb 110]

I don’t want Watts to go but if he goes to Geelong and we get their pick 20, I will be happy if we use that to get a quality outside running midfielder either through the draft or from another Club. I assume the other side of the equation with Watts is that we have our eyes on somebody and we need the pick we get from the Watts trade to expedite this. It may involve letting another player go depending on the quality of who we want. Should Jack go to Geelong they will be my second team which I could not do if he went to the Pies - I truly hope that does not happen.

[Skuit 10,031]

6 hours ago, Big Carl said:

After the pointed comments this week from the MFC if I was Jack I would clean my locker out.

If you really were Jack you would hold a presser and tell everyone about your feelings being hurt.

[Nasher 33,616]

3 hours ago, faultydet said:

 

I was actually thinking prior to reading ProDees quote, that we must have a majority of lefties on the Watts board, and was about to also make a reference to "feelings" over logic.

 

Many here need to consider the feelings of supporters who wish to win a flag.

Don't dreamers lives matter?

Lefty in the pro-trade Watts camp here.

Also a moderator who is going to shut down further political discussion. (Aware you have already attempted to disengage, faultydet)

[Bitter but optimistic 22,242]

Well I'm officially over this thread. 

What more can be said? Commos under the bed!

FMD!!!

I'm outta here until we get a definite deal/answer.

[beelzebub 23,380]

7 hours ago, jumbo returns said:

The story was about him, but he got asked the inevitable Watts' question and fell for the bait..

' Whatever happens to Jack is his own doing' - paraphrasing...

I wish he would have just deflected the question

hes not that bright

[Mazer Rackham 14,971]

2 hours ago, Rusty Nails said:

If it is that premeditated SWY then it must go all the way to his manager who has been reported as saying he will never allow Jack to return to the MFC given the way he's been treated?

Player managers. Men of integrity, character. Men we can look up to. Founts of wisdom.  Role models.

[beelzebub 23,380]

6 hours ago, jumbo returns said:

Not in a public forum - support/respect how your (ex) teammate might be traveling...

Nathan Jones is part of the agenda of a clique at Melbourne to push Jack on.

That and of itself is one thing, that Jack may move on, that he should move on or that he may need to move on  etc.

Its another thing to keep pushing the barrow ( at any opportunity ) and reveal your colours. Some would say they are pure Red and Blue.  Some might say the very same for Jack Watts

[Mazer Rackham 14,971]

This whole drama is not really about Watts

Yes, Watts is in the cross hairs right now. But look for the bigger picture.

Most coaches only get one shot at it. For all the  feelgood chat about Michael Voss being a better coach if he gets another senior gig, which club is going to put their collective nads on the line to try that experiment? None. Because they'll look bloody stupid, and waste years finding out that Voss may have improved, but not to where he lands a flag.

They get one shot. The only coaches who get two shots are flag winning coaches, or ones that go very close (Ross Lyon).

Everyone else is bundled out after a short number of years, having stamped their papers, and end up in footy oblivion, or, for the ones who win hell's tattslotto, assistant coach at Essendon.

Clearly, Goodwin already sees this. Will he be another Justin Leppitsch? Another Brett Ratten? Another  Brendon McCartney? Another Matthew Primus? Another Peter Schwab? (You get the idea.)

Like f**k he will.

If you can recall the cricket career of Ian Chappell, when he became test captain, he tried to be all things to all people. Got middling results. Pretty soon (wise words were whispered in his ear) he realised that it has to be his way, or die wondering. And damn the torpedoes.

(You may also recall that Ian Chappell was no choirboy.)

Goodwin has got this message. Probably already had it.

 

 

Can anyone cast their minds back to the dim past, in a year when an aspiring finals team met some cellar dwellers in the second last round of the home/away games. The underdogs fancied themselves and put up a game fight, but against superior skill, talent, gameplan, everything, found themselves being blown off the park in the last quarter. The aspiring finals team, on paper, had made it to the finals.

Then inexplicably, they took their foot off the pedal and let the cellar dwellers back into the game, and had it gone another 10 minutes, might have snatched defeat. In the twinkling of an eye, the team had gone from finals near-certainties to everything on the line.

The coach must have been livid.

You may recall in the last round of that same season, our heroes had to overcome another set of cellar dwellers, whom they had beaten earlier in the year. Surely with everything on the line, their superior lineup would do the job?

Think again. They flubbed it, badly. Weren't in the game at any stage. And the oppo had 6 of their best out. What a debacle.

The coach must have been livid.

"I must do something about this, or I will be the next Justin Leppitsch, the next Matthew Primus ... and f**k that!"

He cast about, looking for ways to improve his list. Trade Van den berg? Trade Stretch? JKH? For some third round picks?

Then he woke up in a cold sweat. Was that it? Trade some fringe players for some more fringe players? He looked in the mirror and saw Justin Leppitsch staring back at him.

He saw that his side has got great talent, huge promise, and, collectively, a heart the size of a pea.

Leppitsch started laughing and before he knew it, Goodwin was looking at the face of Mark Neeld staring back at him.

 

 

 

 

 

This is Goodwin's one shot at it. He sees what we all saw through the season. And the season before that. When the club's nuts are on the line, the team flubs it.

He sees a future where he's a member of the sacked coaches club, lamenting that he coulda been a contender, but his team had a heart the size of a pea. It's really too bad. Hard luck, eh? What's a coach to do?

Goodwin's response? LIKE F**K.

We should celebrate a coach who upon seeing the great riches at his disposal, has the nads to make the calls he sees as necessary to harness the greatness.

He sees a player who after 9 years in the system, is still on cruise control.

I have no doubt other players have been sent a message too, but because they are not media magnets like Watts, their stories are unremarked.

I am no Jack hater. The happiest end to this story is he stays with us, and, burning and stinging from the message given to him, turns it on and becomes the player we all hoped for over 9 seasons. I would love it. But 9! Long time. Colin Sylvia had 9 seasons I think. Just one good preseason .... maybe the penny will drop ... sorry. Doesn’t work like that.

After 9 seasons, we're all being sent a message. What you see is what you get. The writing is on the wall but all some of us can do is criticise the choice of font.

Do I think Goodwin is some wonder coach working to a cunning and devious master plan?

No. He's a rookie coach learning as he goes, making mistakes along the way. But he's the guy in the hot seat and has to do it his way come hell or high water. He simply cannot do it any other way.

I applaud our coach for seeing the writing on the wall, for himself, for the club, and for Jack, and taking action to correct it. Rather than hoping, hoping, hoping for it to click.

Grab it by the balls, Goody. This is your one shot. Right or wrong, masterstroke or cockup, only the future will tell. But don't hold back for fear of the cockup.

I am reminded of a quote by general George Patton. "I never take counsel of my fears."

Go Goody.

Go Demons.