Post game discussion - Round 10

[QueensBirthday 186]

A real issue today was not getting to the second contest after competing for the ball. That's how Port kept getting number advantages at each contest. One particular player, I counted to eight before he got to his feet when the ball was being disputed 5 metres away. We don't need that in our side.

[DeeSpencer 25,711]

Rubbish game. 

I don't hate our defensive set up, when it works we've played very well and held teams to lower scores. But we need a plan B. And we need to know how to attack in to a team with a man back. Same problem has killed us for years. 

Really my biggest worry right now is we have invested too much in good kids with bad footy brains who struggle under pressure - Harmes, Kent, Hunt, the McDonald's, ANB. None of these guys are known for their smart play. That said, they all have a lot of positives as well and I'm sure the hope is we can get Salem right, Petracca, Brayshaw and Oliver fitter and be on our way. 

Anyway, back to the backline, it's a mess. Vince had to go in the middle, Salem's out, Lumumba (despite his many bad points) can bring some sense of confidence at times. Right now it's just Jetta.

Oscar McDonald looked better and at times looked like he was in for a solid game, but he needs to be the young inexperienced kid finding his way who is shown the ropes. Tom McDonald had a few good moments but they couldn't get him on Dixon enough, and they didn't seem to even try to get him following Westhoff on to a wing for a different role which I would've. Westhoff killed us behind the play in the 1st and 3rd quarters when we had momentum.

The forward line wasn't much better. Hogan's set shot kicking was abysmal, his new routine is worse than previous. Garlett and Kent's brain fades are awful. Time to just play one of those two at a time. 

Midfield was rubbish. Vince going it didn't achieve much. Bugg was quiet as he had to say out and couldn't roll in to provide another option as he has previous. Stretch started well then was seemingly reassigned, couldn't get the ball out to him anyway. Kennedy nothing. ANB just doesn't have the tricks. Newton doesn't have the athleticism or desire to run. Then maybe the biggest disappointment was Dom Tyson. A week off has killed his form and he wasn't crashing in hard enough, wasn't tackling or really anything of quality. 

[Timothy Reddan-A'Blew 5,131]

1 hour ago, pineapple dee said:

What was with the port players raking their hands down the faces of Gawn and Jetta ? I don't think either of those was accidental. Dixon should be scrubbed out for the elbow into Garlands face. That was a weak dog effort.

 

It appeared very deliberate, aimed at the Melbourne player harrassing him from behind, and Garland came in from behind and collected it. Any reference in the media to it being referred?

[Timothy Reddan-A'Blew 5,131]

1 hour ago, Deespicable said:

I wasn't there - like most of us have just watched it on the television, but it's important to note that the diamond defence applies to the centre bounce set-up.

Once the centre bounce passage is concluded we revert to pretty much a man-on-man defence, except several of our players have a licence to move up (press). What was incredibly poor this week (as it was against St Kilda) was that we seemed to constantly be caught allowing their players to break from the stoppage area unimpeded or at least not majorly harassed. As a result they were able to link up and go over the top and you don't miss to many running into goal from 10m out - unless you are Travis Cloke.

While we all know how poor our small forwards were today, there's no doubt our lack of run through the middle (defensively as well as offensively) played a huge part. Apart from Hunt we did not seem to be able to enact any chase downs after the first quarter.

You have to wonder why we went with such a young side, especially since we allowed two of our slower youngsters - Newton and Neal-Bullen - to play in tandem in our midfield - one maybe, but two is just ludicrous when you want to press.

The good thing is that quite a bit of experience will be brought back into the side next week with Dawes and Grimes, plus our key stoppage youngster in Oliver.

And as we've shown all year, we are a young side and we will constantly be up and down - hopefully next week is an up.

Chronic issue #1: Understaffed backline.

Chronic issue #2: What to do with Dawes.

 

Thinking, thinking...

[olisik 4,060]

6 minutes ago, Timothy Reddan-A'Blew said:

Chronic issue #1: Understaffed backline.

Chronic issue #2: What to do with Dawes.

 

Thinking, thinking...

I have been saying for weeks we should try Dawes down back.

[Soidee 1,496]

We have missed some very vital opportunities as a club to stay close to the 8.  Home game losses to St Kilda, PA, and that brain fade against Bummers.  Will now come back to bite us because we fade in games we should win.

Will be lucky to snatch a win before the bye, then all down hill with maybe a win against Gold Coast after the bye.

Coaching group/ Selection Committee must lift its game or we are facing scummy 2nd half of season.

Effort today was just terrible...very tiring this inconsistency.

[John Crow Batty 8,863]

What worries me now is if we lose the next couple is how  we will  finish off the season. If we go the way of the last couple of seasons it will be ugly.  We have reached a watershed moment.

Edited May 28, 2016 by america de cali

[Adam The God 30,259]

5 hours ago, olisik said:

Kent consistently does nothing in first half of games.

That's more like it. I reckon he was good in the Collingwood and Richmond wins. He played probably the worst first half you will ever see against North and then ended up kicking four in the second half. Aside from those performances he's pretty much been a no-show. He's a dumb footballer who plays lazy football for large patches.

Edited May 28, 2016 by AdamFarr

[Adam The God 30,259]

4 hours ago, Sigil said:

Port did a fantastic job of getting under our skin today, niggled all day long. Players spent too long looking at the umpire (fair or not it doesn't matter) and didn't switch on. 

We couldn't stick tackles.

Nothing wrong with the forward line, they are dangerous when the rest of the team do the right things.

Jetta was great in the back line, I like what Wagner does by foot if he has a few seconds. The rest were pish (other than TMac every now and then).

The inside grunt of the midfield need to know that not every single one of them has to go at the player with the ball, makes it too easy for the opposition to get the ball out to a man in space (even if they fluff it, no Dees are there).

Also, on our defense. I doubt these stats are put down, but we hear on the coverage where we are doing well in so many areas on recent years... I think it would be interesting to know how many scores we get out of the backline v other teams.

Oh well, on to next week.

The forwardline's lack of defensive pressure was a major factor in the loss. Our half forwards in Kennedy, Kent, Garlett and Newton were hopeless. Not to mention Jesse's inability to stick tackles or dob simple set shots.

3 hours ago, JackoTheMuss said:

Bang on with your opening point on niggling. A couple of eye-gouges, bit of push and shove, mouthing-off. Did anyone see the footage of a Port mid slapping down Chunks' hands whilst he had his hands on his hips? 

Amazing Jones didn't turn around and give him one in the chops. And Viney losing his cool a bit. We got distracted.  

Yep, it was Robbie Gray. Little [censored].

[picket fence 17,169]

Stand by to see Viney Gone for a couple!! Dreadful to see him get sucked in so easily!

[Fitz Fitzpatrick 886]

5 hours ago, Soidee said:

We have missed some very vital opportunities as a club to stay close to the 8.  Home game losses to St Kilda, PA, and that brain fade against Bummers.  Will now come back to bite us because we fade in games we should win.

Will be lucky to snatch a win before the bye, then all down hill with maybe a win against Gold Coast after the bye.

Coaching group/ Selection Committee must lift its game or we are facing scummy 2nd half of season.

Effort today was just terrible...very tiring this inconsistency.

If you think we are inconsistent then you haven't been watching closely. Today was the same footy as every game since the stkilda. 

Very consistent actually. Another that's been intoxicated by beat up wins against two shocking sides

[Coq au vin 755]

9 hours ago, Deespicable said:

I wasn't there - like most of us have just watched it on the television, but it's important to note that the diamond defence applies to the centre bounce set-up.

Once the centre bounce passage is concluded we revert to pretty much a man-on-man defence, except several of our players have a licence to move up (press). What was incredibly poor this week (as it was against St Kilda) was that we seemed to constantly be caught allowing their players to break from the stoppage area unimpeded or at least not majorly harassed. As a result they were able to link up and go over the top and you don't miss to many running into goal from 10m out - unless you are Travis Cloke.

While we all know how poor our small forwards were today, there's no doubt our lack of run through the middle (defensively as well as offensively) played a huge part. Apart from Hunt we did not seem to be able to enact any chase downs after the first quarter.

You have to wonder why we went with such a young side, especially since we allowed two of our slower youngsters - Newton and Neal-Bullen - to play in tandem in our midfield - one maybe, but two is just ludicrous when you want to press.

The good thing is that quite a bit of experience will be brought back into the side next week with Dawes and Grimes, plus our key stoppage youngster in Oliver.

And as we've shown all year, we are a young side and we will constantly be up and down - hopefully next week is an up. 

It won't be. We will lose to hawthorn by at least 10 goals. Returning from a road trip in the heat  we never do well. Hawthorn are a few notches above us.

[xarronn 380]

46 minutes ago, Diamond said:

It won't be. We will lose to hawthorn by at least 10 goals. Returning from a road trip in the heat  we never do well. Hawthorn are a few notches above us.

We may well lose by 10 goals but not for the reason you have given.

We had a road trip to Alice Springs, where it was quite clearly stated in the telecast that it was only 21 degrees, without humidity and seemed overcast for large stretches of the game.

Hawthorn had a road trip to Brisbane where it was 26 degrees with much greater humidity.

 

[Gator 17,357]

The game-plan is a work in progress and stills needs plenty of tightening.  If a couple of players (even one) get caught out of position then we get opened up like a can of sardines.

We lack a couple of clean big bodied mids.  Oliver and Brayshaw will be those players.  

Hogan needs another marking forward to take the heat off him.  He's an incredible young player.

Bugg has his fans.  I don't rate him.

Neal-Bullen is a fumbler.  He's just not a clean footballer and makes dodgy decisions under pressure.  He's young, but should return to Casey.

And the less said about Newton, Oscar (so slow and awkward), Kent, Kennedy, Tyson the better.

We'll be a better team when Trengove, Oliver, Brayshaw, Salem, vandenBerg and one of Dawes/Pedersen are fit and impacting games. Those first 5 named are talented and that's a lot of talent out of the team.  Never underestimate talent.  

 

[Lord Ivanhoe 311]

15 hours ago, Hogan2014 said:

 

 

Perspective people .. Port have 47 ave more games than us & ups & downs are expected?

What annoys me the most is playing our home game away!

Understand Indegenious round etc but is this a game we sold?

Question is there no more home ground advantage???

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Spot on. That's 3 of 3 games we have lost there. Time to reduce the NT deal to maybe just one game in Darwin. it would have have been a different result at our home ground. Is the Alice Spring ground dimensions similar to Etihad?

As supporters it challenging, this Developing and Learning year. The young team is still light on for size & weight (and of course experience) hence bigger bodied teams can wear us down especially if we don't take our chances (so many missed goals). Sydney this week was a great example of the defensive pressure at Every contest without which we have to be accurate in front of the sticks to stay in the game.

It will be interesting to see if bigger & experienced types such as Dawes, Trengove, Dunn are selected against the Hawks this week

 

[Lord Ivanhoe 311]

12 hours ago, chook fowler said:

Today's game blows the theory that we don't need Prestia out of the water.

So true. Now that others have latched onto to the fact that tagging Viney greatly reduces our output around the stoppages Quality ready made mids such as Prestia are crucial especially whilst the young brigade are is learning, developing, growing.

[Dee Dee 1,108]

15 hours ago, Dee-licious said:

Our issue with early on in our goal kicking. If we were 7.2 (what we should have been), instead of 2.7, we would have rolled them. They would have been down and out and we would have been able to ski downhill. We had a bad day in front of the sticks and that hasnt happened this year so far. We are not good enough not to take our shots. 

. 

Hi,

unfortunately it doesn't work that way.The way Australian football is played and structured,  2.7 will never transfer into 7.2 with accurate kicking (you can work it out).

[Lord Ivanhoe 311]

55 minutes ago, ProDee said:

The game-plan is a work in progress and stills needs plenty of tightening.  If a couple of players (even one) get caught out of position then we get opened up like a can of sardines.

We lack a couple of clean big bodied mids.  Oliver and Brayshaw will be those players.  

Hogan needs another marking forward to take the heat off him.  He's an incredible young player.

Bugg has his fans.  I don't rate him.

Neal-Bullen is a fumbler.  He's just not a clean footballer and makes dodgy decisions under pressure.  He's young, but should return to Casey.

And the less said about Newton, Oscar (so slow and awkward), Kent, Kennedy, Tyson the better.

We'll be a better team when Trengove, Oliver, Brayshaw, Salem, vandenBerg and one of Dawes/Pedersen are fit and impacting games. Those first 5 named are talented and that's a lot of talent out of the team.  Never underestimate talent.  

 

These are the guys that I believe will be part of the back end of the season. As the youth get tired, these 6/7 are there to steady the ship and brand. At least we have got game time into many. They will also bring an interesting complexity and different mix into this current game style and hence give the coaching crew new options for our real tilt at the finals in 2017.

 

[buck_nekkid 5,861]

'We messed it up at selection' - is code for 'we selected kids that didn't do what they planned or promised'.  

That is, with hindsight, the selections were poor, because beforehand there was an expectation that the team would be able to do their jobs.

Terrible pressure in the forward half allowed them to walk out of our backline (every time) - how many times did they go coast to coast?

They spread so much better than us.  We got sucked into contests only to see it slip out-and away.

They smashed us in the contest and second effort.  The niggle was definitely part of this strategy.

Forward line looked good, but a few blokes had off days.

This was a reality check game.  At out best, we play pretty exciting footy.  However, we are a season or two away from finals, and this game underlines why.  We are certainly heading in the right direction though.

Think we may have held off a couple of changes for next week that we should have made this week.  Hawks are vulnerable, but not to the team we put out there yesterday.  Think there will be a raft of changes, including some additional height.

 

[DeeZee 7,396]

I thought our lack or forward line pressure was a stand out yesterday.

If you look at the games we have won, our pressure on the opposition kicking it out ,was manic.

Yesterday it was a stroll in the park for Port Adelaide.

[Wiseblood 24,637]

Just now, ProDee said:

The game-plan is a work in progress and stills needs plenty of tightening.  If a couple of players (even one) get caught out of position then we get opened up like a can of sardines.

We lack a couple of clean big bodied mids.  Oliver and Brayshaw will be those players.  

Hogan needs another marking forward to take the heat off him.  He's an incredible young player.

Bugg has his fans.  I don't rate him.

Neal-Bullen is a fumbler.  He's just not a clean footballer and makes dodgy decisions under pressure.  He's young, but should return to Casey.

And the less said about Newton, Oscar (so slow and awkward), Kent, Kennedy, Tyson the better.

We'll be a better team when Trengove, Oliver, Brayshaw, Salem, vandenBerg and one of Dawes/Pedersen are fit and impacting games. Those first 5 named are talented and that's a lot of talent out of the team.  Never underestimate talent.  

 

I agree with everything above, PD, except for the bolded part.  I think Tommy Bugg has been one of our most consistent players so far this year.  He might not be the greatest user of the footy but he runs hard all day, sticks his tackles and finds the footy as well.  I think he is underrated by some on here.

[DemonOX 8,791]

Next weeks gunna be fun. 

[Wiseblood 24,637]

Just now, DemonOX said:

Next weeks gunna be fun. 

Call me a sucker, but I think we'll go okay next week.  I think we'll make at least 4-5 changes at selection, and all of our inclusions will bring bigger bodies and more experience into the mix.  Dawes, Trengove, Grimes, Oliver and VDB will all be around the mark for selection this week, and probably Dunn as well.  All 6 of these give us those bigger bodies around the contest, while most give us that added experience as well.

I'm not suggesting we'll win, far from it, but I'd like to think some of the inclusions will allow us to match Hawthorn in most areas next week.

[beelzebub 23,376]

Well wasn't  that a debacle.

Seems we're just fiddle fahting around this year after all.

Very disappointing. Looking forward to 17 when we can dispense with the bullshlt.

[Dee1987 277]

Glad to see some people open to the Idea of Dawes down back, worth a try at least. Dunn, Garland and Grimes are done with the MFC. Never been a fan of them they are just players who have a go but fail to have an impact and the current game suggests now you need to have an impact. Vandenberg is a player we really miss with his fierce competitiveness and dash.