Post Match Discussion - Round 17

[Ted Lasso 17,129]

The umpires were close to the most one sided I've ever seen, which doesnt help.

[Beats 190]

I jammed a fork in my thigh to see if I can still feel pain. I can. Someone call an ambulance.

[Norm Smith's Curse 2,078]

Lack of leadership plain and simple.

[Je Roos Salem 661]

Lack of leadership plain and simple.

No one in the team is confident enough to be a real leader

[What 18,810]

We are just so boring, why cant we draft and develop a player like Chad Wingard?

Why wont we kick goals?

Why do we have to be god damn bland?

[monoccular 16,408]

Lack of leadership plain and simple.

And it appears that Roos has, like so many here, given up and lost interest.

[Pipefitter 2,042]

"We were outplayed" - Jack Viney.

Herein lies why yesterday was so shocking. There's nothing wrong with another team being simply better than you, but this quote says, we didn't try hard enough.

Umpiring was shocking but the Saints were first to the ball all day. Yesterday, from the first bounce the players showed no care. I can't cop that.

[Dr. Gonzo 22,632]

I don't understand Melbourne's forward movement. I understand that lack of skill means we do have to kick it down the line a lot, but what difference is that compared to under Mark Neeld.

You watch other teams play and if they take a mark on the wing and they can't find a free player forward they always have defenders free and can switch the play hopefully getting the forwards moving into space. I don't understand why Melbourne can't get defenders free for the switch. Too often we are on the wing, can't find a forward so just bomb it long. That game plan is really not going to get us very far in relation to improvement.

Today there were times when they tried to look to centre the ball through the corridor. It's a good sign but it's just sad that our skill level is sooo terrible they can't hit targets like 25 metres in front of them.

Hopefully the pre-season is heavily based on skills and improving our kicking efficiency.

Players are too lazy to run hard to create an option. Sure guys like Howe will run to the right spots, but they don't push themselves to sprint there and get some distance between them and their opponents. Makes it so easy for the opposition to defend and we end up having to kick down the line.

[Biffen 12,433]

We were pathetic today, but the umpiring was infuriating. Especially from Brad Wallace... I wonder if his old man had a hand in him getting the job?

I thought they deliberately put us out of the game and I wonder how much these [censored] are scrutinised over their mistakes,which numbered roughly 50% of their decisions.

The soulless AHLA pokies pub had the Swans game on the big screen so i went to the corner telly with the old stupid drunks.So 3 kids footy betting had the big telly.

I hate football more than ever.

I am going to write a letter to Gill McLachlan explaining how they have destroyed the game.

It needs to be made clear.

I want those umpires to never draw an income again.

Do they review their errors or just roll on?

I truly believe the Afl has directly told them to stop them mauls-which means Roos whole plan is bung.

[pitmaster 3,112]

The lack of run resulted in too few options for our players and too little pressure on the opposition.

What really appalled me was the lack of skill from players who train several times a week and 16 weeks into the season.

We over used the ball, hand passing when a kick was a better option, hand balled to players under pressure, failed to hit targets and failed to see players who had created space.

Possibly the skills problem was a greasy surface which we failed to adapt to at all. We knew all week the day was going to be wet and we tried to play dry weather football.

I am a fan of Cross but we saw his limitations writ large. And our forwards are dysfunctional.

We have now kicked (from memory) 7.18, 8.12 and 6.12 for a total of 21.42 since Geelong. That is a 33% success rate in front of goal. Did I say our skills weren't good enough?

And is there anyone who can tell me why Hogan has to walk back to the 50 metre arc to take a kick from the top of the goal square? This Mathew Lloyd routine thing might work from distance, but any shot from inside 30 metres does not need more than a three step run up.

Edited July 26, 2015 by pitmaster

[pitmaster 3,112]

I thought they deliberately put us out of the game and I wonder how much these [censored] are scrutinised over their mistakes,which numbered roughly 50% of their decisions.

The soulless AHLA pokies pub had the Swans game on the big screen so i went to the corner telly with the old stupid drunks.So 3 kids footy betting had the big telly.

I hate football more than ever.

I am going to write a letter to Gill McLachlan explaining how they have destroyed the game.

It needs to be made clear.

I want those umpires to never draw an income again.

Do they review their errors or just roll on?

I truly believe the Afl has directly told them to stop them mauls-which means Roos whole plan is bung.

I agree - they murdered us but we made so many blues of our own that I can't even get angry at their performance. It was incompetent and so inconsistent as to suggest they were closet Saints supporters.

Maybe Biffo you should watch the replay and direct GM's attention to specific decisions rather than a general rant. Some of our last quarter tackles were penalised for unfathomable reasons. So good luck with your hatred of the appalling Wallace (him again!) but I want to focus on what we do wrong.

Edited July 26, 2015 by Dr John Dee

[Biffen 12,433]

We saw the limits of a few.

I think the Dunn delusion has gone on long enough.

Players still can't guard a mark,stick a tackle,or in Dunn and Cross' case,beat me in a foot race.

[The Chazz 4,077]

I rarely post on the "Post Match" threads, but need to bring something to everyone's attention...

Did any of you see or hear the bloke watching the game continually roaring out vulgar language? He was wearing a Melbourne jumper, he was threatening to cause harm to not only himself, but a number of his own "flesh and blood" Demon players, as well as some of the officiators too. The stuff coming out of his mouth was something you've probably never heard before. He was also throwing beer all around the place. Quite simply, he was a grub, and was bloody embarrassing.

If you did see this man, I have two things to say to you;

1. I'm sorry.

2. What were you doing looking through my windows? I didn't go to the game, thank Christ.

[chook fowler 18,392]

i know that I'm not saying anything new, but...I just don't get why we are so bad.

It doesn't make sense. We have PJ, Roos, Goodwin, Misson, all names that at the time of their recruitment were considered amongst the best.

As much as I should be happy that the Bulldogs are doing so well, as a fellow 'battler' club, for me, they drill home what absolute shite we are. How does beveridge or Richardson get results like they do, while we get neeld and his results.

How come we still are so bad? It doesn't make sense.

I'm as mystified as you. The only thing I can point to still is recruiting. It has been too unidimensional, picking big bodied inside mids without acceleration and leg speed. Michie, Riley, Newton, Vanders are all similar types with similar deficiencies.

We really have been unlucky with injuries to Salem and Kent who are the exact type of players we need. I suspect Petracca will be important because by all accounts his style is explosive. We are also short a big defender and we are paying the price for Frawley leaving. Riewoldt has destroyed us twice and Daniher and Cloke both have had days out in recent times.

Our club is the Bermuda Triangle for skills. If you have any when you come in to the place they soon disappear. God knows why.

I also question our game plan that is now outmoded. The two bolters of recent times, Port and the Dogs have done so by taking the game on with speed and carry and have not been ultra defensive. As usual we are one step behind and always playing catch up because we are bereft of innovation and pro activity.

Edited July 26, 2015 by chook fowler

[Ted Lasso 17,129]

Alot of times a former coach compliments a new one, macca taught the dogs to defend and play contested footy, bevo has taught them to move the ball and the rest is down to confidence and buy in.

Goodwin i reckon will open our game style up when he takes over but roosy needs to get us consistently bringing the contest and effort we did in our wins.

The issue i have is moves like garland on roo will do nothing but destroy confidence, even on one leg roo was always going to be way too good

[poita 3,708]

My random thoughts on the game:

• We have kicked nine goals in our last seven quarters of football, against the 18th and 13th best teams on the ladder. Absolutely pathetic.
• Once again we were brought undone by the loose man in defence. Why is it that our opponents can consistently get the right bloke free in the right position, whilst our loose man (Cross) was consistently 20 metres out of position? Will Roos ever play man on man in this situation, or will he continue to let teams use this against us?
• The decision not to play McDonald on Riewoldt from the first bounce was spectacularly inept. Garland was incredibly poor on Riewoldt, and McDonald did nothing up forward. Yes, McDonald is out of form, but the best players in the competition would accept the challenge of taking the opposition's best player, not hide in a forward pocket. Other than move McDonald back after the game was lost, did Roos make a single move of substance yesterday?
• St Kilda basically went two kicks for every handball, we went less than one kick for every handball. Do we have any idea how to play the conditions? Or does the coach demand we play a certain way irrespective of opposition and conditions?
• Longer seemed to have the sole objective of negating Gawn's influence, and he did a pretty good job. Max was clearly frustrated and gave away too many free kicks. Of course he was still one of our better players, but he could have been far more influential.
• As bad as our disposal and decision making was at times, our biggest problem remains that players coming out of defence look up and have no forward line to kick to. Why are Hogan and Dawes playing in defence? It is hardly surprising that Hogan doesn't have the energy to contest in the forward line when he runs 10kms a game up and down the ground. I reckon Garlett would prefer to have some big blokes to bring the ball to ground for him as well.
• Harmes and Stretch are contributing nothing at present and both need to go back to Casey pronto. At this point I can't justify upgrading Harmes to the senior list at year end. Stretch will be a player in time, but he is averaging less than 10 touches a game. Brayshaw could probably do with a week off too, although he was (marginally) better this week.
• Once again if Jones doesn't have a major influence we struggle. Gee it would be nice if Tyson or Lumumba or Vandenberg could step up and do something significant.
• Michie is not an AFL footballer. Yes he had a few touches in the last quarter, but every disposal was backwards or sideways. There was no effort to take the game on and make something happen. Even though he has another year on his contract, he has been in the system five years, and I can't see that a sixth will make any difference.
• This is the first time I have mentioned the umpires this year, but they were dreadful yesterday. I'd rather see nothing paid, than have 54 free kicks paid in about 100 minutes of football. And the inconsistency is confounding. I doubt the result would have changed, but they certainly didn't help the cause.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

I haven't been this flat after a Melbourne loss for as long as I can remember.

I don't get upset anymore because in the scheme of things it's not life and death, but I am extremely flat today and my love for Melbourne and football is fading. I don't have anything else to add.

[Dee1987 277]

Agree On Michie hasn't offered anything at all in the last 2 Seasons

[3Dee 1,153]

Was vandenBURG playing with a virus? he looked slowwww, way off the pace yesterday.

It's going to be hard watch the remainder of the season with effort like that.

I don't get upset anymore because in the scheme of things it's not life and death, but I am extremely flat today and my love for Melbourne and football is fading. I don't have anything else to add.

same

[jnrmac 19,326]

Nothing wrong with an empathic response

Really?

Couldn't disagree more. The last person we should be hearing from is the president.Too many big mouth presidents say the wrong thing at the wrong time and create way too much angst that becomes a story in its own right.Knee jerk reactions we don't need.

All to make you feel better?

The footy dept knows what's wrong. If they can't fix it in season they need to make list changes. If they can't get it right soon they will be in the firing line. No amount of president pulpit screeching will fix this by next week.

[Gator 16,921]

Roos isn't the problem either guys. He isn't kicking the ball, missing a handpass or not running hard enough.

I can't agree. Nearly 2 years in and his players don't know what to do when they get the ball. There's no cohesive game-plan to move the ball forward effectively. We also pick and choose with our intensity, while the Saints play in a far more constant fashion.

Poor bloody Hogan. He must hate playing for this mob. Whenever the ball is in the opposition's forward 50 he gets sucked up the ground to a half back flank. This is instructional as we're a stoppage team that relies upon numbers around the ball. But we over do it. Other teams hold some semblance of a forward structure, but we lose ours completely, so naturally when there's a turnover the players hold up play, while we desperately run back. We handball when we should kick and we take the wrong option regularly. We play with no freedom or flair. Teams can have a rock solid defence, but still know when to pull the trigger.

In a short time Beveridge has his team playing attacking footy. Their defensive structures may need work, but they're at least exciting their fans and winning games of footy. Richardson at the Saints also has a side far more drilled than ours.

I'm over Roos and can't wait for Goodwin to take over.

Edited July 27, 2015 by ProDee

[jnrmac 19,326]

I thought they deliberately put us out of the game and I wonder how much these [censored] are scrutinised over their mistakes,which numbered roughly 50% of their decisions.

The soulless AHLA pokies pub had the Swans game on the big screen so i went to the corner telly with the old stupid drunks.So 3 kids footy betting had the big telly.

I hate football more than ever.

I am going to write a letter to Gill McLachlan explaining how they have destroyed the game.

It needs to be made clear.

I want those umpires to never draw an income again.

Do they review their errors or just roll on?

I truly believe the Afl has directly told them to stop them mauls-which means Roos whole plan is bung.

this x 1000

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

Poor bloody Hogan. He must hate playing for this mob. Whenever the ball is in the opposition's forward 50 he gets sucked up the ground to a half back flank. This is instructional as we're a stoppage team that relies upon numbers around the ball. But we over do it. Other teams hold some semblance of a forward structure, but we lose ours completely, so naturally when there's a turnover the players hold up play, while we desperately run back. We handball when we should kick and we take the wrong option regularly. We play with no freedom or flair. Teams can have a rock solid defence, but still know when to pull the trigger.

The bane of my existence.

What frustrates me the most is the forwards run up the ground, then run back again without having any impact on the play. However, when the ball does come down they are either knackered from running so far or running with the flight of the ball instead of at the ball carrier on the lead.

[pineapple dee 2,892]

Ok I couldnt kick a ball 10 metres, i couldn't run 50 metres unless someone was chasing me with an axe. The high point of my footy career was the first 18 at St Pauls Bentleigh ( I was good) But what I cant work out for the life of me is why, when Watts dishes off a handball to a teammate, doesnt he run on to protect the team mate with the ball??? Sheperd for gods sake. Give your mate a fighting chance. Many others could have done the same but didn't either.

[Samael 560]

No one in the team is confident enough to be a real leader

This. Our season is knackered. We defend and deefend and still get thumped. I would prefer to see the rest of the season devoted to taking risks. Forget the result and experiment with attacking footy. Give the players free reign, Let them make mistakes in attack (god knows they make them in our defensive game). Give them confidence to try something different. Learn from mistakes instead of being to scared to have a go. As somebody has already said inside fifty kick the goal instead of some dinky kick to a player in a "better" position. And stop handballing so much.Break the game open, the congested footy is our undoing.