Does Brayshaw play round 1?

[Gator 16,921]

My god, you're big on the sweeping generalisations. From "bevy" to "a gaggle" we now have "countless others".

The only "countless others" in regards to 18 year old draftees playing solid AFL games concerns the 95% (or more) who do NOT have the fitness to consistently play first-22 football.

Whether Brayshaw is in the 5% or the 95%, we shall find out soon enough.

95% of draftees won't be good enough to be considered staples from the get-go and 95% of draftees aren't top 3 draft picks. Unlike Trengove, who played his entire first year as an 18 year old, Brayshaw turned 19 in January.

How fit do you think Dustin Martin was in his first year ? Btw, I didn't name him, Heppell, Wingard, Couch, and "countless others".

When I referred to 'bevy' I was assuming Ablett, O'Meara, Dixon and Lynch wouldn't be playing, i.e. their 2 best mids and 2 best key forwards. That's a really important quartet. Does 4 constitute a 'bevy' ?

'Gaggle' means at least 5. If Bail, McKenzie, Matt Jones, Grimes and Garland all play we'll have a 'gaggle' of ordinary footballers lining up in round 1.

[P-man 13,309]

as bing181 has pointed out, the players you have named form a tiny fraction of the wider pool

furthermore, I'm sure you noticed that none of the players you mentioned are Melbourne players

why? because our d'ment sucks, for one thing, but more importantly, it is because when we play zero gamers they join a pack of other under-50 gamers that are already in the side. There is a big difference between an experienced senior side carrying one kid vs just playing all kids. It is exactly what happened when the Bailey/Neeld sides were 'thrown to the wolves'.

You have to go all the way back to N.Jones to find an MFC player who hit the ground running - and even he came in mid-season, and was average at best in his early days. The difference was we had Neitz, McDonald, White, Bruce, Green, Yze, Brown, Whelan etc a proper group of experienced senior players around him. It is no coincidence that this was also the last moment we qualified as a semi-decent football club. THAT's when you can afford to carry zero gamers.

We will once again field a side that is in the bottom 2-3 for games played, it is why we lose. We should be trying to RAISE that average, not reduce it further by increasing the amount of kids out there

ps you yourself said, immediately after making this post, that AB's form has been largely exaggerated. It seems to me that the handful of posters in this thread who have actually SEEN Casey play this year agree with that assessment. Others are just deciding to say 'he has dominated every week' which appears to be total garbage. Even if it were the case, it has been 2-3 practice matches at VFL level, in no way is that considered a consistent output worthy of promotion if we are a serious football club.

Last season we were ranked 14th for average games played: http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/port-adelaide-and-st-kilda-clear-outliers-on-afl-age-ladder-20140826-108cis.html

With the introduction of Lumumba and Garlett, it's safe to say we won't be in the bottom 2-3 teams in this regard. Age and experience as an excuse is all but gone with the way in which Roos has rebuilt the squad.

It's hard to say his form is exaggerated when the club names him BOG. 26 possessions and 2 goals is a good day out in anyone's language. He's proven he can compete and win the hard ball playing against men, including against Box Hill where he was playing against numerous AFL listed players.

I'm not sure how you can honestly say you'd back Bail or M Jones to have a greater impact. When the heat is on is precisely when they turn to water. We have a quality player who is putting his hand up for selection, and you are erring because of what happened years ago under different circumstances, with different players, and different decisonmaking behind it. This idea that "strong" or "serious" clubs wouldn't play him flies in the face of the examples where younger players have debuted early and gone on to be very successful.

I'm pretty confident the club will make the right decision. If they want to hold him back then so be it, but we need some genuine quality injected into this team as soon as humanly possible, because that is where we were in the bottom 2-3 last season: talent. Your reasoning seems overly cautious to me.

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

Last season we were ranked 14th for average games played: http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/port-adelaide-and-st-kilda-clear-outliers-on-afl-age-ladder-20140826-108cis.html

With the introduction of Lumumba and Garlett, it's safe to say we won't be in the bottom 2-3 teams in this regard. Age and experience as an excuse is all but gone with the way in which Roos has rebuilt the squad.

It's hard to say his form is exaggerated when the club names him BOG. 26 possessions and 2 goals is a good day out in anyone's language. He's proven he can compete and win the hard ball playing against men, including against Box Hill where he was playing against numerous AFL listed players.

I'm not sure how you can honestly say you'd back Bail or M Jones to have a greater impact. When the heat is on is precisely when they turn to water. We have a quality player who is putting his hand up for selection, and you are erring because of what happened years ago under different circumstances, with different players, and different decisonmaking behind it. This idea that "strong" or "serious" clubs wouldn't play him flies in the face of the examples where younger players have debuted early and gone on to be very successful.

I'm pretty confident the club will make the right decision. If they want to hold him back then so be it, but we need some genuine quality injected into this team as soon as humanly possible, because that is where we were in the bottom 2-3 last season: talent. Your reasoning seems overly cautious to me.

Those stats are straight up wrong, I can prove it (not now) . That ladder must be referring to the age of the actual list, not the age of the 22 that take the field each week... which makes it pointless. Check it yourself on footywire, you have to add up each week's data manually, you will find our average games is 65, not 80. Nonetheless, as the article notes, Port and the Saints are exceptional while 16 other teams closely mirror their ladder position. The argument is rock solid.

We got Lumumba and Garlett but lost Frawley so I doubt we will move much

I just want winning games of football to be prioritised over appeasing desperate supporters' desires to see some kid. I agree with you in that I back whatever decision they make.. he is likely to be the sub either way I suppose so it's not going to make a big difference in reality

[P-man 13,309]

Again, the idea of appeasing supporters is based in the past. The arguments in this thread are centred around whether he is ready and deserves a call up. Who he is and his draft number are irrelevant.

If he does get picked then I agree a sub is the likely outcome when looking at how Roos introduced Salem and JKH, albeit different types of players.

[Robbie57 1,996]

I'd expect him to play a quite a few games this year in the Salem JKH pattern from last year. It's all about his development and earning a spot.

I would be concerned about whether he is physically ready for it yet in particular does he have the tank for a full game. I think we should always have a sub who could run out a whole game.

The coaches may be tempted this week given GC is generally a younger team.

If his likely starting spot is either HF or Sub who would you prefer Brayshaw or Howe?

[Scoobs 2]

Let me start by saying I'd love to unleash the kid straight away, but as unthinkable as it may be for a Melbourne side I reckon he might just get squeezed out.

I've got 19 definite starters:

B: Jetta McDonald Dunn

HB: Salem Garland Grimes

C: Vince Cross Lumumba

HF: Watts Frost ???

F: Garlett Hogan ???

R: Jamar Jones Tyson

Int: Gawn Viney ???

Sub: Howe

If Howey is up and firing he slots in to half forward but all reports are he'll likely be sub if he plays.

That leaves 3 spots for: Toumpas, Brayshaw, Kent, JKH, Vandenberg, Bail, Michie, McKenzie, Newton, Matt Jones, Pederson

Spot 1) 2nd Small Forward: Don't think Kent and JKH will both play but think one will fill this role, JKH seems to be in form.

Spot 2) Newton: Think Roos has a big opinion of him and reckon he'll get a game first up and add some toughness around the contest and the extra mid for the rotation.

Then there's one spot which rules out the second stringers straight away (M.Jones, Bail, Michie and McKenzie unless he gets Ablett). Don't think there's a spot for Pedo right now and Toumpas to keep building some form and confidence at Casey.

So I think it's down to two between Vandenberg and Brayshaw which is a win win but I reckon Vandenbergs NAB Challenge puts him marginally in front.

Can't wait for Saturday , GO Dees!!!

[WERRIDEE 5,255]

Let me start by saying I'd love to unleash the kid straight away, but as unthinkable as it may be for a Melbourne side I reckon he might just get squeezed out.

I've got 19 definite starters:

B: Jetta McDonald Dunn

HB: Salem Garland Grimes

C: Vince Cross Lumumba

HF: Watts Frost ???

F: Garlett Hogan ???

R: Jamar Jones Tyson

Int: Gawn Viney ???

Sub: Howe

If Howey is up and firing he slots in to half forward but all reports are he'll likely be sub if he plays.

That leaves 3 spots for: Toumpas, Brayshaw, Kent, JKH, Vandenberg, Bail, Michie, McKenzie, Newton, Matt Jones, [Pedersen]

Spot 1) 2nd Small Forward: Don't think Kent and JKH will both play but think one will fill this role, JKH seems to be in form.

Spot 2) Newton: Think Roos has a big opinion of him and reckon he'll get a game first up and add some toughness around the contest and the extra mid for the rotation.

Then there's one spot which rules out the second stringers straight away (M.Jones, Bail, Michie and McKenzie unless he gets Ablett). Don't think there's a spot for Pedo right now and Toumpas to keep building some form and confidence at Casey.

So I think it's down to two between Vandenberg and Brayshaw which is a win win but I reckon Vandenbergs NAB Challenge puts him marginally in front.

Can't wait for Saturday , GO Dees!!!

Gawn is definitely not a definite starter.

[The Devil Inside 2,147]

Gawn is definitely not a definite starter.

I agree, I don't think he is in good form, he was pretty ordinary at training on Monday, did everything but just didn't shine

[Cheesy D. Pun 1,762]

I'd like to see Michie play first up with Brayshaw to continue in the 2's. His time will come and given that it looks like we'll take at least one underdone player (Howe/Vince) into round one and our propensity to drop our guard for short periods, I think fit, experienced players should be the default with the juniors made to force their way in.

As an aside, I think Bernie Vince is a really important player for us - balances our midfield with a bit of flare and creativity.

[The Devil Inside 2,147]

I'd like to see Michie play first up with Brayshaw to continue in the 2's. His time will come and given that it looks like we'll take at least one underdone player (Howe/Vince) into round one and our propensity to drop our guard for short periods, I think fit, experienced players should be the default with the juniors made to force their way in.

As an aside, I think Bernie Vince is a really important player for us - balances our midfield with a bit of flare and creativity.

If you ask him, he agrees that is what he brings haha

[Gorgoroth 12,431]

That and he can kick a goal from 50 on a regular basis which helps.

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

That and he can kick a goal from 50 on a regular basis which helps.

he does love a sausage

awesome player, we need him in

[KingDingAling 3,683]

I'd like to see Michie play first up with Brayshaw to continue in the 2's. His time will come and given that it looks like we'll take at least one underdone player (Howe/Vince) into round one and our propensity to drop our guard for short periods, I think fit, experienced players should be the default with the juniors made to force their way in.

As an aside, I think Bernie Vince is a really important player for us - balances our midfield with a bit of flare and creativity.

Brayshaw is perfect for our midfield. We need an inside mid. I don't think Jones and Tyson are inside mids. Michie won't add a lot to our midfield dynamic.

I think Brayshaw could come in and add alot - right away. Brayshaw is effective on the inside, I just hope he can teach Jack Viney how to slow down and use his aggression to his advantage.

[dazzledavey36 49,742]

Brayshaw is perfect for our midfield. We need an inside mid. I don't think Jones and Tyson are inside mids. Michie won't add a lot to our midfield dynamic.

I think Brayshaw could come in and add alot - right away. Brayshaw is effective on the inside, I just hope he can teach Jack Viney how to slow down and use his aggression to his advantage.

You sure Nathan Jones isn't an inside mid..?

[The Devil Inside 2,147]

Brayshaw is perfect for our midfield. We need an inside mid. I don't think Jones and Tyson are inside mids. Michie won't add a lot to our midfield dynamic.

I think Brayshaw could come in and add alot - right away. Brayshaw is effective on the inside, I just hope he can teach Jack Viney how to slow down and use his aggression to his advantage.

Michie was doing most of the in and under work on Saturday along with Riley, a lot of Brayshaw's possessions were as described previously, on the outside

You have seen Brayshaw live?

[Norm Smith's Curse 2,086]

I don't mind either way. He will eventually play and he was rated the best of three.

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

Again, the idea of appeasing supporters is based in the past. The arguments in this thread are centred around whether he is ready and deserves a call up. Who he is and his draft number are irrelevant.

You might be right, but basically everybody on this thread who actually saw the Scorps games says his performance has been overrated - and it's praccy matches anyway. So I would suggest he has NOT shown he is 'ready and deserves a call up' .. yet

[Gator 16,921]

You might be right, but basically everybody on this thread who actually saw the Scorps games says his performance has been overrated - and it's praccy matches anyway. So I would suggest he has NOT shown he is 'ready and deserves a call up' .. yet

I would say that his performances have been exaggerated, but that doesn't mean he doesn't deserve a call up.

Based on talent AND performance it's a no-brainer that he does.

[P-man 13,309]

A: Yes

[Wiseblood 24,636]

You might be right, but basically everybody on this thread who actually saw the Scorps games says his performance has been overrated - and it's praccy matches anyway. So I would suggest he has NOT shown he is 'ready and deserves a call up' .. yet

Roosy thinks he is worth the call up.

[Maybe next year 167]

I was at the Casey game on Saturday and I thought he was clearly their best. Based on what I saw last week he should play and I have confidence he will play well.

[CBDees 3,162]

No question now. He is named and playing. Only question is who will be the sub out of him and vandenBerg?

[praha 10,559]

You sure Nathan Jones isn't an inside mid..?

He's the rare sort of hot head that walks the walk. I love Vince.

EDIT: I'm on my phone and quoted the wrong post. I meant Vince, obviously.

Demonland needs a mobile app.

Edited April 2, 2015 by praha

[binman 39,476]

He's the rare sort of hot head that walks the walk. I love Vince.

EDIT: I'm on my phone and quoted the wrong post. I meant Vince, obviously.

Demonland needs a mobile app.

It has one. I'm using it now. It is excellent. Buy a DL membership and you'll have it too

[DeeSpencer 23,642]

No question now. He is named and playing. Only question is who will be the sub out of him and vandenBerg?

50/50. Probably vandenBerg for the mature body starting. But he'd be really good as an impact sub. All depends on the coaches confidence in Brayshaw mixing it with Gold Coast players in the middle. I guess he wont be right mixing it with Ablett, Swallow or Prestia so there's opportunities against lesser names or on a half forward flank.