NAB Challenge 1 - Richmond v Melbourne

[Tatu 416]

Good to see Jack is on the way back. If he can build on where he was a few years ago (pre Neeld) then we will have another good mid/utility player and we might yet see the Bartel comparisons become a reality.

Trengove is easily in our top three midfielders... His class can't be taught... Its a hell of a lot easier to play like Bartel does in a strong geelong team, then it would be to play in last years demons team... Im sick of the player bashing on here.... Trengove just walked away with 29 possessions...

[Deez 298]

just watched the whole game replay , hooked up laptop to tv , , loved it , massive read MASSIVE improvement , my early prediction of 8 wins stands , bolt upright

I did the exact same thing lol, HDMI is great.

[BarnDee 287]

I just used vga cable and audio cable worked good as gold , cheers

[Robot Devil 1,895]

True, but yelling 'kick it short' just seems weird.

To be fair, the last few years I was just yelling "kick it" because I was sick of watching them handball themselves into trouble.

Hoping this is a new era etc etc.

[BarnDee 287]

im what big kev said

[DeeSpencer 23,482]

Trengove is easily in our top three midfielders... His class can't be taught... Its a hell of a lot easier to play like Bartel does in a strong geelong team, then it would be to play in last years demons team... Im sick of the player bashing on here.... Trengove just walked away with 29 possessions...

I'm he's top 3. Really it's probably Jones, Vince and then any of quite a few to chose from who are up to AFL standard as rotation guys but not near the elite end. But you are right Trengove has class but he also has limitations and a playing style.

He's not a bulldozer in close like Jones or Viney, probably not even a top vision and class at the clearances player like Tyson. He's not the run, break the lines and kick 60 like Vince can be. He's a run all day, accumulate the footy (29 touches whilst getting subbed out of the first half with 10 mins to go), strong mark for his size, good tackler and decent decision maker.

I don't see the point trying to make Trengove in to a Jack Viney in close or in to a speedy wing man. It's only been one game and possession counts can flatter especially in the nab challenge but so far it seems Trengove is going to play to his strengths. And that was a bit of a common theme on friday night.

[monoccular 16,394]

Watched the second half before and we were better in the last quarter that the third in my opinion, we seemed to improve as the game went on.

It was also very interesting to hear Brereton say that Pederson was making lead after lead and running himself in to the ground to clear the forward line and shortly after, Roos praised him for his game. I guess there are a lot of instructions given to the players that we aren't privy to and that's why we sometimes think a player has been ordinary when he's done exactly what the coach wanted him to do.

I also only saw the second half but was interested to hear Dermwit raving about Pedersen's work rate. I did hear some still calling him a spud but it seems he did a lot off ball (we have seen so little of that in recent years from our 'stars' let alone our 'spuds') that may go unnoticed by the casual observer and certainly when watching on TV. If Roos raved about him, maybe those who label him a loser and a liability can have another look and reevaluate.

Good point about the handballs. I was more referring to the style Bailey favoured of sweeping the ball out of the back half with a wave of handballs but you're right there were lots of link up handballs to get the ball to an outlier. Also a lot of short quick handballs around stoppages.

Good point also about their capacity to implement the style of footy. Impressive really and speaks to some good training. As training reports have emphasized there has been a lot of training with footys which has to help but perhaps the biggest ingredient is faith by the players in Roos and his messages.

Also i was saying to a mate that perhaps the game plan, which is akin to keeping off, is more natural to footy players than one based on zones and territory

.

I will be interested to see if Roos can / will change the style from what has generally become a zonal basketball or soccer chess game back into a more instinctive attacking mode, though of course based on a sound accountable defence supported by a midfield prepared to, when appropriate, push back - not so much as a flood but as a flexible road out of defence into attack through an open forward line.

Re the forwards, I expect there could also be a more open deep forward structure with players leading higher and wider, leaving the forward line more open somewhat akin to "Pagan's paddock"?

[Macca 16,173]

Re Trengove ... he's got very good vision and he can find the ball a lot. He's a great kick and a more than excellent mark for his size. He can also bring his teammates into the game like many can't. Class is something that can't be measured and Jack is a classy player.

His best position is as a half forward or as a high half forward although considering there's all different types of midfielders these days, Roos could also find a role for him in there either a fair bit of the time or fleetingly.

I thought he set up a number of our plays on Friday night with his creativity. 13 marks indicates that he ran well to position and space. He was our best player within a terrific team effort.

Roos will allow him to play his natural game and then we'll see him blossom.

[RalphiusMaximus 5,993]

Just watched the replay again. It really was great to see some structure in the midfield. Also the effort at running and giving options was great, in particular the guys who weren't getting the ball and just kept on running hard to give the option every time. Pedo and Barry both did this really well for little reward.

It was also interesting to see Vince setting up behind the pack quite often. This is the spot I expect Watts to be taking up when he's fit, to get the quick dish and distribute. Vince played the role really well last night.

As everyone keeps saying, it was only NAB, but it was pretty damn good to watch a win against a decent team like that.

[RalphiusMaximus 5,993]

Also, it's interesting to note Trengove's eyes when he has the ball. They never stop darting around to check out all the options. He may not have quick feet, but he clearly has a quick brain.

[Tatu 416]

I'm he's top 3. Really it's probably Jones, Vince and then any of quite a few to chose from who are up to AFL standard as rotation guys but not near the elite end. But you are right Trengove has class but he also has limitations and a playing style.

He's not a bulldozer in close like Jones or Viney, probably not even a top vision and class at the clearances player like Tyson. He's not the run, break the lines and kick 60 like Vince can be. He's a run all day, accumulate the footy (29 touches whilst getting subbed out of the first half with 10 mins to go), strong mark for his size, good tackler and decent decision maker.

I don't see the point trying to make Trengove in to a Jack Viney in close or in to a speedy wing man. It's only been one game and possession counts can flatter especially in the nab challenge but so far it seems Trengove is going to play to his strengths. And that was a bit of a common theme on friday night.

It has only been one game and you have Bernie Vince in our top two midfielders...lol... Funny that... Suppose people only really see, what they want to see...

Ask yourself this.... If Cross or Viney or Toumpas pulled out the numbers that Trengove did? What would you be saying? Would you be excited?

Trengove has been far better for us, then he gets credit for....

His on field performances slip due to the pressure of captaincy, bad instructions, poor game plan, injuries and no support on or off field... Yet on here, the boots keep kicking into him....

When Scully left us for millions, it was Trengove who committed for four years... Then some [censored] almost ruins his career, by the placing the whole club on his shoulders and making him the youngest captain ever!!! WTF!!! He's hardly worked out his own game and he's given the captaincy... the club used him as there show piece, just like they did with Watts... The club built up unreasonable expectation and almost destroyed him... Then on top of that, he stands accused of using bloody AOD cream!!! Are you kidding me!! Farout!!

Trengove has given us and the club far more then we have given him... When he is out of contract, the other clubs will come knocking and I wont blame him if he leaves..... after what he has been through, i wouldn't blame him if he left the game all together...

[What 18,810]

It has only been one game and you have Bernie Vince in our top two midfielders...lol... Funny that... Suppose people only really see, what they want to see...

Yeah I mean hes only a Best and Fairest from another club who has a higher career disposal average than any Melbourne player of the last 10 years

[Whispering_Jack 28,094]

I thought I would pay a visit to Punt Road End to get a perspective on what Tiger supporters thought. Here's a selection of quotes:

You can cut it, roll it or pack it anyway you like but the reality is we got beaten by Melbourne who were not full strentgh and we were only missing a few players from our best 22. Nab or not losing to Melbourne should be the same as losing to the pies or the scum .... Ie never ok.

A better showing against the pies and all will be forgotten.

We allowed them to chip it around without pressure all night and they denied us the ball. Just like we allowed Carlton to position unmanned outside players 5 metres from the inside contest and they repeatedly punished us when their rucks punched the ball in their direction.

surely that is a planning and tactis issue.

Half the team played for Coburg last year or not at all. How can people really draw anything from the result?

God, I'd forgotten how boring Roos makes football.

Four defenders against two forwards, bring the ball to ground, scrubby sideways pass, and another, and another, and another, lose it, force a stoppage, win it back, scrubby sideways pass, and another, deny, deny, deny, prevent any vestige of exhilarating football from ever appearing, win the war of attrition, bank the four points.

Its going to be a long season now that he is back.

[DemonFrog 1,347]

In the jungle The Mighty Jungle

Ee e e um um a weh

Ee e e um um a weh

Wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh

Wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh

Wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh

Wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh

In the jungle, the mighty jungle

The Tiger sleeps tonight

In the jungle, the quiet jungle

The Tiger sleeps tonight

Wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh

Wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh

Wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh

Wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh

Near the village, the peaceful village

The Tiger sleeps tonight

Near the village, the quiet village

The Tiger sleeps tonight

Wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh

Wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh

Wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh

Wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh

Hush my darling, don't fear my darling

The Tiger sleeps tonight

Hush my darling, don't fear my darling

The Tiger sleeps tonight

Wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh

Wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh

Wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh

Wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh, wimoweh

Ee e e um um a weh

Ee e e um um a weh

Go the DEES!

[Tatu 416]

Yeah I mean hes only a Best and Fairest from another club who has a higher career disposal average than any Melbourne player of the last 10 years

Of any Melbourne player, in the last TEN years.... Are you sure about that?

Also the crow didn't seem to worried about trading him?

I'm not bagging Vince.... He's a good player and if he keeps playing that way through the season... He wont only be our best, he'll be in the comps top twenty.... he has added a lot to our midfield... Who knows, he might go on and have the greatest season he has ever had(i hope he does)..... for me it takes more than 1 game though...

I just think Trengove has been judged to harshly by some on here... If people are gonna whack players, after a bad game... Its only fair that they praise them after a good one... Credit where its due...

[rpfc 27,637]

You can worry about Vince's longevity in the game or his nightlife, but his resume goes beyond that one game.

Trengove is marked harshly, but you doing the same to Vince isn't winning the argument.

And Vince became our 2nd best mid the day he was traded. Trengove has a long way to go to get near Bernie.

[Moonshadow 16,409]

I thought I would pay a visit to Punt Road End to get a perspective on what Tiger supporters thought. Here's a selection of quotes:

That last one about how boring Roos coaches did make me chuckle WJ

[Tatu 416]

You can worry about Vince's longevity in the game or his nightlife, but his resume goes beyond that one game.

Trengove is marked harshly, but you doing the same to Vince isn't winning the argument.

And Vince became our 2nd best mid the day he was traded. Trengove has a long way to go to get near Bernie.

I'm not marking Vince harshly? I'm not the one who brought him into this conversation.... If you scroll back, you'll see how Vince became apart of this small disagreement...lol...

eg: About four years ago, some people on here wanted to trade Jones...lol... This is what I mean by judged harshly...

In no way am i comparing Vince to Trengove... When both careers are over, I'm happy to look back and review/compare then...

Im just disappointed that when all the praise came in for this game, that Trengove didn't get his fair share of praise...

[Barney Rubble 1,576]

For 5 years I have feared Round 1.

After NAB 1. Bring it on. I am finding it more difficult to name our stating 22 line up.

With Riley long term injury list, and with the promising display go Georgiou. He could be the sub promoted.

That would throw the back line selection into the Take 2 mode.

Michies form also throws in another Curley one.

Mid fielders who do you now pick. Jones, Trengove, Vince, Michie, Tyson, Watts, Viney, Matt jones, Toumpas Cross, Evans, Bail can't be ignored either.

What do we do with Byrnes..... Casey or does he get the FP. Role until they give JKH a bit more development time.

Clisby and Kent where do you ply them?

I have just recently got an IPad mini. Forgive me if I make some errors, but the predictive text is a pain.

Mickie instead of Michie

Clubby instead of Clisby.

I think it maybe better to leave as is and await someone to waste 30 posts on my poor spelling or not knowing anyone in the team.

Edited February 15, 2014 by Chippy

[Forest Demon 4,681]

Trenners definitely looked a lot better on Friday night. A couple of blunders including the one in the last couple of minutes aside, he was very good.

[Hannibal 5,814]

I'm he's top 3. Really it's probably Jones, Vince and then any of quite a few to chose from who are up to AFL standard as rotation guys but not near the elite end. But you are right Trengove has class but he also has limitations and a playing style.

He's not a bulldozer in close like Jones or Viney, probably not even a top vision and class at the clearances player like Tyson. He's not the run, break the lines and kick 60 like Vince can be. He's a run all day, accumulate the footy (29 touches whilst getting subbed out of the first half with 10 mins to go), strong mark for his size, good tackler and decent decision maker.

I don't see the point trying to make Trengove in to a Jack Viney in close or in to a speedy wing man. It's only been one game and possession counts can flatter especially in the nab challenge but so far it seems Trengove is going to play to his strengths. And that was a bit of a common theme on friday night.

The secret to Trengove's success will be elite endurance and confidence. When you don't have the characteristics you've mentioned, but you have good skills, make good decisions, have a strong body and are a very good mark for your size you need elite endurance. Trengove has been compared to Bartel 100 times before and it's a good comparison. Run all day, good positioning and standing up when it's counted. Other than marking, Bartel isn't elite in any one facet of the game. But as a package he's been fantastic. With belief, Trengove can become a terrific all-round midfielder.

[Jarka 767]

Someone who surprised me from that game was Dunn, I thought he played with a lot of maturity which is something I'd never expect from him.

[old dee 22,982]

Re Trengove ... he's got very good vision and he can find the ball a lot. He's a great kick and a more than excellent mark for his size. He can also bring his teammates into the game like many can't. Class is something that can't be measured and Jack is a classy player.

His best position is as a half forward or as a high half forward although considering there's all different types of midfielders these days, Roos could also find a role for him in there either a fair bit of the time or fleetingly.

I thought he set up a number of our plays on Friday night with his creativity. 13 marks indicates that he ran well to position and space. He was our best player within a terrific team effort.

Roos will allow him to play his natural game and then we'll see him blossom.

I agree with this Macca, for two years I have been saying he is primarily a half forward.

If we remember some of his games last year he was poor, I remember one game where it did not make the 30 metres distance to goal from directly in front. He was Definately carrying injuries IMO.

Play him as primarily as a half forward and he will be a good player.

[rpfc 27,637]

Someone who surprised me from that game was Dunn, I thought he played with a lot of maturity which is something I'd never expect from him.

Yes, still elbowed a bloke and should have had the ball taken from him but he had a solid night.

[DeeZee 6,853]

We now have real depth, and itll be hard for some really good players to get a game, especially when Hogan, watts, garland,dawes, clark , gawn and viney come back....who do you drop?