Top heavy up front?

[Hannibal 5,814]

I cant see how anyone finds that top heavy. It basically mirrors the current premiers set up of Franklin, Roughhead, Hale and Gunston. Given Clark, Howe and Hogan are extremely mobile and good below their knees I don't see any issue.

I agree.

There's no doubt the group will need to work on chemistry and not getting in each others way. Just as importantly they'll be made to look good, or average dependent on the midfield.

Howe is a bloody good footballer who cops a bum wrap on here and will only get better. He's agile enough to play as a mid, so while he can play tall, he won't add to a top heavy forward-line.

Dawes is the blue collar work-horse. Wait until he gets the third best defender in a year, or two.

Clark has superstar talent. He's quick, agile and very good on the ground. He kicked 5 goals in a game against West Coast in Perth and every one was from a ground ball.

Hogan has good pace and mobility. Like Clark, he could even be effective with small stints on the ball.

I reckon the forward line works if the quality of the midfield ball improves dramatically.

As for comparing our trio of talls with Roughead and Franklin ? It's always difficult comparing anyone to players with runs on the board. Franklin was just OK early in his career. Who can forget West Coast trying to rough up this young skinny tall ? Roughead played a couple of years in the back-line and used to incur the wrath of Hawthorn supporters as being a bit soft. Things change, as they will with our forward line.

Let's just hope that we get a decent run with injuries. Hogan will become this club's first bona fide star since Flower. You build premiership teams around a guy like Hogan. Dawes will also be so much better with Clark and Hogan taking some of the heat.

There's no doubt we need a quality goal kicking small with heart and speed.

[Guest]

On a side note, my old man (who is a mate of Mitch's through photography), got a text from him saying "fully fit and ready to go", so make of that what you will.

[binman 42,456]

Let's just hope that we get a decent run with injuries. Hogan will become this club's first bona fide star since Flower. You build premiership teams around a guy like Hogan. Dawes will also be so much better with Clark and Hogan taking some of the heat.

There's no doubt we need a quality goal kicking small with heart and speed.

A decent run with injuries is absolutely crucial (it's part of footy culture to downplay the impact of injuries but in my view it is perhaps the biggest determinant of a sides success). Whatever anyone says about Neeld it has to be said he had terrible luck in terms of players being out. Surely we are due some luck on that front.

I hope you're right about Hogan because every side needs a super star and i agree that we haven't had one since Flower (Shwarter was very close before his first knee injury and i have no doubt would have gone to be a super star of the game). Super stars obviously help on field but almost as important is the buzz and excitement they bring as well as the new fans that come on board.

[praha 11,226]

Clark, Dawes and Howe are all capable of moving up and pushing onto the wing. They all do it frequently. Especially Dawes.

Hogan should stay in the goal square.

I imagine in a traditional forward set-up it's a bit top-heavy but you'd expect them to rotate around Hogan.

[rjay 24,795]

Clark, Dawes and Howe are all capable of moving up and pushing onto the wing. They all do it frequently. Especially Dawes.

Hogan should stay in the goal square.

I imagine in a traditional forward set-up it's a bit top-heavy but you'd expect them to rotate around Hogan.

Hogan doesn't play that way and I would be very surprised if we used him like that. He covers a lot of ground and should continue to do it.

[Hannibal 5,814]

Hogan should stay in the goal square.

.

I don't agree. One of Hogan's strengths is his hard running. He's a perfect CHF. I accept that he'll be eased into footy and won't often take that role, but the days of a player predominantly playing deep are over. Roos wants mobility and while two way running is more a focus on mids he also wants his power forwards to present and run.

[drdrake 3,151]

I don't agree. One of Hogan's strengths is his hard running. He's a perfect CHF. I accept that he'll be eased into footy and won't often take that role, but the days of a player predominantly playing deep are over. Roos wants mobility and while two way running is more a focus on mids he also wants his power forwards to present and run.

Every forward needs to have the ability to run both ways, pushing up the ground and working hard to be an option inside our forward 50m arc. No such thing as a stay at home forward anymore. If Dawes and Clark are fit Hogan will play the HFF role with the ability to run rather that the Key Role

[Ron Burgundy 8,584]

Howe missed 1 game last year and Hoges is a debutant

Don't know why every poster is talking about that 'group' not getting on the park

Our football department does not expect Clark and Dawes to continue to be injured so the question is obviously valid

I think it is a balltearer of a forward line that will look even better with finally a decent midfield feeding it

Totally agree. This forward line looks great, especially when you compare it to our forward line in 2011, which consisted of the likes of Rivers and Garland. A forward line which, for much of the season, was vaguely VFL standard.

I reckon this forward line has the potential to be a really dangerous, effective forward line. Just need a good run on the injury front and a Blease, JKH, Byrnes or Barry to own the small forward position.

Could be one of the better forward lines in the comp all things going to plan.

[Moonshadow 17,672]

Regardless on whether we agree or not, Hogan has played some of his junior footy down back. And has done very well there. In future, that may be deemed an option should we find ourselves with too many tall forwards. Of course, we'd all love to see him tearing it up as a KPF, but it would be interesting to hear PR's thoughts on this over the next year or 2.

[Lil_red_fire_engine 11,077]

Comparison with Hawthorn is all about proof that the structure works and not about the quality of the player. Of course it will work better with consistent quality midfield delivery as its fair to argue that any forward structure does. The key with this structure is regardless of the quality of player they all have good endurance and in the case of Clark, Hogan and Howe have excellent mobility for their size. I am less concerned about our small forwards as I expect in typical Roos style it is more mids that will rotate through to play these roles rather than permanent crumbers or specialist pressure forwards. This is probably even more likely with the introduction of interchange restrictions.

[Hannibal 5,814]

Every forward needs to have the ability to run both ways, pushing up the ground and working hard to be an option inside our forward 50m arc. No such thing as a stay at home forward anymore. If Dawes and Clark are fit Hogan will play the HFF role with the ability to run rather that the Key Role

Why are you quoting me ?

[DeeSpencer 25,343]

You're kidding right?

If you're comparing these guys' collective performances in the goal kicking over the years tell me which combination comes near them?

Since 2007

LF: 73, 113, 67. 64, 82, 69, 60

JR: 40, 75, 51, 53, 16, 41, 72

Or totals:

113, 188, 118, 117, 98, 110, 132

2011 Riewoldt and Vickery: 62 + 36 = 98

2011 Cloke and Dawes 69 + 27 = 96

2012 Walker and Tippett 63 + 39 = 102

2013 Josh Kennedy and Jack Darling 60 + 42 = 102

So yeah for consistency these guys have smashed it out of the park with only Roughy's injury putting them under 100. But only in the 2 premiership years have they gone past 120 and only in 2008 have they put up a huge number. Other decent key forward partnerships have got to around that 100 mark. 120 goals or 60 each is only 3 goals a game each is my point.

What I'm trying to say is that Franklin and Roughead as a combination create so much danger because of how much they contributed to games as players and what they did to the rest of the forward line and team with match ups and so on. Besides 2008 they rarely ripped teams apart on pure goal kicking. It's what made the Fev and Brown combination in Voss' mind such a bad idea.

So Clark, Dawes, Hogan and throw in Howe in a bad side might only get to 120 goals from all 4 of them combined yet can still have a massive impact on the team.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,665]

On a side note, my old man (who is a mate of Mitch's through photography), got a text from him saying "fully fit and ready to go", so make of that what you will.

I really hope you're talking about Clark, not Morton.

[Guest]

I really hope you're talking about Clark, not Morton.

Mitch Morton's relevance to demonland is? Lol

[dpositive 1,663]

I reckon this is a great thread almost all about the footy, and its almost all about a Demons forward line.

I agree that the fantasizing is dependent on the mids and getting the ball down forward but I would like to see

Howe mainly deep in the pocket running to the goal square for the mark when the ball is dogged there by Clarke Dawes Hogan and Fitzy who are all mobile and love to move to create space. As all those players are pretty good at second efforts and creating space their mobility rotating around and through CHF could create a new game plan and a real problem for defences. they all have an ability to drift back and support the high flier Howe and can act in that role when he or they need a rest or wants a bit of run on the ball.

Hopefully they will all need a rest as the ball will spend so long in our deep forward that they will be exhausted kicking scores and will not have to run too far out to the centre. Also our mid fielders will not have to run too deep defensively or in attack and this will make them more durable and effective in the HB to HF lines with perhaps only one running deep for the crumbing.

I dont know if I have explained that too well but I have seen similar patterns work at various levels. I am confident PR can use the predominant skill and abilities of our players to achieve some significant team football results.

[CBDees 3,167]

I agree.

There's no doubt the group will need to work on chemistry and not getting in each others way. Just as importantly they'll be made to look good, or average dependent on the midfield.

Howe is a bloody good footballer who cops a bum wrap on here and will only get better. He's agile enough to play as a mid, so while he can play tall, he won't add to a top heavy forward-line.

Dawes is the blue collar work-horse. Wait until he gets the third best defender in a year, or two.

Clark has superstar talent. He's quick, agile and very good on the ground. He kicked 5 goals in a game against West Coast in Perth and every one was from a ground ball.

Hogan has good pace and mobility. Like Clark, he could even be effective with small stints on the ball.

I reckon the forward line works if the quality of the midfield ball improves dramatically.

As for comparing our trio of talls with Roughead and Franklin ? It's always difficult comparing anyone to players with runs on the board. Franklin was just OK early in his career. Who can forget West Coast trying to rough up this young skinny tall ? Roughead played a couple of years in the back-line and used to incur the wrath of Hawthorn supporters as being a bit soft. Things change, as they will with our forward line.

Let's just hope that we get a decent run with injuries. Hogan will become this club's first bona fide star since Flower. You build premiership teams around a guy like Hogan. Dawes will also be so much better with Clark and Hogan taking some of the heat.

There's no doubt we need a quality goal kicking small with heart and speed.

i agree with your summation and I am quietly optimistic that JKH will surprise many Demonlanders and opposition supporters by proving to be that magic small forward that we have craved since the Wizard went West.

[Alcho Dee 269]

Great looking forward line, but these guys need games together and time to gel. We need run out of the back line and fast ball movement through the midfield so that teams don't have time to drop back and out number us.

I would play Hogan, Clark and Howe in the goal square Dawes CHF, Fitzpatrick playing with Casey as a replacement for whoever gets injured first, my bet being Dawes. If another goes down Watts goes forward too. Let's hope that we don't loose all 3 big men Hogan, Clark and Dawes....reality is we will loose 1. What we might have gained from 2013 was game time up forward for Fitzpatrick.

[Je Roos Salem 661]

Is Watts being ruled out as a forward this year?

[rjay 24,795]

Is Watts being ruled out as a forward this year?

I hope so, he needs to settle in a position and it looks like the midfield. I could still see him rotating forward as a resting option but that would be it.

[Carrot Top 947]

If it gives the mids confidence to deliver it to them ASAP then it's a good line up.

If the mids hum and har, and then look to give it to a second or third option on the flanks because the forwards are all crowding each other then it's a bad line up.

Only game time will tell, but I think we have enough brains in the coaches box to get that right.

Having too much talent isn't a bad thing. Misusing that talent is.

[Sir Why You Little 36,885]

Haha i have to laugh at those calling this possible forward line "Top Heavy"!! It was only 2-3 seasons ago Brad Green was our only target and often the mids would look up to an empty half of the ground ...

I know which option i prefer.

[dpositive 1,663]

I guess I see Howe not only as a fantastic high marking forward but also as a crumber off the pack.

Clarke Hogan and Dawes are all very mobile and agile but may be more capable of the big pack mark.

Fitzy is also agile but not as consistently high flying as Howe.

We will not need to play all of them on the field all the time but can use the number and skill necessary

I just recon all five provide some fantastic options and will worry most defensive units.

The task for Roos is placing and moving these strengths to not only unsettle but overwhelm every other side.

[DemonTux 97]

re small forwards and rotating mids through the forward line, to compliment the talls, I know I haven’t been to lots of training sessions but it was nice to see EVERYONE during training rotations a week before Christmas practising snapping goals. So a finding a rioli type shouldn’t be necessary if all players are capable of getting their hands on a lose ball in the forward line and confident enough (through practice) to just have a crack. So in saying i am happy with the talls forward especially since we know most of them have a tank to be able to hurt elsewhere.

With forward/defensive pressure the way it i now-days, opportunist goals are gold. If the big options cant grab it (yay depth), then it's everyone responsibility to gain possession and personally i prefer them having a crack than farting around looking for a turn over (i mean option) in the forward 50. Is there an attempt to score from lose ball stat? Would be interesting to know it's effectiveness compared to completed passes/marks under pressure in forward 50... even a point is better than looking like your trying to be clever... law of averages says some may even be goals.

[Biffen 12,940]

Not really an issue if Dawes plays higher up the ground as he does.

Clark will be stay at home full forward if such a thing exists.

If we had 3 Darren Bennetts up there on a wet day I would start to worry.

These three big guys are all fairly good on the ground ball.

If they are all injury free and in the same team it's a great problem to have.

[ignition. 1,463]

I wouldn't consider us top heavy at all, 3 quality talls up forward is ideal - 2 of which (Clark & Hogan) have shown they have the aerobic capacity to push up the ground. Howe's size and ability would see him fit perfectly as a medium forward in any 22 of any side. Leaving two more positions for a small forward and/ or a pushing midfielder/s.

Also with the way the game is going in regards to capping the interchange, we will see an increase in ruck/forwards rotating and resting in the forward line leaving a greater proportion of interchange left for the midfielders. Rather than reducing the number of tall forwards or rucks this method (along with reduced interchange) will increase the challenge of tiring defenders whilst maintaining a fresh midfield.

As for forwards the Dee's are well placed, let's just hope they remain fit and injury free for round one and the team (midfield included) develop a good quality team oriented brand of football.