THE SPIRIT WAS THERE, BUT ...

[Guest José Mourinho]

I think you just don't get it stuie, and you ridicule what you don't understand.

[andrewlamprill37 24]

I completely agree with the article, I think we had a crack and from half time on we had most the play just couldn't covert forward and let through soft goals and that was the difference. I'm sure at the dogs would feel like they got away with one. Unfortunately for us I think what we lack most is smart footballers and I don't care how fast tall short thick strong or fit are if you cant make the right decisions your not gonna go very far especially under pressure where we cough it up time after time. I have watts, trenners and sylvia as our only smart players and I feel I'm still being generous, that's what I'm worried about.

[Dappa Dan 2,188]

I fully undertsand the OP's point...

But surely that game wasn't as bad as the last 3? Some of the changes we need have come about... We had SOME outside ball finally.

[dees189227 10,808]

I can see where Neeld is coming from. If we did everything properly then the scoreboard wouldnt matter because we would probably be in front. Tonight I saw how this game plan would work. There was a time there where the bulldogs just couldnt clear it out. The only problem was we couldnt get the ball back and take advantage.

It was just frustrating we couldnt take advantage in the first quarter with momentum by kicking some goals we should have kicked.

[bing181 8,169]

MFC are just insulting our intelligence now...

No, you are with threads like this.

[Gorgoroth 12,331]

At least we matched them with I50's this week, there is a start.

[Footynut 302]

Sorry stuie - you need to get real.

You seem to expect a guy who has coached 4 games to turn around a basket case.

You easily forget his first presser and how he got caned in the media for being honest.

Do you think he should come out every week and slaughter the team and further degrade their confidence?

He is doing as well as we could expect any coach to be doing.

Dont sit there and tell me there is another coach who would have done any better with this group after 4 rounds.

The players have poor skills, lack composure, are not fit, many lack experience and many lack talent and are showing we have all overated them.

No coach can fix those things all at once and immediately.

Yesterday we saw improvement in endeavour and that is one thing I would expect the coach to impact and that was a good sign.

Do I accept mediocrity? No

Am I unhappy, angry and upset with where we are? Yes

But my head is not stuck in clouds thinking we have some sort of God as head coach who will change the culture, people, processes at the club and turn it all into progress in a short time.

You know what they say about pig sh%t......you cant make strawberry jam from it...

[Webber 10,133]

We had equal inside 50's against a team who couldn't get it inside 50 the previous week. This is not progress, just comparative hopelessness. St.Kilda's defence will tear us apart next week....10 goals plus.

The number of times the dogs had runners ready to get away from the stoppage from the inside of it, while we camped ours to the boundary line side, was just amazing. I just kept seeing them get the ball and feed it inside, then run away. I just don't understand why Mark Neeld doesn't set up our runners at the stoppage to counter this.

Oh, and Mark Jamar is on borrowed time......too one dimensional, and it's a pretty ordinary dimension at the moment.

Also, midfielders need to keep their feet. Brent Moloney always does, Jordie McKenzie never does......

[Waltham33 409]

I am fascinated that people are insinuating we were a basket case. Now certainly there were games last year that we were horrible (one in particular comes to mind), but we won 2 games by over 100 last year and another by over 90. We were never a basket case and I will not buy into that rubbish.

The only positive that I can possibly think of is that Neeld is now building some rapport with his players as opposed to shooting them in public (see round 1 presser).

[nutbean 8,837]

Did anyone seriously go in to this game thinking they were a worse side than us? I've got to say, you'd have struggled to convince me that there existed a side worse than us prior to this game.

Every sports betting agency had the dogs easily as favourites as did most of the experts.

I always believe we can win every game however I was under no illusion as to where we sit.

[Dr. Gonzo 22,500]

I am fascinated that people are insinuating we were a basket case. Now certainly there were games last year that we were horrible (one in particular comes to mind), but we won 2 games by over 100 last year and another by over 90. We were never a basket case and I will not buy into that rubbish.

The only positive that I can possibly think of is that Neeld is now building some rapport with his players as opposed to shooting them in public (see round 1 presser).

You're trolling right? We weren't a basket case last year when we lost by 31 goals (biggest losing margin since the equalisation measures of the AFL ie draft, salary cap etc).

We have been a basket case since 2008.

[Crackers 67]

We had equal inside 50's against a team who couldn't get it inside 50 the previous week. Oh, and Mark Jamar is on borrowed time......too one dimensional, and it's a pretty ordinary dimension at the moment.

Also, midfielders need to keep their feet. Brent Moloney always does, Jordie McKenzie never does......

last week the Bulldogs had four more inside 50s (50-46) and yet the Saints won by 63 points, it was their conversion that was the problem. I agree re:Jamar struggling for greater impact. It seems Jordies only way of clearing the ball cleaning when he dives on his knees is by getting a free kick. If he doesn't get that he just starts teh maul 2 meters in front of him where he rolled the handpass.

[The Song Formerly Known As 6,479]

At least we aren't on the bottom of the ladder...

(yes i am being slightly facetious, but thats all i have left )

[Jaded No More 58,208]

You summarise the game and you name one player for criticism. Morton was far and away the least of our problems today.

Yeah you're right, I picked up one of the players who killed us with his turnovers, which was our biggest downfall yesterday.

He got plenty of the ball, which was great, then he turned it over, which was not.

When top talents can't hit a target, you are going to lose every single time.

He wasn't alone, but he was a good representative of how our hard work for most of the game (except for the usual patches where we went to sleep again), amounted to very little in many cases.

As Rivers said post game, we let them get easy goals, but we had to work really really hard to get ours. We missed easy opportunities, and you can't afford to do that.

Next week I'll make sure I classify that if I get stuck into a player, that I am not therefore solely blaming him for the loss. Just to make things clear.

By the way, I got stuck into Trengove about one second later for not going into that last marking contest in our back half. Not a word of dispute.

I'm confused. I didn't think this week we weren't allowed to comment on Morton just because he had his first really positive showing in 2 seasons?

Edited April 22, 2012 by Jaded

[Lil_red_fire_engine 10,219]

I'm confused. I didn't think this week we weren't allowed to comment on Morton just because he had his first really positive showing in 2 seasons?

Just to contradict yourself when you stick the boots into him with your last comment. You dont even know how to support your own argument.

There were numerous reasons for our loss missed early set shots by Clark, Watts and Howe, errors by Watts, T-Mac, Joel Mc, Frawley and Morton, our inability to shut down Murphy in the first half. The complete lack of impact on the game by Trengove or Jamar even when he has 46 touches. The refusal of some of our midfielders but most notably Moloney to not run or offer any defensive game. These could all have been mentioned yet you chose one. To me that says it in itself.

People have been asking for Morton to get more involved and he did. They have asked our midfield to offer us spread and he did it in bucketloads. They have said that he is too outside and he responded with 8 contested possessions, 6 clearances and 6 tackles. I will focus on that improved output over 2 short kicks and a poor handball.

Edited April 23, 2012 by big_red_fire_engine

[Jaded No More 58,208]

Just to contradict yourself when you stick the boots into him with your last comment. You dont even know how to support your own argument.

There were numerous reasons for our loss missed early set shots by Clark, Watts and Howe, errors by Watts, T-Mac, Joel Mc and Morton our inability to shut down Murphy in the first half. The complete lack of impact on the game by Trengove or Jamar even when he has 46 touches. The refusal of some of our midfielders but most notably Moloney to not run or offer any defensive game. These could all have been mentioned yet you chose one. To me that says it in itself.

People have been asking for Morton to get more involved and he did. They have asked our midfield to offer us spread and he did it in bucketloads. They have said that he is too outside and he responded with 8 contested possessions, 6 clearances and 6 tackles. I will focus on that improved output over 2 short kicks and a poor handball.

This is clearly not going anywhere.

I never once said that Morton was the reason we lost, or was to blame, I pointed him out because he stuck in my mind as somebody who truly frustrated me yesterday for undoing some of his good work with really silly disposals, and incorrect decision making.

There were plenty of others who let us down yesterday, there is no denying that, but it's easier to cop missed shots on goal, than easy disposals being stuffed up under no pressure. It is for me anyway.

I'm not exactly sure why everyone is allowed to get stuck into Watts, despite his continued improvement, but Morton is this week's love child for some? I wasn't the only one who found him frustrating either.

Guess we all get annoyed by different things.

Moloney not spreading doesn't annoy me anymore, because I've come to terms with it, just as I've come to terms with Macdonald turning it over. Maybe I need to modify my expectations of Morton, but it's games just like yesterday that prove to me that it was worth sticking with him through some poor form patches, because he is so capable. Doesn't mean he shouldn't improve, because it's only when guys like Morton, Trengove, Watts and so on take the next step and polish their game that we'll start to see some serious improvement.

Jamar, Moloney, Dunn, Davey, Green, Macdonald... this is as good as we're going to get from them. We should demand more from Morton, and Trengove, and Watts, and Howe and so on, and I'm sure Neeld does.

[dee-luded 2,958]

I have no problem with being on track. I am just dumbfounded as to how bad the club has been allowed to become in a relatively short time.

WYL, when you turn things upside down in order to reorganise, you go backwards a bit.. the circumstances around our start to the season has Magnified this several times over.

We only just look like starting to regroup now.

[Deemort 28]

Fingers crossed for Mitch. Been to the 3 Vic games this year and Mitch is everything we have been waiting for in a KPF. Just excites me when he goes near the ball. Even though he only got the 1 goal against the Dogs I saw it as probably his best, or at least as good as the 5 v the Eagles. Just the presence he has up forward, the way he attacked the footy, his unselfishness, toughness, exactly what we've been crying for since Neitz. If we can fix our midfield (Jack Viney great start) and get him and Jurrah (when fit) a ton of opportunities, will be really exciting.

Good on you Mitch for proving many wrong thus far, keep it up and hope the neck scans are all good.

[Nasher 33,074]

Just on the Morton handball - does any blame go to Moloney on that? I saw someone in another thread mention that it was a fair handball in front of Moloney, but Moloney was unable to accelerate enough to reach it due to having legs of lead late in the game. This thought did occur to me at the time, but I dismissed it because I thought I was probably giving Morton a little too much benefit of the doubt, but I'm interested to hear others thoughts on it.

[dee-luded 2,958]

Memo to the Melbourne Football Club Football Department. Here are some pointers that no amount of GPS Data, Statistical Analysis or Past Coaches or Players can give you. Some comments may contradict each other.

Bate - must play 50-70 meters out from goal. He must be the link player coming out of half back. Play him off the left half forward flank. ;If you put the ball out in front he can take a grab and swing onto the left and get in to a contest. He is too slow to run as a midfielder and is an excellent penetrating kick into the 50. His football smarts aren't the best;Can kick a long goal too if needed. Do not allow him to play on the right side of the ground. Whatever side of the ground has his left leg towards the boundary line, tell him to run that channel. Too slow to swing out onto his left and has no right foot. Do you ever see Buddy Franklin break to the right?

Howe - Play him off the right forward flank. Can take a grab but his area should be between 20-60 meters out from goal. Seems to be one kick too far up the ground for my liking as most of his big grabs are towards the wing. Problem is when he looks up towards whats inside 50, he should be that player coming out towards the 50 and not kicking into it. Has great ground awareness and can crumb the ball if needed and doesn't mind the hard stuff. Too often this year we have no-one to kick into. Need to play Petterd and Howe in the same side.

Petterd ;- Deep left forward pocket. I reckon he is a better kick on a tighter angle with his right leg towards the boundary. Has a tendency to hook shots when his right leg is facing centre of the ground. Can take a grab as well but prefer him to stay on the ground and work his opponent out of the contest. Needs to play a "ground"; game (in gridiron terms) and not an "arial" game. Too often going forward this year too many players going up for the mark which leaves either 1 or even 0 Dees players on the ground against 2-3 opposition. Take that a step further and need two ground players hitting most packs one on each side moving into the contest going towards goal. Covers space going forward and if ball goes out back of the pack a better chance to apply pressure if landing in opposition hands.

Morton - Don't think i've ever seen a more "outside" player in the past 5 years. Needs to play the right wing and run the channel 10 meters past each end of the square. Biggest concern in his tendency to over finesse when trying to hit targets. He kicks the ball 5 meters too short thinking that the player going for the mark will make it to the ball. Has to learn to kick the ball to the player and not drag the player to the ball. Kick through the ball Cale!! Penetrate don't guesstimate!!! Can kick the ball long as seen during his kick into the 50 towards City End.

Davey - Stick with him inside 50 on the right forward pocket. Flashes past packs but always decides where he is going to run to before the contest and hopes the ball goes in his direction. Likes kicking goals from deep in the right pocket. Can kick a ball very straight but has that left to right hook which in the right forward pocket would mean the ball would swing into the goals. Needs to work a lot harder on defensive pressure.

Watts - Improving every week but is being moulded into a Bob Murphy off half back stopper or a Michael Hurley half forward ball burster? Seems to float over the ground and if he was pushing up the ground needs to NOT go further than the wing. Needs to start working on the double backing leads ala Reiwoldt. Loved the grab today when he threw his opponent to the ground but not just doing it enough. More aerobic work for Watts this pre-season. I'd even go so far as to alternate Howe and Watts in the double backing role. Can't be a steading influence in the backline as who is he going to kick to 50 meters up the ground?

I'll add more to this during the week when i can.

Bater,,, Interesting, considering he's a better kick for goal from the right forward flank.

Turning, thats another thing entirely & one he must work on, including his weaker side disposals. His hands look to be getting better feel, & he's starting to look better equipped around the Mids, slowly improving.

Howe: we need to keep working on our versatility. Not pigeon holing ourselves into easy predictable fodder for opposition.

Petterd: needs to get More Aggressive at the Ball & the Man.. He looks to be somehow holding back compared to a few seasons back. Chase & tackle running down opposition & bring them Down hard.

Morton: hmmn, huh, continue taking the game on trying to instill much needed aggression into his lacking gamestyle.

Davey: looked a bit happier than I've seen him for a couple of years. He thru his body in hell for leather. Great to see.

Watts: also needs to continue playing more aggressively, a common theme amongst Most of our players, one of our biggest deficiencies.

[Fat Tony 4,437]

Our ball use was poor last night. On the positive, at least we tried to find an open man more often and bombed it less.

Our team selection is still concerning. The backline is still way too tall and unskilled. Five KPD is two too many. Tom McDonald is not skilled enough and needs more time to develop in the VFL and Joel Macdonald is letting us down by foot. Next week we need to get Grimes, Tapscott and Blease into the backline so we have some run and kicking skill out of defence. IMO Tapsott won’t make it in any other role than HBF. He lacks pace and he didn’t have the required impact from a sub. I would also consider experimenting with Morton as a third tall KPD, but St Kilda might be too tall this week.

Our midfield is way too slow and the Dogs exploited our lack of pace by employing a third man up to wack it clear of the stoppages. We desperately need to get some pace around the ball. Get Frawley in the guts, along with Bartram and Bail. We also need to consider swapping Martin for Jamar, who has dropped off badly.

Davey has lost his pace and Neeld took too long to tag Murphy.

The bench of Watts, Moloney and Howe at half time made no sense to me.

[Sir Why You Little 34,600]

WYL, when you turn things upside down in order to reorganise, you go backwards a bit.. the circumstances around our start to the season has Magnified this several times over.

We only just look like starting to regroup now.

Yes i agree. But that does not explain the prvious 4 years. 2008-2011 i do not blame Bailey as such. But there were people involved who had no idea what was going on.

Those 4 years were almost wasted onfield and now we are even further behind the mark.

[dee-luded 2,958]

At least we matched them with I50's this week, there is a start.

We matched or outplayed them re Endeavor. Desire was great.

We just got to keep that up & start to settle a bit still maintaining the Intensity. As we get used to playing at that intensity, we will find we have some other opponents being defensive, & off balance.

[dee-luded 2,958]

Just on the Morton handball - does any blame go to Moloney on that? I saw someone in another thread mention that it was a fair handball in front of Moloney, but Moloney was unable to accelerate enough to reach it due to having legs of lead late in the game. This thought did occur to me at the time, but I dismissed it because I thought I was probably giving Morton a little too much benefit of the doubt, but I'm interested to hear others thoughts on it.

Cohesion. Being on the same plane mentally. In sync, thinking likewise.

This happens when things start to look up. Coming from belief. The struggle is first, before the new hope.

[dee-luded 2,958]

Yes i agree. But that does not explain the prvious 4 years. 2008-2011 i do not blame Bailey as such. But there were people involved who had no idea what was going on.

Those 4 years were almost wasted onfield and now we are even further behind the mark.

This is the crux of your feeling dispirited.

Our list is quite good, but too many have been allowed to immitate art. the art of getting soft possessions in the lazy back pocket from kickins. And thereon playing tempo footy for the last 6 or 7 years...

The draft picks from '07, 08 learnt this attitude of bruise free stuff.

Now they have to unlearn it & start to put the head over the ball.

Playing tempo footy for years has stopped their development, of learning to play under pressure, kicking & the like.. Thats where it is.