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I went. Got to Gosch's paddock for a few minutes on Friday. It's been a while too. I was sitting in Hisense arena at the Tennis- and realised the boys had switched their training ground. Great news...but there was a catch. They give you leave passes at Hisense but they only last for a max of 30 minutes. I said to my girl friend ...would you like a coffee? I'll go and get one for you." Very noble of me. So I took off...ran across Olympic Boulevard past the 'pies and past the soccer stuff...arriving at Gosch's approx 11am. I only had a few minutes to watch. The rain had stopped and they were running match practice (Melbourne jumpers vs yellow jackets) where just about everyone was parked in the Melbourne jumpers' forward line, apart from 3-4 melbourne jumper defenders and a couple of yellow jacket forwards in an arc across midfield. It seemed like a good idea for a drill - trying to keep the ball in the forward zone and find targets despite a packed defence. The first drill i see started from midfield. The ball gets kicked back into the Melbourne jumpers' defensive zone and Tommy Mac is running backwards with the flight of the ball. It looks routine..but no...Tom drops the mark. They are keen to keep it moving...so he handballs to Frost (also in a Melbourne jumper) who does a deadeye 10 metre pass...straight to someone in yellow. Back to the centre for another try. This time Trengove is running into the Melbourne forward zone, but struggles to maintain control. The ball comes out, and the Melbourne jumpers had 3-4 attempts at finding targets or finding goals. None were particularly successful. Handballs were clumsy; passes missed targets (although Petracca did a great half-volley pickup, and then lost possession) and no one scored anything. My last memory was Viney (aggressive little bugger) kicking from the right forward flank to the goals. The ball went sailing over their heads of everyone and bounced across the boundary line to the left of the posts. My 10 minutes was up and i had to run back to the tennis. My initial reaction was 'Oh god. What a comedy of errors'. But I can be a glass half-empty person and it was a wet morning. Then I thought about the last time I watched a MFC match practice. Cast your mind back to Feb 2012 at Casey - Neeld in charge. I watched in horror as they struggled to win the ball from one contest, then kicked the ball along the boundary line - straight back to another contest!! And on it went. No-one made space. No-one looked for a target, and don't dare to centre the ball. Gruesome. At least they moved the ball quickly yesterday. At least they are showing more zip and flair. They attacked down both wings and used Salem and Lewis as backmen to start the attacks. I wish I'd seen more. We had a lot of guys on the park, and still can't believe that Jordan Lewis was there yesterday in Melbourne colours, and we got him for pick 48. I like what we are trying to do with the game plan. Hey I'm not expecting miracles this year, but if they want to take chances - take the game on - then i will dust off my Kaspersky Demons cap and give them a go.

I spoke to a bloke last night who watched the training session yesterday and he was very positive. When I asked him did he post on Demonland he stated that he wasn't a member (though he attends training every Friday)! It is frustrating to have 86 posts on a training thread and not a single one about yesterday's session.

During a full ground drill yesterday, Gawn was at the top of the square and someone kicked it to him. Just as he was about to take a fairly high mark, Keilty came from the side and used his body/hip just enough to nudge Maxy to the side and take the defensive mark. Apprently this resulted in a big reaction from the playing group. This was also after Max was doing well and had already taken 3 or 4 good contested marks.

The banner is global to all boards.

Did the training session even happen? I'm having some kind of Kafka-esque existential crisis. Maybe all the players and coaching staff woke up to find they were just cockroaches wandering aimlessly around an empty, meaningless world.... Gawd this off-season is killing me

Lewis is a winner, though. He knows how to win and he knows what it takes to win. He knows it takes 22 blokes all doing what is required of them, regardless of their role, and I have no doubt that a bloke of his experience will adapt quickly. He doesn't need to dominate games for us, he just needs to continue to help set the standards and have an impact on game day. That's good enough for me. As someone pointed out elsewhere, we don't need him to be the 'messiah' as such - we need him to be the cream on the larger cake.

Nailed it.

New Year, time to put a few things in order, so a small personal “coming out”. About a year ago, following a remark I heard on a podcast, I realised I was autistic. The Big A. A little while later, I had a bit of paper to confirm it: a diagnosis of Asperger’s syndrome. (Asperger’s is autism without delay in speech development as a kid.) So, whatever, this is a football forum, fair enough. But posting here for the good and simple reason that the vast majority of adults with autism or Asperger’s are undiagnosed. In general, people have little or no real idea what autism really is. I know I didn’t. Given that autism is present at around 1%, then according to the stats, there would be 40+ autistic Demonlanders, most of whom don’t know it. That’s the stats. In reality? Who knows, at least a few. Or more. You’d be surprised. I know I was. There are underlying key diagnostic criteria, but outside of that, there are no specific rules with autism, everyone’s different. But if you have trouble looking people in the eyes, have trouble maintaining a conversation (except about subjects that really interest you, such as Hogan’s goal-kicking routine, or MFC players in the years between the two world wars), are maybe a bit uncoordinated, and are bothered even slightly, by sound, light, touch (e.g. clothes or textures) it might be worth looking into. For example, one of the ever-so-subtle give-aways for me was that I realised I always drive with the sunvisor down, even in winter. Equally, you could be fine with all of that … and still be autistic. If any of this rings a bell with you or anyone you know, you can look around the net for more info, or do one of the (validated) screening tests. They won’t confirm that you’re autistic, but will confirm that you aren’t (if that’s the case). Do a search on RAADS-14 or Baron-Cohen AQ Test. (if that name rings a bell, yes, cousin of …). Happy to reply to any questions as best I can and based on my own experiences, here or by PM. Autism has been good to me. Alongside the challenges, thinking differently has given me advantages professionally and personally. I wouldn't change it for anything. But I would change having spent most of my life not knowing. Go Dees. (Mods, if this is inappropriate or whatever, please delete.)

very timely you bring up the pharaohs, ldvc. i've just been doing some reading on ancient kemet (KmT) aka egypt and came across this commemorative poster of their 1858 bc KFL grand final. You can see the two teams lined up in the centre and above them the 5 umpires carrying the match balls (one central, 2 goal and 2 boundary umps as it used to be). The interesting thing to note on the poster is a previous incarnation of our own maximus gawnius as the very tall star studded one overarching everyone. He was know then appropriately as "nut" the sky god. his name was the origin of the term nutter as maximus is known to be on occasions. couldn't work out who won but it wouldn't matter as the pharaoh owned both franchises. the ground was adjacent to the nile and you can see some spectators watching from boats near the top of the poster. it also seems it was a night final so the afl is quite behind the times

Already: Gawn, Hunt, Hogan My preferred final 7: Jones, Oliver, Petracca, Brayshaw, Viney, Tyson, Goodwin It's all about the future for me. I see no reason for Pearce being on the banner.

Who's being traded?

There are a few who attend, but maybe some of the 86 posts tell you why some read and don't post

I just think Hird has tried every possible angle to be viewed as "the victim" in this whole sad and sorry mess.

It's not the laws which allowed this criminal to be a free man and commit further offences, it's the weak justice system, the judges and magistrates who are too [censored] weak to dish out the correct penalty. Police do their job and charge these people only for the innocent to be let down when the matter goes court.

Im telling you Declan and Tim Smith will surprise everyone this year. Keilty is one of the most impressive intercept marks i have seen for a long time. Remind me alot of McGovern from West Coast who also started as a rookie. Can also push forward and clunk a couple of big grabs and kicks goals. A genuinely good modern swingman to have.

Hello, I'd like to suggest we use the below image as the starting point and go from there.

I can give a perspective of someone who has lived in Adelaide his whole life if it adds to the conversation. Goody was always an amazing player but at the same time unassuming. He would never really tear a game to shreads nor did he have the talent of a Roo/McLeod. What he did do was mix what talent he had with genuine intelligence and hard work. He shouldn't be remembered as a superstar because he never was, but he was like a utility version of a Corey Enright. Maybe not as good as Enright but nearly as effective off a half back or a wing. Had this awkward style that just got the job done. What really encourages me is that he has always had a reputation as a great people person. His teammates loved him, his coaches loved him, his supporters loved him, his superiors when he was an assistant loved him. I believe with his people skills, knowledge of the game and ability to bring people together, he could very well be a more game savvy version of Daniher with a more talented list. I'm even more confident now with our coach than I was when Roos took over and he ended up doing exactly what he promised. I know people who are friends or acquantices with him and I'm very confident that we are in good hands.

Just reading an article on Peter Dutton's view on Christmas Carols in schools: http://www.theage.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/peter-dutton-calls-for-prochristmas-uprising-against-political-correctness-gone-mad-20161214-gtbj63.html Unsurprisingly, he wants the carols, and is angry when a secular school doesn't sing them. That's fine, he's a Christian and he wants his religion to be prevalent. I don't agree with him, but I'm hardly surprised. This is something I've come to expect, and on the whole am not really annoyed with him. What's really got my goat is this quote: "Because the vast majority of Australian people want to hear Christmas carols. They want their kids to be brought up in a normal environment and they don't want to be lectured to by do-gooders who frankly don't practise what they preach in any case." He's equating 'normal' with 'Christian', and I think that's really dangerous. Religious belief has been declining as a percentage of the population in Australia for years: So I take issue when a politician's worldview centres on Christianity being 'normal'. Peter Dutton makes important policy decisions, and I think his skewed view of what constitutes 'normal' in Australian society can effect those decisions. When a high profile politician makes a comment like that, it marginalises those who doesn't conform to his view of 'normal' society. It makes me really angry. Looking at that graph, about 60% or so of Australian's identify as some sort of Christian. 40% is a whole lot of society to lop into the 'not normal' bucket. And he's elected to make decisions on our behalf? How can he possibly do so when he thinks 40% of the country isn't 'normal'. There are a lot of different types of Australians, but he seems to only be governing for some. I see this as a democratic issue. He can believe in a Christian God all he wants, but he needs to govern for the entire country, not just those who are like him. It's not very 'conservative' of him either. One major feature of conservatism (and one I see value in) is self-determination. One's ability to make ones own choices with regards to religion is central to this. He's effectively casting aside those who chose a different path to his. Words matter. Words uttered by leaders matter more. *puts on flame retardant cloak*

Spoiler Alert. He's not on the banner.

On DEMONLAND that is an impossibility.

Yes, I concur JV... and that best team might be the team that has last use of the ball. It's been a great ride for both our teams but only 1 team will go on.

May the best team win! @Macca

Channel 7 will be doing games. Not sure if it's all games, but saw them advertising the other day that they will be televising the women's league.

I hope that bail justice who gave him bail last week against police recommendations has trouble sleeping. Where do they get these idiots from? Friends of criminals they appear to be.

I'm glad the MFC got a licence, but it's a mickey mouse preseason comp that has little interest to me and certainly has nothing to do with the main aim and game, which is the 2017 Home & Away season. If you have Daisy then I suppose you need the women's coach too ? It's not something I'm overly concerned about, just an opinion.

Gee he was hard to miss, a very good footballer who was surrounded by other very good footballer, but he was a stand out for mine.

Robbie Flower by a street Laurie Fowler Alan Johnson Jacko T Viney Tingay Farmer Travis Johnstone Brett Lovett Jurrah

Or 426 like our ex Nick Smith.

I'm praying that the 3 month old infant recovers and somehow lives a healthy life. A reunion of mother and child is something to wish for. Thoughts are also with the others who have sustained life threatening injuries. Those who work in the vicinity or anyone in the area at the time of this heinous act will be deeply effected. A lot of people are going to need a lot of counselling ... the injured will too as well as having a possible lifetime of having to live with the debilitating after effects of those injuries. I feel so sorry for those who died - their lives taken away in the blink of an eye. My thoughts are with them and their families and friends. Edit: The 3 month old boy died later tonight ... breaks your heart. .

Stay strong Bing not one human on this planet is made to perfection... find your spot and be proud.

I hate seeing other sides have epic battles and real rivalries and when they come off the ground, they have nothing left, I hate it because it simply doesn't apply to us. We have no sides that really hate us, like Collingwood/Essendon, Hawthorn/Essendon, Crows/Port etc. we no longer have any respect from other clubs and I hope that Simon Goodwin will reignite them and turn us in to a side to be feared and hated. I want to see our players come off the ground every week spent, because they've given their all. If he can do that then he will be known as a good coach.

You typed that like this didn't you...

Here is Hird snr response to Patrick Smith's articles: http://www.theaustralian.com.au/sport/opinion/patrick-smith-ignores-the-truth-in-his-articles-on-my-son-james-hird/news-story/722b0db398c399c6fc82b7dac1ff7cff Nothing worth quoting - it is a rehash of the whole saga from go to whoa. Full of should've, could've, would've. Calling for a Senate enquiry. He didn't mention whether he had been to see his son, James; one doubts that he has - it would have been all over the news if he had. Or he would have made a comment about James's wellbeing/progress somewhere in the article. One would think visiting your son when unwell would be a far better way to support him and his family than a rant. Interesting, that Cronulla (who just happened to win the 2016 premiership) are not joining the band wagon to have a Senate enquiry into ASADA etc. Cronulla are winners; Essendon et al are sore losers - still bellyaching about the umpires decsion.

Thread needs to be renamed to 'Hammies and Back Pain'

As long as he knows the "Grand old Flag"

Be very very careful!

Training, guys.

Great work. Elvis at full forward no doubt. Hitchcock as coach, Trump as the mascot, Eraserhead at full back and Wolverine in the ruck. Even in this bunch Gysberts is on the bench.

Some didn't lol

Sorry to keep beating a dead horse, but this should read "had the umpires not gifted them six goals from incorrect free kicks..."

Agree on all points. In some ways the game plan the Crows employed in that era had elements of the modern game plan - hard running, big bodied mid fielders, a large group of players who could run through the midfield, rebound off the hb and an emphasis on skilled players who hit targets. Blight was his coach in his first couple of years and his attacking style no doubt has had a big influence on Goody, who i think i've read knew he wanted to coach whilst still playing and was preparing for the role in the latter part of his career.

No one could stop him getting the ball, and like Robert Harvey was still going at 100% energy late in games. A natural footballer with ridiculous areobic capacity for running. I was a huge fan of the Crows premiership teams ( even though I hated 1998) they had grunt, pace, flair and efficiency everywhere. Perhaps the most noticeable thing was they were full of stars but played brilliantly as a team. I hope that is the flavour Goodwin produces as coach.

I'm happy to be patient and watch the league evolve. Rome wasn't built in a day and all that. Although sadly I think a lot of people will measure the standard against the men's league and dismiss it prematurely. Which is ridiculous, not because the women have any less talent or potential, but because the men's league has had 100+ years of development, and a wider talent pool due to societal expectations around sport... Just wait til the 5 year old girls of today reach the big time. Anyway, getting excited now and can't wait to cheer the Dees on!

Love that Lewis is teaching the players how to kick better (and while we knew we needed it, its still a bit startling to hear it from a player). Lewis seems a humble guy with no airs and graces which (could have come from his 4 premiership medals). McDonald says: "He picks his places when he wants to talk, he doesn't want to be overbearing and feel like he's pushing himself on to other guys..." Can't wait to see him as an on-field general (along with Jones) marshalling the troops. I can see Lewis being the one who looks for potential momentum changes, has a quick word to Jonesy and nipping them in the bud - the lack of which cost us a few games last year. I can also see him keeping the players to structures and playing to team rules; again something we fell down on last year. Lewis and Jones will make a fine pair of generals, along with their apostles, Maxy and Viney For years we have yearned for a playing coach and to think that Lewis literally just fell into our lap!

Giants the best side by a mile, dogs, swans and cats should round out the tonight 4 hawks, crows, dees saints round out the top 8 port to seriously struggle, as will pies and tigers so three sacked coaches.

John Lord Ron Barassi Allen Jakovich Jim Stynes Robbie Flower Frank Adams Max Gawn Jeff Farmer David Schwartz Big Bob Johnson

Do you mean this? (Also, check out the handball)

Do they know it's Christmas....on Manus Island Mr Dutton?

Didn't PJ mentioned a few years back that they wanted a store in a more centralised location in the CBD? Regardless of how nice the apparel is, is the branding effective if people not otherwise engaged with it are actually aware of it? I can't imagine anyone that isn't a Melbourne supporter making the effort to catch the train to Richmond or Jolimont, and then walking to the bowels of the MCG to buy a t-shirt. It might seem trivial but the store's location has always seemed at odds with the club's intention of being "the AFL's NY Yankees". I suspect rent in the CBD would be incredibly expensive, but I also suspect that increased foot traffic would lead to a boost in sale, which may offset that increase in rental expenses. If you're a visitor to Melbourne and you see a store dedicated to "The Melbourne Football Club", I suspect you'd be remotely interested enough to curiously window shop or step inside for a gander. I know I would and have when overseas and see similar stores for sporting clubs. I know that branding is a chicken-egg scenario -- you can't have a strong brand if you're not strong on the field, and you can't be strong on the field if your brand isn't strong enough to attract people to financially support it -- but it's little things like this that contribute to the bigger issue that is the club's long-lasting branding issues.