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I haven't looked at any of highlight packages. Mostly because that is what they are, highlights. I have watched a lot of u/18s for about 15 odd years when a friend became an assistant coach at one club and another the coach of another. My nephews also played a few years each and a close family friend played for vic metro. I do not think I'm am expert on who will go where but I have a good idea on the players. The ones mentioned in this thread I think I can comment on. I have seen them all play more than a handful of times Lever in my opinion would have been the first pick if he didn't do his knee. He didn't play in the midfield as a 17 year old but a lot of 17 year olds don't really get that chance because the coaching can be based around 18 year olds trying to get drafted. He may well have played there on occasion this year if he had played if not more permanently. Not really different to petracca who also didn't play mid last year. Lever has however done a lot of training with the mids in his rehab. I think I would pick him at 3 but a serious knee injury has me second guessing. McCartin is very competitive and likes to bash and crash. He is strong and I'm not in the corner where people say he is so much bigger than the backs. Stronger yes, size maybe a bit, but guys like Boyd, daniher, Patton, even wright are/were much bigger than their opponents, mostly because of height. He had a lot of niggly injuries this year which prevented him from showing his best. A recruiting friend of mine told me just after the national carnival that the doggies rate him as a 10 year player and would pick him at 1. He has great hands and is quite quick off the mark so he can create distance and hold marks. He is strong like frawley was strong at the same age. I think he will play some games next year, like hogan would have played this year minus injury and Boyd playing some games for gws. It's not like we have some gun forwards keeping him out and Dawes will miss a few (just basing this on what might happen) and hogan won't play 22 games (I don't believe anyway). Brayshaw is a certainty. He is the best pure midfielder available. (Heeney goes ok). He works hard from start to finish and doesn't give up. He grinds his opponents if they try to go with him. He played on petracca late in the season and in my opinion got the better of him. Great tackler as he goes with his whole body instead of just his arms. He also is a goal kicking mid and we need those desparately. I don't believe stkilda will pick him at 1 but he could go 1. Petracca played midfield this year after playing as a forward last year. Watching him play he seems to go to the right places but I've been told he has worked very hard at this. Has good vision and always seems to get his hands free when tackled. Another mid who knows were the goals are. I think he will go at 1 but I'm hoping we get the petracca, Brayshaw double as we need mids. Laverde I have seen probably the most. He has tricks upon tricks and pace to burn. My issue with him at 3 for us is that I haven't seen him play as a pure mid. Wing, halfback,halfforward are the places I've seen him most. The kid can do anything though. This year watching him play he really reminded me of Sicily who was drafted by the hawks last year from the same club. Wright is big and can kick it a long way. I'm not sold on him for us. He doesn't go as hard at it as McCartin. He is an ok mark but that might not be the case at afl level against guys as big as you (Not saying it still wont be the case). He does have the ability to influence the game from the forward line and if its not working for him he can go in the ruck and influence the game around the ground. I'm not anti picking him if we do. My preference is petracca, Brayshaw the same as everyone I guess but I don't believe it will work out that way. Having watched recruiting from up close I believe we will get the best result we can on the information that is known now. I've had dealings with our recruiters in the past and I believe we have the right people as compared to the past.

Our most important target isn't on that list - Nathan Jones. I'm sick of bleeding players out of this club. Make a statement and re-sign Jones then move on to external targets.

May as well post this for a third time, but in the proper thread now. Take it as you will: MY MAIL: Just spoke to my connection down at the Falcons. He said that if Petracca goes pick 1, we must take McCartin. Said the kid is an absolute brute, who plays aggressively and can mark, kick, tackle, out body and the rest. Makes me think of what could be with a combination of Hogan and McCartin down there for the next 10 years. Also said he is a monster that would be ready to go round 1. Said he played bottom age last year, and made the All-Australian side, and also actually broke Dom Sheeds collar bone in one of the matches. Downside is that he has diabetes, and has sometimes had to run off the field to check his levels but is making good progress in learning how to manage this. Anyways just what I got told. For me, if Petracca goes #1 like he is expected to, McCartin and Brayshaw would be my wishes.

People saying he's undersized is ridiculous. He is bigger than Jack Darling and he goes alright...

why do you say undersized at 194cm and 95kg?

Howe is us supporters only excitement. Sometimes our only reason to go to the game. Howe has been terribly developed and I believe could be our best player. In a good team, he could be anything. He is god to my brained washed 6yo (I have brain washed him with guilt). He is to my son what Robert Flower was to me. Personally I am very happy he remains a Dee.

They were all trades, not FA's?

It's honestly bewildering reading comments lambasting someone I would wager none of you have met in your lives. And for what, exactly? A comment he never actually made himself ("bruise free"). What a DH! Defending himself when physically attacked at a music festival. What a DH! His greatest crime was not being upfront with the club regarding his involvement with Garlett, who reportedly was also attacked. But of course let's assume the worst cause it's Robinson. Did I mention..what a DH!!! I'm sure none of you have ever touched a drop of alcohol or gone out and found yourself In a situation you'd rather not be in. A bunch of pristine angels. His on field value is what matters, and that is debatable. He didn't have the most inspiring season but Malthouse was clearly never a huge fan. Any off field stuff is a bunch of overblown tripe. This idea that he could corrupt the club is absolutely ridiculous.

Or he simply agreed to postpone his retirement by a year to help Roos get started.

The guy that the Geelong premiership players love so much that they go down to help him out. The guy that is held in great regard for his development of players...yep that's the guy.

Do you honestly think they will bring him in straight after we just recruited Garlett...

17.

Me too ... and we're done with Clark for now. Thanks

So, over 13 billion? Sweet!

People have made very early judgements on Toumpas in comparison to bash/ crash players. That's not what he is. I suspect he'll spend more time on a half forward flank this year with Salem on the other and start to show a bit. For mine, he may never be suited to a midfield role (in the Swallow/ Mitchell mould) but rather, be the bloke who can spot up forward targets as the second last link in the chain. You only had to watch the GF to see how critical it was to not just enter the 50 but do so with precision. On that, Hogan is a mobile forward as is Iron Gloves Dawes and for that reason I'd seriously look at Wright as the stay at home forward. We will now have some talent underfoot with Garlett, JKH, Salem and perhaps Toumpas.

As previously mentioned it was the aim of the MFC to trade for 2 A Grade Mids and also leave one top ten draft pick. (My apologies for suggesting pick 2 would stay, I later corrected this.) There were a number of A Grade players targeted but Dangerfield, Hannebery plus a couple of other A Grade Swans were the players MFC gained traction. Mitchell was also targeted as a Tyson style deal. Melbourne were prepared to trade virtually any player on the list for the right price to also help bring these trades to completion. MFC came very close to securing Danger, Danger had agreed to be traded to us on a massive contract but never asked to leave. Roos was never going to trade picks 2 and 3 for one player which was what Adelaide were asking. When the Adelaide administration were unable to get Danger to commit to a new contract last week, Pick 3 and a later first round pick became the asking price. The tigers had shown interest in Trengrove for pick 12. This deal was on the clasp of being done but unfortunately Trengrove failed his medico. MFC then went to look for a replacement and shopped Watts around. Several good teams were prepared to trade their first round pick 10 -20 for Watts, however Roos put an end to this. Roos values Watts much higher than a pick 10 - 20 but no teams were prepared to offer more. Roos wants to keep Watts. Other players were also suggested but no deal was done. On a side note I don't believe the rumour that Adelaide were prepared to offer pick 10 for Trengrove. Attention then moved back to Sydney, it was hoped that Sydney would have salary cap issues this would force them to off load one of their A Graders for pick 2. MFC were also hoping to trade out another player for a pick around 10 which they would have hoped to get Lever. Another option was to trade for Mitchell with pick 2 swapped for a later single digit pick that would have been used for Lever. Clearly no deal was done. It was difficult to get the targeted Swans players to agree to come to the Dees and Sydney are not yet in a position of being forced to reduce salary cap. This will be an issue for them next year, when they will be forced to let players go....... but they want to win the premiership first. We also made a play for Toby Greene. Roos is targeting Lever and Brayshaw in the draft. Brayshaw is a lock in, it will be interesting who Roos takes with the other low pick. MFC is now is a super strong position with massive salary cap space. It will be making big plays for FA next season and you can bet Danger and Sydney players are at the top of their list. So to the riddles...... if you care. Congratulations to Ignition who was closest to the pin, although many correctly solved the first one. "Our likely trading partner is black and white but not a little bird" Answer: Sydney. A Swan can come in black or white and is not a little bird. "Tick, tock, the black mouse has run up the electric clock. Lancelot lurks with feathers or fur to the command of his sir." The black mouse is Dangerfield, time was running out to complete this deal and Watts had been offered as part of the trade. Watts was later withdrawn. Lancelot is the "Jack of Clubs", Watts is the Jack of Clubs. Watts is Lancelot. There were several clubs interested in Watts and he would go where he was traded. Sir is Roos. Ok so they both ended up not happening, trade week is a moving beast. I am sorry to any that somehow feel offended. For god sake it was a rumour thread, lighten up!! I am sure I will cop some more abuse, please its a waste of your time, I simply don't care. The tread was boring, trade week was boring, I had been muted and thought I would add some fun. It did make me laugh.............. very hard. One more thing, Demonland deteriorates when its members start bickering. We once had a site called Demology. It was destroyed by its members bickering, lets not let Demonland go down that path.

That is in fact the truth. We were lucky to have him for a year.

If you take illegal substances as a sportsman then you should expect a 2 year ban. I seen nothing from these players eg remorse etc that deserves a reduction to the maximum penalty. Oh and another important thing. Soon he can kiss it good bye.

eleventy billion

I feel like the occult member who was overlooked when everyone was being slipped the LSD.

A bit harsh....his defensive game has improved this year and he had several very good games running off half back. I think he's very coachable, brave, fit and has terrific skills. We need to remove VFL standard players off our list before we shift Howe.

Lol, not even giving the clubs time to speak to the players... Muppets

Howe is a required player.

In my view picks are paper money. You really dont know what you are going to get or the true value of the pick for some time. Sure they are an opportunity to back your guess before other teams but history shows that remains very speculative exercise. Roos knows this when he articulated his general approach to the draft. It appears our approach was to find the best available replacement for Frawley. Our bet is that Frost is developing as a key backman who is not yet as good as Frawley but can fill that role at senior level. If we passed because of some belief that picks are bankable currency then we have learnt very little as a club. The question is not whether he was worth pick 23 but rather does he fill the role we needed to fill this year and we will know the answer over the next season.

I disagree that he can play. If you haven't got a lot going for you personality wise, you need to be a good enough player to offset that, and Robinson isn't.

If a Frost developers into our 10 year regular FB than 23 wouldn't be a stupid pick- we only think that because we expected to get him really cheap, but if he works out its a good trade.

Some people are very quick to condemn someone who has had a long and distinguished career in player development on the basis of a personality clash with 2 oddballs like Griffen and Cooney and a spooked administration. If you look at the development of the Dogs younger players there is a lot to like.

Ya gotta love this place. People who have never actually seen a player play watch a highlights reel and decide who they want to draft. That's like 5 good things out of 300. Thats what Barrett does. Come on we're better than that aren't we. Please someone comment who has actually seen him play a few times.

16 chances for us to bang our head against a wall for the next 20 years lamenting that we missed out on the next Buddy Franklin at pick #25, the next Nat Fyfe at #29, the next Luke Parker at #33, the next Matt Priddis at #37, and so forth.

Fair enough. Don't rate him as a footballer either - the DH thing is just an incidental thing for me.

Surely we have higher ambitions than recruitinga known DH just for midfield depth. MFC need midfield class not depth. Robinson is a big NO.

Not sure the Saints shafted us. I think we were given a heads up about what they were going to do.They need Frost more than us and far more than a 188cm forward. They were ready to either give a late pick to Swans or get him delisted meaning they would retain first pick in the PSD. Then they would have nabbed Frost in the PSD. Now they are committed to Membrey and we have the first live pick in the PSD. Hopefully that becomes useful. It may not but at least it is there for us. We effectively got Billy and Frost for 23 as we got pick 40 back and 53 as a bonus. The club may have already the decided the likely player we wanted to take with 23 will probably be there at 40 anyway. Frost can now start training with the boys and Mahoney said that is invaluable to a young player. As others said last year we lost Hannath in the PSD. We have our man.

I was on the Laverde train pretty early, but I've changed my mind a little bit since then. I'm not 100% sure he will ever be a midfielder, and his decision making off the HBF can be horrendous at times. At this stage he tends to rush things when he has the ball, almost as if he panics. That isn't to say he can't be moulded into an excellent footballer, the attributes are certainly there. One other thing I want to mention about McCartin is please try to hold judgement until you have seen footage of him unhindered by injuries in last year's championships. He was incredible for an underage player, and this "spud" talk is clearly coming from people who wouldn't have the slightest clue how good anyone in this draft can be. For now, I'm going to sit on the fence with pick 3 and back in our recruiting department to make the correct decision. All players in contention have tremendous strengths and glaring weaknesses, the deciding factor in who becomes the best footballer will be how well they are developed. But I will say this, if our recruiters genuinely believe Jake Lever can be a midfielder, they must take him. It is a big if, but he has the most potential of anyone in this class in my opinion.

Lumumba rumoured to be on $500k pa.

I suggest working backwards (with a bit of guesswork): Savings: - Clark $600K - Frawley $350K (because his contract had been front ended). - Delisted players $1.6m (8*$200K) - Savings from other front ended contracts eg Dawes/Trengrove but these probably offset by renewed contracts eg Dunn/McDonald Savings of approx $2.5m Cost of new players Frost $250K), Lumumba ($450K) , Garlett ($350K) = approx $1m; Cost of new draftees: $500K. Total New Costs approx: $1.5m Other variations: AFL allow pay't up to 105% of cap if offset in other years; sal cap will go up for 'inflation'; savings from contracted delisted players (if any) On the basis of this 'back-of-the-envelope' calc at least $1m for an FA (front ended so that it tapers off when our young players need to be paid more) Oh, forgot an additional cost: Big increase to N Jones when he signs new long-term contract but I would hope his is front ended into 2015. Hope this helps your thinking! ps couldn't open HS article so can't comment on it

A bigger loss than Frawley. Good luck in the future, George

Would you like fries with that

I've only just opened this thread and might be replying too early, but I do find it rather amusing that MFC (as a list management group) can shop Watts around after the Trengove trade went [censored]-up but then Roosy poured cold water on it because he values Watts too much. If a Watts had the potential to secure Dangerfield or any other A grade mid and Roosy hit it on the head then I'd be absolutely amazed.

I remember pre 2009 draft everyone was Saying we should take John Butcher at pick 1 because the combination of Watts and Butcher for the next 10 years would set our forward line up..

I cannot believe Ian Prendergast made the comment about comparing players to construction workers exposed to asbestos. Is he for real. The essendon players had a choice weather to get injected or not, those poor didnt have a clue what they were exposed to. When they rocked up to work they didnt know asbestos was going into there lungs. What a tool.

And to think I was wondering which fairytale to read my son tonight. The opening post will do. I now know why we need such strong consumer protection laws.

Yeah because asbestos victims sign a consent form, have dozens of hours of education and get sent across the road to a dodgy clinic for thosands of injection. And then plead innicence. Yeah I get the comparison... FMD. he must think the world are muppets.

Let me assure all that the FA Danger campaign 2015 has already begun.

We should've got him last year when Picket Fence offered up pick 2 for him.

I also like reading these rumours. But I also understand that they aren't true.

I'd take Caleb Daniel over Roos if he's still available at this pick. Can't wait to see the little fella in action wherever he goes

If Hawthorn can continue to pick up a developing midfielder and key position player every year, they'll essentially never fall down the ladder. The age spread of their list has been flawlessly managed.

I have nil respect for Mitch Clark so it better I say no more on this subject.

I still can't believe that people are so downbeat on Toumpas. Said it plenty, but I reckon he's showed some great decision making and skills in several games. His game against Richmond this year was class as well as picking up about 10 possessions in a single quarter. Give the lad some time for Petes sake.

The only reason everyone was in such a flap about Wines was because nobody paid any attention to Toumpas at all, because everyone assumed he'd be gone by our pick. All the discussion at the time was around Wines vs O'Rourke. I don't know why people find it so hard to believe that maybe Todd just thought Toumpas was a better player, like every other commentator in the business, professional or amateur.