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I really hope they don't. If he is going to play midfield in 2014, he should not be wasting his time filling in Hogan's shoes for a unglorified practice match.

Thomas straddles the line between forthright and provocation I think. I like that he has strong opinions and isn't afraid about being blunt about it, but sometimes I'm sure he voices them in a manner designed purely to get a reaction.

I'm looking forward to seeing what Max King can do. I know he's raw and the answer is probably not much at this stage, so my expectations are low, but I still find excitement in the opportunities given to second and third string players who would otherwise be completely invisible to me. It is disappointing that neither Dawes nor Hogan could get up, but Roos seemed pretty firm on them being available for the second round. It's hard to see any potential forward line we have available kicking a winning score unless Pedersen plays out of his skin, but honestly, I'm just so excited that footy is back that I don't really care about minor details like that. More than anything I want to see if our midfield can show any signs of being functional this early.

What I will never forgive Schwab and Neeld for is their neglect in failing to consult the writings of Nostradamus before they went on their recruiting campaigns for Mitch Clark and Chris Dawes. "'The young lion will overcome the older one, On the field of combat in a single battle; He will pierce his eyes through a golden cage, Two wounds made one, then he dies a cruel death." This is clearly a reference to the demise through injury of both players. If only those morons understood the prophesy, it would have saved us a lot of misery. You can throw McLardy in with that lot as well. He could have put a stop to this nonsense if he wanted to.

* Seeing how our side has adopted Roos' game style.. * Observing a completely new midfield unit with Tyson, Michie, Cross and Tyson, a former number 2 draft pick. * A second year Viney (although may not play) and Toumpas who we've heard has been tearing up the track. * A glimpse of the future with Salem and JKH who are both reportedly training well. Whilst it would have been fantastic to see Hogan and Dawes play, there's still plenty to look forward to. Dknow how people aren't excited... Footy is back already, and we've got much to look forward to.

The midfield setup and rotations should be the same on Friday as they are planned to be for the rest of the year. If the plan is for Watts to rotate through the forward line during the main season, then do it on Friday night too. It is the midfield we are hoping to see the most improvement from and it is where the most change has occurred. Lets start getting it right from the get go. If our forward line isn't able to kick a winning score then so be it. We know the talent we have missing and it won't be long before Dawes and Hogan are back on the park. Midfield has to be the main focus so don't tinker with the plans just because the forward line is depleted.

Headline should be: "Hogan and Dawes rested from mid February practice game in order to be fully fit for round 1" That would make everyone happy. Pedersen can be a big body and a target, he's really just a less classy version of Dawes. Fitzpatrick or a second ruck can play deep and Howe can get the 3rd tall and work on his one on one game that is needed anyway. The lack of talent in the key forwards shouldn't impact the importance of defensive play, stoppage work and 2 way running which is what we really need to establish in the preseason.

Dean Bailey back home and hopefully on the mend - best wishes http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/dean-bailey-returns-home-after-cancer-treatment-20140211-32fiq.html

You're just too bloody decent OD.

Gosh. We have absolutely no idea what it was that was in those injections but we can assure you 100% that it's safe.

Oh no! We're taking it easy with players that have had interrupted preseasons so that we can get the best value out of them for the H&A. What the hell is the club thinking?

Whilst I am disappointed that I will not see Hogan run about on Friday most players will play 2 of 3 matches and I would much prefer to see a conservative approach and Dawes and Hogan play together for the Cats and Hawks game. Thats better than Hogan playing week 1, then get rested in one of the games when he should be in tandem with Dawes. The key is to ensure they are ready for round 1.

Agree This Challenge is like an entree. So many new guys to watch, new game plan. What's not to be excited about. The results are secondary.

I'd just like to add a bit of perspective to this. Clarke, Dawes and Hogan had absolutely no input into last year and we had an underperforming or non-existent midfield (NJ excepted). This first NAB challenge will be all about our new midfield setup and what better way to measure its output than to have it performs with the same forward setup as last year. For those who can, get along and support the Dees. It’s only February.

It's the 14th of FEB......I for one am happy that these players are held back at bit....until the real season starts......The "Woe is us" brigade are out in full force.......These games leading into the REAL season are called practise games for a reason I understand that us long suffering supporters want to win, just win something, but I would rather have the tall forwards right to go for the REAL season where wins mean something.....

You're right, the club should have predicted that Clark & Dawes would suffer collision injuries... Deadset, you have absolutely NFI. I'm surprised you even know the players' names and what club you "support."

Moon and Bbo are keen to learn this phenomenon,as am I.

When a player is one of your most important and those hamstrings keep giving him trouble, you need to get the problem right. The club must be treat the injury conservatively and can afford to do so given we're still in the first half of February.

Can we make this purely a training report thread and not a chest beating and d!ck measuring thread... Every thread one persons opinion is roared down by another know it all demonlander... It is pathetic.

Please stay on topic. If you wish to discuss alcoholic beverages please do so on the general board or arrange to meet at a convenient pub. Thanks.

The voting to play the Demonland comp on either AFL Fantasy or Virtual Sports expires this Saturday. AFL Fantasy is the most favoured atm. Apart from having a spanner thrown in the works when VS Sports and the AFL decided to go their own seperate ways,everything else has been going relatively smoothly. My job has been made easier with everyone getting their confirmations in early. For those not aware, we had over 50 players in 3 leagues last year,some unidentified, so I had no idea who some were that played in 3 leagues. I knew some were not registered on Demonland, and I expect some of the same when I post a code for a league in the coming weeks. Every Demon supporter will be able to join one of our leagues and play if they wish too. Although not a enforced requirement, I would urge anyone that only reads these threads and want to compete in a league to sign up to Demonland (even if it is just to express an interest just to play DT) and then be allocated to a league suited to their DT ability, everyone in theory in a league of equal footing. Towards the end of the 2013 season I requested confirmations for 2014 to gauge an idea if it was going to be worth my while sorting through all the coaches and then sort everyone into a league. We had enough to fill almost 2 leagues, then my job began. The idea for an tiered DLand DT / SC comp began in 2011. I then began to save the names of the coaches in our very 1st league, the name of that league in 2011 was DT Demons Legends League. I suspect some of these players as still with us today, under the guise of a different DT team name or a different DLand Username or both. ( I may post this data, some interesting names back then) some may recognise themselves, from back then. Our 1st Premiership winner back then was Muppets 1st XVIII, I'm not sure if that is related to the Muppets 1st XVIII today. The next GF winner was Mega_Watts in 2012. Then last year we had 3 leagues, Toumpas' Souvalaki, Cellar Dwellers and Z's r coming, all winning a GF in their respective leagues. The "Rookie" league had 7 players qualify into the 'Legends League", more than any of the 3 leagues. Last year we had the qualifying leagues for the 1st time, and this year will be the 1st year that the idea from 2011 begins. Having said all that,along with some background history, the Leagues are only as good as the players involved, its YOUR comp to enjoy and how successful it remains relies on retaining the numbers , I just do a bit of organising.Getting confirmations in as early as possible really helps organise the comp. So thanks to everyone for making my task a bit easlier, now I hope the "Legends League" kicks some butt in the overall standings in Dream Team. The Legends are the best we have on DL, I'm expecting some competive games amongst them. Good luck to those 18 players. There are 5 vacant spots still reserved for the Legends League, I hope at least 2 more confirm before the cut off.Should these 5 players not return next in line to be promoted are in order of... 1: Darkhorse 2: Kervo's Kaos 3: Roo's Boys 4: Marvel Mavericks 5: Muppets 1st XVIII Next week I will PM out the code for the Legends League, so those that are playing in this league, keep an eye on your PM notices. There is will be a short delay then the invites will be sent to those qualified for the Tridents League. (including the new players for 2014) Then a code will be made public and posted in this thread for the Tridents league allowing non DL users to fill this league, and if needed another code if another league is required. Any Demon supporter and DT player shouldnt miss out on joining a league.

Pedersen is one who may surprise this season, Roos does not praise lightly, difference this year is Pedersen has had a full pre season with a new coaching set up, like everybody else would assume he wants to forget the last year or two and start again

Max King could be the answer for Melbourne against Richmond in the NAB Challenge What's the mystery about Max King? Do they think he arrived at the club in a UFO?

I'm sadly excited about this, even though we all know NAB Cup is a load of rubbish. I thought it was fitting to spend Valentines Day with my true love.

Riley in the main group! Looks like he'll do running with the boys! Great news. No deeds go unpunished here. Nathan Jones piffs a ball at Chip Frawley, falcons him, and then Chip proceeds to get Jonesy back, piffing multiple balls at him before finally getting him. Hardly anyone's here after 300 odd on Friday... wow. Everyone except for Jayden Hunt, Col Garland and Daniel Cross is here training. Guessing Cross and Hunt are affected by the bug which swept through last week, while Col is obviously injured. Mitch walking laps, looks like Nicho without training jumper on will be in rehab. Stretches + runthroughs as is always the case. Tapscott, Clark and Nicholson in rehab. Tapscott asked to run at 80-85% so issue must be minor. Basic short kicks following runthroughs. Group split into three - one group doing short kicks and handballs. Ruckmen doing some jumping drills, and a small group doing forward 50 leads. McKenzie's doing some kicks inside 50 with Tapscott. Not entirely sure why. Whether it's just to help Tappy or he's joined rehab I can't say. New drill in main group - three groups of eight utilising handball to get out of trouble followed by a short kick to next group. Group must negotiate a defender. In another drill, they're doing screamers. Unsurprisingly Howe is in that group. And taking the best hangers by a mile... also not surprising. McKenzie leaving the track early. As is Clark. Watts too. Full ground drill. Six groups going in both directions, two defensive groups, two midfield groups, two forward groups. Aiden Riley's first real hitout at training and he delivers an absolute gem to Harmes. Running hard. Dean Kent is another who's really looking good, has a lethal boot on him. Boys come in for a drink. Group split into defenders, mids and forwards. Trenners leaving the track early too. As is Jetta. Hogan getting some massaging on the sideline, then finishes up. Forwards working on leads inside 50. Defenders working on getting the ball out from a congested scenario. Brad Miller is urging that players look for the eye contact when preparing for a lead. Brings them in briefly to discuss this with the boys. Looks like mids are working with the ruckmen with tap work. Fitz is still being himself, a few miscued kicks, looking awkward but managing to do the job. That's what I love about the bloke. Interesting to note Miller doing some one on one coaching with JKH, again about eye contact (what he was talking about before). It's easy to see the difference between a first year AFL player and a more experienced player. New drill - few wearing bibs and they're doing a full grounder with the game style they intend to play. With the cooler conditions today compared to Friday movement is also much quicker. Don't mind seeing Sam Blease on the burst from half back to inside forward 50 much like 2011 when he was on half back. That's exactly what I'd want him to do as coach, set us up from half back. Riley's back in rehab, doing running on the sideline, but he's been pretty impressive today. JKH gets three possessions in one chain in the main group, using his pace as always. Pedo ignores a running Viney, u-turns and hits Fitz. Cops a bit of a spray for ignoring Viney. I read an article yesterday about Jeremy Cameron and how good his ground skills are - I reckon Howe is just as good on the ground as he is in the air. Just does not fumble the low ones. Boys come in for a chat. Weird moment - Harmes comes in for goal, Toumpas takes the ball off him and Harmes tackles Toumpas! Bit of playfighting ensures. Hmm. Few players doing some goalkicking, ruckmen doing some tap work with the midfielders and forwards/defenders doing some one on ones. Interesting. Up at the goalkicking end, the classic 'Coffee Bet' as they kick for goal. Comes down to a 'shootout' between King and Barry who shanked their kicks, Barry takes his boot off and kicks it from the boundary! Huge celebrations erupt! Boys finished up afterwards, a bit of a lighter session today.

Thanks for the summary Arrow. Everything Grant Thomas says is unique in the AFL world because he basically says whatever he feels like as he cares little what others think of him (most other media have plenty of conflicts of interest etc) but he also seems to be still nursing a damaged ego and it comes out in some of his comments.

There is only one way to get off the topic on this thread ...

Can we make Fitzy a key defender?

This has been really pleasant! We have had a difference of opinion and managed to not insult each other. Thank you.

Thats great. Im a big fan of Jake Spencer. His second efforts are absolute top shelf, especially for a 200cm ruckman. Great guy to go into battle with.

Until such time as the AFL move away from a business model which has TV Rights at the centre, all other forms of media content and broadcast are going to be compromised. I live OS, and watch online through a subscription to AFLTV (not accessible in Oz, though perhaps there's a way round that with a proxy), but the service is - and I'm being generous - substandard and unreliable. Even then, it's just a simple broadcast over the net: clearly the AFL has yet to even begin to grasp the reality of online and interactive viewing - or perhaps they have, but won't budge for fear of upsetting their precious broadcasters. If the AFL want to get rid of the illegal streams, they need to get their own house in order.

I think we have got this one covered.

Sigh... some of us are working on the present and future. We all feel a little bitter about the gross waste of time, money and inspiration that occurred through the previous administration. But there's a difference between that and "Mitch Clark injured his foot = Cameron Schwab's ruining us". Also, Frawley's decision will hinge as much on success as on money, I'm sure of that. We have vast piles of salary cap room anyway, so the amount we are paying both Clark and Dawes is not really going to be a factor in Frawley's decision. What will be a factor, as stated by him, quite clearly, is whether the club is looking like making real progress and becoming a proper professional team with real prospects. Both Clark and Dawes can have a major hand in that - both are exceptionally professional presences and both capable of filling absolutely essential on-field roles. Let's say both are fit by round 3, they may well define our season.

Our club Dr, who by the way was IN THE ROOM while i was injected had huge reservations about these. So much so he wrote a looonnggg letter about it.... and then walked away to go have lunch with brand Hird.

My memories of Pederson in the ruck are not pleasant ones. Could just be my recollection but he seemed to get dominated regularly. I'd be happy for him to be plonked forward and see what Roosy is on about with this new and improved Pedo. With our luck we may well need to draw upon his services throughout the season.

I think because of the care and attention that is going into the rehabilitation of all 3, we will finally get to see them on the park together, personally I reckon around Round 4

I doubt Viney will play as he missed last week.

If you think so.But I will go as far as saying our I would back Chip, Tom M, and Garland against Riewoldt, Vickery and co. We now have some midfield depth and should give Tigers a run for their money. Vince and Cross add toughness and class. There's every chance Richmond will take us lightly. Let's be the aggressor from the opening bounce. We will have a make shift forward line, so let's mix it up and see what happens. I know the Tigers have a knack of beating Hawthorn but they are overrated. If your mentally beaten before the opening bounce don't bother running out.

The Restaurant in Rome was Taverna Antonina, Via della Colonna Antonina, 48. 00186 Rome, Italy +39 06 678 3717 We ate there 3 nights in a row the food was excellent. It's off Via del Corso near the Piazza Colonna

Yeah....a competent preliminary medical can always predict a Lisfranc fracture injury !!!! How silly.....and whoever drafted TheOx should have known he would do his knee. Just plain inept drafting! mjt - we must get you to do our due diligence next time around. (PS: don't take up cycling or horse riding - crystal balls don't cope too well with those sports). PPS: I wonder if you would still be saying this had Mitch not suffered that very rare (but apparently predictable) injury and gone of to win the Coleman once or maybe even twice?

So very predictable.

Gee I bet all the clubs knew that he would land awkwardly and stuff his foot then had problems with it afterwards...........some people have no idea!!

Under five days until the footy. Thank Christ.

Ok so who voted for Essendon as a favourite Club? LOL

Hit that 6-12 month age when they don't sleep much, especially on hot nights, and you jump at anything that moves??? The missus is on edge, you can't put a foot right and you're wondering why parenthood is so easy for everyone else?........ Oh, hang on, that's just me....... Did I say that out loud?......

Adelaide - Hate Them Brisbane - They stopped Collingwood from winning 2 Premierships so I like them Carlton - The want to be Collingwood Supporters Collingwood - Hate them with a passion. Worst Club in the AFL by a country mile. Essendon - Drug Cheats! Fremantle - Second worst team in the AFL. Supporter are just annoying whingers (sorry Mum and Dad). Geelong - Left sorry for them in the past. Gold Coast - Don't care about them either way. GWS - Don't care about them either way. Hawthorn - The one that got way. North Melbourne - Send them to Canberra Port Adelaide - Supports as just about as feral as Collingwood Richmond - Are they in the AFL? St Kilda - Feel sorry for them. Sydney - Starting to Hate them because of their recent whingers West Coast - Words can not describe my feeling for these East Perth W#4@ers Western Bulldogs - Would be the team I would support if there was no MFC as their colours is the second best in the AFL. Melbourne - Perfect colours, theme song, but pity its not able to play AFL level footy, but I will support them anyway as I love pain and suffering!

I dislike any and all opponents, for various reasons ranging from smug or feral supporters through to being spoon fed success via long term AFL assistance. I always felt that was what made the game so good, tribalism and a healthy hatred of anything other than your team.

Match winner od, not miracle worker.

Just quietly, that's a very eclectic range of interests you have in your profile...

The left arm looks a little under-illustrated.