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hmm yes the guy that is simultaneously labelled a complete dud yet a massive loss, amazing how that works

I have always wanted to make up cheeky graphic of how demonland views demon players. Along the line of this Draft day - super star First game - the next big thing A little while later - dud why we pick him we should of picked..... 50-100 game mark - Great player going to be our future A little while later - plodder, needs to delist/trade/retire At the end of his days - list clogger, too slow, too old Years after retirement/left demons- Champion/we always loved him/never should of let him go

To get better we can not allow any of our top 25 players to leave the club currently, expcially those that will still be in our best 25 in the next 3 years. Frawley, Watts and Sylvia are automatically in our top 22 currently. Gawn has pushed himself into the top 25 after a bad run with his knees. We can't afford to let any of these players go and need to keep trying to improve the list through draft picks, development and blokes who are squeezed out of other clubs such as Dawes was.

Everyone talks of culture. Well forget about the personalities involved and whether or not you like Jack, a good culture DOES NOT GIVE AWAY ITS CORE PLAYERS and a good culture DOES NOT LOSE PLAYERS to other teams. Jack's confidence is shot and he is too scared to do anything because of the way he is treated (I cannot name my source as it will compromise their position in the club) so what sort of culture denigrates its players. What culture belittles a leadership group when you have been in an organisation for a week. Ask the board member who let it be known that the coach has had a blue with every member of his staff. Good culture don't leak like a sieve. PJ needs to send a message that we don't give up on our players, we don't treat them like dirt and we value their contribution and efforts and we want them to stay and improve. Fix the FD first and do it yesterday. I want Chip, Sylvia, Watts, Davey and Gawn all to stay because we will miss them when they are gone.

Say what you like about Davey but when his playing days are over he'll be remembered as the pioneer of forward pressure and a great of the club

Lets hope Neeld is shown the door before Watts goes. Neeld is a cancer to this club and must be removed asap

The damage that Neeld may have done to this club is potentially alot greater than anyone could have anticipated. If we lose all of Sylvia, Frawley and Watts, we are pretty much cooked for a long, long time to come. It's a sickening thought because it's a realistic one. We have to move heaven and earth to keep these players, and something tells me that parking Watts in the backline isn't helping one iota in convincing him to stick around. He's not a defender. He's a goal kicker.

Basically as far as I can see the team has two issues at the moment Inexperience at AFL level And mental baggage for some players, left over from the last two or three years, the ability to overcome this comes through maturity, but dealing with guys who are in late teens or early twenties exacerbates the issue As far as actual training, from what I have seen and heard from last couple of weeks, we have been working solely on the contested work, which is good, as we need to make sure we get our hands on the ball in the first place, or get the other team to turn it over If we do that I can see that the next step at the moment is to get it into the good ball users hands, we saw this last weekend with Davey and Terlich. I believe away from the glare of publicity and open training sessions, all players are working overtime on their disposal skills, Garland being one who is showing improvement, again a lot of this is mental, if you stuff it up once, you are prone to do it again, hence Dunn's run of horrible kick ins, yet he was one of the better more conistent disposers previously As mentioned by Neeld, Davey, who we all agree is on his day an elite disposer by foot, is playing his role in developing the team's foot skills We also need to spread better, again I have seen drills at training that are focused on this particular area. We will get it right eventually, I am like everybody else would prefer it now rather than later, but because I do go to training, talk to the coaches and players, listen to commentators/pundits who actually know what they are talking about, discuss with other footy followers whose opinion I value, I am willing to be a bit more patient than some on this board Yes we lost the Richmond game, but some of the signs were good, not great, but they were there Now I want to see a repeat if not a betterment against Fremantle I just get a bit bored with the naysays such as Old Dee and his "the Club is doomed call", we have brought in a highly experienced CEO in Peter Jackson, I want to see what he has got to say in four or five months before forming any opinions myself

By now most here should know my opinion. After round 5 last year I started writing posts outlining the terrible choice we made in making Neeld Coach. I said that he had divided the players, he had lost the players before he even coached his first game, I said Neeld did not have the personal skills or management skills to be head coach, I said after round 6 Moloney and Rivers would walk, midseason I spoke of a major falling out (fight) between Neeld and Martin and that he would never play for Melbourne again. I spoke of a falling out between Jurrah and Pettard with Neeld......... but few listened. I told all that would listen that Neeld was the greatest mistake since firing Norm Smith and that if we did not remove him quickly he would drive us into extinction. I said we were in a slow motion train crash. I was and still am called an alarmist, a nutter, other people asked for me to be banned from this sight, however, everything I have said on this subject has turned out to be true. This season, I have said that as things currently stand, Frawley, Sylvia and Watts would leave season end. Again as recently as yesterday I have been smashed. My information has never been made up, it has come from within the playing group and player managers. I love this club and l will do anything I can to help ensure its long term viability and survival. I have made significant donations to this club via debt demolition. I only want to see my club survive. It is time for those who still have their head in the sand to wake up. We are deep in survival mode. We should no longer be looking at Premierships, we must put all effort into survival. Make no mistake, we have 2 to 3 years to turn this club around or we will be relocated or merged in time for the next broadcast contract. If we lose more senior players that task will be close to impossible. Its time to look at the big picture, everything must be done to hold all our top 25. I will make things very clear to all who will listen. Mark Neeld may not be the person who started the rot, however, he is not the person for our club. He has divided our playing group, he has lost our players, he does not have the motivational or personal skills required. He is a cancer, he is part of the problem rather than the solution. He was a terrible choice in head coach. The ONLY chance we have is to fire Neeld immediately, replace him with a motivational coach that can unit the players and do whatever we can to land Roos or then next best experienced coach. Only then may our players stay. Only then may we survive. This is the train wreck I told you all was coming. I am devastated. We must move quickly while there is still time. I again call on the board to fire Neeld immediately.

The board and FD don't need any more problems. I just hope the players don't read it after they get thumped. We are the intellectual equivalent of a pack of wild dogs ripping up a rabbit. On a good day.

I resent that.

So we have a number of players out of contract at the end of the year. Reality check: happens every year, to every club Other clubs are expressing interest in payer X or player Y. Reality Check: of course they are. It is called list management. Player X is delaying contract talks to the end of the season Reality check: of course the,y would. If the manager thinks their value will go UP due to this years performances, why sign now? Why not ' explore the market? Especially when your advisor ( the manager) gets a direct cut of the result. Player Z is disgruntled. Reality check: source? Is this contract negotiation leverage? Player Y has friends at Collingwood. Reality check: half of Collingwood have friends in prison, doesn't mean they have to go there. Player Z is not loyal. Reality Check: only supporters are loyal. Players are paid employees with a limited lifespan, trying to make their career The media report a story of Player Y leaving Reality check: D'Oh- that is what they do- stretch the truth to make a story so you will buy their rag. It isn't fact, it's supposition. So, the deal isn't done until its done. All the speculation for what? Cold showers and reality checks for several here, I think.

Sorry Jaded do you seriously believe that? I was at that Game and i'd say apart from a few MFC people the majority were Essendon wankers that were cheering [censored] they are wankers Bombers supporters..........I hate Essendon with a passion So my question to you is......... Were you there did you see mass of MFC fans cheering or are you believing what you heard in the media?

Can't blame him if he wants a fresh start. When our own supporters are so pathetic that they cheer when he gets subbed off, and our coach is such a stubborn moron that he berates him before he even steps foot inside the rooms, then proceeds to play him like a yo-yo, what do you expect? I'd want to get the [censored] away from this basket case too if I had a limited time frame to have a successful career and I've been treated with such contempt. This club is a joke. My anger and disgust towards it makes me ashamed, but I can't help it. Look at what the [censored] is going on around us!

What a magnificent way of saying nothing

That's not true. Neeld has not destroyed Jack Watts' confidence. He has proven unable to cope with the demands of being a number 1 pick in the short time he's been in the AFL. Neeld has attempted to help him by releasing the shackles of being a lone forward in the worst club in the land and given him a role playing on a man down back. One which he has excelled in for the most part when fit. I am a huge Jack Watts fan and I am dissapointed that he has not yet reached his potential but I also realise he is 22, and still learning the game... In that Bombers game he was being buried by self doubt on the field. Neeld taking him off was merciful. But let's make one thing clear... Jack Watts is responsible for Jack Watts' performance, no-one else.

What and have Demonland screwed as well. No thanks

so watts, the bloke weve all defended for years and years, put our hope in, wants out. if he goes, [censored] the club, [censored] the afl and [censored] footy, im off.

Seems to me top clubs like Geelong ( Ottens, Rivers) Hawthorn ( Gibson, Hale) Collingwood ( Jolly, Ball) Swans ( Tippett, Hall) aren't that concerned about draft picks at all. They know they aren't going to get them because they are on top. Just pick off the good players from the cellar dwellers, much easier. IMO Players association and managers have blind sided the AFL on this. Means 5 year plans for cellar dwellers simply can't work as players depart prior to reaching their peak and you are left with immature kids. Its a nonsense to be hoodwinked by them. Winning should be a week to week expectation. The potential losses that worry me most for our club are Frawley & Gawn. Silvia may have a couple of years left and Jack Watts hasn't moved up to the consistently good or match winning status. I think we know where we would be left if we lost all four. Hope we get on the front foot here.

perhaps he's the nominated a candidate, given the job of decapitating Balyentyne, Fyfe and Mundy in the 1st 5 mins and then sit out a 20 week suspension?

Nothing gives you the right to highjack every thread. Make your point. Make your point once. Then drop it. You're getting really really tedious, and I for skip your posts because you just say exactly the same thing (player manager, blah blah, Watts, blah blah, Neeld, blah blah) over and over. You are not doing your argument one iota of good. As for being desperate, it's a football club. Desperate is when you don't have enough money to feed your kids or pay your rent.

My best friend is an Essendon supporter. For years I have put up with her gloating about their superiority, "St James of Hird", Llloydy etc, etc, etc. At the height of our issues this year she even offered to buy me an Essendon membership for my birthday. I politely told her where to shove it. I have a long memory and despise Essendon and hope they get the book thrown at them and more...

Why do you have to show character to stay somewhere where you are not happy? If im not happy at my job, i would start looking elsewhere, life's too short to stay somewhere thats destroying your confidence just to build character.

Will never forgive them for what Dean Wallis did to Brad Green and Michael Long to Troy Simmonds. There supporters are just as worse (not including your daughter) I watched in horror in round 2 when they leaned over and abused and spat on our players when they walked off down to the race after the game! typical arrogant bunch of no lifes! They deserve whatever they got coming for them!

Yet your contributions (personal attacks on everyone who doesn't think we are cruising along on the road to glory) are fantastic contributions. Keep up the good work champ!

When it comes to list management I like to think I am very capable of removing blinkers and seeing things for what they are. Sylvia is to be kept but I think he will leave. As a 'list manager' there is only so much power I have. Frawley is to be told that he can come to the club and ask for better terms if he wishes. Hopefully he is a RFA next year (one of the 10 highest paid players) and we hold the cards. Watts is a tough one as his skills are elite and his physicality near the other end of the spectrum. If a suitable trade was offered then you would listen to it but he is an 'asset' and you don't just give those away. In terms of immediate importance - we need experience and talent but Watts has become 'tradeable' due to our forward line and backline having 6 talls younger than 26 who are all more accomplished than he is (Clark, Dawes, Hogan, Frawley, Garland, and McDonald).

Sweet. Next one Please. Keep 'em coming.

The Board have more pressing issues than join an Internet forum site. I would have thought that attendance at functions like the recent Trident function would be a more sensible and productive avenue for supporter interaction than some of the toxic soup that served up anonymously on this site. A huge NO for me.

GNF I love your posts, especially the fact that u get your info from the inside. (I am obviously taking you at face value when you say that, as I dont know u and wouldnt know if I passed u in the street) Do u know or have u heard of any movement on Neeld? Keep posting.

Chill out nut job! In Internet culture, a lurker is typically a member of an online community who observes, but does not actively participate

If it's true, that the 3 players, Sylvia, Frawley and Watts, are considering their options so that they can play finals and possibly win a premiership, can I ask them this... If you're not happy with the onfield performance of this team, DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. The 3 of you have enough talent and all should be leaders of this club, you have enough ability to work together and turn games around, it's time you stood up. This sh!t about wanting to play finals so you have to go elsewhere, why's that? So you can go to another Club, possibly make their best 22 knowing there are blokes in the team that are willing to work their arse off meaning you don't have to? Blaming the coach is utter bullsh!t - I'm sure he would look a bloody lot different if the 3 of you worked hard and got the best out of yourself. If it's true, it's pi$$ weak from the 3 players. If it's not, I'll happily withdraw my rant. Thank you.

We can get 'Sat' to turn out the lights when everyones gone...

Certainly looks like the fittest he's ever been. Hopefully he plays on for another two years. and produces a few more boys for our future.

Guys. This is an article from Jay Clark. Let's not get carried away.

It is absolutely the context he used it in, and "you really do exhibit the early signs of paranoia" really beggars belief as a response. Edit: Re topic: I don't think it would work in the form suggested. Perhaps quarterly reports from a generalised account?

If Watts and others are thinking about leaving then it is now time Jackson pulled out his aces. I will [censored] spew if Watts goes and Neeld stays. FFS MFC get your act together and sort this out pronto.

MFC press conference at 3pm. They have a new CEO.

We were all up in arms about Scully until we landed Hogan. If we netted a good mid in return would we still feel the same about Watts, I think not.

I have already posted in another thread that I have a friend who volunteers for the club with fundraising efforts and is in the rooms at every game before, during and after the game. All the statements about the players not being behind Neeld were dismissed, rather their comments were that they had never seen the playing group so united. This HUN article is just speculation. I also wonder why people would say that it is Neeld who is the sole problem if Watts really is disgruntled. What about Bailey??? What about the 3 1/2 years that he was in charge and the club stupidly decided to debut Watts for the Queens Birthday clash in 2009 for "marketing" purposes. Seriously, if Watts has a problem with the club, I think it would have more to do with the pre-Neeld era than the post-Neeld era. I sometimes wonder if Scully would still be playing in a Melbourne guernsey if Neeld was around, because Scully obviously didn't see much discipline or leadership amongst the experienced players while he was here given he reportedly cited their behaviour on the China trip as one of the reasons he didn't feel certain about remaining with the club. I actually think Watts has performed better under Neeld. His move to the backline has been a great move. I was actually pretty frustrated to hear that Watts had played most of his junior football along the half back line and on the wing, but we decided to throw him into the forward line despite the fact that he physically wasn't ready for it. We as fans, also placed too much emphasis on him becoming that big gorilla forward we've wanted rather than looking for the club to utilise his athletic ability and disposal ability for the best of the club. As a forward, Watts is more a Josh Kennedy type than a Jonothan Brown. But that wasn't the way the club operated under Bailey. There wasn't any thought, or any analysis of player skills and matching them to the abilities we required for different positions. That was when the administration of the club (Schwab and co) were meddling with the football department. If I was Watts, that would be the part of my career that would make me think about leaving. Not the current period. But hey, blame Neeld if you want. I'm getting in the way of some more Neeld bashing, so my apologies. Please proceed.

We all know your views.........You do not have to rant on and on and on about it...........You highjack every thread with your anti Neeld sentiments..........I don't think you have posted in any thread where you have not called for slash and burn of Neeld......Geezzz...

Watt's confidence was destroyed when we played him too early, you can't attribute it all to MN, particularly when he was playing some of his best footy last year under MN. What I have seen from Watts this year isn't a lack of confidence, it's a lack of effort. He used to go to ground too easily, even at Casey, in his early years. Now he is too lazy to get into those situations. The only time he put in some effort was when he was breifly played up forward where his confidence in his kicking and marking was already there.

That's BS, Dr. If those 3 players want to play finals bad enough, they can make it happen in the red & blue. They have top training facilities, they have a handy FD, they have handy "support" players around them, and most importantly, they have the ability to move this club forward. If they want to take the easy way out and go to a team where they don't have the responsibility of leading a club to finals footy, then they can fcuk off. I will refuse to let players hold the club to ransom unless they have runs on the board. In any job, if your top performing employee is criticial about the runnings of the company they work for, then you listen. You don't sit back and listen to the lazy pricks who prefer to sit back and sulk rather than doing something about it. Until your words are actions, I dismiss anything you say. In that, if Nathan Jones wanted to leave, I'd be very concerned.

I liked how Neeld had him over for dinner. That, along with recent comments by Col Garland makes me think he finally trying to balance the school principal style of managing players he went in with last year.

I don't quite understand the lack of interest the club seems to have in keeping experienced players within the club. Whether the problem is Neeld, the culture, the lack of wins or simply a poorly conceived notion of rebuilding through youth, i don't know, but it is going to severely slow any rebuild that we attempt and in my opinion it is the reason we are at the beginning of rebuild number two. Everyone in football, including our coaching panel seems to agree that number of games and experienced players is fundamental to afl success however throughout the rebuilding process we seem content with the idea of losing more and more experienced players without anything sort of reasonable attempt to stem the losses. Neeld raised his five year plan the other day. Who is going to be leading our back line in 5 years time if we lose Frawley? And who is going to replace the 80 games we have put into Watts??? And where is out experienced bigger body in the midfield/forward going to come from without a Sylvia?? So basically we are going to take our current team, allow arguably the 3 most talented players to leave and this will improve our side?? I am very frustrated, as I'm sure we all are.

Help Peter Jackson. This is the stuff we need him working on, and hopefully he is. I know he has a lot to work on and he even said it himself when he mentioned about the inexperiance at this club, IMO We can't afford to have frawley, Sylvia, Watts and possibly Davey walk out the door. If Neeld has to go to help retain these people, then make the call and resign these boys back up. I couldn't take another year of Neeldy complaining that now he's got 16 players with under 50 games experience. Please Save this club from Neeld and itself.

I dont think I can remember the MFC being in such a dire position with players wanting to leave. Neeld is a nut job and he needs to go. He has actually made us worse which I thought was not possible and is driving players away to top it off (and he wants another 3.5 yrs). Its like being in a horror movie which never ends with Neeld is the star. If we can land a BIG NAME coach (Roos, Choco, Eade etc) I am sure the players would rethink leaving but this needs to happen NOW not at the end of the season. I really hope for all us supporters (and players) this is happening. If anyone on here has a contact which is reliable with what is going on PLEASE give us some hope?

I don't want to lose Watts because he has talent, something that is all too rare at Melbourne. I agree that Neeld has done a poor job getting the best out of the players, but by God Watts has put in some insipid soft and weak efforts so far.

Since when was Watts disgruntled? I agree that he is a natural forward but he did have his best year to date last year in the back half.

Yes it is wrong to ever wish for your team to lose, that is how the list management saga was born! I want to see the same level of effort brought by the players this week, one things for sure Freo will always bring effort I want intensity and dogged determination for every contest I want to see every Dees player walking off the field having left everything out there after having a red hot crack Whilst I want a win I want to see all of the above and continuous improvement each week