Oliver is no 'stager'!

[Chris 2,892]

11 minutes ago, doc roet said:

If Clarrie hadn't gone down, instead took a couple of steps back and held his jaw, Schofield would be out for a couple of weeks.

The umpire saw it, as he reported that slimebag straight away, and there would be no talk of Ollie staging it.It was the fall that everyone was looking at.

Exactly. People are looking at the fall not the elbow. That is why Schofield is the angle in this. If you actually look at the hit it was there, it smacked his jaw shut and shock his head. It wasn't big but it was there. The AFL would clearly prefer to tell people elbowing is fine, as long as it isn't too hard!

[Chris 2,892]

8 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Said elsewhere THIS is the lesson here. Contest the MRP !!  People often argue it's impossible to defend the implausible....well, here we have exhibit A 

We play too nice.

People are correct, it is impossible to defend the implausible, that is unless you are dealing with the AFL, they after all are masters of creating implausible rulings to solve non issues. 

[Willmoy1947 4,140]

1 minute ago, Chris said:

People are correct, it is impossible to defend the implausible, that is unless you are dealing with the AFL, they after all are masters of creating implausible rulings to solve non issues. 

Yep, they probably sussed us up as not rocking the boat too much, whereas the coen "get st###ed" brothers would have held their breath and stomped their tootsies.....

[Jara 1,153]

5 hours ago, McQueen said:

In today's West Australian rag.

As if we needed anymore reason to loathe this mob.

Pathetic losers. Show em a clip of the incredible clearance out of a rolling scrum that Clarrie got against Richmond. One of the most fearless, determined pieces of play I've ever seen 

 

They're just jealous. 

[DemonWA 3,936]

4 hours ago, Skin D said:

I wonder what Garry Lyon would do if a large strong man elbowed him to the chin outside his radio studio in Richmond with no provocation in front of multiple witnesses? The football field is for playing football not for common unlawful assault.

Sorry, but these sorts of comments smack me as inconsistent. (not saying you are inconstant personally, but just the general vibe on Demonland)

If Jack Viney had done what Scofield did we'd have said there was nothing in it and would have been up in arms about it having to go and argue the case. In fact it would be added the footage to the Jack Viney made me cry thread, and we'd gloat about how much of a hard nut Viney is and how soft the person who got a chip on the chin is.

 

 

 

[Chook 15,022]

20 minutes ago, DemonWA said:

Sorry, but these sorts of comments smack me as inconsistent. (not saying you are inconstant personally, but just the general vibe on Demonland)

If Jack Viney had done what Scofield did we'd have said there was nothing in it and would have been up in arms about it having to go and argue the case. In fact it would be added the footage to the Jack Viney made me cry thread, and we'd gloat about how much of a hard nut Viney is and how soft the person who got a chip on the chin is.

 

 

 

Not me. Not during the halftime break. If Viney had done it during the quarter I'd disapprove but say "that's footy." Elbowing someone (let alone in the neck) as they're going to the changerooms is not on. Oliver shouldn't whacked Shuey either.

The "dive" Oliver took when (was it Higgins?) got him the other week was much worse than this one because he should've expected it and was probably looking for a free. This one? There was no incentive for him to dive, and no expectation that he would get hit.

Edited June 28, 2017 by Chook

[Pates 9,660]

3 hours ago, nutbean said:

To be frank I am over it  - staging ...not staging...guilty..not guilty..

My only concern now  is that it does not affect his game going forward. That is all care about.

If anything I think it'll just pour gasoline on the fire inside Oliver. Watch him hit the contests even harder this week. 

[dpositive 1,672]

7 hours ago, Akum said:

Best post on this whole issue.

Unfortunately, it's also the least likely to happen. The AFL seems to prefer leaving things so that they can be manipulated.

Thanks Akum. Was going to leave it as I also agree with you.

BUT.

Just saw Lethlean in announcing Hoult appeal that the AFL holds that a blow to the head is most serious(or something like that) 

AND YET

Apparently an elbow to the head not in play is ok

It would seem they can't even manipulate very well.

MFC should appeal to remove the stain that is reflected in the West Coast paper on our players, our medical team and us as supporters.

Let alone the lack of duty care the Tribunal decision has highlighted.

A player has not been made aware of the consequences of a blow to the head.   If a similar fracas with push and shove occurs an Brayshaw is in the vicinity of a wandering elbow the outcome may be much worse. Oh well I suppose the AFL can bolt the stable door then.

[buck_nekkid 6,043]

So, the tribunal makes no comment on Clarrie's action, it only ruled that the contact was deemed as too low to warrant the penalty.

DId Clarry milk it?  Only he would know.  If milking it was a crime, Selwood would be on death row.

Glad Bash-em-in-the-face Houli is soaking up the media attention.  The WA newspaper and that cartoon - sore losers.  Ring a ring a rosy - run rings around the Meth Coast posers.

[dpositive 1,672]

2 hours ago, DemonWA said:

Sorry, but these sorts of comments smack me as inconsistent. (not saying you are inconstant personally, but just the general vibe on Demonland)

If Jack Viney had done what Scofield did we'd have said there was nothing in it and would have been up in arms about it having to go and argue the case. In fact it would be added the footage to the Jack Viney made me cry thread, and we'd gloat about how much of a hard nut Viney is and how soft the person who got a chip on the chin is.

 

 

 

I may have said that but the AFL is clearly saying the head is sacrosanct and I agree with that.

No player including our own should intentionally target the head.

[DemonWA 3,936]

27 minutes ago, dpositive said:

I may have said that but the AFL is clearly saying the head is sacrosanct and I agree with that.

No player including our own should intentionally target the head.

I don't think he did intentionally target the head. He intentionally tried to elbow Clarry, but I don't think he was targeting the head at all

[dpositive 1,672]

5 minutes ago, DemonWA said:

I don't think he did intentionally target the head. He intentionally tried to elbow Clarry, but I don't think he was targeting the head at all

True

Didnt target head but did contact head. That's when sacrosanct becomes the key. There should still be a penalty for head contact. You mitigate the penalty by not having intention in this case there was intention to contact and it resulted in contact to the head. 

Should not be sanctioned 

[monoccular 17,570]

17 hours ago, nutbean said:

To be frank I am over it  - staging ...not staging...guilty..not guilty..

My only concern now  is that it does not affect his game going forward. That is all care about.

Hopefully it will fire him up big time!

[P-man 13,366]

On 27 June 2017 at 10:22 PM, Pennant St Dee said:

I have held back on this but now it's done. I will say it is the right outcome and I hate Meth Coast more than anything.

It was a glancing blow and Clarrie exaggerated the contact and it isn't the first time he has exaggerated contact. I love him as a player and he's a gun and only going to get better. I hope he learns from this and we move on. 

He's been under intense scrutiny this week like never before and I hope it doesn't impact on Friday night.  

If the roles were reversed I would have been livid. Schofields acyions were unnecessary and so was Clarries.

Time to focus on Friday night

Agree with this. Have also held back because the fire didn't require any more fuel.

I was willing to apply benefit of the doubt but it was significantly lessened after watching his previous flop (no nice way to put it unfortunately) against Higgins. I'm now more just hopeful we won't be seeing this again from him. It would be a crime to have this overshadow his talent. The big positive is that he has time on his side.

That said, the vicious reaction has been well over the top for a 19 year old still finding his feet on and off the field despite the crazy start to his career. West Coast fans and media especially have made the absolute most of it. For several reasons.

 1. They lost the game.

 2. They're keen to point the finger and have someone else besmirched for diving as the likes of Darling and Shuey are.

3. They along with the rest of the league know that Melbourne are developing a reputation as a hard team that is going places and viewed this as an opportunity to take away from that.

4. They know Oliver is a gun so a bit of tall poppy gets applied.

5. They're West Ciast fans and media.

They can boo him for all eternity. It will likely make him play better. 

[SFebes 4,884]

16 hours ago, Jara said:

Pathetic losers. Show em a clip of the incredible clearance out of a rolling scrum that Clarrie got against Richmond. One of the most fearless, determined pieces of play I've ever seen 

 

They're just jealous. 

can any cartoonists here do a WCE team snorting multiple lines of coke in a handball drill?

[Jara 1,153]

28 minutes ago, P-man said:

Agree with this. Have also held back because the fire didn't require any more fuel.

I was willing to apply benefit of the doubt but it was significantly lessened after watching his previous flop (no nice way to put it unfortunately) against Higgins. I'm now more just hopeful we won't be seeing this again from him. It would be a crime to have this overshadow his talent. The big positive is that he has time on his side.

That said, the vicious reaction has been well over the top for a 19 year old still finding his feet on and off the field despite the crazy start to his career. West Coast fans and media especially have made the absolute most of it. For several reasons.

 1. They lost the game.

 2. They're keen to point the finger and have someone else besmirched for diving as the likes of Darling and Shuey are.

3. They along with the rest of the league know that Melbourne are developing a reputation as a hard team that is going places and viewed this as an opportunity to take away from that.

4. They know Oliver is a gun so a bit of tall poppy gets applied.

5. They're West Ciast fans and media.

They can boo him for all eternity. It will likely make him play better. 

Like some of what you say, but I still don't see how you can be so certain he exaggerated. You don't know. You can't know. Only he knows (and the other person to have a good idea was the ump, and we know what he thought).

 

Either way, main thing is that he comes out and blasts em this week.  

[Chris 2,892]

51 minutes ago, P-man said:

Agree with this. Have also held back because the fire didn't require any more fuel.

I was willing to apply benefit of the doubt but it was significantly lessened after watching his previous flop (no nice way to put it unfortunately) against Higgins. I'm now more just hopeful we won't be seeing this again from him. It would be a crime to have this overshadow his talent. The big positive is that he has time on his side.

That said, the vicious reaction has been well over the top for a 19 year old still finding his feet on and off the field despite the crazy start to his career. West Coast fans and media especially have made the absolute most of it. For several reasons.

 1. They lost the game.

 2. They're keen to point the finger and have someone else besmirched for diving as the likes of Darling and Shuey are.

3. They along with the rest of the league know that Melbourne are developing a reputation as a hard team that is going places and viewed this as an opportunity to take away from that.

4. They know Oliver is a gun so a bit of tall poppy gets applied.

5. They're West Ciast fans and media.

They can boo him for all eternity. It will likely make him play better. 

Higgins round house hit him in the throat! That would put most people on their backside.

[premiers13 48]

The problem is ...now you can apparently lay force on the head region, as long as its 'not forceful'. So a slap or push to the area must be OK?

A fine should have been the minimum outcome or are we saying you can bring force to the head region and 'we will decide the force of that blow'

As for acting, just watch Rance...now that's acting!

Clayton is a tough young man, just hope the Swans have a go at him!

[P-man 13,366]

54 minutes ago, Jara said:

Like some of what you say, but I still don't see how you can be so certain he exaggerated. You don't know. You can't know. Only he knows (and the other person to have a good idea was the ump, and we know what he thought).

 

Either way, main thing is that he comes out and blasts em this week.  

I never said I was certain because you're right, there's no way of being certain. But when he falls in the exact same delayed manner from minimal contact, I become more doubtful. 

He won't let all the chatter bother him. Of that I am almost certain.

36 minutes ago, Chris said:

Higgins round house hit him in the throat! That would put most people on their backside.

Didn't look like a lot to me. I won't dig up the footage because I have no intention of dwelling on it.

Hopefully this is a "remember when?" moment in his career and nothing more.

 

[Nasher 33,617]

12 minutes ago, P-man said:

 

Hopefully this is a "remember when?" moment in his career and nothing more.

Heh, yeah. Hey, remember when our best ever junior player got punched - twice - and it was his reputation that got soiled? LOL yeah I remember, hilarious stuff!

[P-man 13,366]

9 minutes ago, Nasher said:

Heh, yeah. Hey, remember when our best ever junior player got punched - twice - and it was his reputation that got soiled? LOL yeah I remember, hilarious stuff!

Open the other eye, Nash. It's not beyond the realms of possibility that Clarry has added some mayo onto it. I just don't want to see this being what he becomes known for.  

I'm expressing a view among fellow supporters, ideally without a hissy fit coming the other way. 

[Nasher 33,617]

15 minutes ago, P-man said:

Open the other eye, Nash. It's not beyond the realms of possibility that Clarry has added some mayo onto it. I just don't want to see this being what he becomes known for.  

I'm expressing a view among fellow supporters, ideally without a hissy fit coming the other way. 

It's not without possibility, but it still upsets me though that after all this, the focus is still on how the victim reacted to being punched. It's part of a much broader cultural issue and I thought you would get that. @rpfcdid a good post on this on the very early pages on this thread.

I want to be clear. I give Clarry the benefit of the doubt on the dive, but ultimately it's irrelevant. I don't care if Oliver did a triple backflip with pike - Schofield threw an elbow and got away with it purely because everyone decided they weren't happy with the way the victim of the elbow reacted to it. I reckon it stinks to high heaven.

[Demonstone 22,792]

(C)Larry Olivier was no stranger to a stage.   Maybe people just got the names confused.

[Wiseblood 24,637]

He copped one to the chin, may have exaggerated the contact a little, but we'll never know as we weren't the one copping the hit.

The sooner we move on from it, the sooner it's forgotten and we focus on Oliver just playing football.  It's no good adding fuel to the fire when it's unnecessary.

[P-man 13,366]

19 minutes ago, Nasher said:

It's not without possibility, but it still upsets me though that after all this, the focus is still on how the victim reacted to being punched. It's part of a much broader cultural issue and I thought you would get that. @rpfcdid a good post on this on the very early pages on this thread.

I want to be clear. I give Clarry the benefit of the doubt on the dive, but ultimately it's irrelevant. I don't care if Oliver did a triple backflip with pike - Schofield threw an elbow and got away with it purely because everyone decided they weren't happy with the way the victim of the elbow reacted to it. I reckon it stinks to high heaven.

Sure, I get that view. There is an imbalance in terms of the amount of focus on Oliver when he's the one whose been elbowed in the face. Schofield would've been worthy of a week suspension had it been upheld.

But by the same token, I'm not a fan of staging. Never have been and never will be. I gleefully mock those who do it. Lindsay Thomas is my most hated player purely because of it.

IF this is in that vicinity (and I acknowledge it's an IF), then I can't be a hypocrite and shrug my shoulders. Plus Oliver is way too good to be mucking about with this stuff.