FAREWELL JORDAN GYSBERTS

[Jordie_tackles 354]

The fact Gys could not break into a truly awful senior team in 2012 must be taken into account.

Is that attitude?

That said, if there are no other clubs showing interest we should keep him for another year.

But what does Gys want?

The coach will know.

Started the season injured, and then got a broken jaw mid season in his Casey return...... that is my take, also was unfit all preseason i think he can improve big time with this preseason and an uninterupted run. Also some hardcore dedication, not saying he doesnt have this just that it will be required to take the steps required.

He is one who should be strapped to Jones like Blease is rumoured to be doing this offseason.

[Adam The God 29,417]

I'm not so sure about. Blease was still get low possession games at Melbourne towards the end and would have been just hanging in there. Gysberts gets more of the ball and is more inside.

They both still have poor tanks but lets see what another per season can do.

Gysberts has still shown more at afl level than blease IMO.

I kind of see where you're coming from here, BR. Gysberts has played three gun games. I was at Shell Stadium to see his first game. He was in the top 5 players on the ground, even though we got smacked. It was a Chris Judd-like start to his career. Blease has kicked some wonderful goals, but has never really strung a consistent four quarter performance together (owing to his poor tank).

[Dee Fan 3,247]

It's a Catch 22 he's not going to attract much at the moment so do you keep him hope he has a good year and trade him at the end of next year, of course if he does then do you keep him?

He's got ability but he's a bit like a jumper you buy on the spur if the moment, do you wear it or do you look at it decide you just don't like it give it to someone else and get over it.

[DeeSpencer 24,784]

Blease is more AFL ready though. Put him in a good team with forward 50 entries, get him chasing as he started to learn how to do and he could hold a spot in a top side even been inconsistent.

Gysberts just looks both close to AFL but a mile off. He can win the ball and his usage can be very good by hand and decent by foot but he's so far off the physical side to compete with inside midfielders and his lack of speed means he really can't play any other position. He reminds me in a funny way of Juice Newton - here is a guy whos very good at his one trick at VFL level, put him in a bad AFL team and against good opposition and he's rubbish because he lacks other tricks. For Newton it was playing FF in the VFL for Gysberts its playing inside midfield. The first step is always to get the body ready to compete because then you give yourself a fighting chance. It took Juice the best part of a decade to fill out a bit and by then he was really not going to develop any more. If Gysberts does a preseason and has some weight on and most importantly has top line endurance and has some power in his game then he'll probably do enough at AFL to hold a spot and then develop.

Eventually in a perfect world Grimes plays back and Sylvia, Howe and Trengove probably play on spurts through the inside midfield spots leaving Jones and McKenzie as the only pure centre square established players we have but even then Gysberts has to prove he's a cut above Magner, Viney, pick 4 to get himself a game.

[Blind_turn 36]

Well I don't want to sound like a [censored], but consistent with the money ball theory every player be it on our team or any other is simply an asset that can rise and fall in value over time. For a club to be successful they must optimise their playing lists constantly. (See Sydney as a good example).

You can think of a players value at any point in time as being the sum of what he can offer today plus his potential upside. It seems clear that Gysberts value at the moment is low - lower than when we drafted him. As others have pointed out in the last year his value has fallen due to a poor pre season and then a broken jaw. I think his potential though would still be recognised by many. Therefore, it is irrational to trade him when his value is at a low point. He is under contract for another year and given an ounce of luck if he can get a preseason under his belt and play some more games in 2013.

If that scenario unfolds we win either way, if he lifts his game and potential is converted into real value - great, but if he gets a game but the coaching staff still see unresolvable deficiencies at least his current value will have been improved and I feel sure their will be some club looking for a high possession on baller with what they may still believe to be a lot of potential.

So definitely save!

[Jarka 767]

I'm undecided on Gysberts just yet, however I'd like to see how he goes in the next pre-season, I'd like to see him working his butt off to get a spot in the team.

[Tim 3,346]

Under no pressure he can hit a target....... I doubt I've ever seen someone's kicks take so long to travel through the air.

He had 5 kicks this year. One of them sticks in my memory - a set kick on the Members wing after a mark or free, towards Punt Rd; wobbled interminably to an uncontested mark to a GC player.

Sure, it's only one kick (although 20% of this year's output), but it is in line with the general standard.

[Sir Why You Little 36,668]

I kind of see where you're coming from here, BR. Gysberts has played three gun games. I was at Shell Stadium to see his first game. He was in the top 5 players on the ground, even though we got smacked. It was a Chris Judd-like start to his career. Blease has kicked some wonderful goals, but has never really strung a consistent four quarter performance together (owing to his poor tank).

yes Gysberts played a solid first up game at Geelong, but lets be realistic The Cats paid little attention to him...That was also the game we "rested" players. Another ludicrous idea. I wonder whether that was the week when the MFC learnt of $cully's future plans?

It was very odd to put up the white flag on thursday...But we are talking about the MFC!!

Edited October 14, 2012 by why you little

[daisycutter 29,341]

WTF? Do you have eyes?

if biffo laid eyes on you you'd turn to stone............

[Guest neeldstherealdeal]

Just has the look of a bloke who couldn't really give a rats one way or the other. It is VERY hard to make a competitive animal out of such a person.

Another poor draft selection.

[stuie 7,374]

He had 5 kicks this year. One of them sticks in my memory - a set kick on the Members wing after a mark or free, towards Punt Rd; wobbled interminably to an uncontested mark to a GC player.

Sure, it's only one kick (although 20% of this year's output), but it is in line with the general standard.

Just has the look of a bloke who couldn't really give a rats one way or the other. It is VERY hard to make a competitive animal out of such a person.

Another poor draft selection.

^no idea whatsoever.

You're easy to pick Range Rover aka "neeldstherealdeal"

[Grimseyisgod 378]

GOODBYE JORDIE

i honestly could not care less to see him go, looking forward to see what or if we can get someone/a good pick for him.

Either Injured, not in form.. always an excuse to not be playing.. frankly im sick of it

[rpfc 28,052]

He's contracted and I for one doubt he will leave now that Geelong isn't interested.

[Dee Fan 3,247]

GOODBYE JORDIE

i honestly could not care less to see him go, looking forward to see what or if we can get someone/a good pick for him.

Either Injured, not in form.. always an excuse to not be playing.. frankly im sick of it

Yeah he even went out and had his jaw broken just so he wouldn't have to play, what a tool, sack him.

[Deers 202]

I find it remarkable how some supporters get so attached to young players despite their absence from the senior team.

There's a good reason they can't get AFL games.

And don't start with the injury B/S. If Sydney players had the same mindset they would struggle to field a team each week.

[whelan45 202]

I find it remarkable how some supporters get so attached to young players despite their absence from the senior team.

There's a good reason they can't get AFL games.

And don't start with the injury B/S. If Sydney players had the same mindset they would struggle to field a team each week.

Yep, should of just played at an AFL standard with injuries. Very sound logic.

[stevethemanjordan 6,952]

Really? What team are you watching. We barely have 5 players each week who get more than 10 kicks.

Accumulators are people like Swan and Mitchell.

Gysberts finds his own ball. We have VERY FEW of those. However doesn't do any damage with the possessions and has no engine. But he is young and could be good.

We barely have five players each week who get more than ten kicks because we rarely have possession of the ball. Obviously the better we get as a side, the more possessions and numbers our players will have.

Maybe accumulator was the wrong word. What I mean is that we have a number of mids who don't have a problem getting first touch within contests, and so using Gysberts 'famous' first two or three games of his career as a measuring stick is ridiculous. I feel as though supporters base their opinion of him from those first few games.

It's not like he had the ball on a string, was using it really creatively and making sure his possessions were damaging. To me he just showed that he has a knack of winning the ball at the contest without much else.

He is not damaging by foot. He is not an aerial threat. He is a shocking runner for an AFL player let alone a midfielder. He lacks speed. He has a very light frame. He doesn't seem to hunt the ball or show physicality around the contest.

They're all worrying signs for a former pick 12 and a supposable Pendelbury prototype....

Demonlanders, you gotta realise that from time to time, (and in our case, history has shown a lot of the time) that you can get draft picks wrong.

The MFC need high quality midfielders that show they have several strong attributes.

Please name me one other football skill related attribute Gysberts possesses other than his supposed ball finding ability at the contest.

Gysberts had 26 and 27 disposals in his first two AFL games and in his third game against the pies he had 10. His first game was against Geelong at

skilled stadium. I'm sure a lot of you will agree that the Geelong midfield would have taken advantage of the fact that there was a skinny first gamer running around in the midfield and I'm not sure anyone would have taken too much notice of him. Food for thought.

My curiosity only arises because so many people seem to rate him so highly on the back of not much. It confuses me greatly.

[Dee Fan 3,247]

We barely have five players each week who get more than ten kicks because we rarely have possession of the ball. Obviously the better we get as a side, the more possessions and numbers our players will have.

Maybe accumulator was the wrong word. What I mean is that we have a number of mids who don't have a problem getting first touch within contests, and so using Gysberts 'famous' first two or three games of his career as a measuring stick is ridiculous. I feel as though supporters base their opinion of him from those first few games.

It's not like he had the ball on a string, was using it really creatively and making sure his possessions were damaging. To me he just showed that he has a knack of winning the ball at the contest without much else.

He is not damaging by foot. He is not an aerial threat. He is a shocking runner for an AFL player let alone a midfielder. He lacks speed. He has a very light frame. He doesn't seem to hunt the ball or show physicality around the contest.

They're all worrying signs for a former pick 12 and a supposable Pendelbury prototype....

Demonlanders, you gotta realise that from time to time, (and in our case, history has shown a lot of the time) that you can get draft picks wrong.

The MFC need high quality midfielders that show they have several strong attributes.

Please name me one other football skill related attribute Gysberts possesses other than his supposed ball finding ability at the contest.

Gysberts had 26 and 27 disposals in his first two AFL games and in his third game against the pies he had 10. His first game was against Geelong at

skilled stadium. I'm sure a lot of you will agree that the Geelong midfield would have taken advantage of the fact that there was a skinny first gamer running around in the midfield and I'm not sure anyone would have taken too much notice of him. Food for thought.

My curiosity only arises because so many people seem to rate him so highly on the back of not much. It confuses me greatly.

In his third game against the pies he was hit by Ben Johnson whilst he was trying to get the ball and injured his back, it was a cowardly hit and he didn't play again that year.

The following year he played 15 games and was ranked 4th amongst the Rising Stars for effective disposals behind Heppell, Hibberd and Shuey so his disposal can't be as bad as some on here believe.

See who was behind him.

http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_player_rankings?year=2011&rt=RA&st=ED

Here are some more interesting statistics.

http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/pc-melbourne-demons--jordan-gysberts

My understanding is that they are concerned that after 4 years in the system he still hasn't put on any weight.

[monoccular 17,328]

What is this 'talent' people keep speaking of?

Please.

He found it easy to accumulate possessions during his under 18 year. His first few games within the AFL were high numbered games and of course supporters start licking their lips thinking we have yet another 'star' in

the making.

We have enough accumulators who have plenty more strings to their bow. Gysberts has literally shown no other strong attribute.

I do not rate him at all.

Can a team have 'enough' accumulators? How many have each of the Premiership teams had this millennium? At least 5 I would hazzard a guess.

Just for interest, can you please name our accumulators over the last 2 seasons?

[binman 42,010]

Well I don't want to sound like a [censored], but consistent with the money ball theory every player be it on our team or any other is simply an asset that can rise and fall in value over time. For a club to be successful they must optimise their playing lists constantly. (See Sydney as a good example).

You can think of a players value at any point in time as being the sum of what he can offer today plus his potential upside. It seems clear that Gysberts value at the moment is low - lower than when we drafted him. As others have pointed out in the last year his value has fallen due to a poor pre season and then a broken jaw. I think his potential though would still be recognised by many. Therefore, it is irrational to trade him when his value is at a low point. .....

So definitely save!

Interesting post which raises some valid points. However the key query over Gysberts is his attitude and desire to do the necessary work. I vividly recall the reports of him being on the edge of collapse after time trials last pre season. IIRC correctly Blease also really struggled. The difference? Blease turned the corner and lifted his work rate mid season - a point he made himself in an unusually frank dee tve interview (ie that he it took him a while to 'buy in'). I get the feeling Gysberst has yet to turn that corner.

Granted he had his jaw broken but Neeld was quick to praise players who were training hard (eg Sylvia, Nicho, Blease, Trenner - even Watts post being dropped). I never heard them say this about Gysberts. So i would suggest that Neeld could care less about 'potential'. He only wants players who are prepared to train at the required level and Gysberts would seem not to be at that level.

The other thing about the 'moneyball theory' is that you get players to the the club who are undervalued not keep players whose value the club is well aware of. We'd be better of getting what we can for him now and cutting our losses - unless he can convince Neeld he is prepared to do the work and given he has had 12 months to do so i reckon this might be a hard ask.

[monoccular 17,328]

In his third game against the pies he was hit by Ben Johnson whilst he was trying to get the ball and injured his back, it was a cowardly hit and he didn't play again that year.

The following year he played 15 games and was ranked 4th amongst the Rising Stars for effective disposals behind Heppell, Hibberd and Shuey so his disposal can't be as bad as some on here believe.

See who was behind him.

http://www.footywire...rt=RA&st=ED

Here are some more interesting statistics.

http://www.footywire...jordan-gysberts

My understanding is that they are concerned that after 4 years in the system he still hasn't put on any weight.

The skinniness is a real concern - a broken jaw unfortunately interrupts significantly and attempts to address that too, for a month or two.

But that is what Craig and Missen are employed to do - asses whether he can put on (appropriate type of) weight; if so, do it, if not bye bye I guess.

[Goodvibes 3,596]

So are you all telling me he's not going to be Joel Corey now?

[stuie 7,374]

GOODBYE JORDIE

i honestly could not care less to see him go, looking forward to see what or if we can get someone/a good pick for him.

Either Injured, not in form.. always an excuse to not be playing.. frankly im sick of it

I find it remarkable how some supporters get so attached to young players despite their absence from the senior team.

There's a good reason they can't get AFL games.

And don't start with the injury B/S. If Sydney players had the same mindset they would struggle to field a team each week.

So much ignorance.... Where's Michael Jackson when you need him...

[timD 994]

We barely have five players each week who get more than ten kicks because we rarely have possession of the ball. Obviously the better we get as a side, the more possessions and numbers our players will have.

Maybe accumulator was the wrong word. What I mean is that we have a number of mids who don't have a problem getting first touch within contests, and so using Gysberts 'famous' first two or three games of his career as a measuring stick is ridiculous. I feel as though supporters base their opinion of him from those first few games.

It's not like he had the ball on a string, was using it really creatively and making sure his possessions were damaging. To me he just showed that he has a knack of winning the ball at the contest without much else.

He is not damaging by foot. He is not an aerial threat. He is a shocking runner for an AFL player let alone a midfielder. He lacks speed. He has a very light frame. He doesn't seem to hunt the ball or show physicality around the contest.

They're all worrying signs for a former pick 12 and a supposable Pendelbury prototype....

Demonlanders, you gotta realise that from time to time, (and in our case, history has shown a lot of the time) that you can get draft picks wrong.

The MFC need high quality midfielders that show they have several strong attributes.

Please name me one other football skill related attribute Gysberts possesses other than his supposed ball finding ability at the contest.

Gysberts had 26 and 27 disposals in his first two AFL games and in his third game against the pies he had 10. His first game was against Geelong at

skilled stadium. I'm sure a lot of you will agree that the Geelong midfield would have taken advantage of the fact that there was a skinny first gamer running around in the midfield and I'm not sure anyone would have taken too much notice of him. Food for thought.

My curiosity only arises because so many people seem to rate him so highly on the back of not much. It confuses me greatly.

What a pile.

Gysberts finds the ball. It is not a 'suppossed' skill. Watch him play. FMD.

This thread is littered with people arguing about his limitations and yet you find it necessary to get on, make a series of points that are borderline irrelelvant or already made and then defend it by saying that you are concerned that people are making their opinons' up on the first 3 games. You finish this by failing to remember the injury that RobbieF points out. That was particularly nice - to accuse others of limited reasoning when yours was so...ignorant.

Thanks for appointing yourself the guardian of well thought-out arguments. You are extending your efforts about Morton to Gysberts. Excellent. Now why don't you go and define "inside mid" as someone who gets the ball and butchers it. No wait, you've done that already!

Gysberts' great talent is that he can get the ball in tight. He is physcially weak, has no tank and cannot hurt the opposition. In four years his strenghts have barely improved and his weaknesses are painfully unchanged. Trade now, trade next year or delist.

[stuie 7,374]

Trade now, trade next year or delist.

Uggghhhhhh.... This thread is like beer, the more of it I have the dumber I feel for partaking in it