Would you Let Jack Viney go to GWS!

[dee-luded 2,959]

I heard Todd Viney speak on draft picks a couple of weeks back during the championships and he mentioned

us taking the best available - so lets hope we get Jack as a seconds rounder, because he wont get picked at 3,

he isnt the best available, GWS or GC pick him then they have him - and we get Grundy, which is a massive get.

GWS clearly need a ruckman, GC might bid on Viney, but I would think theres a fair few in front of Jack atm anyway.

IMO the draft top 7 or 8 could be done according to needs as the bottom teams strive to quickly become competative.GWS & the GCSuns IMO need hard in/unders to add to they're Class recruits they've already taken last year.

Ironically we need mostly Class 2nd & 3rd touch players to really set us up, Class inside/outsiders with High Kicking skills & gut run. (see Whitfield, Toumpas, Mayes, Stringer). Add to this Kennedy @ Mid1,,, or if you wish to pamper Todd & Jacks ego's then take Viney @ (Mid1) which is a bit closer to where he's should be, if he's there. There IMO, would be nothing to stop us using that pick on him, if it was the wishes of many. It would just be a bit generous.

[old55 23,687]

or if you wish to pamper Todd & Jacks ego's then take Viney @ (Mid1) which is a bit closer to where he's should be, if he's there. There IMO, would be nothing to stop us using that pick on him, if it was the wishes of many. It would just be a bit generous.

That scenario is never going to happen - if GWS and GC don't bid for him, then someone will bid for him somewhere and we'll take him with our next pick - there's NO WAY he'll be in the draft mid 1st round.

[dpositive 1,672]

I thought the club had already put some effort into having jack play with us He did play at casey and appeared to show attributes that would be welcomed in a developing melbourne squad.

without knowing what comments were made to him and among the players I would hate to see the integrity of the club compromised by any action of GWS. WE must honour our intention to Jack or it all becomes a little sordid. If we have to use a higher pick because of GWS tactics to honour any antention at least make that public and expose the GWS draft tampering.

[dee-luded 2,959]

That scenario is never going to happen - if GWS and GC don't bid for him, then someone will bid for him somewhere and we'll take him with our next pick - there's NO WAY he'll be in the draft mid 1st round.

I know that 55, but he is not the best of the early picks, re class etc.. But people seem to be enamored with him hoping to relive the Todd Viney days, & a sense of loyalty to the name... Based in hope of course.

What I posted is a sort of silly proposal for those who want to pay some sort of relevant fee towards his name, which I don't want to do. (he's most likely valued in the draft around 5 - 12)

Some people seem to feel guilty running the risk of not grabbing him Rnd 1.

I want to pick him with our Rnd 2 pick. Or fight to trade for him next year, or 2014.

Edited July 12, 2012 by dee-luded

[Theo 273]

I thought the club had already put some effort into having jack play with us He did play at casey and appeared to show attributes that would be welcomed in a developing melbourne squad.

without knowing what comments were made to him and among the players I would hate to see the integrity of the club compromised by any action of GWS. WE must honour our intention to Jack or it all becomes a little sordid. If we have to use a higher pick because of GWS tactics to honour any antention at least make that public and expose the GWS draft tampering.

Jack is wll aware and supports the clubs view that if the MFC believe Jack is not the 3rd best player in the draft they will NOT take him.

They will not be bluffed by Sheedy in particular. If GWS or GC nominate Jack they must take him. MFC must then decide whether to counter this nomiination and take him at their first pick,,or pass. In my view they would pass.

In reality GWS an GC would be damaging their brand by choosing Viney because the club, their supporters, their staff and all and sundry who follow these clubs, or have a financial or pecuniary interest in them would not think Jack is the 1st or 2nd best player in the draft.

We will get Viney in the second round.

Edited July 12, 2012 by Theo

[rpfc 28,762]

Effectively, it is a decision on whether we think he is the 4th best player; we have picks 3 and 4.

I would say that he would be near to that in many minds but I hope it is moot I do.

I just like his intangibles and I know he would walk into our group and demand more of them just because of what he demands of himself.

Such an impressive kid and intimidating little footy player.

[45HG 1,559]

I just like his intangibles and I know he would walk into our group and demand more of them just because of what he demands of himself.

Such an impressive kid and intimidating little footy player.

Reminds me of a conversation mid-2009

[McQueen 17,867]

GWS or GCFC would have to see him as a first or second pick. Why would they want to pick Viney otherwise? To screw over the third worst team in the comp?

[dee-luded 2,959]

Jack is wll aware and supports the clubs view that if the MFC believe Jack is not the 3rd best player in the draft they will NOT take him.

They will not be bluffed by Sheedy in particular. If GWS or GC nominate Jack they must take him. MFC must then decide whether to counter this nomiination and take him at their first pick,,or pass. In my view they would pass.

In reality GWS an GC would be damaging their brand by choosing Viney because the club, their supporters, their staff and all and sundry who follow these clubs, or have a financial or pecuniary interest in them would not think Jack is the 1st or 2nd best player in the draft.

We will get Viney in the second round.

If not Whitfield or Grundy...

[felixdacat 459]

NO!

[demonkeaney 61]

Is he tall? Nope, maybe 178cm at a stretch

Is he quick? Nope, not over distance

Is he multi dimensional, multi tasker, Go forward or back? Nope

Elite penetrating kick?Nope

Similarity, Judd, Pendels? Nope, Thinking Tony Shaw, Mitchell

Real draft value? about 12/18

Match winner? Not that I have seen, good hands in close, great foot soldier

Viney Sentiment? Good guys come last, and we are expert at that.

About Kevin? Who cares

Midfield rating? Jamar, Viney, Howe, Mckenzie, Magner, Maloney, Trengove, Bail, Nicholson, Spencer, Martini? About 16th/18th

Jack Viney is a Joel Selwood type.

Is Selwood tall?? No

Is Selwood quick?? No

Is Selwood multi dimensional, multi tasker, Go forward or back?? No

Elite penetrating kick?? No

Similarity, Judd, Pendels?? No

Geelong must be SPEWING!!! Obviously drafted abit of a dud there.

Get a grip!

[The heart beats true 18,145]

Honestly I want Jack VIney to play for Melbourne and I think he's going to be excellent but I, like others here, can't justify taking him above his worth simply because of the name. If that means he goes to GWS but we get a player that is better then that is actually the kind of cut throat, win at all costs attitude that might help us be at the right end of the ladder in a few years.

Or we could draft him above what he's worth to please his daddy, and then give him a shiny blazer. That certainly sounds like something we'd do.

[daisycutter 29,731]

assuming we finish 3rd last and assuming the regular pundits don't have jt in top 5

we tell gws and gcs publicly that if they bid for jt we won't offer our pick 3

they would not risk bidding for jt in those circumstances

i also suspect the afl would make some statements publicly and otherwise to dissuade gws and gcs from being funny buggars

no need to do any deals and this would further enhance our likely support from afl

[robbiefrom13 892]

Integrity is worth loads. Think of economic rationalism and the cancerous effect it had when everything was based on what the bean-counters said and human factors or rights-and-wrongs were dismissed.

The public standing of MFC lost a lot, as far as integrity goes, with tanking, throwing away our respected captain because he'd done a hammy, even the style of our play, with its lack of accountability... Then Scully's duplicity further tarnished the image of our club...

We need to distance ourselves from every sort of chicanery and "pragmatism". It would be a very sound investment instead to prioritise at any cost a culture of integrity.

We do not do an Adelaide at the tribunal. We do not try to set up Visy deals or go corporate lawyers and accountants to find an edge. We actually make a success without having cheats of any description on our list. We are not drawn into the Sheedy-style [censored]. Maybe it's a good thing to be told we have turned into an old-fashioned club. We begin to look after our own. Close ranks, and build strength. Norm Smith practised this. And in that vein we take Viney - of course we do - he's OURS.

As to the calculation of his size and speed and the length of his kick - grow up! (Barassi was of indeterminate size and not especially quick, the son of a former player. But didn't the qualities that he did have outweigh the measurables! - and in a number of ways similar to what we hear JV's assets are. I can't wait to see Jack Viney running out for us.)

Edited July 13, 2012 by robbiefrom13

[DemonWA 3,936]

No way

[BIG JIM 508]

After the State champ's there is no way GWS will bid on the boy.

He is not even close to top 2 he is rated maybe 7 to 15.

The MFC will pass if they bid and take Grundy,Stringer,Toumpas.

I really want the kid but Melbourne will not play the boys club card.

Not with such high picks in a super draft.

Sheedy will not even be coach when the draft comes IMO.

This little gem will come to Melbourne with pick 23.

Choco will be in charge of GWS

[Hannibal 5,814]

Integrity is worth loads. Think of economic rationalism and the cancerous effect it had when everything was based on what the bean-counters said and human factors or rights-and-wrongs were dismissed.

The public standing of MFC lost a lot, as far as integrity goes, with tanking, throwing away our respected captain because he'd done a hammy, even the style of our play, with its lack of accountability... Then Scully's duplicity further tarnished the image of our club...

We need to distance ourselves from every sort of chicanery and "pragmatism". It would be a very sound investment instead to prioritise at any cost a culture of integrity.

We do not do an Adelaide at the tribunal. We do not try to set up Visy deals or go corporate lawyers and accountants to find an edge. We actually make a success without having cheats of any description on our list. We are not drawn into the Sheedy-style [censored]. Maybe it's a good thing to be told we have turned into an old-fashioned club. We begin to look after our own. Close ranks, and build strength. Norm Smith practiced this. And in that vein we take Viney - of course we do - he's OURS.

As to the calculation of his size and speed and the length of his kick - grow up! (Barassi was of indeterminate size and not especially quick, the son of a former player. But didn't the qualities that he did have outweigh the measurables! - and in a number of ways similar to what we hear JV's assets are. I can't wait to see Jack Viney running out for us.)

That's a really good post, Robbie.

I just have one problem though. I'm sick of other clubs and the AFL rubbing our noses in it.

Edited July 13, 2012 by Ben-Hur

[Jesse Christ 2,884]

Honestly I want Jack VIney to play for Melbourne and I think he's going to be excellent but I, like others here, can't justify taking him above his worth simply because of the name. If that means he goes to GWS but we get a player that is better then that is actually the kind of cut throat, win at all costs attitude that might help us be at the right end of the ladder in a few years.

Or we could draft him above what he's worth to please his daddy, and then give him a shiny blazer. That certainly sounds like something we'd do.

[censored].

Viney is worth a high end draft pick to us- the fact that his "daddy" works with us and is a club legend is inconsequential, but an added bonus at the end of the day.

I can't believe that some on here would actually begrudge using a high draft pick on this kid. We bemoan our lack of culture, yet drafting this kid well do a good deal to fix this- with his style of play and workrate.

If we pass on him (which we wont- and if you believe we will you are kidding yourself) it is unlikely we will get him back- and then you can have a sook while the sure thing kills it in the midfield for GWS/GC, and we may end up with another NQR, or gutter rat that could abandon the ship.

Wake the f up!

[binman 43,732]

I still think he was worthy at the time of going top five, but my point is that just because they are rated top five now, doesn't always equate to very good long-term players. To be honest I was probably harsh on Trengove but his lack of pace really has for a long time concerned me.

I tried but i can't let this slide. A bit harsh on Trengove and no mention of being harsh on Watts?.

I rate Trengove, why wouldn't you. He'll be a terrific servant for the dees and i reckon next year after another full Misson pre season he'll get his zip back and be amongst our best wek in, week out. Glad we took him but i suspect he may fall a touch short of elite - A grade, which for what its worth i define as AA selection.

Watts on the other hand will definitely be an elite A grade player and by the time he is 25 will be an All Australian (something that over the years Melbourne have struggled to have). He will be star, well and truly worthy of a top 5 pick. He is already (worthy of a top 5 pick that is - worthy of number 1 for that matter).

I really look forward to the humble pie that will have to be eaten on this site by the posters who don't rate Watts or have got stuck into him.

[BIG JIM 508]

I tried but i can't let this slide. A bit harsh on Trengove and no mention of being harsh on Watts?.

I rate Trengove, why wouldn't you. He'll be a terrific servant for the dees and i reckon next year after another full Misson pre season he'll get his zip back and be amongst our best wek in, week out. Glad we took him but i suspect he may fall a touch short of elite - A grade, which for what its worth i define as AA selection.

Watts on the other hand will definitely be an elite A grade player and by the time he is 25 will be an All Australian (something that over the years Melbourne have struggled to have). He will be star, well and truly worthy of a top 5 pick. He is already (worthy of a top 5 pick that is - worthy of number 1 for that matter).

I really look forward to the humble pie that will have to be eaten on this site by the posters who don't rate Watts or have got stuck into him.

Could not have said it any better Jack has grown this year and with another pre season this kid will be a GUN.

So many demon fans have given this kid so much crap.

The big boys always take time but with this kid you must have been blind not to see how good the skills of this guy were.

Look what he is doing as a tall skinny kid.

Watch as the boy turns into a man over the next 2 years.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

I tried but i can't let this slide. A bit harsh on Trengove and no mention of being harsh on Watts?.

I rate Trengove, why wouldn't you. He'll be a terrific servant for the dees and i reckon next year after another full Misson pre season he'll get his zip back and be amongst our best wek in, week out. Glad we took him but i suspect he may fall a touch short of elite - A grade, which for what its worth i define as AA selection.

Watts on the other hand will definitely be an elite A grade player and by the time he is 25 will be an All Australian (something that over the years Melbourne have struggled to have). He will be star, well and truly worthy of a top 5 pick. He is already (worthy of a top 5 pick that is - worthy of number 1 for that matter).

I really look forward to the humble pie that will have to be eaten on this site by the posters who don't rate Watts or have got stuck into him.

I do like and rate Watts, but will he be considered top five from his draft in years to come?

[BIG JIM 508]

I do like and rate Watts, but will he be considered top five from his draft in years to come?

He will be considered a great number 1 pick.

[binman 43,732]

I do like and rate Watts, but will he be considered top five from his draft in years to come?

Well obviously i think so - and i will happily remind doubters when it proves to be the case

[H_T 3,049]

Integrity is worth loads. Think of economic rationalism and the cancerous effect it had when everything was based on what the bean-counters said and human factors or rights-and-wrongs were dismissed.

The public standing of MFC lost a lot, as far as integrity goes, with tanking, throwing away our respected captain because he'd done a hammy, even the style of our play, with its lack of accountability... Then Scully's duplicity further tarnished the image of our club...

We need to distance ourselves from every sort of chicanery and "pragmatism". It would be a very sound investment instead to prioritise at any cost a culture of integrity.

We do not do an Adelaide at the tribunal. We do not try to set up Visy deals or go corporate lawyers and accountants to find an edge. We actually make a success without having cheats of any description on our list. We are not drawn into the Sheedy-style [censored]. Maybe it's a good thing to be told we have turned into an old-fashioned club. We begin to look after our own. Close ranks, and build strength. Norm Smith practiced this. And in that vein we take Viney - of course we do - he's OURS.

As to the calculation of his size and speed and the length of his kick - grow up! (Barassi was of indeterminate size and not especially quick, the son of a former player. But didn't the qualities that he did have outweigh the measurables! - and in a number of ways similar to what we hear JV's assets are. I can't wait to see Jack Viney running out for us.)

Excellent post.

But wouldn't it be beneficial to the club if there was an ability legally to explore options 'for' finding an edge ? And at the same time, 'neglectful' if the club didn't ?

[Jordie_tackles 354]

The question is so much is he worth a top 2 pick to GWS or GC but a top 4 pick to MFC. they are calling our bluff and yeah they risk taking him but i dont there is anyone in the 4-10 range who is alot better than Viney when i really think it through. Wines isnt and Stringer has a big risk factor non of the other names are above Viney imo from what i have seen and read.

I thought both clubs will pass but that was when i thought Viney isnt top 2 or even 3 but he is definitely in the mix at 4 and i would say leading the pack at 4.

The final aspect to this is though the top 3 as always are in their own league so if we call the bluff we could end up with a Whitfield, Grundy, Toumpas combo of two of these guys or basically a top 3 pick for a 4-7 pick which is a big difference.

Is a complicated scenario i havnt even convinced myself writing this just getting my thoughts on paper really.

Edited July 13, 2012 by Jordie_tackles