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Earl Spalding

SEN still on air?

Ron Barassi.

Should have had a massive clean out (Clarko Style) after the 2004 Season, to be on top and then lose 5 Games should have told us the list was not up to it. Players should have been sold whilst they had value, but ND (Bless him) had his faves

It has indeed been a long road for those of us who stated supporting just as we went into decline in the mid sixties. Those years were really odd, we still had Premiership stars like Tassie, Barry Bourke and others but were in fact going backwards. The 70s saw other Clubs like Richmond hit the jackpot with a young Tommy Hafey, a hard nosed administration and some recruiting gems. Barass was working his magic at a reguvitated Carlton, who again had a hard nosed administration and a rich recruiting zone. meanwhile planning was underway at North with a great admisitration and recruiting department. Essendon and Collingwood remained strong while Hawthorn were still under John Keneddy with a strong admisitration and a following division of Scott, Tuck and Matthews. The 80s rolled on and it took our best coach in my time, John Northey to get things rolling. And thats what he did, he rolled the dice and created an attacking style of play which took one of the best sides ever in the Hawks to kill the dream. We would go on to make one more GF under Danahier but we never were a chance. I now hold my breath, as I am not close to the powers that be and am constantly bewildered why everyday supporters have had a better feel for the playing list than those running the show. Still, maybe this year we are as good a chance as anyone else.

And Norm Smith got South into the finals in 1970 but he had to change clubs to do that.

Drinking, drugs and poor life choices are as much a symptom of mental health issues as they are a cause.

It has always been my impression that the Melbourne Football Club just never quite lifted the standards of professionalism, resources and organisation as other clubs did. Not that we went backwards so much as everyone else was going forwards a little bit faster. Eventually that led to a wider and wider gap, and the very fact of that gap made it harder and harder to motivate a whole club to unify their effort. Complacency and 'traditionalist' culture, combined with chronic shortage of income, meant that any innovations (some of which were already a decade or more old at other clubs) were adopted piecemeal, tokenistically, and temporarily, rather than being permanently included in the way the club expected to operate. An obvious psychological trap at the club is the pattern of 'we got there, everything is okay, time to relax.' We reach a point of looking alright, then go no further. In particularly wilting under the pressure when we discover that actually, no, they wont leave us alone now, we have to keep going every bloody week! We've turned it around to some extent, but given that false dawns are our specialty, we are all watching and waiting.

We were an established club that thought the good times would go on for ever. Arrogance is a fatal disease. Other clubs got the jump on us and we've never recovered. Been playing catch up since then...

Ok, yes i have a few small multis on. Mixed with a few Bendigo runners.... Good luck indeed.

I must say that studying the form and discovering new ways of punting is a lot of fun. The 'hope' attached does help of course Wadda. So I have plucked out a series of multi's at Sha Tin today - all with small outlays to win ok amounts. Was it HG who declared that you back the 2nd or 3rd favourite for the place? Multi 'em up to avoid large outlays though. Got a few favourites involved as well. If I can double my total outlay I'll be happy but there's a couple of big dividends in there if luck is on my side. Good luck to all those having a punt today!

Lol why does everyone think Collingwood invented him as a backline player, it’s infuriating I recall his reason to go to the pies was to play as a forward, and jack watts shouldn’t be on the list no regrets there

hahaha....yes i would have mate, all invited and a bank to punt with ! Oh well, we probably cant go anyway and i cant drink that much champagne !!

@Wadda We Sing still can’t believe how close that was. I’m spewing for ya mate....for the price of a short black the ADATR crew could’ve had the Lavazza marquee on Cup day.

Yeah i hear ya Macca & thanks...was stiff alright ! Haha I got on a roll early and it just kept going. I had several other multis including ours, but if i took a 4 leg multi i still lost on 1 leg and ditto 3 leg multis. Despite having 7 or 8 selections that got up, i didnt get a return. The cash out before the King of Leogrance leg was 357. I was very tempted to cash out, then reinvest, but the odds had come in on the remaining legs, so i thought id let it ride and make another decision after the 5th leg. Sadly that was not to be. I only got annoyed when the remaining legs saluted haha....but hey i only dropped 30 on the day and saw some terrific races, so its all good. I still think its the way to go, mainly because you lose less than if you bet on each individual horse. Also if you have a live multi rolling, you tend to bet less on the races upcoming i think. If i went the other way on those 7 selections and picked them individually, i would have outlayed say 70 (10 each) and only returned 190, for a combined win of 130, so no big deal. I prefer to live on the edge ! Its more fun although my furniture might not agree ! The trick i reckon, is to pick the right races, skip a few....you dont have to get them in a row. I have a tendency to also go for races with less runners, when possible. I notice there are a lot of races on internationally today, seems its coming back. Its a fairly good social distance sport i guess. Lets hope cricket is the same ! Good luck at Sha Tin. Enter the Dragon !

All things happen for a reason ... McLean bleating about the tanking ultimately served a decent purpose. We were completely stagnant and going even further backwards in 2012/13 and the massive changes that happened once PJ arrived might not have happened unless we reached rock-bottom. The investigation saw to that. And massive change often only happens when the proverbial hits the fan (big time) But we're still behind a number of clubs with regards to professionalism & having a ruthless winning culture (IMO) The answer is to have top people filling the 6 Pillars required ... Pres, Footy Manager, Coach, Captain, CEO & Chief Recruiter. A top list of players therefore follows as a matter of course. And then you win (hopefully, win big)

The turning point ... Round 5, 1964 Essendon vs Melbourne Saturday 16 May Venue: Windy Hill Attendance: 27,000 B Crompton Massey Tas Johnson HB Anderson Roet Leahy C Watson H Mann Adams HF Vagg Groom Kenneally F Jacobs Bourke Townsend Foll Wise Barassi Rov Emselle 19/20 Foster Matthews Windy Hill was never a happy hunting ground for the Melbourne Football Club and it was proving to be so for them at half time when inaccurate kicking for goal saw them trailing by a goal against Essendon who began the game as favourites by virtue of their demolition of the reigning premier Geelong. The Demons lifted their game in the second half in what was probably the catalyst for turning around a season that was in danger of slipping away. Tony Anderson and Neil Crompton stood firm all day in defence while Norm Smith’s move of third gamer Graeme Watson into the middle allowing Hassa Mann to take on the main roving duties proved to be the master stroke as the team dominated the rest of the game despite their continued inaccuracy in front of goal. In an interesting sidelight, both of Melbourne’s reserves, including first gamer Robert Foster, sat out the entire game on the bench. Runner Sam Allica was reported for illegally delivering messages to players other than the captain or vice-captain for the second time in the season. Essendon 2.0.12 4.4.28 5.7.37 7.11.53 Melbourne 1.6.12 2.10.22 5.18.48 10.25.85 Goals Barassi Bourke H Mann Vagg 2 Groom Jacobs Best Anderson Crompton Watson H Mann Emselle Kenneally Reserves Melbourne 10.9.69 defeated Essendon 6.13.49 Goals Carroll 5 Bartlett Wood 2 Slade Best Carroll Vaughan Bartlett Under 19s Melbourne 13.18.95 defeated Essendon 9.7.61 Goals McNabb Schultz 4 Reinholdt 2 Coutts Osborne Russell Best Stewart Minton-Connell McNamee

The crunch came on this day 56 years ago ... Round 4, 1964 St. Kilda vs Melbourne Saturday 9 May Venue: Junction Oval Attendance: 35,000 B Crompton Massey L Mann HB Anderson Roet Leahy C Williams H Mann Adams HF Vagg Groom Kenneally F Barassi Bourke Townsend Foll Tas Johnson Wise Rov Emselle 19/20 Jacobs Watson The young St Kilda side was still smarting from their loss in the previous season’s first semi final when they took on Melbourne for what turned out to be their last encounter at the Junction Oval. The Demons wasted their opportunities in the opening quarter with wayward kicking for goal allowing the Saints to control the game from there on taking a 16 point lead into the main break. Although they got to within five points early in the last quarter, the home side steadied to a comfortable 26 point win, leaving the Demons in mid table with a 2-2 record for the season. St. Kilda’s charge was led by two exciting young teenagers Carl Ditterich, 18, and Ian Cooper, 17 while Ray Groom was Melbourne’s best. Half forward Barrie Vagg kicked four goals, but his impact on the team’s overall performance was lacking. Veteran winger Brian Dixon who was a Liberal Party candidate for the local seat of St Kilda at the forthcoming State Election missed with a shoulder injury which might have been regarded as a blessing in disguise for him. St. Kilda 2.1.13 7.5.47 8.11.53 13.15.93 Melbourne 1.6.12 4.7.31 6.12.48 9.13.67 Goals Vagg 4 Emselle 2 Barassi Bourke Groom Best Groom Anderson Roet Barassi H Mann Adams Reserves St Kilda 9.8.62 d. Melbourne 7.11.53 Goals Wood 2 Bartlett Bourke Carroll Matthews Slade Best Matthews Davis Lord Under 19s Melbourne 17.6.108 defeated St. Kilda 6.12.48 Goals Feldman 4 McNab Schultz 3 Osborne Marr Stone 2 Russell Best Griffiths Marr Pritchard

The 1964 season moved into May ... Round 3, 1964 Melbourne vs Carlton Saturday, 2 May Venue: MCG Attendance: 45,494 B Crompton Massey L Mann HB Anderson Roet Leahy C Dixon H Mann Watson HF Groom Lord Kenneally F Barassi Bourke Townsend Foll Tas Johnson Wise Rov Emselle 19/20 Vagg Williams The Demons had been unconvincing in their opening two rounds and, despite their Round 2 win over North Melbourne, the selectors reacted by dropping three players in Matthews, Miller and Robbie and relegating Vagg and Williams to the bench. Future test cricketer Graeme Watson who passed away in April, 2020 was selected for his first game. It was not a game for forwards with skipper Ron Barassi, the only player to fire up front all day. He kicked two goals himself but his strong play set up many scoring opportunities for others in the team’s 46 point victory as the visitors struggled. At the final break, they had only one goal on the board. Evergreen stalwart Don Williams who came onto the ground in the second quarter replacing Tony Anderson (broken nose) and Dr. Brian Roet were Melbourne's best on the day. The team finished one man short after Brian Dixon (shoulder) and Barassi (cramp) left the field late in the last term. Melbourne 2.5.17 6.10.46 8.12.60 11.13.79 Carlton 1.1.7 1.3.9 1.6.12 4.9.33 Goals Barassi Bourke Emselle Townsend 2 Groom Kenneally Lord Best Williams Roet Emselle Barassi Dixon Massey Reserves Melbourne 12.13.85 defeated Carlton 10.10.70 Goals Carroll 3 Bartlett Wood 2 Foster Matthews Mounter Slade Zinko Best Jacobs Matthews Lynch Under 19s Melbourne 9.15.69 defeated Carlton 10.5.65 Goals Leahy McNabb Pritchard Stone 2 Feldman Best Pritchard Leahy Stone

Being born in the early 1980's meant I missed out on the Glory Days of the 1950's and early 1960's. We all know about the sacking of Norm Smith and Ron Barassi Jnr moving to Carlton. Two things that should never have happened. But I want to know what else happened? Why did the Melbourne Football Club fail so miserably and fall into decline from the late 1960's into the 1970s? Who was responsible for the missed opportunities of recruiting players or the development of players? Who is responsible for our lack of success during that time? I also want to know why the Melbourne Football Club board didn't support Norm Smith 100% (rightly or wrongly) when he allegedly called an umpire a "cheat" in 1963? Why didn't they back him? Why didn't they do more to support their Premiership coach? At least pay for his legal expenses and other costs and look after him? Additionally why didn't the Melbourne Football Club board do more to prevent Ron Barassi Jnr from leaving the club to go to Carlton in 1965? Who were the board members and football department people? That were part of the club during that time in the 1960's and 1970's? Why were so many of them totally inept? I would like to know why the board wasn't held accountable for their mistakes? I also heard that Norm Smith attempted to join the Melbourne Football Club board in either 1967 or 1968 but failed to obtain enough votes. Is this true? If so, why didn't the Melbourne Football Club members back him? Obviously these questions may open up some old wounds. But I want to get my head around what went wrong in those days. I would appreciate the thoughts of those who have any knowledge of these times.

Round 1 was a garbage performance by the club. The loss didn’t bother me as West Coast have an 80% winning record at Optus. It was the way we lost. Nothing changed from last year. 1) Dominating the opening minutes of the game, only to kick a bunch of behinds and letting the opposition off the hook. Then proceed to concede an avalanche of goals. 2) Horrid and inefficient inside 50 entires. Kicks beautifully targeted to Hurn, McGovern and Barrass from minute 1 to final siren. 3) Bush league type errors and playing players that aren’t up to it. Eg- Spargo continually kicking it to the opposition all day. 4) Innaccurate shots for goal because we insist on kicking it wide to the pockets. 5) We held up the ball when we should’ve gone fast, and we went fast when we should’ve played tempo footy. 6) Letting the other side kick Coast to Coast goals because of our pathetic lack of pressure. 7) Our so called gun players such as Brayshaw and Petracca who just can’t get the best out of themselves under Goodwin. Brayshaw since round 1 2019 and Petracca throughout Goodwin’s tenure. It was essentially round 24 2019. Hoping to see a far different and more efficient side for round 2.

That's a strange thing to say 'Nelo'... Drugs can be the cause of the mental issues and no doubt staying off them would be an enormous help. ...but quite often it is people with pre existing mental issues self medicating that go down this rabbit hole. Once in the cycle it's a difficult one to break, it's not as simple as just walking away.

There's a lot of truth in that. It would be amazing if we could get the admin and coaching to stop trying to copy the successful models of other clubs, come up with our own blueprint (that works) and then stick to their guns and follow through with it.

There's a bit of truth in that - but it also reeks of excuse making. Collingwood in Jock McHales day had a policy of paying every player the same. It cost them Ron Todd but they still got on and made finals, GF and won premierships. Our problem is we are co atantly questioning our direction, like we have some ongoing existential crisis about what we stand for. Is it because we grew from a stadium and not a suburb? If we were the East Melbourne Football Club would we be better off? Complacency was definitely a problem after the 50s and 60s and being the club of the establishment probably doesn't help either. We need to just learn how to be a football club instead of constantly worrying about our identity. Being a football club is simple, look after your people (including supporters) and win games of footy. Nothing else matters.

From my reading that was just the straw that broke the camels back. It seems there was a relationship breakdown between Smith and the board that would've blown up anyway.

If you look at the history of the club, right from the beginning we've been slow to adapt and embrace new realities. The MFC has had a history of relying on the prestige of being THE MFC, the FIRST club and assuming that players will just want to come here. Back when the league first agreed that players could be paid "travel expenses" for coming to games, guess which club refused to do it? Player payments. Recruiting zones. Paying players to move into different cities so they could be recruited by your club... Melbourne have always been the team that missed the boat. Then when they finally did try to do something a little bit dodgy to gain an advantage, they stuffed it up, failed to capitalise on the advantage they had worked for and then got caught out and fined half a million dollars.

I have kepi all the tickets etc. and have sent them another pointed email asking what is the delay

It all went bad (and came good) at the worst times. A down period was to be expected after our glory years. Every team has gone through it. Hardly surprising. Longer than usual, but news of our struggles during that period is hardly known (or cared about) outside of Victoria. We bounce back in the late 80s and run into a brick wall powerhouse in the Hawks. We stay near the top for long enough and become complacent: at a time when football department spend was on the rise we stayed in amateur town, training at Junction Oval using Average Joes gym and recovery equipment. Whilst the rest of the league was becoming professional, we never quite transitioned until much later. We were in essence a team run like an amateaur football club until the late 90s (at the earliest). We fall a bit, survive multiple merger attempts, and start a new era. BOOM. Another brick wall in the Essendon powerhouse. We stick with a crop of good but not great players, and the "boys club" is formed, or at least cemented in the culture. We crash and burn, and at the start of the social media era, where information and news spreads faster than the Road Runner, we are known as that team always at the bottom of the ladder. Melbourne's population booms, neutral supporters latch onto your Hawthorns and Geelongs, and it's "uncool" to follow a team like Melbourne. Growth is difficult. EVERYONE knows how bad we are. There's no hiding from it. Meanwhile, we continue to tread water to stay afloat, struggling to win games and get people to our games. Thus, slow growth at a time when even modestly successful clubs can pump millions into their departments. We bounce back and have a strong season, only to crash down again due to shocking player management. All is good though, we have an urgency to redeem ourselves. And then a pandemic happens, stifling any legitimate attempt to reboot and regain momentum. There's no definitive time when it went wrong. It's just in our DNA.

Club never evolved as comp become more professional. Never established a home base for its supporters, just look @ Collingwood base which we were offered but rejected & It’s now 2020 & still no home base Continuous poor appointments to people both on & of the field , always band aide approaches with no strong long term strategic plans. After the failed merger in 96 Hawks developed a plan with its members resulting in a new home base & 4 flags. Mfc continued down the same path of just trying to survive & relied on a white knight Gutnick to save the club! Continues poor recruiting with poor culture & development , just look @ all the early top 15 draft picks we took from 07-13 & see how many are on our list, let alone any Afl list

Have to agree to disagree on that one.

we became the bastard step-child of the mcc the mcg became a mill-stone around our collective necks whereas once it was our prime differentiator

The failure to social distance is a worry.

It’s a worry that it is likely the AFL will cut player welfare staff to cut costs. I hope not.

Martin Pike

Stevens has addiction issues. Unsure if they’re the result or cause of his mental issues also. Stevens was breaching AFL isolation and social distancing rules and will be in trouble regardless of what happens. He’s also not willing to give police any details surrounding the incident. Seems very likely to be drug dealer stuff gone wrong. He’ll likely never play any meaningful AFL level footy again. It’s a shame to lose another talented footballer to drugs. It’s also a shame that mental health is becoming a go-to excuse to cover other less savory choices and issues.

The laws of libel & slander would have been the reason why the club didn't back Smith when he called the umpire a cheat. It was a silly thing for Norm to do anyway ... a man of his maturity reducing himself down to acting like a blinkered supporter. And why would the Board members hand themselves a criminal record all because a coach has lost the plot. Smith settled with the umpire (out of court) so there's your answer in a nutshell. Great coach all the same. But the truth is the team was becoming weaker because of the zones and Smith (IMO) turned his attention to the lowest common denominator. The umpires. We no longer had carte-blanche for the emerging talent (via the recruiting genius Jim Cardwell) and that continued on until drafting appeared.

It still staggers me how these people with supposed mental health issues are continually into the drinking, drugs or hang around with the wrong crowds. Get rid of those 3 things to start with and I’d say it has to help your well being.

Gerard Healey. Scott Thompson Darren Jolly

Um, the Barassi Ranting Method took Carlton and North Melbourne to 2 Premierships...

Regret - we look back and wish we didn't do it. Thats not how it works, you make the best decision that you can at the time. Howe - wanted to go, so this was a trade because we had to. In each case the numpties don’t have all the facts. The clubs might have made some bad calls, but we cant know what would have been the outcome if the trade was not made. I have zero regrets about the trades they mention. I may have more regrets that we were a club that no one wanted to come to for so long, that we were crap at developing players and we chose a string of coaches who were just not up to it.

I rate Neeta very highly, but Rob Flower was pound for pound the best footballer we have ever had! Even including Ronald Dale Can you imagine Robert Flower running around for the power sides of the 70ts and 80ts Carlton, Collingwood, Hawks, Essendrug? He would be a multiple Premiership player no doubt. I'll leave you with this of his 15 or so Big V games he was just phenomenaly Brilliant!

Culture isn't drugs, its a whole bundle of ideas, values beliefs, disciplines, creativeness, forming communal standards. Other clubs were drinking since the 50's maybe earlier. So, what is it that's different, from them to us. When they win, and we lose? They are aggressive.......... We are conservatives, and inhibited in decision making They are not afraid of public perceptions......We are always embarrassed at the slightest They are fulfilled living the life they want....... we are always guilty for not keeping our morals They are Positive ...................... We are Negative. I think this is what we lost when Smithy was unceremoniously sanctioned from our colours, and Barass took his Melbourne MoJo to Carlton, with him. What were we left with, from all that... MfcSS__ .

Whilst not a great Molony fan I think the reason they put him up for trade is they had plenty of his type of player. They needed Ottens, as they do again need an Ottens type. I don't think it had anything to do with wanting Moloney out.

More importantly, do I get a new fridge magnet?

What I'm getting at is recruiters, like everyone, don't always get it right. You seem fixated on the mistakes made by Melbourne's staff. I read your posts as implying that the kind of weird stuff Brock McLean talks about only happened at Melbourne, because of its stuffed 'culture'. Well, sorry the weird stuff went on everywhere. That Melbourne made recruiting errors is a given, so did all the other teams.In the end, success breeds success. Success also glosses over inherent cracks and problems, witness the reason Hawthorn had to ballast Franklin. Hodge too was borderline as was Chick, many others etc. The tragedy of Bomber Thompson at Geelong and Essendon is a festering can of worms which no-one wants to address. West Coast is a basket case of corpses and lives totally ruined. I could go on. In the meantime, my friend, you make out Melbourne is some kind of lunatic tragedy. What I'm suggesting is it was/is no worse than other clubs. Cards have been stacked, not many fell our way. Obviously, Melbourne have been in the wilderness since 1964, got close in the Northey, Daniher, Balme days. Melbourne should have made the finals in 1976: only an after the siren kick down at Geelong kept them out. Melbourne looked poised in 2018, by the time they reached Perth they were done and dusted. Poo happens. So they appointed Neeld? Bailey, Beckwirth, Jones, Ditterich, the list is endless. Other clubs made similar boo boos. Nuff said. Go read some Dosteoevesky. Which one, you ask. Fyodor.

30 man squad Fowler Steven Smith Wight Brett Lovett Hardeman Yze Flower Wells Alves Lyon Schwarz Wilson Farmer Neitz Jakovich Stynes Gerard Healy T.Viney int. Johnson Gawn N.Jones Davey Squad - Tingay, White, Robertson, J.Mcdonald, Moore, Green, Parke, Oliver Steve Febey (standby ?)

Not sad at all.He was very much the author of his own misfortune and part of the problem at the club.Not even gracious enough to leave without embroiling the club in an unwarranted and debilitating enquiry

I think you’re the one on the Whiskey ? tonight Jack

Laurie Fowler has to be in the team. Three time Bluey Truscott B&F ahead of Robbie. Fowler did the job every week. He was tough. Determined. 140 games in 7 years. Victorian rep when only him and Robbie were considered the only decent Demon players. Played for Victoria in 1981 and then got cut by the Dees. It was Ridiculous. I saw Grinter and Fowler. Both were great blokes to have in the trenches. But I’d choose Fowler.