2022 Champion Data Rankings

[durango 2,007]

I have watch and played football from 1952 and found that champion data is the biggest load of rubbish unfortunately coaches look at statistics and think they are the holly grail of data.

The players who block and tackle a player jarring the ball from his grasp are not rewarded they don't reward a kick or handball to advantage verses a miskick or a bad handball.

The kick by Harmes in the GF to Bayley was superb did he get extra for that kick no this is why statistics can be skewed, because that kick energized the teams belief they could win and the result was a premiership.

The computer program was written by a person who may or may not know anything about football and does not analyse the result of the kick or handball other than good or bad.

If it was done properly there would be grades of handball and kicks where depending on the accuracy they would get a rating out of 0 to 9.

  

[leave it to deever 17,511]

21 hours ago, Demonland said:

Spoiler Alert; Max isn't elite ...

MELBOURNE

Elite players: Three – Jake Lever (key defender), Clayton Oliver (midfielder), Christian Petracca (midfielder).

The premiership Demons had five players earn selection in the All-Australian team last year, headlined by skipper Max Gawn.

But Champion Data only gave three elite status based on its analysis – the same number as in 2020 despite the team’s premiership win.

Star midfield duo Clayton Oliver and Norm Smith medallist Christian Petracca retained their A-list status from 2020 while defensive marshall Jake Lever replaced Gawn.

Gawn was one of seven Demons to earn an above average rating.

Champion Data explained Gawn only marginally missed out on elite status with little separating the Demons’ star from Tom Hickey, Brodie Grundy and Sean Darcy.

Bayley Fritsch, Alex Neal-Bullen, Kysaiah Pickett (all general forwards), Lever’s defensive partner in crime Steven May (key defender), Tom McDonald (key forward) and Ed Langdon (wing).

Gawn, May, Lever, Oliver and Petracca all earned All-Australian selection last year.

 

The others ...

ADELAIDE

Elite players: Three – Jordan Dawson (general defender), Taylor Walker (key forward), Paul Seedsman (wing).

After a forgettable 2020 season, the Crows were the only team in the league without an elite player heading into 2021, according to Champion Data’s ratings.

But this year they have three, bolstered by the arrival of off-season recruit Jordan Dawson from the Sydney Swans.

After struggling with his form throughout parts of 2020, 31-year-old Walker earned his elite rating coming off a 48-goal season from his 17 games. He averaged 2.8 goals (elite), 5.3 marks (above average) and 13.4 disposals (elite) a game.

Seedsman didn’t miss a match for the Crows last season and averaged 26.1 disposals a game (above average).

The Crows also have six players with an above average rating – Brodie Smith (general defender), Tom Doedee (key defender), Ben Keays (midfielder), Rory Laird (midfielder), Rory Sloane (midfielder) and Reilly O’Brien (ruck).

BRISBANE LIONS

Elite players: Five – Daniel Rich (general defender), Lincoln McCarthy (general forward), Harris Andrews (key defender), Dayne Zorko (midfielder), Hugh McCluggage (wing).

After their semi-final run last season, the Brisbane Lions retained the same number of elite players as they had in season 2020 – but with some changes.

Veteran Rich retained his elite rating after a season in which he earned his first All-Australian selection, averaging 26 disposals and 640.4 metres gained (both elite).

Vice-captain Andrews – rated elite for spoils (8.6) and intercepts marks (3.8) – and midfielder McCluggage, averaging 25 disposals a game, also held their rating.

After an injury interrupted year, 2020 Brownlow medallist Lachie Neale’s rating slipped to above average along with fellow midfielder Jarryd Lyons.

Captain Dayne Zorko joined the elite group after a season in which he claimed the club’s best and fairest for a fifth time, while forward Lincoln McCarthy’s rating also lifted after a 36-goal season.

The Lions had eight players with an above average rating – Charlie Cameron (general forward), Joe Daniher (key forward), Daniel McStay (key forward), Neale (midfielder), Lyons (midfielder), Zac Bailey (mid-forward), Oscar McInerney (ruck) and Mitch Robinson (wing).

CARLTON

Elite players: Three – Adam Saad (general defender), Zac Williams (general defender), Jacob Weitering (key defender)

Captain Patrick Cripps has missed out on an elite status for the second year in a row, falling from above average at the start of last year to “average” based on Champion Data’s ratings.

But perhaps the biggest surprise was Blues young gun Sam Walsh’s above average rating, slipping from his elite ranking the previous year.

Walsh averaged 29.8 disposals a game, won his first club best-and-fairest award and finished fourth in the Brownlow Medal count.

Champion Data acknowledged Walsh’s fantastic season, rating above average in every area for a midfielder, which resulted in his overall rating being above average.

Recruit Adam Saad was the only Blue to retain his elite rating from the previous year.

Saad was joined by vice-captain and defensive general Jacob Weitering – who holds an elite ranking for spoils and disposals – and fellow recruit Zac Williams, despite an injury interrupted start to life at his new club and mid-season questions about his fitness.

He met the minimum 10-game qualifier with his 14 senior games.

The Blues had seven players rated above average – Sam Docherty (general defender), Nic Newman (general defender), recruit George Hewett (general defender), Fisher (general forward), Lachie Fogarty (general forward), Harry McKay (key forward) and Walsh (midfielder).

Retired defender Liam Jones would have also been listed among the Blues above average players.

ESSENDON

Elite players: Three – Nick Hind (general defender), Darcy Parish (midfielder), Jake Stringer (mid-forward).

The Bombers’ three elite-rated players is up from one in season 2020.

Defender Jordan Ridley was the Bombers’ only elite-rated player entering season 2021 but his rating slipped to above average.

Recruit Nick Hind earned an elite rating in his first season at the Bombers after comfortably filling the void at half-back left by the departure of Adam Saad.

Young gun Darcy Parish, who averaged 30.5 disposals a game, and midfielder-forward Jake Stringer – coming off a 45-goal season – were also elevated to an elite ranking.

The Bombers had seven players rated above average – captain Dyson Heppell (general defender), Mason Redman (general defender), Ridley (general defender), Anthony McDonald-Tipungwuti (general forward), Will Snelling (general forward), Zach Merrett (midfielder) and Kyle Langford (wing).

FREMANTLE

Elite players: Two – Sam Switkowski (general forward), Sean Darcy (ruck).

Dual Brownlow medallist Nat Fyfe was the Dockers’ only elite-rated player from the 2020 season but his status has slipped after an injury-interrupted year.

Restricted to 15 games in 2021, 30-year-old Fyfe’s season – which ended in Round 19 due to a recurring shoulder injury – was rated above average by Champion Data.

Ruckman Sean Darcy earned an elite rating after a year in which he averaged 28.5 hit-outs a game (above average), 10 hit-outs to advantage (elite) and 4.7 total clearances (elite).

Forward Sam Switkowski just met the minimum qualification with his 12 senior games, in which he had a return of nine goals.

The Dockers had seven above average rated players – Travis Colyer (general forward), Michael Walters (general forward), Brennan Cox (key defender), Luke Ryan (key defender), Rory Lobb (key forward), Fyfe (midfielder) and veteran David Mundy (midfielder).

GEELONG

Elite players: Three – Tom Stewart (general defender), Tom Hawkins (key forward), Sam Menegola (wing).

The number of elite rated players at the Cats is down from four in 2020 to three in 2021.

Spearhead Tom Hawkins, who kicked 62 goals for the season, and wingman Sam Menegola retained their rating but defender Mark Blicavs and midfield star Patrick Dangerfield slipped.

Blicavs and Dangerfield, who was restricted to 16 games due to suspension and injury, were rated as above average by Champion Data.

Defender Tom Stewart earned an elite rating following a season when he received his third All-Australian nod and was crowned the Cats’ best and fairest before a syndesmosis injury in Round 21 ended his season, cruelling the Cats’ premiership hopes.

Dangerfield and Blicavs were among 10 Cats rated above average, including Zach Tuohy (general defender), Brad Close (general forward, Gary Rohan (general forward), Jack Henry (key defender), Jeremy Cameron (key forward), Mitch Duncan (mid-forward), and Isaac Smith (wing).

Ruck recruit Jonathon Ceglar also joins that list after his arrival from the Hawks.

GOLD COAST

Elite players: One – Touk Miller (midfielder).

The Suns had two players with an elite rating in 2020 – Matt Rowell and Sam Collins – but Touk Miller was the only one to make the grade last year.

The 25-year-old midfield ace earned a spot on the interchange bench in the All-Australian team following a career-best season in which he averaged 31.8 disposals and 7.1 tackles a game.

Collins was one of five Gold Coast players rated above average while Champion Data rated young gun Rowell below average in his injury-hit 12-game season.

Rowell missed most of the first half of the season after injuring his knee in Round 1 last year.

Jack Lukosius (general defender), Wil Powell (general defender), Nick Holman (general forward) and Lachie Weller (mid-forward) were the Suns also rated above average.

GWS GIANTS

Elite players: One – Toby Greene (general forward).

Harry Perryman was the only GWS player to hold an elite rating in 2020 and now his place has been taken by match-winner and controversy magnet Toby Greene.

The rating highlights the huge hole that will be needed to be filled by the Giants for the start of this season with Greene to miss the first five rounds through suspension.

Greene copped a six-week ban for making contact with an umpire in the Giants’ elimination final win over the Sydney Swans in last year’s finals series.

The All-Australian forward kicked 45 goals last year and averaged more than 17 disposals a game.

Perryman (general defender) was one of seven Giants’ players to earn an above average rating alongside Isaac Cumming (general defender), Lachie Whitfield (general defender), Daniel Lloyd (general forward), Harry Himmelberg (key forward), Tim Taranto (mid-forward) and ruck Matt Flynn.

HAWTHORN

Elite players: Four – Jack Scrimshaw (general defender), Luke Breust (general defender), Dylan Moore (general forward), Chad Wingard (mid-forward).

The Hawks were down from five players with an elite rating in 2020 to four in 2021 as the club moves into a new era under coach Sam Mitchell.

Triple premiership player Luke Breust and Chad Wingard are the only two to retain their elite rating from the previous year

They are joined by young defender Jack Scrimshaw and 22-year-old forward Dylan Moore, who kicked 27 goals for the Hawks last season.

Captain Ben McEvoy and James Sicily – sidelined with a knee injury last year – and Jack Gunston, who played just one match as he battled a back complaint, were the Hawks other players with an elite status in 2020.

The Hawks had seven other players with an above average rating – Blake Hardwick (general defender), Jarman Impey (general defender), Changkuoth Jiath (general defender), Sam Frost (key defender), Tom Mitchell (midfielder), Daniel Howe (wing) and Tom Phillips (wing).

NORTH MELBOURNE

Elite players: One – Aaron Hall (general defender).

Ruckman Todd Goldstein was the only player to score an elite rating in 2020 but he has been replaced by defender Aaron Hall as the only Kangaroo to make the cut in 2021.

Hall averaged 27.9 disposals a game, a whopping 650.5 metres gained and 7.5 marks a game – all elite rankings.

Goldstein was one of six North players to be rated above average, including Jack Ziebell (general defender), Jaidyn Stephenson (general forward), Hugh Greenwood (midfielder), Ben Cunnington (midfielder) and Tarryn Thomas (midfielder).

PORT ADELAIDE

Elite players: Six – Zak Butters (general forward), Robbie Gray (general forward), Aliir Aliir (key defender), Jeremy Finlayson (key forward), Charlie Dixon (key forward), Karl Amon (wing).

The Power boast the second-highest number of elite-rated players on their list in the league, but with one big omission – Brownlow medallist Ollie Wines.

In 2020, Port Adelaide had four A-graders – Robbie Gray, Charlie Dixon, Zak Butters and Steven Motlop.

That number has jumped to six, bolstered by the arrival of former Giant Jeremy Finlayson in the off-season.

Butters, Gray and Dixon retain their elite status and have been joined by All-Australian key defender Aliir, who emerged as one of the recruits of the year after his move from Sydney.

But midfield star Wines was only rated as above average by Champion Data in a season he won the Brownlow Medal, club best and fairest and All-Australian selection.

Wines was the ninth-highest rated midfielder – just outside the eight elite.

Champion Data explained the only reason he wasn’t rated elite was his ball use by foot, rating as a below average kick in 2021.

Wines was one of seven players rated as above average for the Power, also including Travis Boak, Tom Jonas and Connor Rozee.

Finlayson, who kicked 23 goals last year for the Giants, will provide another tall forward option for the Power, who were dealt a pre-season injury blow with Dixon undergoing ankle surgery last week.

RICHMOND

Elite players: One – Dustin Martin (mid-forward)

After slipping out of the finals mix last year, the number of Tigers with an elite rating also fell.

After claiming a third flag in four years in 2020, the Tigers has three players hold an elite status – Nick Vlastuin, Shane Edwards and Dustin Marin.

Superstar Martin was the only player to retain his elite rating in 2021 as his season came to an early end when he suffered a serious kidney injury in Round 18 against the Brisbane Lions.

Until then, he had averaged 22.6 disposals, 3.6 clearances a match and kicked 19 goals.

But the Tigers had 11 players rated above average, headlined by Shai Bolton, Dylan Grimes, Jack Graham, Jack Riewoldt and Nick Vlastuin.

ST KILDA

Elite players: One – Jack Sinclair (general defender)

Dan Butler and Jack Steele earned an elite rating for the Saints in 2020 but Jack Sinclair was the only one to make the cut last season.

Runner-up in the St Kilda’s best-and-fairest behind captain Steele, Sinclair found his niche at half-back to become one of the Saints’ most dependable players.

Despite being named on the interchange bench in the All-Australian team and finishing equal-fifth in the Brownlow Medal count, Steele, who averaged 29.2 disposals and 8.5 tackles a match, was rated only above average by Champion Data.

The Saints had six more players rated above average – Jack Higgins (general forward), Dougal Howard (key defender), Rowan Marshall (ruck), Paddy Ryder (ruck), Daniel McKenzie (wing) and Seb Ross (wing).

SYDNEY

Elite players: Three – Isaac Heeney (general forward), Lance Franklin (key forward), Tom Hickey (ruck).

The Swans have retained the same number of elite players heading into the 2022 season but two of the names have changed.

Heeney retains his elite status from season 2020 but superstar forward Lance Franklin – who booted 51 goals last season – and ruckman Tom Hickey replace co-captain Dane Rampe and defender Jake Lloyd.

Lloyd’s grading slipped to above average – one of seven Swans with that rating, including co-captain Luke Parker and forward Tom Papley.

Midfield warrior Josh Kennedy and new co-captain Callum Mills, who battled achilles issues for the second half of last season, were rated average by Champion Data.

WEST COAST

Elite players: Two – Liam Ryan (general forward), Nic Naitanui (ruck).

The Eagles were among the five clubs to boast the equal-highest number of players with an elite rating in 2020 but that slipped to two in 2021.

Electric forward Liam Ryan and star ruckman Nic Naitanui, who was named on the interchange bench in the All-Australian team, both retained their elite status.

Ryan kicked 24 goals last season while Naitanui averaged 31.2 hit-outs, 12.3 hit-outs to advantage and 7.2 clearances a match.

Champion Data said Naitanui was rated a long way clear of any other ruckman in the league last season.

The Eagles had nine players rated above average by Champion Data, including defender Jeremy McGovern, key forwards Oscar Allen and Josh Kennedy and midfielder Elliot Yeo.

Vaccine-hesitant forward Jack Darling, who is unable to train with his teammates until he gets vaccinated, was also among those rated above average.

WESTERN BULLDOGS

Elite players: Bailey Dale (general defender), Caleb Daniel (general defender), Marcus Bontempelli (midfielder), Tom Liberatore (midfielder), Jack Macrae (midfielder), Adam Treloar (mid-forward), Bailey Smith (wing).

They might have been heavily defeated in the Grand Final against Melbourne but the Western Bulldogs emerged as the club with the highest number of elite rated players in the competition in season 2021.

Up from their five the previous year, skipper and midfield star Marcus Bontempelli and defender Caleb Daniel were the only two to retain their elite status.

Defender Bailey Dale, who prospered after a switch to defence last pre-season to be named in the All-Australian team, midfielders Tom Liberatore, Jack Macrae and wingman Bailey Smith also made the A-grade.

And Adam Treloar also a strong recruit, earning an elite rating as a mid-forward.

The Bulldogs also had five players rated above average – Bailey Williams, Cody Weightman, Alex Keath, Josh Dunkley and Lachie Hunter.

Thanks a lot for this.

I think we all know it won't be long for three others to join this list in Kozzie...LJ and Petty or Sparrow. 

[Gawndy the Great 9,011]

16 hours ago, mauriesy said:

Going on players named in other teams, if Fritsch, May, Gawn, Salem and Langdon are not elite, Champion Data is measuring the wrong things.

Yep their data analysis is still pretty rudimentary. It needs more sophisticated modelling which does more than just capture a raw stat such as a kick or mark. Things like time in game, pressure rating at that point, who was leading, etc etc all add context and value to the raw stat.
 

The other thing is there are really no penalty stats other than frees against. Which makes the statistical analysis more attack bias. This is why Williams and Saad can be categorised as elite defenders because they rebound well. But if you could factor in stats that measure scores against those individuals and deduct that from their overall value, you will quickly realise what everyone in the industry knows - they are not elite defenders. There also has to be a factor of secondary and tertiary positions so the versatile players like Gawn can be measured appropriately given he probably spend 30-40% of the season not playing in his preferred position. 

End of the day I don’t think you can place much value in individual stats like they do in American Sports. Team stats on the other hand are essential.

 

[rjay 24,917]

13 minutes ago, durango said:

I have watch and played football from 1952 and found that champion data is the biggest load of rubbish unfortunately coaches look at statistics and think they are the holly grail of data.

I think they do a good job of counting numbers...

Then it's up to the professionals (coaches) to interpret them.

Champion data are out of their league when they try to do the interpreting.

They need to stick with the counting.

[MT64 1,144]

7 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Champion data is dying a slow death.

By trying to stay relevant it then goes and posts this garbage.

Don't they charge clubs for this sort of dribble???

[jnrmac 20,058]

Champion Data doing massive brand damage to themselves.

[sisso 2,580]

What a joke we had one of the most dominant finals series ever (teams usually have at least one nailbiter in finals we **** it in) with just THREE elite players??

[Mazer Rackham 14,971]

11 minutes ago, sisso said:

What a joke we had one of the most dominant finals series ever (teams usually have at least one nailbiter in finals we **** it in) with just THREE elite players??

Just shows how badly we underachieved with M. Jones, McKenzie, Magner, Petterd, etc, running around for us.

Elite players are for runners up and cellar dwellers!

(Not a shot at the above named players btw.)

[DeeSpencer 25,678]

The thing to remember is Champion Data is 49% owned by the afl and have seemingly no desire to open the stats up for wider use.

They drip feed some stuff to the herald sun or fox footy as required. Making sure it’s often provocative enough to sell some papers.

Clubs get access to far more of the data. And have data scientists to interpret it. But it’s qualitative, it’s not just counting.

Their kicking rating stuff was really interesting. And I’m sure they’re tracking all sorts of things with players running patterns.

They just decide they’ll keep the good stuff to paying customers and release silly stuff to the public. 

[Macca 16,961]

On 2/15/2022 at 6:55 AM, picket fence said:

We have the following who in my book are elite

CLARRY

MAX

TRACC

MAY

LEVER

SALEM

LANGDON

FRITSCH

Thats just for starters add the almosts Viney, Bowey,BBB, Kossy, Gus theres 13 straight up who would walk into ANY side then add Rivers, Sparrow to the mix and whadaya know, there's a premiership team right there!

Champion data, ?? Full of flaws!

Agree on your 8 and Fritsch makes it because of how well he played in the finals (esp the 6 goals in the GF)

But Viney has to be classed as elite because of his stellar performances in the finals ... worth triple points or more, all things considered

Missed 10 games because of injury but if we're judging a player before the ball is bounced in a big game, your 8 plus Viney are elite.  And the proof of that is the PF & GF ... smashed both teams unceremoniously!

[waynewussell 5,727]

I now refer to this publication as Chumpion Dada!

[djr 1,445]

Found an interesting article in "The Roar" dated back to Aug 2019 that discuss many of these issues. Apparently only small handful of clubs pay the required $150,000 for CD's in-depth analysis. Most pay for the base product and then do their own analysis on stats that are important to them.

https://www.theroar.com.au/2019/08/27/locking-up-afl-data-will-only-make-it-less-valuable/

Edited February 16, 2022 by djr

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,750]

47 minutes ago, waynewussell said:

I now refer to this publication as Chumpion Dada!

Too right.

See https://www.tate.org.uk/art/art-terms/d/dada#:~:text=Dada was an art movement,satirical and nonsensical in nature

[Demon17 5,188]

48 minutes ago, djr said:

 Apparently only small handful of clubs pay the required $150,000 for CD's in-depth analysis. Most pay for the base product and then do their own analysis on stats that are important to them.

 

If true, this is good to hear.   You wonder about CD doing a sense check of their analysis. It must occur to them the flaws now apparent.

Would they be now thinking if they've kicked an own goal marketing - wise?

Usually there's outrage on these sites when the list come out like Robbo's or Sheehan's, but they are subjective anyway and good for initiating arguments.

CD are the opposite, portraying these as facts, the data doesn't ie, etc, etc,.......

Highlights maybe their limited programming expertise.

[Macca 16,961]

1 hour ago, waynewussell said:

I now refer to this publication as Chumpion Dada!

The issue is that their criteria is woefully poor ... so poor that they haven't got Gawn as elite.

However, it's not like the evaluations are from someone or an organisation without any credence.  This mob are supposed to be able to evaluate the numbers so that it makes sense

Accurate evaluations can only be taken seriously if the base criteria is close to being entirely accurate

It's like they don't watch the actual games and just look at the numbers

For instance,  Before T-Mac hurt his back he was at one stage running 3rd in our B&F (round 17?) in a team full of gun players

Why?  Because in my opinion the MC would have been very happy with his disciplined forward play (playing in front) thus bringing our small forwards into play on a constant basis ... as well as impacting the games with marks, kicks & scores

Does CD measure all that?  I doubt it

Edited February 16, 2022 by Macca

[daisycutter 29,613]

2 hours ago, Demon17 said:

If true, this is good to hear.   You wonder about CD doing a sense check of their analysis. It must occur to them the flaws now apparent.

Would they be now thinking if they've kicked an own goal marketing - wise?

Usually there's outrage on these sites when the list come out like Robbo's or Sheehan's, but they are subjective anyway and good for initiating arguments.

CD are the opposite, portraying these as facts, the data doesn't ie, etc, etc,.......

Highlights maybe their limited programming expertise.

not really a programming problem, but an algorithm problem

you'd think they'd a least benchmark their modelling output with expert reality checks...aka the pub test

there must be a high degree of arrogance at chumpion data to foist this rubbish on a footy-mad public

[IRW 1,387]

On 2/14/2022 at 6:24 PM, waynewussell said:

Chumpian Data continues its death wish to become irrelevant! 

Don't say that, David King won't be able to sleep

[IRW 1,387]

On 2/15/2022 at 6:55 AM, picket fence said:

We have the following who in my book are elite

CLARRY

MAX

TRACC

MAY

LEVER

SALEM

LANGDON

FRITSCH

Thats just for starters add the almosts Viney, Bowey,BBB, Kossy, Gus theres 13 straight up who would walk into ANY side then add Rivers, Sparrow to the mix and whadaya know, there's a premiership team right there!

Champion data, ?? Full of flaws!

Geez what did Dogga do wrong?

Edited February 16, 2022 by IRW
Spellin

[durango 2,007]

I think there should be a category above elite where a players like Oliver and Petracca could be ranked.

The grading like A B and C have been used by people like Gary Buckenara there should be an A+, A-, B+, B-, C+ and C-.

  

[Roost it far 8,255]

These rankings are garbage, didn’t we have the best team in the comp going into 2019?

Edited February 16, 2022 by Roost it far

[Queanbeyan Demon 6,843]

Is this list from an episode out of Archive 81?

[mauriesy 7,287]

If Champion Data scored the merits of an apple tree, they'd measure the trunk, branches, leaves and the height, and ignore the quantity and volume of the fruit.

Edited February 16, 2022 by mauriesy

[Watson11 2,240]

5 hours ago, Roost it far said:

These rankings are garbage, didn’t we have the best team in the comp going into 2019?

Champion data only seems to rate offence.  Everyone else knows defence wins flags.

[In Harmes Way 7,766]

The AFL won't be unhappy with Champion Data peddling statistics that give hope to supporters of all the teams that didn't win the flag.  

[Lucifers Hero 39,737]

They could help their cause if they lifted the minimum games from 10 per season!

One wonders if their cause is too actually identify the best/better players or generate clicks and discussion/controversy.

imv it is the latter.  Not much will change.