Jump to content

  • Podcast LIVE Tonight @ 8:30pm     

  • Podcast LIVE Tonight @ 8:30pm     

James Frawley Retires... And Starts Playing Again


Demonland
 Share


Recommended Posts

Not saying that any D’lander is a hypocrite (God forbid), but in the interests of full disclosure and transparency I think we should all declare, before passing comment on chip, whether we have ever

a)       changed jobs in our life

b)      choose an option which resulted in a greater financial return to us

c)       choose an option which provided us with greater opportunity

I tick all the above.

He gave 7 good years of good service when we were a rabble, (the last year club and player had separated in spirit) and we got pick 3 when he left. Won his medallion at the Hawks and has now taken the option of an extra year at the saints. Are people seriously saying he should forego a years income, at a level that he’ll probably never be able to earn post career.

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

And another thing, the assumption that a flag at the Hawks has a lesser value than one he would have won at the Dees is bogus. A flag, is a flag, is a flag. Pretty sure Brian Lake wouldn’t swap his 3 peat with the Hawks for a flag at the Dogs.

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites


On 11/26/2020 at 4:52 PM, whatwhatsaywhat said:

i think players playing for three or more teams will become more and more the norm

the cachet of being a 'one club player' has completely disappeared in the modern era, with afl player and club mentality finally catching up to where overseas sports have been for 40+ years

For one reason only.... $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, BAMF said:

I get the angst and I agree that his premiership medallions aren't worth as much as others.

Yeah, he was at the highest level and should have got the best out of himself no matter what the scenario was.

But think about how poorly the club was being run.

Our priorities:

Losing games. High draft picks. Arguing with suppliers about the colour red. Blazers. Complicated logos. The presidents health. Whiteboards. 

At the time I was really disappointed with how Chip left the club. In hindsight I think it was a fantastic decision for him and don't begrudge him a single thing.

The Club is bigger than the individual player and Frawley decided he did not accept that Group value. That does not go well for the man then or now.. Dollars speak bigger values for Frawley.. If you do not believe me just go to the Saints web site ( after he "retired" and signed with St Kilda.....and read the BS he told their supporters... ) One could ask from those comments  if he thought so much of St kilda now why did he go to Hawthorn...  Oh, yeah, to get away from the "mismanaged Melbourne"  -  BS it was for fame and fortune.....at Hawthorn.. I have no time for this type of player who shows no Club loyalty... and I totally disagree with the excuses made in the post above. Facts are Facts...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, Ohio USA - David said:

The Club is bigger than the individual player and Frawley decided he did not accept that Group value. That does not go well for the man then or now.. Dollars speak bigger values for Frawley.. If you do not believe me just go to the Saints web site ( after he "retired" and signed with St Kilda.....and read the BS he told their supporters... ) One could ask from those comments  if he thought so much of St kilda now why did he go to Hawthorn...  Oh, yeah, to get away from the "mismanaged Melbourne"  -  BS it was for fame and fortune.....at Hawthorn.. I have no time for this type of player who shows no Club loyalty... and I totally disagree with the excuses made in the post above. Facts are Facts...

Are you in one of the States where weed is legal?

  • Haha 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, demonstone said:

You must really dislike May, Lever, Hibberd and Langdon, then.  It works both ways, you realise.

nah ds, it's one of those things that only work one way

not everything has to be scientifically logical

why else would we all be here spreading our passion on 'land when nothing much is coming the other way

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Ohio USA - David said:

The Club is bigger than the individual player and Frawley decided he did not accept that Group value. That does not go well for the man then or now.. Dollars speak bigger values for Frawley.. If you do not believe me just go to the Saints web site ( after he "retired" and signed with St Kilda.....and read the BS he told their supporters... ) One could ask from those comments  if he thought so much of St kilda now why did he go to Hawthorn...  Oh, yeah, to get away from the "mismanaged Melbourne"  -  BS it was for fame and fortune.....at Hawthorn.. I have no time for this type of player who shows no Club loyalty... and I totally disagree with the excuses made in the post above. Facts are Facts...

Of course, if you're living in Ohio, you're in the land that has alternative facts.

  • Haha 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Of course, if you're living in Ohio, you're in the land that has alternative facts.

More so perpetually on the move

In a red phone box

  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Ohio USA - David said:

For one reason only.... $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Obviously you don't believe that a player should have more important responsibilities in his life beyond the team... how dare he accept a position doing what he loves (playing footy) while at the same time putting his future in a much more secure position!

I sure hope that you never accepted a pay rise, or left one company to work for another that was offering better remuneration, conditions and a real shot at success; I'd hate to think you were a hypocrite. 

Edited by hardtack
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Better days ahead said:

And another thing, the assumption that a flag at the Hawks has a lesser value than one he would have won at the Dees is bogus. A flag, is a flag, is a flag. Pretty sure Brian Lake wouldn’t swap his 3 peat with the Hawks for a flag at the Dogs.

I don't necessarily agree on this...

Whilst I'm sure his flag at the Hawks fills him with pride.

If he had won one with the Dees after going through the hard times with mates he started out with it would have just that little bit more value not the Hawks one of lesser value.

...but as you say, a flag is a flag and as I say, they're hard to come by...good luck to him.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't understand all this 'passion' about James Frawley. He walked, as every employee is entitled to. Good riddance, have a good life, James. 

I also understand that what galls is that he played good footy as a Demon, then played rather ordinary football - the lack of a tackle against the Bulldogs - and in the end, that's life. Sailor Vee, as they say in the navy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, rjay said:

I don't necessarily agree on this...

Whilst I'm sure his flag at the Hawks fills him with pride.

If he had won one with the Dees after going through the hard times with mates he started out with it would have just that little bit more value not the Hawks one of lesser value.

...but as you say, a flag is a flag and as I say, they're hard to come by...good luck to him.

Nah a flag is a flag. I left one club where I played in a flag, to another where I won back to back. All three are as good as each other

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think the dichotomy of the current AFL being a BIG business that requires monetary decisions to be made but or the feeling of fans for the idea that it's about 'bleeding for the jumper' is very much at play here.

If you see the AFL as a business then what the clubs and players do in their decision making is just that, a business decision. Not a lot of room for romanticism.

If you see the AFL as being the old school tribalism that requires club loyalty and moves and trades eliciting an emotional response or betrayal then yeah, I can see how people would get [censored] at players for leaving and such.

I kind of swing between the two but find trying to fit them both in to be a case of cognitive dissonance.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, hardtack said:

Obviously you don't believe that a player should have more important responsibilities in his life beyond the team... how dare he accept a position doing what he loves (playing footy) while at the same time putting his future in a much more secure position!

I sure hope that you never accepted a pay rise, or left one company to work for another that was offering better remuneration, conditions and a real shot at success; I'd hate to think you were a hypocrite. 

I believe that playing a Team sport is different  at the AFL  sporting level and is quite different than a "day job" in some ways that you and I enjoy. These players are on performance contracts and that contract encompasses a Team attitude to win ultimate glory - a Premiership flag for The Team and its members. There is little loyalty in a Club these days......Should a player leave a Team for another Club then he does it selfishly for money and other glory and not for the spirit of the Team he left behind. Just read the St Kilda Web site where Frawley speaks of how lovely it is to be at St Kilda and his reasoning...  Wipe away the BS and you begin to see it is for money $$$  There is no loyalty to The Team.. You can disagree with me all you like  but I am entitled to my own opinion.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Ohio USA - David said:

I believe that playing a Team sport is different  at the AFL  sporting level and is quite different than a "day job" in some ways that you and I enjoy. These players are on performance contracts and that contract encompasses a Team attitude to win ultimate glory - a Premiership flag for The Team and its members. There is little loyalty in a Club these days......Should a player leave a Team for another Club then he does it selfishly for money and other glory and not for the spirit of the Team he left behind. Just read the St Kilda Web site where Frawley speaks of how lovely it is to be at St Kilda and his reasoning...  Wipe away the BS and you begin to see it is for money $$$  There is no loyalty to The Team.. You can disagree with me all you like  but I am entitled to my own opinion.

 

But it’s a 2 way street Ohio. Collingwood showed no loyalty to Treloar and Stephenson so you can’t blame players for making decisions that are in their best interests.

Loyalty left the building when the AFL went professional. Perhaps revert back to the amateur status, take all that TV money and distribute it to clubs and grassroots to spend on facilities and junior coaching. Players play for the teams in the postcodes where they were born. It’s the model used in Gaelic Games in Ireland. You play for the county team you were born into. No transfers. It’ll never happen, too much money involved, but it’s the only way to ensure genuine loyalty to the Guernsey.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 minutes ago, Better days ahead said:

But it’s a 2 way street Ohio. Collingwood showed no loyalty to Treloar and Stephenson so you can’t blame players for making decisions that are in their best interests.

Loyalty left the building when the AFL went professional. Perhaps revert back to the amateur status, take all that TV money and distribute it to clubs and grassroots to spend on facilities and junior coaching. Players play for the teams in the postcodes where they were born. It’s the model used in Gaelic Games in Ireland. You play for the county team you were born into. No transfers. It’ll never happen, too much money involved, but it’s the only way to ensure genuine loyalty to the Guernsey.

Treloar and Stephenson were on Contracts as distinct from Frawley at Hawthorn where he chose to retire. Treloar had no reason to leave he could have stayed there and ran out his Contract.

Frawley on the other hand left Melbourne at the end of his contract and chose to retire from Hawthorn as I said then he writes this bizarre piece on the St Kilda Web site that makes him  out to be such a fallen soldier. A martyr for the Club and how he just loves being at the Club that his cousin Danny played for...  What he should have said to St Kilda fans is that " I am here for the money and if you think you can get an extra year out of me then fine... I will still take the money but I have no loyalty to the Club despite what I just said ...." I stand by my comments and please respect my point that I too have views - it is not a one way web site here. People have opposite views - so be it.

  • Facepalm 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 10/8/2020 at 11:24 PM, Cheesy D. Pun said:

You can't blame anyone for leaving in that era. The club was a complete and utter shambles.

Many potentially great young players had their careers ruined by incompetence - he didn't want to be one of them.

Think you might be giving "shambles" a bad wrap CDP. The Filth and Norff are an example "shambles" this year. We were the dictionary definition of diabolical ineptitude bordering on the criminally insane. 

  • Like 1
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, Ohio USA - David said:

Treloar and Stephenson were on Contracts as distinct from Frawley at Hawthorn where he chose to retire. Treloar had no reason to leave he could have stayed there and ran out his Contract.

Frawley on the other hand left Melbourne at the end of his contract and chose to retire from Hawthorn as I said then he writes this bizarre piece on the St Kilda Web site that makes him  out to be such a fallen soldier. A martyr for the Club and how he just loves being at the Club that his cousin Danny played for...  What he should have said to St Kilda fans is that " I am here for the money and if you think you can get an extra year out of me then fine... I will still take the money but I have no loyalty to the Club despite what I just said ...." I stand by my comments and please respect my point that I too have views - it is not a one way web site here. People have opposite views - so be it.

I respect your point of view Ohio. Your opinion is just as valid as mine.  If a player can do a job and perform the club will retain them and as long as the player believes the team can win a flag they'll stay. If the interests of club and player align, happy days, if not then a parting of the ways occurs. Loyalty plays little part in it imv.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Ohio USA - David said:

I believe that playing a Team sport is different  at the AFL  sporting level and is quite different than a "day job" in some ways that you and I enjoy. These players are on performance contracts and that contract encompasses a Team attitude to win ultimate glory - a Premiership flag for The Team and its members. There is little loyalty in a Club these days......Should a player leave a Team for another Club then he does it selfishly for money and other glory and not for the spirit of the Team he left behind. Just read the St Kilda Web site where Frawley speaks of how lovely it is to be at St Kilda and his reasoning...  Wipe away the BS and you begin to see it is for money $$$  There is no loyalty to The Team.. You can disagree with me all you like  but I am entitled to my own opinion.

Yes, of course you're entitled to your own opinion, no one is denying that.  However, for AFL footballers these days, football IS a day job and as such they have the right to seek better conditions, better wages, and better opportunities for their advancement elsewhere, as soon as their contract has run its term.  

Gone are the days of footballers who held day jobs and played as part of a team on the weekends with a couple of evening practices a week.  These days AFL is a business, a very big business, and loyalty is a rarity.  Clubs move out players regardless of whether they have a contract or not just so they can free up salary cap space in order to attract the big names with big dollars and to attract big name sponsors with equally big cheque books - it's a two way street (give loyalty to get loyalty). 

If you want to apportion the blame, then I suggest you first look at the clubs who are offering the big money... as I have said in previous posts, the players are, rightfully, looking to secure their own (and their family's) futures and it is the clubs that are enabling that by making offers they can't refuse.  Their life as footballers with an opportunity to use their talents to make a good living is very limited unless they are one of the handful that have what it takes to move into the media post footy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, Ohio USA - David said:

I believe that playing a Team sport is different  at the AFL  sporting level and is quite different than a "day job" in some ways that you and I enjoy. These players are on performance contracts and that contract encompasses a Team attitude to win ultimate glory - a Premiership flag for The Team and its members. There is little loyalty in a Club these days......Should a player leave a Team for another Club then he does it selfishly for money and other glory and not for the spirit of the Team he left behind. Just read the St Kilda Web site where Frawley speaks of how lovely it is to be at St Kilda and his reasoning...  Wipe away the BS and you begin to see it is for money $$$  There is no loyalty to The Team.. You can disagree with me all you like  but I am entitled to my own opinion.

 

frankly I think you are taking the pi.. Football Clubs do not give out contracts for the life of a players career. Players and Club typically commit for three years. That is the extent of each parties loyalty to each other. I think you are confused with amateur, social footy or underage stuff played with your mates. AFL mateship is mostly BS. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Match Previews, Reports & Articles  

    DEES GIVE DOGS A BONE by George On The Outer

    First place versus second on the ladder promised to be a precursor to what can be expected in the coming finals race.  However, it was the Demons who faltered and gave the Bulldogs a bone to feed their hunger just weeks out from the end of the season. The win also sent the Dogs to the top of the ladder, a position they are unlikely to cede in the coming weeks, given their fixture. While Melbourne may now struggle to keep a spot in the top four with its draw and will likely depend on the res

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Reports

    THE WORM WILL TURN by The Oracle

    When I was asked to preview this game, I wasn’t sure whether it was going to be played in Darwin, on the Gold Coast or the MCG. I had no idea as to the identity of Melbourne’s opponent. This would have made for one hell of an interesting match preview so I’m glad that the AFL managed to reorganize its fixture to enable a game … any game at all … to proceed in Round 19. We’ll worry about the Gold Coast Suns or whoever they put us up against when the weekend’s done and dusted and if and when

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Previews

    DRAWN AND DEEFLATED by George on the Outer

    1st v 17th ... it would seem a sure one way contest between the Hawks and the Demons but it was not to be with the game finishing in a draw, the only positive being the Demons still retain their top spot on the ladder. Melbourne was taught a football lesson by Al Clarkson, who with limited resources, just instructed his players to scrap, fight and surge the ball forward.  It stifled the Melbourne free flowing style of play and denied them the opportunities they could normally expect. I

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Reports

    PINK RAIN by Whispering Jack

    There is no certainty about life under a pandemic. You wake up one morning without a care in the world; the sun’s shining and it’s a beautiful day. An hour later, everything’s up in the air, the entire state is on high alert and the apartment complex next door’s in lockdown. The simple decision you had to make about buying a ticket to the footy at the weekend suddenly might get put on the back burner. There are other things in life to prioritise and on top of that, they’re predicting rain for th

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Previews

    COR BLIMEY by KC from Casey

    In years to come, the old timers will talk in wonderment about the “Avalon Avalanche” that hit Werribee’s Avalon Airport Oval on a mild winter’s afternoon at about ten minutes after the halfway mark of the game between the local Tigers and their cross town rivals, the Demons from Casey. At that moment in time, the game was poised as if on a knifepoint. Up until the main interval, it had been the visiting team which had maintained the lead from the start but it had struggled to entirely asse

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Casey Articles

    POWER FAILURE by George on the Outer

    South Australians should be well familiar with the damage that storms can do to the power supply.  But Port Power forgot those lessons on Thursday night football as they watched the Melbourne storm descend upon them from across the border and ruin their hopes of a top four placing. Just as equally, the win to the Demons cemented their spot in the top two and sent out the message that a team who had been going around in circles for the past couple of weeks, has in fact, turned into a cyclone

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Reports

    CASEY SUFFER FIRST DEFEAT IN TWO YEARS

    The circumstances were a little unusual last Saturday night as KC from Casey was unavailable to report on the Casey Dees due to work commitments. On the ground things were somewhat unusual as well given that, although there was a game to be won on the night, preparations were also being made for the forthcoming Thursday night clash against Port Adelaide with Ben Brown rested for large slabs of the evening. It turned out perhaps, to be a stroke of genius for Melbourne with Brown making a strong c

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Casey Articles

    WEATHERING THE STORM by Mel Rundle

    The magic of Melbourne’s magnificent start to 2021 is beginning to wear off. In its past six matches it lost to three teams that were outside the eight, out of form —  teams which it had very little trouble bearing last year. This week, the temperature is turned up even higher with the hard fought spot in the top four at risk. The really ominous factor about the Demons’ upcoming Thursday night meeting with Port Adelaide this week is that it is due to take place at the very place where its dec

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Previews

    FEE-FI-FO-FUM by George on the Outer

    “Fee-fi-fo-fum, without a Full Forward the Premiership can’t be won!” So said the GWS Giants, as they exposed Melbourne’s fatal deficiency with a nine point win at the MCG.  In past weeks Melbourne has been barely able to gloss over the lack of a serious target in front of goal, while others were able to contribute.  But in a near repeat of the game from the previous week, players running up the ground simply had no-one to kick the ball to, when all that was needed was that one tall target.

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Reports

    MUCH ADO ABOUT EVERYTHING by Whispering Jack

    Let's face it. We Melbourne supporters are a demanding lot. Here we are with our team on top of the ladder with a record of 12 wins and 2 losses, a decent percentage and a fair run home for a team with finals credentials. We have a fit list with lots of in form players, many of who are in contention for All Australian and other high honours, the team’s playing with purpose and cohesion and its VFL affiliate is undefeated and going gangbusters.  Still, we're all walking around with conc

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Previews

    HIATUS by KC from Casey

    After their five week Covid19 lockdown hiatus, the Casey Demons were fairly scratchy against Essendon VFL for the best part of 2½ quarters on Sunday afternoon but they finally settled down to motor away to a 48 point victory. With 20 AFL affiliated players on the team sheet, the Casey line up looked the strongest team ever put together since linking up with the Demons but the team struggled to score in the early going and managed its first goal to Aaron vandenBerg late in the first term.

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Casey Articles

    ESSENDONE & DUSTED by George on the Outer

    Essendon was the latest casualty as the Melbourne juggernaut rolled over the Bombers on its way to a 12th win for the 2021 Season.  It was a display of the difference in quality, coaching and system that defines those who will compete in finals and those that lie outside the top eight. Sadly, in these Covid times a mere 19,414 attended the game and the silence outside the ground before the match was eerie.  Normally, thronging crowds lining up at ticket gates and food carts were replaced by

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Match Reports


×
×
  • Create New...